Javlok feedback.

[SolaireTheSunWalker]

Honestly the throw either needs to not do damage to yourself or it needs to be reduced because having a few mods on the weapon it'll one shot you from 5 meters away. comparing it to other guns, the Tonkor does a bit of damage to yourself if you try to rocket jump but you can kill groups of enemies w/o killing yourself. With the Javlok if there's an enemy close to you well your alt fire become useless unless you want to kill yourself with it.

[PsychedelicSnake]

If they don't get rid of or tone down the self-damage, I think that all weapons that have self-damage as a trait need a visible AoE indicator to show just how big the blast zone is. It's a guessing game a lot of the time.

[StealthyCARNAGE]

Although I'm not a big fan of self-damage either, I think I'm actually starting to get what the intent behind this feature was. It's so you don't end up using alt-fire 90% of the time while ignoring primary fire. Basically, it has self-damage on alt-fire to make sure you actually have a reason to make use of the weapon in its entirety. Of course, this is just a guess.

[polarity]

They don't need self-damage.  A knock-back would be sufficient to prevent spamming at point blank range (and open up the use of explosive weapons for some proper rocket-jumping).

Otherwise stop being so damn stubborn, and make the self damage a fixed percentage of warframe health.  Not everything has increase with mods, or fit into your endless power-creep model.

[DreamsmithJane]

Tonkor is an aberration. All AoE weapons should have self-damage and not be used in close quarters. Otherwise, you'd never use any other weapon. Just stop hitting yourself.

[[DE]Momaw]

2 hours ago, DreamsmithJane said:

All AoE weapons should have self-damage and not be used in close quarters. Otherwise, you'd never use any other weapon. Just stop hitting yourself.

I have to agree with this.

Javlok's AOE radius is generous, but it doesn't exactly clear a room. Just stand back a little bit. If you are wondering whether you're within range, if you're seriously thinking that you need some kind of indicator of the blast radius, then you are too close to use AOE weaponry. The entire point of this style of weapon is that they are tremendously powerful but are risky to use unless you respect the minimum safe distance.

Edited December 20, 2016 by Momaw

[Sennera]

All projectile weapons (bows, launchers, Drakgoon) originate the projectile at the muzzle of their respective weapon, where guns like the Soma or the Tigris originate the hitscan 'bullet' at your character's camera so... If you stand within 5 meters of an enemy and shoot at them with the Daikyu, it'll miss them going just left, but if you place your reticle a little to the right of the enemy (as if to miss to the right) it'll hit them.

The above is a flaw in projectiles in general, but since the 'barrel' of the Javlok is longer than most other projectile weapons it's more pronounced for it.

 

Also I completely agree that the fireball needs a tiny blast radius to make the weapon more viable. It's already got the sound effects and visual effects for it, so I think it'd be fine to turn it into a tiny explosion on whatever it hits. It'd make up a little for the drawbacks that already make the weapon cumbersome (reload time, travel time, charge time, etc.)

Edit: Oh and I would LOVE if the weapon charged and held like the Daikyu does, for its fireballs that is.. Or at the very least, take off the charge and adjust the fire rate appropriately. It's hard enough leading targets without having to lead your target leading to compensate for a charge you can't hold...

Edited December 20, 2016 by Sennera

[Germoney_Hipster]

i like the sound of a magazine-less system where you keep firing until you run out of ammo :P

[The66Monkey]

Just got the research done in dojo. Javlok Capacitors????!!!!?!?!?!??!?!?! what the hell is this 5hit?

another rescource? STOP DE! when oxium released i thought it was bad to release another resource but i understood it. with kuva and nitain extracts and argon crystals and whatever else we have gotten since then it is getting stupid. give us a use for all the stuff we have instead of just adding new resources all the time.

[Sennera]

18 minutes ago, The66Monkey said:

-snip-

It's a blueprint part, which is a pretty common thing.

[Sennera]

The primary firing mechanic definitely needs a change.

The clunkiest part for me is that alongside leading my target, I have to lead my target leading to compensate for the charge time. Making it fire like the Daikyu where you have to fully charge but can hold the shot would definitely help. Aside from that, the small magazine for its reload time IS absolutely absurd.

Hell here's a better idea: the charge mechanic could be removed from primary fire entirely. Turn it into a semi-auto fireball lobber, give it an 18-round magazine (3 fireballs per 'bulb' on the magazine's model?) BAM your primary fire becomes viable and we get a sick fire based assault rifle.

 

_{oh and, get rid of the self damage and I'm sure no one will complain}

Edited December 20, 2016 by Sennera

[Trickster-_-]

In case someone has already made the following suggestions and request then please dont mind me repeating it again.. BUT.. If thats not the case then ....

Also apologies for the lengthy post .. please bear with it..

Straight to the point now then..

Javlok doesnt really work out well right now for the fire rate and reload rate it has .. instead of useing shred which may make the javlok kinda go thru walls and may be possible to get lost sometimes.. rarely.. It would be good to try and use fire rate mods like speed trigger and reload mods like primed fast hands to make it seem more like a semi auto rifle than anything else..

Temporary solution to actually make it more fun than it seem right now..

I ve used primed fast hands and speed trigger to make it fast .. but now I am using Spring-loaded chamber mod along with speed trigger to boost the fire rate to a level which make give some amount of satisfaction for the time being to players who have lost hope for javlok..

I definitely recommend fire rate mods like speed trigger and spring-loaded chamber for fire rate increase.. and primed fast hands to get a faster reload rate.. (1.4) along with this i suggest players to try using the default heat damage as it is .. meaning dont try to mix it with other elements to get gas of radiation or blast .. if you want u can use other combos with ur heat damage as default..example heat damage  + viral damage.....heat damage + corrosive damage.. ......heat + magnetic ...

Choice is yours but try to let the default heat damage to be as it is .. some how heat damage when left untouched actually makes the javlok more better in terms of actually hitting the enemies rather than missing the shots even with 100 accuracy..

Thats what I have done to make it more fun as a rifle for the time being .. kinda seems to be working well with fire rate and reload mods.. making it seem more like a rifle now..

And as for the spear, that needs some fixing for sure.. many are not happy with its projectile throw or its type of damage done..

According to many forum posts which i read on the topic of javlok, everyone wants a ragdoll effect for the javelin thrown at a group of enmies..

 

Here are some suggestions i had for the javelin thrown feature of the javlok..

- As players already suggested a rag-doll effect or at-least making the stronger enemies fall down to the ground to gv enough time to pick up the javlok..

- Radius of damage to be increased depending on the range of throw of the spear to the enemy groups..or enemy

- Range or radius of picking up the javlok to be increased to at-least 1 - 1.5 meters.. cos right now the warframe doesnt pick up the javlok even if it ran next to the javlok or anywhere near to it closely.. unless we actually made the warframe run right over the waypoint marker (or make the trigger button itself which we use for throw to retract it back)

- Most important for the way point or marker for picking up the javlok (the marker which shows where its thrown or where to find it after the throw) .. make the whole javlok glow in its full glory with some energy light or the energy light color we use for the weapon.. along with the way-point or the marker to find the thrown spear.. its kinda weird right now that the javlok cant be picked up even though the warframe runs right next to it or beside it.. its like we have to be accurate to actually go to the exact spot where its pierced into .. Please make the whole javlok glow with the energy color we assign to the weapon.. and also to make the pick up radius a bit more larger so the pick up is easier

- In case of javlok being lost through walls by some rare chance of punch thru into the wall.. its should return to the player on to the back so that we can just switch again back to our primary (I think this feature is already present if I am not wrong).

- The most asked or pleaded requests from players - SELF DAMAGE .. ha ha I kinda feel that since its a ranged weapon when being used a spear for the throw, its fair that the self damage is supposed to be implied .. but like i asked before.. the self damage could at-least be controlled by making the radius of explosion or self damage depend on the range of the spear thrown.. longer the throw bigger the radius of damage (plus may be could add 2x damage or 3x damage or 100 percent status damage.) this should kinda help out the self damage issue I think.. hope the players agree to this condition..

- Could it be possible for the heat slug or heat sludge or the heat flame shot from the javlok to actually leave like a patch of flames on the ground ? (similar to the Hayeka masters fire weapon that spews flaming patches of flame on the floor that deals damage to any who walk over it) something like that but for like 5-8 seconds (or at-least just the first and last shot of the clip to do that type of flaming effect or for the javelin throw damage effect also could work out well if it spewed some flames on the ground while we go and pick the javelin up).

.. Well these were some of my suggestions and requests based on my testing out of the javlok up until now..

For those who had the patience to read the whole post, thank you.

Hopefully DE gets to read this feed back and may be implement the few ideas I had for the spear throw and damage in general..

 

P.S.

Definitely needs some work on the accuracy issue of the weapon.. even with 100 accuracy it sometimes or should i dare to say, Most of the time, its doesnt really hit the target when shot..

The shots themselves need a crowd control damage in case players are using elemental combos such as blast or gas or viral.. I havent been able to get a good crowd control from the shots fired at enemies, instead it does gas damage to one enemy and the enemy behind them is not affected until the enemy in front actually falls to the ground.. I did use shred mod but right now the accuracy of the whole weapon is kinda not set right..

 

Thank You .. Hope the above suggestion make it a bit more fun for players with javlok right now.. and hope the requests also meet my fellow player's demands as well..

Thanks again..

 

[Brandr_]

I feel like shotgun mods may benefit this weapon more so than rifles. Just me though, all the unique weapons are rifle, so a new spin for a new weapon?

[----_Hayden_Tenno_----]

On 17.12.2016 at 4:59 AM, MushroomChevalier said:

80m damage

not sure if trolling or just saw overlapping numbers but this is not gonna happen.

 

On 17.12.2016 at 4:59 AM, MushroomChevalier said:

If I were in charge of making the Javlok a better weapon overall I would keep the stats where they are at right now, there is nothing wrong with them. My problem, however, is the mechanics for it and the enormous negative coming from Heavy Caliber. 

thank god u are not in charge, because this weapon is lacking something, they either change QoL stuff like mag size / reload speed or they simply buff this thing.

if u give us a new primary weapon, with a high risk potential on its alternative fire mode... then u better make sure its worth using, wich it isnt atm.

 

[StealthAzuma]

Also have you seen what a max heavy cal does to it if you put it on, you can't hit this side of a barnyard door with it compared to if you put a max heavy cal on say a flux rifle the beam wobbles but as for the javlok you are latterly throwing it and it feels like the tenno is going crosseyed every time he throws it. 

That idea of a heat slug or slag when you throw it a pretty cool idea because then its worth throwing but atm  its more of a downside then a upside of throwing it compared to just using the normal fire  as well theres little to no reason to throw it if its not going to do much to a enemy in the first place.

[MushroomChevalier]

10 minutes ago, ..-Hayden-Tenno-.. said:

not sure if trolling or just saw overlapping numbers but this is not gonna happen.

 

thank god u are not in charge, because this weapon is lacking something, they either change QoL stuff like mag size / reload speed or they simply buff this thing.

if u give us a new primary weapon, with a high risk potential on its alternative fire mode... then u better make sure its worth using, wich it isnt atm.

 

Well try it out and see for yourself, grab a Sonar Banshee and a Speed Nova and hit their weak spot, it may have been overlapping numbers but it seem pretty seamless to me when I hit that number.

So you give no info on how my idea was not adequate for you? The Magazine size and the reload speed don't affect me too badly, its simply called playing it smart and not reloading in front of a group of enemies. Plus the alternative fire does have some worth right now just to cheese some levels, Akkad for example when you go with a Gas build and toss the Javlok into that group of enemies, procs the gas and I see it do fairly enough damage to kill them in a speedy manner. 

Also its really easy to not die from the Alternative fire, its called not tossing it at an enemy 3 feet from your face. I suggest you work on your game play some more along with getting your thoughts out cause all you give out is vagueness.

[----_Hayden_Tenno_----]

5 hours ago, Trickster-_- said:

Choice is yours but try to let the default heat damage to be as it is .. some how heat damage when left untouched actually makes the javlok more better in terms of actually hitting the enemies rather than missing the shots even with 100 accuracy..

this is the biggest bs i read today....

if u mod this thing for grineer and dont go for viral+radiation u are a fool.

 

 

5 hours ago, Trickster-_- said:

- The most asked or pleaded requests from players - SELF DAMAGE .. ha ha I kinda feel that since its a ranged weapon when being used a spear for the throw, its fair that the self damage is supposed to be implied .. but like i asked before.. the self damage could at-least be controlled by making the radius of explosion or self damage depend on the range of the spear thrown.. longer the throw bigger the radius of damage (plus may be could add 2x damage or 3x damage or 100 percent status damage.) this should kinda help out the self damage issue I think.. hope the players agree to this condition..

if u cant handle selfdamage u should go back to the nubtube, aka tonkor.

 

 

5 hours ago, Trickster-_- said:

It would be good to try and use fire rate mods like speed trigger and reload mods like primed fast hands to make it seem more like a semi auto rifle than anything else..

nobody uses speed trigger.... u always go for vile acceleration... its always better in terms of DPS....

 

 

5 hours ago, Trickster-_- said:

- Most important for the way point or marker for picking up the javlok (the marker which shows where its thrown or where to find it after the throw) .. make the whole javlok glow in its full glory with some energy light or the energy light color we use for the weapon.. along with the way-point or the marker to find the thrown spear.. its kinda weird right now that the javlok cant be picked up even though the warframe runs right next to it or beside it.. its like we have to be accurate to actually go to the exact spot where its pierced into .. Please make the whole javlok glow with the energy color we assign to the weapon.. and also to make the pick up radius a bit more larger so the pick up is easie

we already have a big fat marker on minimap and on the thing itself, seriously dude.

 

5 hours ago, Trickster-_- said:

Definitely needs some work on the accuracy issue of the weapon.. even with 100 accuracy it sometimes or should i dare to say, Most of the time, its doesnt really hit the target when shot..

there is nothing wrong with the accuracy... not sure what u are doing wrong but this thing is pin point accurate. the only issue here is when u put on heavy caliber, wich decreases the accuracy way too much for some reason, this will probably be fixed on the next patch.

 

 

The javlok overall is fine, but imo is lacking damage and range on the throw, increase the damage/crit multiplier/chance and explosion radius and this thing is totally fine the way it is.

[----_Hayden_Tenno_----]

27 minutes ago, MushroomChevalier said:

Did I trigger you that badly?

lel, nah im just allergic to nonsense...  :)

 

27 minutes ago, MushroomChevalier said:

first of all the Mag size is 6 fire rate is not slow at all when you put in speedy trigger, its fairly instant. And before you talk about how slow the travel time is put in a terminal Velocity and it isn't slow at all. 

thats already 2 mods i need in order to make it somewhat usable.... and yes the mag size is 6, u happy now?^^

27 minutes ago, MushroomChevalier said:

Not every weapon needs every positive in order to be good, I'm sorry that you can't handle a few imperfections of a weapon in a game.

i never said it needs every positive in order to be good, but it should have atleast ONE good thing, and no... the nice throwing mechanic doesnt count. and i know how to handle downsides of weapons, my most used gun is the opticor wich has alot of them.

27 minutes ago, MushroomChevalier said:

Take the weapon with a gas build against the infested and it will do well, the Primary fire will help clear out some mods at 100+ but the throw in itself isn't good for the type of risk that it gives off.

yea right, gas for infested.... pls no more.... 

its sad that u dont even know what elements to use....*cough* corrosive+blast *couch*

 

27 minutes ago, MushroomChevalier said:

And it seems like youre the special snowflake since you cant take it when someone disagrees with you, sorry to offend you Dictator I'll try my best not to throw facts at you next time.

facts? u must be talking about the 80m damage on that infested ancient... WITH GAS DAMAGE PROBABLY LOL! http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Damage_2.0/Fossilized

 

27 minutes ago, MushroomChevalier said:

Also until you actually go with that kind of setup with a Banshee and a Nova you can't really say otherwise cause all your saying is that it can't happen when you have the resources to actually try it but refuse to waste your "precious" time doing a test to see if my statement stands tall. But yet again I typically don't run with that type of setup and it was just something that I had experienced, you really need to calm it down kid.

you my friend should calm down, since i think u feel a little offended just because im debunking your bs.

I dont need to test the whole banshee thing myself... i know it didnt happen.... i used sonar banshee alot and i know what kind of multipliers u can get with her, u would have trouble getting that kind of damage even with opticor or lanka, and those hit alot harder than the javlok.

 

27 minutes ago, MushroomChevalier said:

Maybe you should play roblox instead, I heard its a very fun game for children.

im 28 my friend.

and who are u to tell me what to play.

go play lego u sad excuse of a gamer,

because if u cant even get your elements right this whole game is maybe a bit too complicated.

 

edit: u had two valid point... this thing should've been a melee weapon and heavy caliber is weird

(wich will probably be fixed on the next patch anyway.) 

Edited December 20, 2016 by ..-Hayden-Tenno-..

[Sennera]

The problem with accuracy exists for ALL projectile based weapons. It's a long-standing issue that if you're within 5m of your target, you have to aim to the right of them to hit them otherwise your projectile will go left of them.

Projectiles begin their fight from wherever the 'muzzle' of your weapon is physically, so for a few meters the projectile flies to the left of your reticle which will obviously screw up your aim. You just have to practice aiming projectiles, preferably with a more forgiving weapon than the Javlok (take a bow).

 

The only problems I see with the Javlok right now are the charge mechanic, magazine capacity, fireball shots, and the self damage:

• Charging without a hold might be an okay mechanic for hitscan, but with the Javlok you have to lead your target leading to compensate for where the enemy will be when the shot fires. They love to change direction in the split second it takes to charge, and unlike bows (I use the Daikyu, mandatory charges ;'D) you can't hold the shot so you can't re-lead once it's charged.

The solution is to either make the charge hold-able, or remove the charge and give us a normal semi-auto fire mode. This thing isn't a bow, the charge is just a novel gimmick for the sake of novel gimmicks. (Where in comparison throwing an explosive spear is a fun gimmick for the sake of fun, AKA '-shwiiiinkBOOOOM-')

 

• Next up magazine capacity. 6 shots with 2 second reload is fine... if you're using a sniper rifle. Generally close-to-medium range weapons need at least mediocre magazine capacity OR a fast reload. Push the magazine capacity up to 18 (3 shots per 'bulb' on the Javlok's magazine model) and you have a reasonable capacity for a fireball caster/rifle, and a hefty reload to remind you you're using a heavy weapon.

 

• The fireball shots. Simply, they need some splash damage on them so you can hose down a hallway of enemies. It makes sense to have the big balls of fire make a little boom at the end, in fact they audibly/visually make a little boom already, it's just an empty boom right now though.

 

• Self-damage. This thing has an INSTANT explosion wherever it hits. It's completely unforgiving for mistakes and things beyond your control. Last night I had a team mate run right past me from offscreen as I threw the Javlok, catching the spear in his back right in my face. I couldn't see it coming, I had no chance of avoiding it, the self-damage I took would've killed a lesser warframe, it would've been too severe a punishment for something beyond my control. If the spear took a few seconds to explode (it can't because of its throw/return mechanics, where in some cases such as hitting a friendly it instantly returns) then self-damage would be reasonable.

Cap the self-damage, stick a stagger on it. There, I'm punished for throwing it at my feet, but I'm not outright killed just because a squad mate accidentally catches my spear in their back.

[RistN]

I expected too much from it...Stats and primary attack are ok.Secoundary attack however is total fail.It's AoE should be larger and self dmg it does makes it very hard to use.Self damage shouldn't even exist on it.

There is a strangely long animation when you throw it meaning that spear won't end up where is aimed when alt fire button is pushed but on a spot where your cursor was when animation ended.Also when throwing it, it has an arc and very slow flight speed meaning that if you want to throw it further you have to aim high and it takes forever to fall down.

This is a weapon with which you will most likely kill yourself and it's not practical weapon for fast paced game.

If self dmg was removed and thrown spear did some constant aoe dmg around it(like zenistar)or it had larger aoe it would be fun and useful.This way it's now it's just mastery fodder in my opinion.

[Jin_Kazama]

Self damage is fine, stop throwing it so close.

However anyone saying the damage is fine clearly only uses it for gas. Which limits it greatly buildwise. The fact that multishot doesn't affect it and heavy Calibur shuts it down so hard means it does no damage on throw.

 

AND LET'S GET IT A RIVEN ALREADY XD

[MushroomChevalier]

2 hours ago, RistN said:

I expected too much from it...Stats and primary attack are ok.Secoundary attack however is total fail.It's AoE should be larger and self dmg it does makes it very hard to use.Self damage shouldn't even exist on it.

There is a strangely long animation when you throw it meaning that spear won't end up where is aimed when alt fire button is pushed but on a spot where your cursor was when animation ended.Also when throwing it, it has an arc and very slow flight speed meaning that if you want to throw it further you have to aim high and it takes forever to fall down.

This is a weapon with which you will most likely kill yourself and it's not practical weapon for fast paced game.

If self dmg was removed and thrown spear did some constant aoe dmg around it(like zenistar)or it had larger aoe it would be fun and useful.This way it's now it's just mastery fodder in my opinion.

Yea I can see why it is considered mastery fodder but try it with Terminal Velocity and Speedy trigger and it does kind of well. Im not saying that its the best weapon out there just saying that it is somewhat viable to how it is now. I modded for Gas/Crit/Status and have the stats set as GAS: 2600 / STATUS: 78.1% / CRITICAL CHANCE/MULTIPLIER: 50% / 4.4x. and with the charge rate being about .19 seconds the Javlok can fire rapidly and with terminal velocity its about the same speed as a dread. 

For now it does seem pretty decent against infested but that it, it can't do anything towards Armored units even when modded for Corrosive. If you try out a build with stats similar to mine against the infested you'll be surprised how well it works.

[Ethedor]

yes javlok with heavy caliber must be a bug i mean, opticor and javlok has the same 100 accuracy point yet opticor can still fire without any noticable accuracy drop and when i used heavy caliber on javlok i was barely able to hit the enemy just in front of me!

i can only compare this weapon to an opticor... and oh boy it fails in every aspect

i hoped that javlok will have a chargeable shot increasing its dmg like with an opticor... but it does not sadly...

you attack with it, it charges one shot... around 0.3 sec... then it starts the projectile which will travel where you pointed it, so its not 100% that the target will be there after the charge time + projectile travel time... i mean... srsly guys? 

and it does not have a innate AOE dmg like the opticor has to compensate its low ammo/low fire rate which is very very sad

if only it would be more like the staff weapon from stargate... its idle animation is S#&$ty, its attack mod without zooming in is also S#&$ty one handed attack and its projectile model is a fireball... and not like in the stargate movies/series what we have seen
they should remodel it and make it look like a molotov cocktail instead!

and you can also can equip an adhesive blast mod on it which does... nothing :D

so Jaffa Kree to you DE

[Ethedor]

for me a weapon is either good at killing crowd of enemies efficiently like a Sobek with Acid shells and Shattering Justice (dont tell DE how OP it is and how its totally like an upgraded tonkor thx)

or a weapon is good at taking down bosses with high dmg per shot and stuff like an Opticor or a nice Twin grakatas with corrosive dmg

i cant put Javlok in either group which makes it useless

[MushroomChevalier]

14 minutes ago, Ethedor said:

yes javlok with heavy caliber must be a bug i mean, opticor and javlok has the same 100 accuracy point yet opticor can still fire without any noticable accuracy drop and when i used heavy caliber on javlok i was barely able to hit the enemy just in front of me!

i can only compare this weapon to an opticor... and oh boy it fails in every aspect

i hoped that javlok will have a chargeable shot increasing its dmg like with an opticor... but it does not sadly...

you attack with it, it charges one shot... around 0.3 sec... then it starts the projectile which will travel where you pointed it, so its not 100% that the target will be there after the charge time + projectile travel time... i mean... srsly guys? 

and it does not have a innate AOE dmg like the opticor has to compensate its low ammo/low fire rate which is very very sad

if only it would be more like the staff weapon from stargate... its idle animation is S#&$ty, its attack mod without zooming in is also S#&$ty one handed attack and its projectile model is a fireball... and not like in the stargate movies/series what we have seen
they should remodel it and make it look like a molotov cocktail instead!

and you can also can equip an adhesive blast mod on it which does... nothing :D

so Jaffa Kree to you DE

Yea there's no doubt that the Heavy Caliber on the Javlok is a bug, like I said if they end up fixing it to the point were it isnt so unbearable to use then it would make the weapon far more viable. The Primary attack should have a small AoE to it as well, makes it far more useful and the such just like the opticor. Also to compensate with the slow projectile speed just putting on Terminal Velocity helps out a bunch, to the point where it feels like Im trying to lead a bow shot. While the weapon in itself is lacking and has some terrible issues to it, its not the worst weapon out there and it can be worked around to be somewhat viable but only towards infested from what I tested.