Littlerift Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 1 minute ago, DatDarkOne said: It does when the punch takes them out. :D No, that just delays a later confrontation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DatDarkOne Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Littlerift said: No, that just delays a later confrontation. In my experience, it hasn't. edit: those who have no fear of retaliation continue to do such things. Once that fear has been established, ideas of retaliation usually cease. Edited January 25, 2017 by DatDarkOne added content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagPrime Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, trunks013 said: Wait what ? sorry guys i'm little late but what ? Honestly if some tenno has been rude to another tenno is bothering me. No matter if its Female , Male , White , Black , Yellow , Red , Purple with orange dots or even an attack helicopter. I dont care. One should not be rude against someone else. This is a game some tenno may need a reminder that we play game for fun not to get insulted by someone else. I with a lot of my fellow tenno highly disaprove with this kind of behaviour. No tenno should hide who they are in fear of being insulted freely over the internet by some stranger who hide behind the fact that you dont know him/her. Put them on ignore list or report them. SOMEONE CLONE THIS PERSON!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gr33hn Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 1 minute ago, DatDarkOne said: In my experience, it hasn't. Same here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnccs215 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 3 minutes ago, Littlerift said: No, that just delays a later confrontation. it is true. Specially when done to people who see violence as a legitimate alternative, it tends to fuel their... Extremism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlerift Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 15 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said: In my experience, it hasn't. edit: those who have no fear of retaliation continue to do such things. Once that fear has been established, ideas of retaliation usually cease. I don't much care for anecdotes, although if that's what we're doing then I can recall around 3 incidents of bullying in which retaliation lead to much more damage being done to the victim. But hey, playing the internet tough guy who doesn't take no nonsense is cooler, so lets just stick with that. Why bother with trying to take a nuanced stance on the psychological basis for bullying, or try to understand the social entanglements that bullying typically entails - the old wives tale of "Just sock 'em in the mouth" is perfectly good enough, I'm sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Akeva-Banshee- Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) My best advice for avoiding this bad behavior is to join a clan that has at least some of the following principles. Unity, Cooperation, Understanding and selflessness. These traits are hard to find in a clan but when you do the amount of salt you see in the game from other players goes down tremediously. Also I recommend disabling Region Chat. Edited January 25, 2017 by -Akeva-Banshee- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gr33hn Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 15 minutes ago, Littlerift said: I don't much care for anecdotes, although if that's what we're doing then I can recall around 3 incidents of bullying in which retaliation lead to much more damage being done to the victim. But hey, playing the internet tough guy who doesn't take no nonsense is cooler, so lets just stick with that. Why bother with trying to take a nuanced stance on the psychological basis for bullying, or try to understand the social entanglements that bullying typically entails - the old wives tale of "Just sock 'em in the mouth" is perfectly good enough, I'm sure. I have to ask, have you been bullied? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlerift Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 Just now, VikingoX said: I have to ask, have you been bullied? Not that it's any of your business, or relevant, but not personally no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trunks013 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) 2 minutes ago, VikingoX said: I have to ask, have you been bullied? Been there and i can tell you from my personal percpective i wish that to no-one. Its actualy easy to see on some people from their way to interact with other or the life experience they have. Edited January 25, 2017 by trunks013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DatDarkOne Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Littlerift said: But hey, playing the internet tough guy who doesn't take no nonsense is cooler, so lets just stick with that. Being an internet tough guy and taking no nonsense in real life are not the same. The former is a lie, while the Later isn't. Only fools continue to do things after knowing they can be hurt doing them. I recall all of my bullies growing up. Each one of them cease being a bully to me once they realized I would not be an easy target. I have experienced it, have seen the effects too many times, and I've even seen women do it (quite well too). You shouldn't assume that someone is playing the "internet tough guy" because their experience is different than yours. I'm just a old man who will not suffer fools. :D Edited January 25, 2017 by DatDarkOne added content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagPrime Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 42 minutes ago, Littlerift said: No, that just delays a later confrontation. In my experience, it doesn't always. When I was in school, I was always the new kid, because we were moving constantly, and having a brother that ran around yelling "I'm an alien!" and a sister that spent most of her life with her nose in a book. Just one of those will get you bullied, imagine having All three! I can honestly say that being the one to land the first and last punch will end a lot of issues before they start. I became the kid you didnt mess with, and you didn't mess with my siblings or friends. Not proud of it, but there is a...primal? mechanic to bullying that sometimes extreme violence solves. And that's mainly due to kids find that words hurt other people and gives them a sense of power, but only because they're lacking confidence, usually in a physical area and they have been bullied for it as well. 7 minutes ago, Littlerift said: Not that it's any of your business, or relevant, but not personally no. It is somewhat relevant, it's hard to say "talking works best in this situation" when you've never been in said situation. Please don't feel like I'm trying to start a right or belittle you, I actually have a lot of respect for you based on seeing you about the forums, I'm just offering my view from being on the receiving end of bullying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnccs215 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 1 hour ago, Littlerift said: I think it's possible to make bullying and harassment more scarce within society, but I don't think school can do that - at least not primary schools. The issue with primary school children is that they're not entirely socially developed (although this is true until about the age of 21), which means that interventions into directly changing behaviour tend to be less effective. It's also important to note that bullying tends to be a group activity - I've never encountered a case of bullying wherein the bully was acting alone, or acting without a chorus of friends who supported his/her actions either. If there's going to be change regarding bullying then it'll occur in later life, in my view, and it'll arise in full form in a generation of children who're born to a generation who already have taken on these beliefs - much like how racism and sexism will be defeated (hopefully, as you say, the global climate is cycling back towards the hideous tribalism of our ancestors). I'm from the UK, for the record, although the school I'm working in currently is making use of the rather vague national curriculum to try to import some methodologies from Finnish and Singaporean pedagogy rather than relying on the rather... err... stout and rigid systems that are typical here. I was very impressed by our school's Online Education programme, which focused on a lot of these issues, and the children I work with are notably less accepting of bullying and other harassment than children were when I was in school. I think we're moving in the right direction, but as with all of these things progress is made generationally not intrapersonally. Leopards rarely change their spots, but evolution can do what it likes. Edit: ^ I would comment on the obvious idiocy of what TheZathel is saying, but I fear I'd be wasting my breath; as I said, leopards rarely change their spots. mh... Then I suppose I have to had some details: When I meant changes to education, I was mostly referring to elementary and high school, not as much primary -- or, better saying, I think a longitudinal effort, taking place all throughout the full stay of a person on school, and not one only focused on a particular stage, will hold the most results. I am aware of how prejudice and stigmatization start very soon on a child's life, but they do are strengthened and specified on the teens, when their views of the world, people, and themselves really start to ground. Focusing on a constant support throughout one's growth is much more likely to prevent and combat toxic behaviour, as well as lessen their effects. Though I cannot present sources, I do believe bullying and harassment taking place on later life (post teens), specially online bullying, does tend to be mainly made by a sole person -- though I cannot disprove, dismiss nor diacredit the idea that they are supported by a "chorus", be it by an actual group of friends, or simply the belief that what they are doing is acceptable or, worse, "cool". My point of using societies view of these actions as a way to discourage them focused on that exactly -- remove the support, and the bullying won't happen. I do am happy that the schools you work with are taking advantage of said vagueness in order to introduce what I believe (based on some psychology classes I took) is top-of-the-line education. I also hope they will bear the fruits they are meant to, and that the positive effects you are seeing on those children ciment themselves and continue to show. I do am aware some schools take advantage of that very same vagueness to propagate retrograde ideals, which is not pleasant at all, however. I am portuguese, and I only have so much experience on the education here present, as well as some very superficial knowledge on US's, UK's, and Finish's educational systems. School plans in here are somewhat more standardized than what it seems to be there, though private schools usually take some additional "liberties" on their programs. We have little focus on moral and civism -- which in my school were lectured through EMRC -- educação moral religiosa e católica or "moral, religious and catholic education -- which is optional for schools to give and students to take, due to its religious nature, but let's just say that there was a lot of insinuated pressure for students to take said classes; and EC --educação cívica or civic education -- which was subpar at its best, usually focusing more on studying employment and etiquette over analyzing discriminatory practices, morality, or society in general. I do have to say sexual education was neatly mixed with Biology and EC, since we did learn with great profoundity how sexual organs and pregnancy work, and how to take care of them. Little analysis of sexism however, and I later discovered my school was an exception in its rather acceptable curriculum of sexual education. EC was removed from the program soon after I started college, replaced by arguing and debate -- whose program I have yet to check, but judging by my younger siblings mentality, it doesn't focus much on the issues in question. Bullying is, in general, poorly dealt with. Taking measures against it is purely optional for teachers and responsibles, which means I know of schools that deal with it rather well, and schools were suicides aren't uncommon. Private schools, specially religious, are an even trickier issue. Though sexual segregation is forbidden, many schools will actively desincourage girls and boys from playing together, ranging from separating them, to shaming the children that do (got a friend who, on the fifth grade, was repeatedly called a @#&* for being friends with a boy). all in all, from what I know and experienced, its not enough, downright bad in some cases, but might still be better than a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmatt3r Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 Use discord , way better . in game voice is meh.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagPrime Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 3 minutes ago, Darkmatt3r said: Use discord , way better . in game voice is meh.. Discord is where the issues are occuring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnccs215 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, Noamuth said: Discord is where the issues are occuring. IIRC, its an "also" case, not the sole issue. dealing with stuff like this on discord tends to be easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmatt3r Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Noamuth said: Discord is where the issues are occuring. just create a private discord Or just make one Edited January 25, 2017 by Darkmatt3r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagPrime Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 4 minutes ago, tnccs215 said: IIRC, its an "also" case, not the sole issue. dealing with stuff like this on discord tends to be easier. True, but IIRC, it's mainly Discord. OP mentioned repeat offenders and not having any way of dealing with them. 2 minutes ago, Darkmatt3r said: just create a private discord Or just make one Reread the opening post. OP and their friend are playing on a Warframe Discord server and is experiencing issues there as well as in game. And we're back to "we shouldn't be forced into hiding because other people refuse to not be jerks" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tnccs215 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 Regarding bullying and "punching back" I trust this is a much more complex thing then simply "it always works" or "it never works" from what I've experienced and seen, it depends a lot on the bully, the victim, the environment, culture, and the nature of the bullying. The fear of retaliation, both in the bully and the victim, play a big part, as well as the probability of an exterior person (usually an authority) stepping in. Noa's case is a good way on how it may work, but should the bully not feel any form of threat in the victim, the probability of retalion escalates immensely. For example, in the case of sexual harassment as bullying, made by someone who does not feel threatened at all, can lead either to be coined as a "crazy *@##$", "stupid %&^", or even rape. Giving a personal example, it took me nothing but to look to a bully of mine in the eyes to be left with my nose open. Honestly, its such a tricky thing I believe it usually must be observed case by case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmatt3r Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 Just now, Noamuth said: True, but IIRC, it's mainly Discord. OP mentioned repeat offenders and not having any way of dealing with them. Reread the opening post. OP and their friend are playing on a Warframe Discord server and is experiencing issues there as well as in game. And we're back to "we shouldn't be forced into hiding because other people refuse to not be jerks" If they are OP's friends then they should talk to them about their action which resulting this fiasco . Take SS or make a vid regarding it & contact support about it. Toxic players should get the punishment they deserve . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagPrime Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 Just now, Darkmatt3r said: If they are OP's friends then they should talk to them about their action which resulting this fiasco . Take SS or make a vid regarding it & contact support about it. Toxic players should get the punishment they deserve . Read. The. Posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmatt3r Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) 1 minute ago, Noamuth said: Read. The. Posts. i will give it a read again >.> Edit : Men will be men , try to ignore or report , thats what i have to say , not everyone is same but FeelsBadMan . Edited January 25, 2017 by Darkmatt3r Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DatDarkOne Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 2 minutes ago, tnccs215 said: Regarding bullying and "punching back" I trust this is a much more complex thing then simply "it always works" or "it never works" from what I've experienced and seen, it depends a lot on the bully, the victim, the environment, culture, and the nature of the bullying. The fear of retaliation, both in the bully and the victim, play a big part, as well as the probability of an exterior person (usually an authority) stepping in. Noa's case is a good way on how it may work, but should the bully not feel any form of threat in the victim, the probability of retalion escalates immensely. For example, in the case of sexual harassment as bullying, made by someone who does not feel threatened at all, can lead either to be coined as a "crazy *@##$", "stupid %&^", or even rape. Giving a personal example, it took me nothing but to look to a bully of mine in the eyes to be left with my nose open. Honestly, its such a tricky thing I believe it usually must be observed case by case. I can agree with this. Kudos on giving another way of seeing things. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gr33hn Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) ------------ Edited January 28, 2017 by VikingoX -Too personal- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trunks013 Posted January 25, 2017 Share Posted January 25, 2017 (edited) 7 minutes ago, tnccs215 said: Regarding bullying and "punching back" I trust this is a much more complex thing then simply "it always works" or "it never works" from what I've experienced and seen, it depends a lot on the bully, the victim, the environment, culture, and the nature of the bullying. The fear of retaliation, both in the bully and the victim, play a big part, as well as the probability of an exterior person (usually an authority) stepping in. Noa's case is a good way on how it may work, but should the bully not feel any form of threat in the victim, the probability of retalion escalates immensely. For example, in the case of sexual harassment as bullying, made by someone who does not feel threatened at all, can lead either to be coined as a "crazy *@##$", "stupid %&^", or even rape. Giving a personal example, it took me nothing but to look to a bully of mine in the eyes to be left with my nose open. Honestly, its such a tricky thing I believe it usually must be observed case by case. Yep its situational. Before becoming a ... i think the more precise translation is "Freak" but anyway. Before that i pushed back and they were waiting for me after school( 30 of them ). Got me in trouble because i was dump enough to go see the principal. He came with me open the door and noticed the little crowd. Then thats the funny part. "C'est pas mon problème" he gave me a gentle push outside and closed the door. So yeah unless you push rly hard if the entire place is against you. You will endup prety badly. Btw my mother got the same answer from the cops at the hospital. Edited January 25, 2017 by trunks013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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