Problems with AI and their Correlation to Improper Stealth

[Arniox]

I used to enjoy warframe specifically for its stealth. But with recent patches to the AI system in general and how it notices changes in the environment. There is not an easier or even useful way for me to do proper stealth anymore. For a game all about being a ninja in space, it feels dissimilar. For this reason, I would like to start a discussion on this topic.

 - They are able to notice you anywhere you go, no matter where you go. This means that even if you're hiding and standing perfectly still either behind a rock, a boulder, or a stack of boxes; the AI still somehow, notice you and start firing immediately after seeing you. Completely breaking the stealth immersion that I oh so dearly miss about warframe. Somehow, all rest of the enemies within the mission immediately know exactly where you are and proceed to fire directly at you and set the alarms. It would be largely appreciated if you guys over at DE could work on a system that means when one enemy finds you, he doesn't alert everyone else in the entire map. For balancing issues, the enemies around the target/victim would become alerted (red arrow with small, red arrow inside it. Not full red arrow). If you can kill the enemy quick enough, then the mission quickly returns to stealth.

 - When they notice a body, they immediately turn around and shoot directly at you. Now this doesn't happen all the time, they'll usually go to check the body and their arrow on the minimap will turn to the arrow within the arrow. Meaning they are alert. However, sometimes, they will turn around and shoot straight at you without consideration of positioning. They also do this without checking the body they were going to investigate or doing anything else. Again, completely breaking stealth.

 - The stealth itself is extremely weak and only held on the barest of legs. The stealth mechanic is very fun and immersive when it works, however, it's very weak. The slightest notice from enemies or the barest hint that you exist sets them off and completely breaks the mission. I noticed this when I played TWW quest. In the quest, you are required to be stealthy, or at least; it's an option. However, it's so easy to break. You got spotted easily, and once they notice you: the whole stealth concept breaks and turns into a boring exterminate. That's why I used alt-f4 about 20 times during TWW and started from the start over 20 times, just because I wanted that perfect stealth mission. I love stealth (you can probably tell at this point).

 - There is no way to very quickly calm everything down and return to stealth. As soon as the alarms sound off, all you can do is shut them down, and then go and hide in a corner for a couple mins on the other side of the map. Eventually, they forget about you. It's extremely annoying and for most exterminates where I want to farm XP or something similar, I can't go through the entire mission unseen (which is what I would really enjoy having the ability of).
They can and will spot you in all sorts of positions that you never thought possible to be visible. There have been so many times I have completely aborted and restarted the mission due to the enemies just seeing me and going berserk instantly and giving no time to cool them down or stealth kill them. A solution for this would be blind or cc abilities actually blind enemies and thus remove all notice of you as a player.
An example of this would be when you use equinox, you could sleep some enemies and remove any notice they had of you so that you can stealth them. This would be particularly useful in stealth exterminates so as to quickly stop enemies from shooting or warning others. You could sleep the group that saw you and then continue the mission relatively re-established as a stealth god.

 

TL;DR: Please fix stealth. Thank you.

 

Anyways, thanks for reading my spiel and I hope you can understand where I'm coming from and how annoying it is to try to enjoy turning a boring mission into a fun, hide and seek stealth mission.

 

In regards - Arniox

Edited March 16, 2017 by Arniox

[SilvaDreams]

So long story short... You need to "git gud"

Because if anything they made stealth more realistic. I and Many others can do stealth without an issue.

Worried about a body being seen, use a channeled attack and it vaporizes the body.

Edited March 16, 2017 by SilvaDreams

[Mk.1]

@Arniox Sorry this isn't on topic, but what Glyph is that and how can I obtain one?

[SilvaDreams]

5 minutes ago, Mk_1 said:

@Arniox Sorry this isn't on topic, but what Glyph is that and how can I obtain one?

Likely a partnered YouTube or streamers glyph.

[Mk.1]

1 minute ago, SilvaDreams said:

Likely a partnered YouTube or streamers glyph.

I was wondering whose it was.

[Arniox]

3 minutes ago, Mk_1 said:

I was wondering whose it was.

Sure. It's VVhite_Angle's. he's a french streamer. Took me ages to get his. I just went to his discord and asked him for one (he also speaks English). He told me he might give me one in the future after doing a bunch of other giveaways. I eventually forgot about it and a few months later, he randomly pm'ed me and sent me a code. :P

The fast way is to support him on his french version of patreon. Forgot what it was called. Tipeee I think.

20 minutes ago, SilvaDreams said:

So long story short... You need to "git gud"

Because if anything they made stealth more realistic. I and Many others can do stealth without an issue.

Worried about a body being seen, use a channeled attack and it vaporizes the body.

 

lol. g8 m8. Tbh, I wouldn't mind the current system if there was a specific stealth mission. Like how there's exterminate, defence and others. Not counting spy. Would be cool to have a stealth mission of some kind.

[SeaUrchins]

Yep, stealth's broken with enemies standing idle on their spawn points, wandering into walls or appearing right in front of you. I hardly think it will change though, you're supposed to run around like a headless chicken causing commotion and shooting everything. Ninjas, you know.

Edited March 16, 2017 by SeaUrchins

[Yaerion]

4 hours ago, Arniox said:

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Disappeared from General Discussion and reappeared, covered in blood, in Feedback]General.

[ChuckMaverick]

Side-note: The new Ferrox is amazing for stealth runs with its high single-shot damage, punch through and instantly vaporising enemies on death.

[Arniox]

8 hours ago, ChuckMaverick said:

Side-note: The new Ferrox is amazing for stealth runs with its high single-shot damage, punch through and instantly vaporising enemies on death.

Oh OK.  Cool :) good to know. I chucked 3 forma on that bad boy as soon as I got it. It's so good. 

8 hours ago, Yaerion said:

Disappeared from General Discussion and reappeared, covered in blood, in Feedback]General.

Kek. OK mod :)

[MobyTheDuck]

My problems with the current stealth system are:

- Killing a large amount of enemies in a single hit breaks/ends the stealth multiplier, because one enemy can notice the other dying within nanoseconds of it happening.

- Enemies can detect THEMSELVES being killed.

- When using multishot weapons, unless a SINGLE BULLET kills the target, it breaks stealth and ends your multiplier.

[Arniox]

2 hours ago, MobyTheDuck said:

My problems with the current stealth system are:

- Killing a large amount of enemies in a single hit breaks/ends the stealth multiplier, because one enemy can notice the other dying within nanoseconds of it happening.

- Enemies can detect THEMSELVES being killed.

- When using multishot weapons, unless a SINGLE BULLET kills the target, it breaks stealth and ends your multiplier.

Yeah I noticed that problem with bullet detection. They somehow notice when you kill them without using stealth take-down. If you kill them normally with a slide attack or gun, they notice themselves dieing and break stealth. And they notice you killing others around then within a split second. It's annoying.