Sniper fix idea

[Fallen_Echo]

I think everybody knows what's are the main problems with snipers but if not heres a list:

1. hip-fire accuracy is technically zero
2. most maps are unfit for sniper gameplay
3. their limited mag size, firerate and reload speed makes them unsuitable for this game

So im going to suggest the easies way for DE to fix it, another band-aid mods.

The Targeting Subsystems

This mod does 3 things:

1. Adds 60% bonus damage and 2 meter punchthrought on a headshot for the next shot stacks infinietly as long as the player scores headshots (not kills, just headshots)
2. When the bonus is added the next shot drains ammo directly from the reserve and ignores the magazine and the firerate
3. Hidden bonus, this mod places a small mark on the enemy head when you filled the codex entry for that enemy

 

The Null Precision

This mod just like the upper does 

1. It removes the ability to zoom in or accumulate combo
2. Removes headshot damage bonus
3. Increases damage by 100% and grants 100% hipfire accuracy
4. Incomnpatible with the Targeting Subsystems

Edited May 14, 2017 by Fallen_Echo

[Acersecomic]

Funny, I have zero problems performing with a sniper and easily content with everyone else in terms of damage and kills, except when someone slides around with maiming strike and maxed reach on Atterax.

[Xardis]

Adding mods would be the same as fixing frame by adding augments. What needs to happen is a in built punch through and change the combo system so it lasts +2 more sec at base and doesnt decay with missed shots. As to bonuses while scoped - scrap them, instead make it so that it shows headshots like you suggested and makes them slightly easier to score.

[Fallen_Echo]

16 minutes ago, Xardis said:

Adding mods would be the same as fixing frame by adding augments. What needs to happen is a in built punch through and change the combo system so it lasts +2 more sec at base and doesnt decay with missed shots. As to bonuses while scoped - scrap them, instead make it so that it shows headshots like you suggested and makes them slightly easier to score.

I suggested these becuase i believe DE would rather add in some more bandaid mods than admit that the sniper rework was a failure and created more problems.

[Jackviator]

On 5/14/2017 at 5:30 AM, Fallen_Echo said:

I suggested these becuase i believe DE would rather add in some more bandaid mods than admit that the sniper rework was a failure and created more problems.

So keep giving feedback on how it's a failure and created more problems then. Otherwise it might never get fixed.

As for suggesting more band-aid mods... No. Just... no. No more Body Counts. No more Harkonar Scopes. No more Primed Regens. They need to actually fix issues at the source, don't encourage them to keep doing otherwise.

In short: Innate punch-through, longer combo timer, reliable hipfire accuracy, and no more scope shaking at longer zoom ranges. Plz DE, I'm begging you.

Edited May 17, 2017 by Jackviator

[TaylorsContraction]

6 hours ago, Acersecomic said:

Funny, I have zero problems performing with a sniper and easily content with everyone else in terms of damage and kills, except when someone slides around with maiming strike and maxed reach on Atterax.

Pretty much this.  The only thing I'd like at this point is for them to remove the hip fire accuracy loss.

[Acersecomic]

2 hours ago, TaylorsContraction said:

Pretty much this.  The only thing I'd like at this point is for them to remove the hip fire accuracy loss.

But if they remove the hip-fire penalty then it just turns into a rifle instead of being a sniper. I understand there are more mechanics defining snipers as snipers like damage multipliers on zoom and combos but the whole schtic of snipers is scoping in for a kill.

[Bobtm]

I'm not in agreement with almost anything in the first post.  Hip-fire accuracy should be improved on snipers so that closer range encounters aren't so additionally unwieldly.  Aside that, they're not in near as bad a spot as folks seem to think they are.  If we were to get the weapon swap speed increase that we should have gotten years ago, then things would be golden.  Having to not wait a painfully long time to swap weapons would lend more benefit to this choice, since you wouldn't feel so bogged down when deciding to change up which weapon you're using.

Our base weapon swap speed should, honestly, be tripled of what it is now.  Warframe isn't a sluggish game, yet slower paced games have way faster swap speeds than what we have.

Snipers as a class are not going to be your efficient choice in a game like Warframe, that is a given.  However we have a loadout for a reason.  Having a very hard hitting sniper rifle has its advantages as part of a set of gear, especially so if you've chosen to be either a tank or CC frame.  They also work nice when paired with a faster secondary or a melee that counterbalances the slowness that is the sniper class of weaponry.

A favorite current combination of my own is the Rubico and the Pandero.  Not only do they have similar sounding names, but they also have the same aesthetic style and off-set the advantages and disadvantages of the other.

8 hours ago, Xardis said:

As to bonuses while scoped - scrap them, instead make it so that it shows headshots like you suggested and makes them slightly easier to score.

That's a terrible idea.  Headshots being highlighted is of no benefit, and scope bonuses are of notable benefit.  Outside of a very small few enemies, their head is the knob between their shoulders, and on their neck (except when they have no neck) which means you're advocating the loss of a strong bonus in favor of a cosmetic and useless gain.  We already have a hit-marker that denotes a headshot by flashing red.  Just watch that marker when making shots and learn a headshot location if you don't already know it.

Then, once you do know the headshot location, you know it and don't even have to be concerned.

9 minutes ago, Acersecomic said:

But if they remove the hip-fire penalty then it just turns into a rifle instead of being a sniper. I understand there are more mechanics defining snipers as snipers like damage multipliers on zoom and combos but the whole schtic of snipers is scoping in for a kill.

They're still a sniper even if you aren't using their scope.  All the hip-fire accuracy loss does is make them unnecessarily unwieldly.  If you compare them to the class of burst fire or semi-auto weapons in the game, the snipers would not overshadow/overpower them merely by having good accuracy from the hip.

The existing scope bonuses of the snipers already grant enough of a benefit to entice the player to use that scope for maximum output on their shots.  There's no reason to impose a penalty on a player who may not desire to use that benefit during a closer range encounter.

[TaylorsContraction]

51 minutes ago, Acersecomic said:

But if they remove the hip-fire penalty then it just turns into a rifle instead of being a sniper. I understand there are more mechanics defining snipers as snipers like damage multipliers on zoom and combos but the whole schtic of snipers is scoping in for a kill.

No it doesn't because it will always retain its advantage at range.  I always snipe enemies when possible.  Watching my teammates rush of into the distance with most enemies dea's by the time they get there.

There are times I need to use a scope and there's the other 70%of the time when I don't.  Quick scoping is no fun but that's what I do for now to kill enemies at point blank range.  Not going to risk missing a round by hip firing and dying.

[Fallen_Echo]

10 hours ago, Acersecomic said:

But if they remove the hip-fire penalty then it just turns into a rifle instead of being a sniper. I understand there are more mechanics defining snipers as snipers like damage multipliers on zoom and combos but the whole schtic of snipers is scoping in for a kill.

Well they are called sniper rifle for a reason. Also it doesnt make sense that i can accurately launch rockets, deathbeams and shot with all kinds of rifles but suddenly when i get a sniper in my hand i lose my ability to be accurate.

 

10 hours ago, Bobtm said:

That's a terrible idea.  Headshots being highlighted is of no benefit, and scope bonuses are of notable benefit

Well this effect could be removed from my mod suggestion as its just a hidden bonus. The main point of the first mod is to make snipers into a skill rewarding powerful weapon.

60% bonus damage, 2m punchtrought, infinite fire rate and direct ammo consume as long as someone is able to score headshots is pretty encuraging.

The second one is there for those who just want to use snipers as semi-auto rifles.

I doubt that DE will ever change the hipfire accuracy on them, but lets hope.

[Acersecomic]

4 hours ago, Fallen_Echo said:

Well they are called sniper rifle for a reason. Also it doesnt make sense that i can accurately launch rockets, deathbeams and shot with all kinds of rifles but suddenly when i get a sniper in my hand i lose my ability to be accurate.

It's a matter of classifying, not logic.

[70five]

If you ask me, I'd say the hallmark of snipers is that they are so powerful that they can take out targets WITHOUT getting a headshot (as is typical in most shooters nowadays). In theory this SHOULD be accomplished by the sniper combo... but the feature is so impractical and unreliable to maintain that you can't rely on it.

Some kind of punch through could also be nice... perhaps 2m of punch through on nullifier bubles??

...maybe snipers will be fixed when a sniper frame is released? *cough* hint DE *cough*

[DSpite]

21 hours ago, Acersecomic said:

But if they remove the hip-fire penalty then it just turns into a rifle instead of being a sniper. I understand there are more mechanics defining snipers as snipers like damage multipliers on zoom and combos but the whole schtic of snipers is scoping in for a kill.

You could easily add the mechanic that Sniper rifles use specialized rounds. Even in RL, there is extremely small caliber ammo fired from larger casings that give the ammunition extremely long and flat trajectories, with the negative side effect that they have very small kinetic energy. This means that you can get a kill shot through a vital point - like an eye socket, or a weak point in Armor - but at the same time, hits anywhere where there is even a SMALL amount of armor? Low or no penetration.

You trade distance and accuracy over raw kinetic kill energy.

Our sniper rounds could be like that, with increased lethality when striking crit spots, reduced damage elsewhere, with the trade-off of infinite range, hit-scan, and removing sway, maybe with the added disadvantage of not been able to crit at all unless zoomed ... or something.