Instant death proc in the Index is simply bad by design

[Fser]

I just killed by ????? and had all my chips in the Index taken and scored by enemy AI.

My digital avatar just stood in awe from how bad that "feature" is by design. 

I lost the game. Lost 140k credits too, and since I'm out of credits and I want to clear the quests, I'm going to waste life farming mindlessly at Akkar or something. 

"Sabotage!" said the NPC. No, it was just a stupid design choice that got the pass.

How anybody thought this was a good idea is just beyond me. It's not mischievous, it's just plain stupid.

[Fiftycentis]

you have to fail it once, then you don't even have to spend more creds on that quests

and for credits is better the index than akkad or any other mission

Edited August 13, 2017 by Fiftycentis

[Fser]

Just now, Fiftycentis said:

you have to do it once, then you don't even have to spend more creds on that quests

and for credits is better the index than akkad or any other mission

It does not change the fact that the proc is ridiculously stupid. I've read that winning by "too much" also kicks you out, disqualifies you and robs you of credits.

The Index to me now seems like just a stir-fry of bad ideas.

[Tali]

Is it in the Glast Gambit quest ? and if thats the case, in the last one you will die automatically every time you try to score. The enemy will win that one no matter what, but that is a part of the quest itself.

[Fiftycentis]

1 minute ago, Fser said:

It does not change the fact that the proc is ridiculously stupid. I've read that winning by "too much" also kicks you out, disqualifies you and robs you of credits.

The Index to me now seems like just a stir-fry of bad ideas.

only in the quest, you have one step when you don't have to go over 10 points of advantage, then the one that you have to lose

but then, in normal index 150k requires 2 missions that lasts 5 minutes each or less

[Fser]

2 minutes ago, Fiftycentis said:

only in the quest, you have one step when you don't have to go over 10 points of advantage, then the one that you have to lose

but then, in normal index 150k requires 2 missions that lasts 5 minutes each or less

I'm not on the 160k credits part yet. I got robbed of my victory on the part prior, the one without the victory margin. 

I did not come here to seek help. I wouldn't have posted on the feedback forum if I needed assistance.

This is where players provide feedback for the game.

And I'm here to tell DE that I find this particular design choice incredibly bad, and wish they could remove it so other player will not have to suffer from it.

[Fiftycentis]

i think that when the quest came out there was full of people blaming for that quest part... still, that part is still there, because it's part of the quest, removing it would mean remake the quest, and it's not that easy

[Fser]

2 minutes ago, Fiftycentis said:

i think that when the quest came out there was full of people blaming for that quest part... still, that part is still there, because it's part of the quest, removing it would mean remake the quest, and it's not that easy

I'm referring solely to the instant death proc, which I imagine wouldn't be difficult to disable.

[Epsik-kun]

Yes, Glast Gambit is an absolutely terrible piece of garbage combining a variety of tremendously obnoxious decisions and is probably the worst thing DE ever made.

That being said, the actual concept of the match being sabotaged is just bad which means it isn't among the worst parts of the quest. It also doesn't carry over to the actual Index, as it's a quest-only feature.

[Rawbeard]

kinda funny, reminds me of the "perma death" warning in Hellblade. I assume you have sound and text disabled, so you completely missed the story going on while ???????? kills you.

[BaIthazar]

52 minutes ago, Fser said:

I'm referring solely to the instant death proc, which I imagine wouldn't be difficult to disable.

the instant death proc is part of the quests story.

completing the mission should give you a new mission to sabotage the sabotage

once you complete the Glast Gambit you won't have to worry about the death proc or victory margin ever again.

again, it might be a stupid mechanic (I don't deny that)
BUT IT IS PART OF THE STORY OF THE QUEST

it's an effective way to show that Nef Anyo is a cheating son-of-a-Phorid
if you are complaining about it that must mean that you have not been paying attention to the quest dialogue

Edited August 13, 2017 by BaIthazar

[Fser]

9 minutes ago, BaIthazar said:

the instant death proc is part of the quests story.

completing the mission should give you a new mission to sabotage the sabotage

once you complete the Glast Gambit you won't have to worry about the death proc or victory margin ever again.

again, it might be a stupid mechanic (I don't deny that)
BUT IT IS PART OF THE STORY OF THE QUEST

it's an effective way to show that Nef Anyo is a cheating son-of-a-Phorid
if you are complaining about it that must mean that you have not been paying attention to the quest dialogue

I am complaining because it is a stupid mechanic. It is stupid. You agree it is stupid. It shouldn't be this stupid. Even if I could recite every word in the quest dialogue, it doesn't make this quest any less stupid. 

[Fser]

I just lost in the 160k part. Thanks to the victory margin, which is also incredibly dumb, I lost at the very last second. If you put such ridiculous restrictions in the quest, you shouldn't have set the entrance fee that high. This is highly annoying to the common player. I have lost 300k credits here, credits I farmed using my time and credits that could be better spent elsewhere.

This part of the quest had so little thought put into it while it was in development, it should be made into a case study and be sent to game design classes to educate new game developers what horrible game design is.

[-N7-Leonhart]

8 minutes ago, Fser said:

I am complaining because it is a stupid mechanic. It is stupid. You agree it is stupid. It shouldn't be this stupid. Even if I could recite every word in the quest dialogue, it doesn't make this quest any less stupid. 

Ghhh, it's just a mission, a SINGLE mission, just complete the god damned quest and you will probably get a reward higher that what you have lost anyway.

[Fser]

3 minutes ago, -N7-Leonhart said:

Ghhh, it's just a mission, a SINGLE mission, just complete the god damned quest and you will probably get a reward higher that what you have lost anyway.

It's actually a chain of missions. I'm voicing out my opinion in hopes of DE tweaking it, so future players don't have to waste life farming credits because of this bull crap. 

Don't defend bad game design choices. 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Fser

[-N7-Leonhart]

3 minutes ago, Fser said:

It's actually a chain of missions. I'm voicing out my opinion in hopes of tweaking, so future players don't have to waste life farming credits because of this bullS#&$. 

Don't defend bad game design choices. 

  What chain of missions? It's just THE one quest. After you do it properly, you will get your payback.

Edited August 13, 2017 by -N7-Leonhart

[Fser]

1 minute ago, -N7-Leonhart said:

  What chain of missions? It's just THE one quest. After you do it properly, it will get your payback.

There are three instances where I have to enter the Index for this quest, hence a chain of missions. 

Doesn't matter if I get my payback later, you are missing the entire point of the post. Please read again and contribute meaningfully to the discussion or move on .

[-N7-Leonhart]

Just now, Fser said:

There are three instances where I have to enter the Index for this quest, hence a chain of missions. 

Doesn't matter if I get my payback later, you are missing the entire point of the post. Please read again and contribute meaningfully to the discussion or move on .

I did the quest. I thought it was a bit annoying. BUT, I did not gotten b*tthurt over it, since I understood that's how the story goes. Your opponent has cheated and you had to find another way around that.

This really shows that there are characters in the world that are able to think and the tenno in all of their might are actually quite vulnerable to trickery.

[Fser]

Just now, -N7-Leonhart said:

I did the quest. I thought it was a bit annoying. BUT, I did not gotten b*tthurt over it, since I understood that's how the story goes. Your opponent has cheated and you had to find another way around that.

This really shows that there are characters in the world that are able to think and the tenno in all of their might are actually quite vulnerable to trickery.

You cannot rationalise bad game design with in-game lore.

[-N7-Leonhart]

1 minute ago, Fser said:

You cannot rationalise bad game design with in-game lore.

What, was not the first defeat in ages sweet?  This game has a way of making you feel like every enemy around is an idiot and defeat is impossible.

In all honesty, this kind of game design is used pretty much everywhere. No matter what your character does, you are bound to fail and be captured or whatever when the game script says so.

[Fiftycentis]

11 minutes ago, Fser said:

waste life farming credits

if you reach neptune you can farm 75k creds in 5/6 minutes, no way you are gonna waste your life for some 100k lost for the quest

[Tacritan]

You realise you can get up to 1,2m credits from a single raid? (Server reset mission bonus trick) And you get your money back further in the quest? 

Quests are not all about slashing through enemies mindlessly you know.

[Fser]

5 hours ago, -N7-Leonhart said:

What, was not the first defeat in ages sweet?  This game has a way of making you feel like every enemy around is an idiot and defeat is impossible.

In all honesty, this kind of game design is used pretty much everywhere. No matter what your character does, you are bound to fail and be captured or whatever when the game script says so.

This kind of design is used pretty much everywhere? Please point me to a game where there's a single-player encounter that first throws a curve ball at the player by making new rules you have to abide by, then punishes the player severely without notice nor warning, and then require significant effort to retry once you fail. I will avoid it like the plague.

Other posters have mentioned about the rate we can earn credit, and that 140k, 160k aren't a lot. First, you are all missing the point. Instant death is bad design, and the Index, during the quest, is insufferable. Second, it's all relative. This amount may seem little to you, but it's a lot to me, and perhaps also many other players. The discussion is about the mechanics, not on how rich you are/ how good you are at making-money in-game.

[-N7-Leonhart]

7 minutes ago, Fser said:

This kind of design is used pretty much everywhere? Please point me to a game where there's a single-player encounter that first throws a curve ball at the player by making new rules you have to abide by, then punishes the player severely without notice nor warning, and then require significant effort to retry once you fail. I will avoid it like the plague.

Let's see. From the top of my head:

- Crysis 1 and Crysis 2 have instances where you are captured and then escape by sheer chance no matter what you do before (can't avoid it);

- Farcry 3 had many instances where you were too dazed to have proper control or someone just knocked you down by jumping from behind the corner, no matter what you did;

- even in Dark Souls, you are forced to lose the first fight with Seath the Scaless, no matter what, so you can come back with a vengeance.

And of course many more that would take forever to mention. All of them have in common the fact that you are forced to lose fights, all for the sake of the story. Your salt is misplaced if those events are scripted.

Edited August 13, 2017 by -N7-Leonhart

[Chipputer]

So you're mad that DE tried to implement a story element to show that the bad guy of the quest is a cheater and are now calling it bad design despite the fact that the quest dialogue directly addresses it and then sends you out to do something about it? Wow.

The victory margin was also for story reasons. It's called sandbagging. People do it in real life to cheat money out of people all the time. Adding it into a quest where you're literally betting money is not only perfectly fine-- it's realistic.

tl;dr - You are literally going to need to suck it up and play by the quest rules because getting upset isn't going to change it.