Ember's Deluxe Skin Feedback

[phoenix1992]

2 minutes ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

While I remotely agree, I do disagree as well. I’m not saying players should stop hating on it, what I’m trying to say is that players that are ranting without constructive criticism about it should stop saying what they’re saying.

Kinda hard to draw a line, when (as you are aware, since you have seen your fair share of topics and posts) there are multiple examples of hating, bashing and abusing that sticks around in the forum, while feedback is moved and merged into semi death sub forum.

There is also the issue that when topics are merged (or edited) context is lost and some posts look like rambling, even though the original poster never had the intention or the knowledge for the change.

You say the word "hate", I say that there is mutual lack of understanding between DE and the forum users that leads to results that neither side wants.. More transparency and communication would do wonders.

[BornWithTeeth]

The Ember Deluxe skin is terribly flawed. It’s basically just Ember with the plastic bits of a chicken costume glued to her, complete with a ridiculous jiggling mohawk. It’s a visual joke carried too far.

 

However, I’m done ‘hating’ on it. It’s a disappointment, that’s all. Ember gets a bad Deluxe skin, and I don’t spend Plat on it, end of story. What I’m more disappointed with is DE’s handling of the situation. They utterly ignored the clear community feedback and rushed the skin out far faster than anyone would have expected, and then cracked down on posters pointing out what they had done. The entire affair comes across as if someone on the design team had a chicken-shaped axe to grind.

[(XBOX)weedyodaa]

2 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

The Ember Deluxe skin is terribly flawed. It’s basically just Ember with the plastic bits of a chicken costume glued to her, complete with a ridiculous jiggling mohawk. It’s a visual joke carried too far.

 

However, I’m done ‘hating’ on it. It’s a disappointment, that’s all. Ember gets a bad Deluxe skin, and I don’t spend Plat on it, end of story. What I’m more disappointed with is DE’s handling of the situation. They utterly ignored the clear community feedback and rushed the skin out far faster than anyone would have expected, and then cracked down on posters pointing out what they had done. The entire affair comes across as if someone on the design team had a chicken-shaped axe to grind.

It's good for the people who want to be a chicken. 

[xXDeadsinxX]

2 minutes ago, phoenix1992 said:

Kinda hard to draw a line, when (as you are aware, since you have seen your fair share of topics and posts) there are multiple examples of hating, bashing and abusing that sticks around in the forum, while feedback is moved and merged into semi death sub forum.

There is also the issue that when topics are merged (or edited) context is lost and some posts look like rambling, even though the original poster never had the intention or the knowledge for the change.

You say the word "hate", I say that there is mutual lack of understanding between DE and the forum users that leads to results that neither side wants.. More transparency and communication would do wonders.

Yeah, I agree 100% with you. Like you said, players are not understanding why DE did what they did, which is why they rant without constructive critism. Which is why when DE does a certain thing in the game, players start ranting with their pitchforks. We’ve both seen it before, it definitely isn’t pretty.

[Mattoropael]

It's not just people missing the old concept.

The current deluxe we got is just flat out terrible, there's no way around it and the vastly-superior old concept was only salt to the wound. Add in the fact that they're rapid-firing deluxe skins with the other two (Mag and Nekros) being simply stunning, and you can see how DE invented their own disaster.

[BornWithTeeth]

2 minutes ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

Yeah, I agree 100% with you. Like you said, players are not understanding why DE did what they did, which is why they rant without constructive critism. Which is why when DE does a certain thing in the game, players start ranting with their pitchforks. We’ve both seen it before, it definitely isn’t pretty.

Just to point out, this is not just about people missing IgnusDei’s design. In the absence of his concept, the new skin is still not good. It is literally just an Ember Warframe with plastic-looking chicken bits on her.

Leaving IgnusDei out of this altogether, I’ll point out that DE themselves are perfectly capable of far better work. Chroma’s Deluxe skin is phenomenal, managing to be totally transformative while still capturing a perfect alternate take on the Chroma design. The Vermilion skin is just Ember, with tacky bits on top.

[xXDeadsinxX]

3 minutes ago, Mattoropael said:

It's not just people missing the old concept.

The current deluxe we got is just flat out terrible, there's no way around it and the vastly-superior old concept was only salt to the wound. Add in the fact that they're rapid-firing deluxe skins with the other two (Mag and Nekros) being simply stunning, and you can see how DE invented their own disaster.

Like I said though, it’s down to personal taste at the end of the day. If you don’t like the skin, then don’t use/buy it. 

Though you can dislike the skin which is perfectly fine, but ranting and hating on DE is another thing players don’t understand quite well on the forums.

[Misgenesis]

Players are free to dislike it and DE is free to not cater their designs. Dont like it, dont buy it.

Personally i like it and both concepts had good things about them.

Edited November 2, 2017 by Misgenesis

[BornWithTeeth]

1 minute ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

Like I said though, it’s down to personal taste at the end of the day. If you don’t like the skin, then don’t use/buy it. 

Though you can dislike the skin which is perfectly fine, but ranting and hating on DE is another thing players don’t understand quite well on the forums.

DE have also handled this situation badly. They gave us a subpar skin, ignored a massive amount of feedback, rushed the skin out far faster than any other such project, as if they were trying to finish it and get it out before the community could generate even more feedback, did not add any of the additional effects or tweaks which were hastily mentioned as fig leaves by the devs, and then began frantically merging and deleting when players got annoyed with them. This was not done well.

[xXDeadsinxX]

Just now, Misgenesis said:

Players are free to dislike it and DE is free to not cater their designs. Dont like it, dont buy it.

Exactly. Though, players are hating on DE and the skin for redoing it. It’s not constructive criticism at all, they’re just ranting about it which is not right. 

[BornWithTeeth]

1 minute ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

Exactly. Though, players are hating on DE and the skin for redoing it. It’s not constructive criticism at all, they’re just ranting about it which is not right. 

The players gave constructive feedback weeks ago. DE ignored it.

[xXDeadsinxX]

2 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

DE have also handled this situation badly. They gave us a subpar skin, ignored a massive amount of feedback, rushed the skin out far faster than any other such project, as if they were trying to finish it and get it out before the community could generate even more feedback, did not add any of the additional effects or tweaks which were hastily mentioned as fig leaves by the devs, and then began frantically merging and deleting when players got annoyed with them. This was not done well.

Well, they likely rushed the skin because it was long over do. Plains of Eidolon was probably in the way first to progress further  on the deluxe skin. But DE have also worked extremely hard on the skin, and players are giving awful feedback on it, which is ranting on the skin.

[xXDeadsinxX]

2 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

The players gave constructive feedback weeks ago. DE ignored it.

That was weeks ago though. If you look at the forums now, it’s players ranting on it now without constructive criticism, which is not the way to go.

[BornWithTeeth]

Just now, xXDeadsinxX said:

Well, they likely rushed the skin because it was long over do. Plains of Eidolon was probably in the way first to progress further  on the deluxe skin. But DE have also worked extremely hard on the skin, and players are giving awful feedback on it, which is ranting on the skin.

Hard work =/= guaranteed good outcome. This skin is subpar among the Deluxe skins, and again, I’m not even including IgnusDei’s other work here. Saryn and Chroma’s Deluxe skins blow this one away by contrast.

[phoenix1992]

1 minute ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

That was weeks ago though. If you look at the forums now, it’s players ranting on it now without constructive criticism, which is not the way to go.

That was not weeks ago.

The last post before the release was on Tuesday.

[BornWithTeeth]

1 minute ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

That was weeks ago though. If you look at the forums now, it’s players ranting on it now without constructive criticism, which is not the way to go.

I don’t think it’s a helpful message to say to players “You can’t be annoyed with DE now just because they totally ignored all of your feedback weeks ago. You have to focus on being constructive!”

 

Can you see where I am coming from on this? My perspective is that the skin itself is not very good, but DE’s handling of the situation has exacerbated the mess. 

[unknow99]

1 hour ago, Keltik0ne said:

Doesn't matter much about the skin, when there's so much exceptional work for Ember on tennogen.

 

Seriously, have you seen the Magesty, Graxx or Ignition skins ? Tough act for DE to follow.

 

46 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

Agreed.

I got it and it works out just as I envisioned with the Majesty Helmet and different colors.

Aaaaand what do players without a Steam account or real bucks for tennogen do? Cry in a corner and hope that DE brings another Deluxe skin to Ember?

Ember is my most played warframe. I've been playing for 4 years  and I think she's been used 25% or something. I had quite big expectations for that skin ( add to this the fact that I don't use Steam because I started playing in U7).

My opinion on it? I'd say 5,5/10. Why ?

1) That frigging mohawk. What were you thinking? Ember has always been about that punk/KFC/fire theme since she was a he called Blaze. HOWEVER, that mohawk looks wayyy too big, wayyy out of place! Not even subtle. They could at least try to shrink it or something, because it's taking too much place right now,sorry... 

2) Default color scheme : that dominant blue-green doesn't match the fire theme at all : that's probably the second reason why a lot of people think it's a Zephyr skin... Look at DatDarkOne's color scheme for instance : THIS is a fire focused color scheme! You use warm colors like red/yellow/brown/orange!... Not blue/green unless you work for GazdeFrance or something...

3) Talking about birds : the feathers. Again, they're way too present! FIRST reason why people think it's a Zephyr skin.

4) Underdeveloped fire theme. Don't trust me? Just look at these flames, they look like they were an afterthought : "oooh right, we forgot that she casts fire! Quick,add something :s !" While Ignus skin CLEARLY shows that. (half her body is burned)

5) All her tennogen skin are Vastly superior to this one, sorry. Really makes you thin huh, that fans would put an official skin to shame that much! I find it quite funny. :p

In conclusion, it's passable but Dayum, what a letdown. She could've got so much more... You're not seeing the colour of my bill$ on this one DE, sorry. 

I'm still hesitating though : I might farm for it, but one thing is for sure! As soon as I get it, I'll :

• change the colors for Warmer ones ,
• replace that helmet ASAP for Phoenix (yeah, normal helmet is meh and backdraft is one of the ugliest helmets in the game).

For those who don't like it : vote with your wallet and voice your opinion here, on reddit or on /wfg/...

For those who like it : good for you, but don't fall into fanboyism and say that those who dislike it have no taste/DE worked so much on this and blaah blaah blah...

[unknow99]

38 minutes ago, SergeantSunshine said:

Really, one of the biggest issue I see people have with the skin is that they do not like how the helmet looks. Just use a different helmet. Personally, aside from the helmet, Ember Vermilion looks pretty darn great. You just gotta mess around with the colors for a bit to get it just right.

I agree but that's a shame that you'd pay a whole package just for parts of it, when some easy fixes might make it look acceptable... :/

[xXDeadsinxX]

5 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

I don’t think it’s a helpful message to say to players “You can’t be annoyed with DE now just because they totally ignored all of your feedback weeks ago. You have to focus on being constructive!”

 

Can you see where I am coming from on this? My perspective is that the skin itself is not very good, but DE’s handling of the situation has exacerbated the mess. 

I do see your perspective, I’m just saying that now, players aren’t doing constructive criticism with what they’re saying. 

6 minutes ago, phoenix1992 said:

That was not weeks ago.

The last post before the release was on Tuesday.

My mistake, sorry.

[BornWithTeeth]

4 minutes ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

I do see your perspective, I’m just saying that now, players aren’t doing constructive criticism with what they’re saying. 

My mistake, sorry.

Some players are being rude and overreacting, but many are not, and their criticisms were and are valid. This is 100% a problem which DE have made for themselves.

[Rociel]

2 hours ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said:

Are you saying that Frost Harka isn't thematic, because if so, realize that Frost Harka transforms Frost from Ice Warrior to the incredible Ice Viking!

No, I mean his deluxe helmet looks bad mixed with other skins and his deluxe skin looks bad mixed with other helmets.

 

1 hour ago, zzzNitro said:

I'm glad you like it, but like you said this skin is not enough, it's vanilla ember a bit more edgy, it could even pass as an ember tune-up or straight model rework, but it just doesn't cut it as a "Deluxe" skin. 

meh, when people on forum and reddit will shut up with their "this is the ugliest thing in warframe", I will think about using different words. Currently - I like it, I bought it, I don't regret it and I`m not worried about IgnusDei concept turning out badly anymore.

[Rakawan]

DE has managed to actually avoid both sides of a razor edge that a lot of game developers fall into. Sacrificing their vision for player opinions, and sacrificing player opinion for their vision.

This game has a healthy amount of player generated content and yet remains true to the dreams of those who build it.

Those complaining about the Ember skin need a history lesson about DE. They went full on for public opinion once and the result was an overall subpar game called Darksector, with a lot of potential but not much realized, because of compromise.

Warframe is their attempt to build their dream. It may not be your dream, and that is fine. It is their decision how much input they take into account and how many player suggested changes they make. They are under no obligation to tailor things to every vocal minority, especially when said minorities do nothing but rant and rave withrout any constructive feedback.

DE reserves the right to make their game how they want it to be, and it is that refusal to compromise that has made warframe the great game is today.

For those glorifying Igneus. He overstepped his bounds, and burned bridges, something he admits. DE is under no obligation to bow to someone who forgot his place in the creative process.

DE does not charge a monthly subscription, nor to they promise specific results. They offer the game as is, and you either buy the items within or don’t. They are under no obligation to provide you with exactly what you want.

TL:DR

You don’t like it, don’t buy it. THhat is how this sort of game works, that is how it should work.

 

[unknow99]

24 minutes ago, Misgenesis said:

Players are free to dislike it and DE is free to not cater their designs. Dont like it, dont buy it.

Personally i like it and both concepts had good things about them.

They're absolutely free to not listen to the community.

If they want more dough though... That Will harm their business. :/

So yes, don't like it,don't buy it. And if the sales are super low & disappointing for DE, they might consider changes to make it more appealing to the userbase.

hate it or love it : VOTE WITH YOUR WALLET

[phoenix1992]

1 minute ago, Rakawan said:

Those complaining about the Ember skin need a history lesson about DE. They went full on for public opinion once and the result was an overall subpar game called Darksector, with a lot of potential but not much realized, because of compromise.

 

Dark sector was killed by publishers, not by public opinion. Steve has said it himself.

 

7 minutes ago, xXDeadsinxX said:

I do see your perspective, I’m just saying that now, players aren’t doing constructive criticism with what they’re saying. 

15 minutes ago, phoenix1992 said:

"players are not doing constructive criticism"

Yet there is topic with 20+ pages centered around constructive criticism, including posts that said that Ignus's skin was not the hot potatoes that people think it is (even from Ignus himself).

[(XBOX)weedyodaa]

I don't think the skin is really bad, just hard to customize and give a good FashionFrame for. It reminds me of Oberon's delux, because of the leaves looking slightly like feathers. The look for it is hard to get. Unless you wanna smack on the Riv-Elite guards, smack some gold on it and call it and call it a day.