Daily Log-in Highly Unfair

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

13 hours ago, Xarian said:

Time gated exclusive rewards (login rewards) don't drive revenue at all, but are supposed to drive player retention by convincing players to stick around and play more - but really, they don't have that effect at all.

Market Research, and about 1000 other games that use this model, say differently. Would love to see your research on it, though.

As for Founder's Pack being "bad for the game".  If it weren't for DE running the Founder's Pack....there would likely be NO Warframe right now.

[Urabask]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Market Research, and about 1000 other games that use this model, say differently. Would love to see your research on it, though.

As for Founder's Pack being "bad for the game".  If it weren't for DE running the Founder's Pack....there would likely be NO Warframe right now.

Very few games have 600+ day milestones in their login reward system.  It's much more common for it to be capped at a week.

Edited February 27, 2018 by Urabask

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

13 hours ago, Xarian said:

But the thing is, this sort of player division creates a toxic community as a whole due to the escalating infighting. We've already seen this with people saying things like "suck it up" and casually throwing around insults or insinuating that new players are whiny babies simply because they want to be able to obtain the login rewards without waiting 3 years.

Toxicity in the community is the fault of the community, not DE.  People decide to do bad things...they are not forced to.  Y'all COULD decide to take the higher road and be good people.  If ya choose otherwise, that's on you and you alone.

As for the rewards...You want the 1st place trophy without running the race, or without coming in 1st place.  That's simply not going to happen.  I think if you're that obsessed over these gifts from DE, then you're missing the REAL gift - WARFRAME as a whole.  Don't get hung up on a few freebies that you WILL get -eventually-  and instead go experience the HUGE game with MASSIVE amounts of FREE content that you can play NOW.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

6 minutes ago, Urabask said:

Very few games have 600+ day milestones in their login reward system.  It's much more common for it to be capped at a week.

Very few games last 600+ days AND are free to play.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

14 hours ago, Xarian said:

It's been my experience that games with exclusive rewards work best when the exclusive rewards are cosmetics that are extremely gaudy and ugly, especially minor variations of cosmetics that are already in the game

Translation: "I don't have it so noone should!"   Your "solution" to this "issue" (read: "non-issue") is to get rid of any items worth having and just give everyone crap.  Why not just delete the whole damn system at that point?

[Urabask]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Very few games last 600+ days AND are free to play.

600 days isn't even two years.   MMOs all aim to last for around 7+ years and still don't have milestones like Warframe does.

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

40 minutes ago, Urabask said:

600 days isn't even two years.   MMOs all aim to last for around 7+ years and still don't have milestones like Warframe does.

Very few games are Warframe.  In fact, no other games are Warframe. So...what's wrong with Warframe being different?

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

Here's what I don't get about this stupid circular argument:

"DE should implement some reward for "veteran" (read: "Long Time") players!"

DE gives login system that "rewards" playing for a long period of time.

"DE should get rid of this login system!  It takes too long!"

DE announces possible changes to Login System, allowing quicker reward choices.

"DE is screwing us all!!"


Stop throwing DE under the bus just because you aren't happy!  They give us this amazing game experience and all for FREE, and all people on BOTH sides can do is complain about what they DON'T have.  I'm really disappointed in this community sometimes.

[Urabask]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Very few games are Warframe.  In fact, no other games are Warframe. So...what's wrong with Warframe being different?

That wasn't the claim you were making though.  You were claiming that, "about 1000 other games that use this model," in response to being told that login reward systems aren't effective at increasing player retention.  They may be good at increasing player retention but they do that by focusing on much shorter lengths of time than Warframe's reward system does.

Edited February 27, 2018 by Urabask

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

2 minutes ago, Urabask said:

That wasn't the claim you were making though.  You were claimed that, "about 1000 other games that use this model," in response to being told that login reward systems aren't effective at increasing player retention.  They may be good at increasing player retention but they do that by focusing on much shorter lengths of time than Warframe's reward system does.

And I stand by that.  Just because games AIM to last 7+ years, doesn't mean they DO.  Warframe is already on year 5...and stronger than ever...all without charging a dime to play.   How many other MMOs are still going that strong on that setup?  

Regardless, I'm not saying Warframe is the only one to do it.  In fact, I noted quite the opposite.  I still fail to see what this has to do with the original topic.

I have no intention of debating irrelevant stats and muddying the waters on this thread, with all due respect. We can debate this other topic elsewhere, if you like.

[Urabask]

27 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

And I stand by that.  Just because games AIM to last 7+ years, doesn't mean they DO.  Warframe is already on year 5...and stronger than ever...all without charging a dime to play.   How many other MMOs are still going that strong on that setup?  

Regardless, I'm not saying Warframe is the only one to do it.  In fact, I noted quite the opposite.  I still fail to see what this has to do with the original topic.

I have no intention of debating irrelevant stats and muddying the waters on this thread, with all due respect. We can debate this other topic elsewhere, if you like.

Really?  You don't see the connection between most games focusing on short term rewards? Most of the login rewards are at milestones that are well past when most players quit the game.  They are in effect non-existent for most of the players that will play the game.  They also have virtually nothing to do with Warframe's longevity or continued success.  DE could remove the whole system and give everything in it to every player in the game for free and the change in player population would be a blip on their steamcharts page.

It's also hilarious that you are accusing me of muddying the waters when you double and triple post attacking anyone that's opposed to the login reward system's current state.

Edited February 27, 2018 by Urabask

[MagPrime]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Translation: "I don't have it so noone should!"   Your "solution" to this "issue" (read: "non-issue") is to get rid of any items worth having and just give everyone crap.  Why not just delete the whole damn system at that point?

I can get behind that 

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

42 minutes ago, Urabask said:

Really?  You don't see the connection between most games focusing on short term rewards? Most of the login rewards are at milestones that are well past when most players quit the game.  They are in effect non-existent for most of the players that will play the game.  They also have virtually nothing to do with Warframe's longevity or continued success.  DE could remove the whole system and give everything in it to every player in the game for free and the change in player population would be a blip on their steamcharts page.

It's also hilarious that you are accusing me of muddying the waters when you double and triple post attacking anyone that's opposed to the login reward system's current state.

I'm not attacking anyone opposed.  I'm "attacking" bad reasons why it should change.

I'm honestly all for the change. I'm also fine if they keep it.  It doesn't bother me one way or the other.

Doesn't mean I support bad ideas.

[Gerrix]

TBH the biggest problem is not the weapons tied to logins, it's the primed mods. There are no equivalents or similar mods, no other way to get anything even approaching the power level of those primed mods. Those are what I personally find an issue with in the logins. There is enough weapon variation that I could care less, but the mods make me annoyed whenever I think too hard about it.

[Xaranoth]

2 minutes ago, Gerrix said:

TBH the biggest problem is not the weapons tied to logins, it's the primed mods. There are no equivalents or similar mods, no other way to get anything even approaching the power level of those primed mods. Those are what I personally find an issue with in the logins. There is enough weapon variation that I could care less, but the mods make me annoyed whenever I think too hard about it.

But there are similar mods.... the non-primed versions. Non primed shred is still a perfectly usable and good mod, as is non primed fury. And berserker also exists, which for any melee with ~15% crit chance or higher is honestly better than primes fury imo. As for primed vigor, the only place that’s useful is either a meme Inaros or a late-game min-maxed chroma, and even then that’s debatable. Youre honestly not missing out on much in not having those primed mods. They’re more like small unnecessary upgrades as a way of DE saying thank you for playing the game for so long.

[rapt0rman]

5 minutes ago, Gerrix said:

TBH the biggest problem is not the weapons tied to logins, it's the primed mods. There are no equivalents or similar mods, no other way to get anything even approaching the power level of those primed mods. Those are what I personally find an issue with in the logins. There is enough weapon variation that I could care less, but the mods make me annoyed whenever I think too hard about it.

Eh, the primed mods from login rewards are actually quite tame, they're great fun, but there's nothing you can do with primed fury or primed shred that you can't do with regular fury or regular shred.

[UltraLYT]

If you feel like being punished, just stop doing it.

[MagPrime]

2 hours ago, rapt0rman said:

Eh, the primed mods from login rewards are actually quite tame, they're great fun, but there's nothing you can do with primed fury or primed shred that you can't do with regular fury or regular shred.

Can confirm.  

[(XBOX)Eminem2420]

*shrug* I have completely given up on ever acquiring the login weapons. 

[Riganone]

On 2/20/2018 at 12:56 AM, (PS4)CamoLogan said:

My friends and I put tons of hours into warframe before the daily log-in was a thing. Then we stopped playing and when we started playing again we were far behind most other newer players. The log-in system needs reform such as rewards being given for playing time or at least prelog-in era people should be give some sort of hefty boost. I'm at about 270 days right now and the way the system is currently makes me want to stop playing. I don't think I'll ever make it to day 500 which is really sad. Maybe a better idea would be to take log-in reward weapons away?

Centuries from now we will find a way to cure all diseases and live longer. We who are alive now will never ever get to enjoy those. Not fair, right? Should we ban medical science because it benefits those who came later but not those who were born earlier? Let's get back to Warframe. There was a time when journal entries were difficult to obtain. Now, ghouls drop them all over the place. Should we get compensation for grinding for those earlier? I don't think so. We play the game for what it is at the very moment. If this game is to last, it should keep improving. That would inevitably mean that those who joined later will have a much better experience than those who started early. Look on the bright side. At least you have Excalibur Prime and all those event items newbies won't ever have. My inventory is holey. :3

 

Because my friends and I almost feel as if we have been punished for playing the game early on and I would be willing to bet that I have played longer than most players that are at or over day 500. Also signing in each day begins to feel like a chore and I find myself just signing in to get the bonus and then immediately getting off. And when I miss a day I feel as if im being punished.

You are not being punished. When you login and lose credits or resources, then you are punished. You were not rewarded. That's different from being punished. You're not playing a zero-sum game with newbies, their gain is not your loss. :3

 

You would think you would want to implement a system where you are rewarded for playing rather than just signing in right?

Add more rewards instead of removing the current one. Like say, anniversary gifts or something. Or set milestone rewards for time spent in game. I would love that.

[(PSN)Synkreto]

This thread still going ? People still did not get over the fact that others who were born some 730 days earlier as them are 2 years older, and therefore get to legally have sex, drive etc. 2 years ahead of them ?

Sheesh, Life these days...its SO frigging UNFAIR ! /s

[GlaikitMayflies]

14 hours ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Here's what I don't get about this stupid circular argument:

"DE should implement some reward for "veteran" (read: "Long Time") players!"

DE gives login system that "rewards" playing for a long period of time.

"DE should get rid of this login system!  It takes too long!"

DE announces possible changes to Login System, allowing quicker reward choices.

"DE is screwing us all!!"


Stop throwing DE under the bus just because you aren't happy!  They give us this amazing game experience and all for FREE, and all people on BOTH sides can do is complain about what they DON'T have.  I'm really disappointed in this community sometimes.

Gah, your white knighting is indeed unwavering. I bet you will act differently, Had DE gated essential mods, and weapons behind this unfair and ungrindable wall. But sure lets strawman other individuals arguments, and label them "entitled", because we don't want to share our toys with them. The irony is oozing from this one.  

The truth of the matter is that DE messed up, by gating content, like mods and weapons, to this "daily login" system. Had this system just been purely cosmetics, I doubt people will be angry nor will they rise a stink about it. And just to be clear, locking content to this "daily login" is not okay, its malicious. 

 

[RayxAyanami]

I though this thread died long back.

[GlaikitMayflies]

Just now, (PS4)Synkreto said:

This thread still going ? People still did not get over the fact that others who were born some 730 days earlier as them are 2 years older, and therefore get to legally have sex, drive etc. 2 years ahead of them ?

Sheesh, Life these days...its SO frigging UNFAIR ! /s

How constructive. Bah, you are right, why waste time on posts like these, when self-appointed knights will just ignore everything critical you have to say of the game. 

Edited February 28, 2018 by toxicpanda

[(PSN)Synkreto]

39 minutes ago, toxicpanda said:

Gah, your white knighting is indeed unwavering. I bet you will act differently, Had DE gated essential mods, and weapons behind this unfair and ungrindable wall. But sure lets strawman other individuals arguments, and label them "entitled", because we don't want to share our toys with them. The irony is oozing from this one.  

The truth of the matter is that DE messed up, by gating content, like mods and weapons, to this "daily login" system. Had this system just been purely cosmetics, I doubt people will be angry nor will they rise a stink about it. And just to be clear, locking content to this "daily login" is not okay, its malicious. 

 

 

37 minutes ago, toxicpanda said:

How constructive. Bah, you are right, why waste time on posts like these, when self-appointed knights will just ignore everything critical you have to say of the game. 

No reason or intention for me to try and be constructive in a dialogue with a person that dramatically blows things out of proportion motivated by a sense of entitlement . Said Person's intention is simply to get what they want, they are not interested in actual dialogue .

The "Issue" of the "messed up" ,"unfair" LogIn reward System is simply a NONIssue to me , in the sense that I find it utterly ridiculous to even complain about . Simply because you login, you get stuff . Whats to complain about that ?

And frankly, you calling the daily login system "malicious" is just hilarious...like yeah, way to go throwing a Tantrum because you did not get the Toys...yet .

Edited February 28, 2018 by (PS4)Synkreto