Daily Log-in Highly Unfair

[-AncientWarrior-]

1 hour ago, Ham_Grenabe said:

It's free stuff. Sometimes it's junk, sometimes it's neat, but it's just a free gift for logging in. Sometimes I think if DE shipped people a box full of money, there'd be complaints about how it was folded. 

Hah.. thats a great response .. nail + hammer (hits it on the head) 

Anyway .. 1 minute per day doesn't take much effort to get the FREE GIFT from log-in.. hell you don't even have to play to get the FREE GIFT.. 

oh .. Gotto go log-in .. 3 days off 800 log-in 's .. getting me FREE GIFT .. thanks DE  :) 

[Chimiasai]

il y a 5 minutes, Strykerclaw96 a dit :

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Daily_Tribute

Even if they're not being "suppressed", what would they gain from being given all the rewards right off the bat? The Azima and Zenistar require MR 6 and the Zenith requires MR 10. As for the mods, new players wouldn't be able to afford to rank them up past the limits of the non-primed versions.

I didn't say that someone who's in the game since three days should get an Azima and a lot of my suggestions are based on the hard grinding or the real loyalty:

-Hiding some weapons/mods/cosmetics milestones behind some missions and being able to drop them without retribution.

-Give a player one step on the milestone (Without the daily rewards) each 3 hours of playing in missions.

-Give players additives steps on each successive day connected (1 day = 1 step, 2 consecutive days = 2 steps) with a limit of 7 steps per day. (Not fan but still better)

-Give players the ability to actively grind the milestone by some hard missions or long missions.

Shall i resume? Oh... And, to add on it, those changes on the milestones are just a way to help peoples catch up the delay.

There's a vast space between giving daily rewards as candies during halloween and the actual daily rewards systems (Yeah, daily tribute, my bad by trying to follow the example of Prime-Ares) But as i repeat and always say... The daily tribute shouldn't manage milestone as he actually does. The daily gift is, by itself, truly fine and i'm grateful for it. But the steps of the milestone is nothing but a mere reminder of "Hey, connect daily without caring of what happens and you'll get something nice in a 100 days... Cya".

[(PSN)jonnyblaze1976]

So let me see if i can understand this. You played warframe before the daily login revamp, and then came back after the revamp. So i guess my question is this...did you not expect some new stuff to happen while you were gone? The game isn't going to go into standby mode while you are away. Just log in everyday whether you play or not. It takes just a few minutes. I'm past 750 days and i can assure you i didn't play every one of those days.

[Nykerios]

11 minutes ago, Chimiasai said:

But the steps of the milestone is nothing but a mere reminder of "Hey, connect daily without caring of what happens and you'll get something nice in a 100 days... Cya".

Except none of the Milestones really matter at the end of the day. The Azima's alt fire is terrible, the Zenith's gimmick is slow and boring, and the Sigma & Octantis has a worse version of what the Zakti does. As for the mods, any player can live without them.

[EndermanBeast]

1 hour ago, corallein said:

And then there's Primed Fury, Primed Vigor, and Primed Shred.

Ok, mostly just Primed Fury, but still.

 

They're not the best mods. = You don't need them < You want them.

[Chimiasai]

il y a 2 minutes, Strykerclaw96 a dit :

Except none of the Milestones really matter at the end of the day. The Azima's alt fire is terrible, the Zenith's gimmick is slow and boring, and the Sigma & Octantis has a worse version of what the Zakti does. As for the mods, any player can live without them.

So, why does we have to hide them in a timewall which grow longer as the days are passing. Because, if there's a rework of it, it's not only for the players pleasure but also it's nearly impossible to keep a system which take something away from you for years... Not days.. Just years before you can get something while you got everything else in the game.

il y a 8 minutes, (PS4)jonnyblaze1976 a dit :

So let me see if i can understand this. You played warframe before the daily login revamp, and then came back after the revamp. So i guess my question is this...did you not expect some new stuff to happen while you were gone? The game isn't going to go into standby mode while you are away. Just log in everyday whether you play or not. It takes just a few minutes. I'm past 750 days and i can assure you i didn't play every one of those days.

If you're talking about me? Nah. I created the account long ago but i invested in the same only one years ago. And no, my problem is not about having to play... But the opposite... Being loyal as the daily tribute want but not having something... While there's a lot of alternatives, of way to change without breaking the actual progression of the "veterans". I don't want to remind myself "Come to warframe daily" and worry if i followed thoroughly the daily connection each day. 

[Nykerios]

2 minutes ago, Chimiasai said:

So, why does we have to hide them in a timewall which grow longer as the days are passing. Because, if there's a rework of it, it's not only for the players pleasure but also it's nearly impossible to keep a system which take something away from you for years... Not days.. Just years before you can get something while you got everything else in the game.

It's a system to keep you engaged with the game in any capacity. If you keep thinking, "Oh, I should login to Warframe to get the login day." Then afterwards you might think "I'm logged in, might as well play a bit".

Ta-da, player retention. They're not doing it to reward you, it's just bait to keep you playing.

[Chimiasai]

il y a 8 minutes, Strykerclaw96 a dit :

It's a system to keep you engaged with the game in any capacity. If you keep thinking, "Oh, I should login to Warframe to get the login day." Then afterwards you might think "I'm logged in, might as well play a bit".

Ta-da, player retention. They're not doing it to reward you, it's just bait to keep you playing.

But the system can be abused. Some players just login and logout instantly while others can't login as frequently as they're... Or have to wait too long for getting rewards. It's no more a question of player retention.

[Nykerios]

1 minute ago, Chimiasai said:

But the system can be abused. Some players just login and logout instantly while others can't login as frequently

So it's abuse if someone can't log in due to real life issues and someone else can? My PC died on me and I couldn't play for months, and I'm not whining and begging for a system where I can catch up with no effort. If the system rewards logins, it's working as intended.

[(PSN)jonnyblaze1976]

I hear your arguments and get your point i just don't agree or think its unfair. Of all the different grinds in warframe simply logging in is easiest one of all. Its extra things that everyone of us can get with the exact same amount of effort.

[Chimiasai]

il y a 1 minute, Strykerclaw96 a dit :

So it's abuse if someone can't log in due to real life issues and someone else can? My PC died on me and I couldn't play for months, and I'm not whining and begging for a system where I can catch up with no effort. If the system rewards logins, it's working as intended.

And yet, there's alternative who rewards the players who's still playing after the loss of his computer. Even the application could help for peoples who want to connect daily but it's no more a "player retention system". And once again, it's not about "Oh, i could deal with so do the same", it's a simple way to hide a growing problem. The milestones are increasingly farther as the game is aging. And that kind of distance isn't attractive at all for new players. Can you really say "Oh... That syandana? Got it after two years of daily login".

And you've no way to catch up... Nothing. It's like "You didn't know the game before that day? Too bad, you'll get each new items in the milestone after a very long delay. Even if you're more grindier than everyone... Even if you do the best for this game. Too bad, don't ya?"

[Nykerios]

1 minute ago, Chimiasai said:

Can you really say "Oh... That syandana? Got it after two years of daily login".

And unless that Syandana gives you some sort of boost it's as useless as getting 50 Endo on a login. It changes nothing.

2 minutes ago, Chimiasai said:

And you've no way to catch up... Nothing. It's like "You didn't know the game before that day? Too bad, you'll get each new items in the milestone after a very long delay. Even if you're more grindier than everyone... Even if you do the best for this game. Too bad, don't ya?"

And why is a catch up necessary? If Player A worked to get something the normal way, Players B-F shouldn't be able to get the same thing by screaming loud/long enough.

[Chimiasai]

il y a 35 minutes, Strykerclaw96 a dit :

And unless that Syandana gives you some sort of boost it's as useless as getting 50 Endo on a login. It changes nothing.

And why is a catch up necessary? If Player A worked to get something the normal way, Players B-F shouldn't be able to get the same thing by screaming loud/long enough.

By the same argument, we could put nearly every weapon behind the milestones because they're useless. Phage? Useless, milestones. Embolist? Useless, milestones. Prova? Useless, Milestones. And we go deeper. And if you're only saying for the cosmetics... So, why not restrain the access of buying helmets until their reach a precise milestones? And the syandana, players shouldn't have syandana until they've been connected each day half a year. (Nah, that kind of argument is just lazy)

And daily login isn't work at all. Barely a way to attract players and a lazy button for peoples who doesn't care about what's in the daily and solely want their milestone. Can you tell me someone,  mr 15+, who's entertained and motivated to play in the game by receiving a neurode? The daily tribute shouldn't be named Daily tribut but Grindy Tribute or Milestones Tribute as the distance from a new players and the most recent advantages from the milestones increase

Edited February 20, 2018 by Chimiasai
Meant barely, not merely

[Nykerios]

57 minutes ago, Strykerclaw96 said:

It's a system to keep you engaged with the game in any capacity.

 

6 minutes ago, Chimiasai said:

And daily login isn't work at all. Merely a way to attract players

Now you're just repeating my arguments. I don't have the time to run in circles with you, I have more important things to do like a job (which also keeps me from getting logins now and again, but who cares)

[LeaserResael]

hace 7 horas, Oreades dijo:

Well it does sound like they are considering changing the login rewards from one gigantic track, that I'm sure is becoming a nightmare to maintain/extend to more of a shorter repeating login reward track like GW2 has. At least if I was getting the correct gist from the little they talked about it in a devstream quite some time back. 

So instead of get to 700 cumulative logins to get a specific MacGuffin it becomes get to 30-50 days and choose from the list of MacGuffins. Again assuming I'm interpreting what they said correctly.  

Undoubtably that is going to cheese off a bunch of people who don't like to share their toys, the self purported "veteran players" who will spill into the forums and freak out about how DE is disrespecting them or whatever. I've personally mulled it over and I look at things I have like the Zenistar, yeah that took me 300 days but ya know I can respect the fact that if given the option I would have preferred to get it much much sooner. Same with things like Primed vigor. I mean it isn't like it negatively effects me in any way if someone else has a Zenistar or Primed Vigor or whatever. So how selfish would I need to be to throw a tantrum over an arguably improved login reward track :P 

The problem is that if DE does that then they're not consistent. Remember the Hema back at the beginning of last year? They wouldn't change the costs because that would have been "disrespecting" the "time" players spent to get it.

So now they'll make it so people can get these items without having to spend the same time as all the people that logged in the required amount of days.

While I don't personally mind them changing the login system (I even posted about this topic before and proposed a system like this where after X amount of days you can choose what do you want to get), I mind DE not being consistent. If they claim to respect people's time, they need to do it across the board, not just sometimes.

[(XBOX)Ivan of Jupiter]

13 hours ago, WhiteMarker said:

Where is the "F*** you"?
Did you play for the same amount of time others did? You did not. No F*** you here.
The LogIn-Rewards aren't unfair. If they were unfair, this would mean, everyone gets treated differently. That's not the case. Everyone gets the same treatment. And the systems is extremely fair because of that.
Is it perfect? Hell no. Is it fair? Yes, 1000 times yes.

If anything, any rework to the system wouldn’t be fair to us, honestly. 

Someone that’s only played for 50-100 days would be able to get SaO meanwhile it’s taken me 700 days. That’s an F*** you If I ever saw one.

[Saturmorn_Carvilli]

I don't care all that much about whether or whether not I will get everything.  The daily log-in reward is doing what it is supposed to do on me, which is to log in daily.  I am nearly to 300 now.  Wasn't sure I would get here at day 100, and I don't know even now if I will see day 500.  I think warframe only has about 300-400 'days' worth of content, if you take it kinda slow.  But for now, I keep logging in everyday even if that is all I do.  So good job DE, the system works.

However, I would prefer that even when and if the login track rewards are implemented, that DE consider stopping adding more 'exclusive' content at day 1000.  That's nearly two years of playing (or logging in) the same game daily.  I think that is just too long for a new player just starting out to even consider. Also, like I said, that is well past the point a player has basically done everything in the game anyways.  I also think it is plenty long for long haul gamers to think they have done something special.  I would be all for continued 50 day rewards after 1000, but I would be at a loss for something everyone can get anyways that is still worth something to a player that has been playing for two years.  All I can think of is maybe Arcanes (the good ones) and/or a Catalysis (since it it rare someone doesn't have use of one of them).

[NeithanDiniem]

4 hours ago, Chimiasai said:

-Hiding some weapons/mods/cosmetics milestones behind some missions and being able to drop them without retribution.

-Give a player one step on the milestone (Without the daily rewards) each 3 hours of playing in missions.

-Give players additives steps on each successive day connected (1 day = 1 step, 2 consecutive days = 2 steps) with a limit of 7 steps per day. (Not fan but still better)

-Give players the ability to actively grind the milestone by some hard missions or long missions.

- They already do this, and people still complain.

- Highly abusable, and requires 3 hours of game play compared to one minute. You lock out anyone wanting a quick fix on Warframe or lacking time to play and force them to catch up more than they do now.

- Burns through content fast, meaning DE has to spread it out more with longer milestones, making people have to consistently grind more time in-game than the system we have now.

- The "hard" missions we have now are already being argued right now on the forums as being way too easy for players to get into and surpass. Your solution only means MORE time frinding, FURTHER alienating limited-time players from rewards.

Need I go on? 

Edited February 21, 2018 by NeithanDiniem

[NeithanDiniem]

48 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Ivan of Jupiter said:

If anything, any rework to the system wouldn’t be fair to us, honestly. 

Someone that’s only played for 50-100 days would be able to get SaO meanwhile it’s taken me 700 days. That’s an F*** you If I ever saw one.

Someone will always be butthurt, but there are far more people that don't have SaO compared to those that do. Majority then wins.

[NeithanDiniem]

2 hours ago, LeaserResael said:

The problem is that if DE does that then they're not consistent. Remember the Hema back at the beginning of last year? They wouldn't change the costs because that would have been "disrespecting" the "time" players spent to get it.

So now they'll make it so people can get these items without having to spend the same time as all the people that logged in the required amount of days.

While I don't personally mind them changing the login system (I even posted about this topic before and proposed a system like this where after X amount of days you can choose what do you want to get), I mind DE not being consistent. If they claim to respect people's time, they need to do it across the board, not just sometimes.

You didn't have to play missions to rack up those 800 days. You could have spent 800 minutes and gotten it. Hema required hours and days of grind from each player contributing. I don't agree with the cost as it is now, but comparing Hema to the login is not an accurate comparison.

[Chimiasai]

il y a 10 minutes, NeithanDiniem a dit :

- They already do this, and people still complain.

- Highly abusable, and requires 3 hours of game play compared to one minute. You lock out anyone wanting a quick fix on Warframe or lacking time to play and force them to catch up more than they do now.

- Burns through content fast, meaning DE has to spread it out more with longer milestones, making people have to consistently grind more time in-game than the system we have now.

- The "hard" missions we have now are already being argued right now on the forums as being way too easy for players to get into and surpass. Your solution only means MORE time frinding, FURTHER alienating limited-time players from rewards.

Need I go on? 

-Peoples complain for everything, nah? 

-By that, i mean: One daily daily tribute login + one step on the milestone each 3 hour of active gameplay, with no daily rewards for. (Only one daily tribute/day)

-Hum, did you read what follow the suggestions? What i meant is to only catch up, not extend the number of steps between milestones => You cannot go further than the number of days since the beginning of the daily tribute.

-I think you didn't followed my thought at all and only read that post in particular. I'm not talking about time-limited players but players who have schedules which limit their daily login, if you're having some troubles to consistenly have a daily access but also being an hardcore grinder/player. Plus, if the rework of the dark sector is pretty good and can be truly difficults with the affixes, it can be a new way to farm the steps of the milestones

 

TL;DR: Each of my suggestions is a complement from the already existing daily tribute/step on the milestone.

[FlyingDice]

3 hours ago, Strykerclaw96 said:

So it's abuse if someone can't log in due to real life issues and someone else can? My PC died on me and I couldn't play for months, and I'm not whining and begging for a system where I can catch up with no effort. If the system rewards logins, it's working as intended.

This is tremendously disingenuous. It's a common pattern across all games with login reward systems for people who aren't playing the game but plan to return to it eventually to take the minute per day for the login rewards. Trying to frame that as "dedication" to a game is laughable. Someone who can only play one or two days a week thanks to working double jobs but plays 6+ hours per day that they're on is far more dedicated to the game than someone who logs in for twenty minutes each day to get their reward and play a mission or two, yet they progress almost four times slower.

Not to mention the "oh, you played for years before the current login reward system was introduced? Tough S#&amp;&#036; that doesn't count as dedication either" attitude that's pretty prevalent. It's transparently obvious that the real intent here is "I HAVE THE SPESHUL MODS AND WEAPONS THEY MUST REMAIN EXCLUSIVE REEEEEEEE".

It's justified for grandmaster founders who ponied up for Cyclops Prime, Lato Prime, &c. The rest of us could have backed. We didn't. DE promised exclusivity there, and it's fair for it to be maintained. The login tracks, however, were only added a couple years ago, and there was never any promise made that they would remain in the current state forever, nor was any money exchanged based on that premise. If you want to blame anyone, blame DE for time-locking functional content instead of sticking with cosmetics.

[NeithanDiniem]

Just now, Chimiasai said:

-Peoples complain for everything, nah? 

-By that, i mean: One daily daily tribute login + one step on the milestone each 3 hour of active gameplay, with no daily rewards for. (Only one daily tribute/day)

-Hum, did you read what follow the suggestions? What i meant is to only catch up, not extend the number of steps between milestones => You cannot go further than the number of days since the beginning of the daily tribute.

-I think you didn't followed my thought at all and only read that post in particular. I'm not talking about time-limited players but players who have schedules which limit their daily login, if you're having some troubles to consistenly have a daily access but also being an hardcore grinder/player. Plus, if the rework of the dark sector is pretty good and can be truly difficults with the affixes, it can be a new way to farm the steps of the milestones

 

TL;DR: Each of my suggestions is a complement from the already existing daily tribute/step on the milestone.

- It means that it isn't a solution. People complain about locking content behind locations just like the login.

- Still abusable and still burns through content, see below.

- To make content not be a trivial 7 days and you got it thing every time new items show up, DE would have to make the milestones be further away than 50 steps to give them time to make content to add to the login. They can't do that when they would have to add one every week.

- No, it's an accelerant to get new content, which as stated above forces DE to make the content take longer to get just so they can MAKE the content. It is not a solution, and it directly hurts players with less time to play.

Their proposed system puts all rewards on a 50 day set that repeats each time, meaning all rewards will take 50 days to get each time, including new ones, while letting people pick what they want and skip what they dont. It also means DE has 50 days to make new content to add to the pool, not a week.

[-Trey-]

 

[(XBOX)Solargeo]

1 hour ago, Chimiasai said:

-Peoples complain for everything, nah? 

-By that, i mean: One daily daily tribute login + one step on the milestone each 3 hour of active gameplay, with no daily rewards for. (Only one daily tribute/day)

-Hum, did you read what follow the suggestions? What i meant is to only catch up, not extend the number of steps between milestones => You cannot go further than the number of days since the beginning of the daily tribute.

-I think you didn't followed my thought at all and only read that post in particular. I'm not talking about time-limited players but players who have schedules which limit their daily login, if you're having some troubles to consistenly have a daily access but also being an hardcore grinder/player. Plus, if the rework of the dark sector is pretty good and can be truly difficults with the affixes, it can be a new way to farm the steps of the milestones

 

TL;DR: Each of my suggestions is a complement from the already existing daily tribute/step on the milestone.

Dude its fiiine the way it is. the rework will benefit you. So calm down. Hek while the zenistar is good. only the alt fire of sorts of it is good. and P fury is indeed good but not needed, except for min maxing . Akizma the pistol is outclass by the lex p . the rifle? braton P, melee? War and Galatine P. 

No its called a LOGIN system for a reason. whats next you want some system that rewards people who spend a lot heavily ? Please note that was Sarcasm

Anyway the Login Rewards are just that REWARDS. to show you had Dedication . and now even thats being thrown out.

Edited February 21, 2018 by (XB1)Solargeo