Here's Why Bombards Need A Nerf.

[AdunSaveMe]

And it's not so much because of their damage, which is utterly insane.

When you go into a T4 void mission, you expect to deal with high damage.

 

It's because of four things;

-Their rockets are hard to see in the void. They look almost exactly like corrupted dera projectiles, and in a busy firefight, you're usually not going to notice them until they've blown you up.

 

-They fire fast. I don't know how fast, but I swear I've seen one churn out a rocket every second.

 

-Their rockets have ridiculous lock-on ability. To the extent that any mobility, rolling, jumping, coptering, will often not let you avoid it. Running around a corner will still leave you with a rocket heading towards your backside. This also causes problems with Zephyr's Turbulence, which is already slightly unreliable; deflected rockets will just turn around and go for you again.

 

-Explosions go through shields and are not blocked by objects. Not warframe shields, but volt and frost shields. Shields that are meant to block incoming fire do not do so. The rocket is stopped, but the explosion continues unhindered, hitting any behind it, and somewhat defeating the purpose of having a shield in the first place. This also applies to solid objects, like walls and closed doors.

 

All these things put together make a very powerful unit, and it doesn't even have a real reason for it. The cause is simply broken mechanics that haven't been properly assessed instead of genuine challenging design.

This is a unit that outclasses every single unit of the same level, and that is bad for gameplay.

 

Also, the rockets are silent. Thanks, Obama.

Edited March 28, 2015 by AdunSaveMe

[(PSN)immanks102]

I'm not even gonna read this. Just yes, nerf, nerf them! 

I just read it and I agree lol nerf, nerf, nerf! 

[Ryker]

It's not that bombards are broken.

It's the way explosions in this game are handled. 

They are managed very poorly and just no-collide through anything. 

[VampirePirate]

They are one of the very few enemies that actually present a challenge.

[Zagrax]

I swear, sometimes void units get strange fire-rate boosts, like the corrupted corpus with struns will magdump the thing in about a second sometimes, and bombards will suddenly fire 1 rocket that knocks you down, and fire 4 more before you get up that you have no hope of dodging.

[AdunSaveMe]

They are one of the very few enemies that actually present a challenge.

A challenge is a problem that requires skill to bypass it.

 

Broken units with infinitely scaling health and damage fall under the category of artificial difficulty. Which is a bad thing.

[Sasquatchias]

They are one of the very few enemies that actually present a challenge.

 

An unfair challenge.

 

Using my acrobatics and such I should be able to go and dodge their rockets to get to them/safety, yet the tracking is so ridiculous that at times I feel they make a U-turn straight into the air back at me.

 

And lets not forget when you're a good distance away yet the explosion (and knockback) still hits you despite nothing on screen touching you.

[(PSN)DanteVincent]

They are one of the very few enemies that actually present a challenge.

A swarm of unavoidable homing missiles isn't a challenge, unless you consider old Radial Javelin a challenge, case in which we should bring it back. Both things are one and the same, broken. 

[Fifield]

A challenge is a problem that requires skill to bypass it.

 

Broken units with infinitely scaling health and damage fall under the category of artificial difficulty. Which is a bad thing.

 

Hang on, are you complaining about scaling at 40+ mins or Bombards?

The game is already too easy.  Bombards are one of two units that stop T4D going past 60 mins.

Having said that, if the game was made much more difficult in other ways, I'd support a small nerf.

[Jahadaya]

 I bet if DE added a unit that could kill you in two hits from across the map without any hope of you avoiding it, you'd be okay with that t- oh wait, they already have those.

Which unit is that exactly? 

[KidMemphis]

You all recall how much easier the Void was before DE threw Nullifiers and Bombards in the mix?

^_^

[Vyrn]

Another problem (and in my opinion it's one of the worst) is that they have a seemingly high proc chance. I've been chain stunned by a single Bombard.

 

He hit a wall several feet away, I got knocked down by the proc, I got up and began moving away, his next rocket hit some cover, I got knocked down again, and the cycle continued.

 

Combine that with Blast procs' throwing you forward (even if you are aiming through an Electric Shield, meaning you get tossed in front of the Shield towards the explosion), and your cover is now completely useless.

 

Personally, I think a tweak to their firerate, the homing capabilities, and the status chance would be fair.

[jjpdn]

NERF THEM LIKE HOW THEY NERFED POOR MAG!

IT WILL BE A GLORIOUS REVENGE!

 

LINE OF SIGHT!

 

LINE OF SIGHT!

 

LINE OF SIGHT!

Edited March 27, 2015 by jjpdn

[AdunSaveMe]

Hang on, are you complaining about scaling at 40+ mins or Bombards?

The game is already too easy.  Bombards are one of two units that stop T4D going past 60 mins.

Having said that, if the game was made much more difficult in other ways, I'd support a small nerf.

Both.

 

The game needs tweaks in many directions. Fixing an obviously broken unit is a good start. When a portion of the playerbase and DE themselves accepts broken units and poor design and the game begins to rely on them for its 'difficulty', something is seriously wrong.

 

There is really no reason to be content with things like that when there are vastly better alternatives that wouldn't make the game easy just a few tweaks away from here. You can shout about how they make it hard and how I should just get good and whatever you want, but the fact of the matter is that this is flawed, and there are better options that would still retain a level of difficulty.

 

But of course, there's always people that refuse to believe that it can be improved.

If you don't like it, you're just bad at the game.

Edited March 27, 2015 by AdunSaveMe

[Jahadaya]

A challenge is a problem that requires skill to bypass it.

 

Broken units with infinitely scaling health and damage fall under the category of artificial difficulty. Which is a bad thing.

Maybe you just don't have the "skill" to bypass their rockets, then? Or maybe you're not supposed to be able to easily bypass the rockets?

 

Also, did you really just say that? Infinite scaling isn't a problem inherent to Bombards. Please tell me you're kidding. 

[AdunSaveMe]

Maybe you just don't have the "skill" to bypass their rockets, then? Or maybe you're not supposed to be able to easily bypass the rockets?

 

Also, did you really just say that? Infinite scaling isn't a problem inherent to Bombards. Please tell me you're kidding. 

If you read my post, you'd see the bit where I mentioned the nigh-unavoidable tracking and dodgy explosions.

 

I did not say it's a problem inherent to bombards. It's part of the overall problem, and only makes the bombard problem worse.

[climatiseur]

Yes, the homing strength is too strong to a degree that is quite ridiculous, Maybe the tweak can start at this point.

 

But I want to point out the rocket can be shot at and explode in mid-air. Hope it helps a little bit,  yet, the homing still needs tweaks in my eyes.

[LifeNine]

Agreed. I can do a cart wheel to the side just before the rocket hits me and then the rocket will turn around and knock me down. I have also seen and rocket follow me after I turn 90 degrees down another hallway in the void and do a 180 after I manage to get around the rocket. If I remember correctly, you also can't do a flip jump over the rockets because they turn up immediately when you are going above the rocket.

[Sasquatchias]

Yes, the homing strength is too strong to a degree that is quite ridiculous, Maybe the tweak can start at this point.

 

But I want to point out the rocket can be shot at and explode in mid-air. Hope it helps a little bit,  yet, the homing still needs tweaks in my eyes.

Personally I have never been able to shoot down their rockets.

 

I mean I've clearly seen that I've been hitting them yet for the some reason the game just does not detect it happening.

[(PSN)WiiConquered]

Which unit is that exactly?

Ballista is exactly that. Seekers are pretty close (they're not as accurate so this doesn't actually happen often--but it's purely RNG based and not related to your actual actions besides "CC them into vegetables" and "Go invisible"). Toxic Eximi can be that if they spawn too close to you, or approach and proc you the second you see the aura.

Several other units, like the Corrupted Bombard, Nullifier, Infested Ancient, aren't as bad but still have the underlying problems on a slightly lesser scale.

[inappropriatename5818]

They are one of the very few enemies that actually present a challenge.

 

Annoying/broken =/= challenge   

 

Rockets shouldn't turn 360 degrees to follow you. they should miss if you dodge them, turn by maybe 30 degrees, then fly off into a wall, so you could dodge them if you see them. Right now all you can do if you see a rocket going for you is clench your buttcheeks and take it.

Edited March 27, 2015 by RektumExplorer

[Fifield]

But there's nothing broken about the Bombard.  It's just a Grineer with a Ogris that homes in on you slightly.

The only possible issue with the Bombard is that it's 3x more dangerous than its fellow enemies (excluding Nullifier, Ballista and Manic).  This sudden increase in difficulty provides a nice little adrenaline rush and means we have to be on our toes from the level they're introduced at.  Is this all a good thing?

I think so.  What if they were only 2x as dangerous?  I think that would work too.  A minor nerf would be to slow the missile and thus make them more avoidable/shootable. There's something to be said for making them more visible too.

 

What we cannot do is nerf Bombard's damage as that would make T4D go on even longer.  Therefore every other enemy should be buffed.
Players generally want shorter 'endless' missions, not longer ones. T4 enemies need a health/EHP boost.  T2 and particularly T3 enemies need both a health/EHP boost and a much bigger damage boost.
To compensate, remove forma from drop tables.

Edited March 27, 2015 by Fifield

[AlphaHorseman]

But there's nothing broken about the Bombard.  It's just a Grineer with a Ogris that homes in on you slightly.

The only possible issue with the Bombard is that it's 3x more dangerous than its fellow enemies (excluding Nullifier and Manic).  This sudden increase in difficulty provides a nice little adrenaline rush and means we have to be on our toes from the level they're introduced at.  Is this all a good thing?

I think so.  What if they were only 2x as dangerous?  I think that would work too.  A minor nerf would be to slow the missile and thus make them more avoidable/shootable.

 

What we cannot do is nerf Bombard's damage as that would make T4D go on even longer.  Therefore every other enemy should be buffed.

Players generally want shorter 'endless' missions, not longer ones. T4 enemies need a health/EHP boost.  T2 and particularly T3 enemies need both a health/EHP boost and a much bigger damage boost.

To compensate, remove forma from drop tables.

Oh I think severely accurate missiles that fire quickly is something to be looked at.

 

They have better tracking than their counterparts, and even their AoE presents issues. They don't present a challenge. A challenge can be overcome with skill and avoided. The rockets however can turn on a bloody dime and the AoE ensures that they can always damage us if we have no way of blocking their AoE attacks, which most frames do not.

[AdunSaveMe]

But there's nothing broken about the Bombard.  It's just a Grineer with a Ogris that homes in on you slightly.

Except the extreme missile homing, which makes it hard to avoid even for skilled players, and the broken explosion mechanics.

 

They don't need health and damage boosts. They need actual mechanics that call for skill, not gear.

Is it really too much to want a game that judges and rewards you for your skill instead of just the numbers on your gun?

 

Because you can spin it any way you want, but Warframe is more of a number battle than anything.

 

Some skill is required, obviously. I'm not denying that. But the majority of it is a gear check.

Edited March 27, 2015 by AdunSaveMe

[Fifield]

I don't think it's too much to ask that players going into T4 (which was endgame until a few days ago) have properly modded level 30 gear.  On the other hand, I do prefer skill check vs gear check, which is why I've suggested a possible nerf of slowing the missiles down and agreeing with your suggestion of making them more visible -- as long as other enemies are buffed.

I've never seen a missile turn tho Wiki says it's a "minor homing ability".  Don't suppose there's a video of this anywhere?