Traumtulpe

How slowly do I have to say this? You have to get shot, a lot, for all charges to get dissolved. A CC frame getting shot even half as much is stone cold dead, disabling all of it's abilities and weapons. It's not hard, is it? A child should be able to understand this.

No this is simply not true. At all. In any way, shape, or form. Enemies that have been stunned by Mesmer Skin do not get unstunned. You complain that Revenant's ability got turned off after getting shot 18 plus times. Any CC frame is long dead before having gotten shot 18 times. At which point all of their abilities are tuned off permanently. Because their are dead. Look, I'll make this really easy for you - so you have no excuse: Revenant is playing along, stunning enemies being untouchable. Oh no, an eximus showed up! The eximus rapidly shoots Revenant! 6 shots in rapid succession! Revenant is still immune! 6 more shots in rapid succession! Revenant is still immune! 6 more shots in rapid succession! Revenant still hasn't taken any damage! 6 more shots in rapid succession! Revenant's shield gating saved him! Revenant is still alive, quickly cast Mesmer Skin again! CC frame is playing along, stunning enemies being untouchable. Oh no, an eximus showed up! The eximus rapidly shoots CC frame! 6 shots in rapid succession! CC frames shield gating saved it! 6 more shots in rapid succession! Oh, you are dead!

Exactly this. The bugs and issues keep piling up, but DE just moves on to the next hype. "Oh we have no time to fix these bugs and rework these broken systems, we're too busy making a new open world with 17 different species of cactuses for you to collect (which will come with even more bugs we'll never fix! And we'll bring some old bugs we actually did fix for a change back too, yay!). Also you'll be able to raise Tamagotchis in Warframe, isn't that great?" "Also we have no money for deciated servers (we're making good profit though!), we can't be bothered to use the test servers or pay people to playtest our patches either! Yay!" "And don't forget to buy Soulframe when it comes out since we're kinda done with Warframe! ;D"

Again, this is utter nonsense. Mesmer Skin typically has >18 charges (you can get a lot more!), meaning Revenant was perfectly immune to 18 shots of an eximus unit before he got buffed. Any CC frame in the game is long dead getting shot 18 times by an eximus. So by your own logic, acting as if eximus units simply "dispelled" Mesmer Skin instantly, these very same eximus units would "dispel" the life out of any CC frame instantly. You contradict yourself very, very clearly. Hypocrisy 101.

That is horsemanure. Mesmer Skin didn't stun eximus because of overguard, it still did exactly what it said on the tin: Absorb a number of hits. But because it didn't stun exminus units, DE instead made Revenant invulnerable - specifically and explicitly to compensate for eximus units no longer getting stunned. Well guess what, CC abilities also no longer stun eximus. And warframes who's defense is CC - just as Revenant's defense is Mesmer Skin - did not get any invulnerability. Why? Because money. It's that simple. 1/2 of Revenant's ability stops working: Oh no, this will lose us money. Quick make him invulnerable! 100% of many other warframe abilitys stop working: Working as intended!

Exactly! And this includes uncapping the status effect, and increasing the DoT damage by the % of Heat+Toxin mods on the weapon. Because right now in the game, if you have Gas on the weapon (Heat+Toxin) and then remove either of the Heat, or Toxin mod, the remaining element's DoT will do higher damage (because it does scale with the mod percentage). You can literally increase your damage by 60% to 165% by removing a mod, that's how bad gas is. Even before considering the 10 proc cap. You are talking out of your ass. DE literally buffed Mesmer skin to include invincibility periods because eximus units were "making the ability useless" due to not getting stunned by it and thus depleting the charges fast. It of course still absorbed the specified amount of hits, it just didn't stun them to prevent quick charge loss. They said this straight up. CC frames are affected far worse - their stuns don't work either,, but they absorb zero hits. Overguard makes their abilities 100% useless. Only difference here is, DE needed to sell Revenant Prime at the time (they were really pushing him hard, they even gave him an exclusive 50% ability strength mod - which most other warframes would love to be able to use).

And how did you come to this completely wrong and unfounded conclusion? It caps at 10 stacks, at which point new procs will replace old ones. Please do not spread misinformation. Someone at DE will think "oh well there is this one person saying X and this other person saying Y, I guess we'll just continue to sit on our hands and do nothing about these game breaking bugs then".

No, I distinctly remember radiation dissolving the body with a specific animation. It's been a long time though.

A one second cast delay doesn't hurt Gauss. Getting 10x viral on everything passively without doing anything and getting 500% energy from all sources and staggering enemies and buffing your weapons with the best damage type in the game all from one ability is just dumb. It's just completely stupid. And DE did this because nobody plays Grendel, and they have some sort of burning, misguided, need to balance usage stats - but overpowered abilities don't change the fact that Grendel isn't a prime, is a fat dude, and the missions to get him are expensive, late game, and unfun. Ember doesn't need to get anything in return. Currently Blood Altar is useless and unused, even by the frame it originates from. Your suggestion to keep it useless, to do nothing, and this is in any case worse than trying to fix the issue. Worst case scenario the change could always get reverted, but again, you do not get 2 kills per second by standing still. You do not.

I remember in the past kills with Radiation damage would dissolve the body, but that seems to have been patched out at some point. Looks like you're out of luck unless you consider abilities.

To be fair, daggers weren't used because they are particularly good at killing people; They were used because they were legal to purchase (when swords were not), and easy to conceal - neither of which are a consideration in Warframe. If you wanted to kill a magical creature with steel skin and no internal organs (Grineer, functionally), you probably wouldn't choose a dagger for the job. A Big spiked hammer sounds more like it.

There is zero balance in normal star chart. None whatsoever. Not even a scintilla. The only balance there is that you can oneshot enemies with any weapon - you might deal 1x, 10x, 100x, 1000x, or 10000x their entire health pool with that hit though. Also you can be invincible with any warframe. Dragon Breath... in theory you are right, being able to use it with melee seems interesting at first, but if you try it you quickly realize that it's not at all. First of all the ability aims where the warframes head points - if you're like me and like strafing, this is almost never at the enemies. Unless you aim, but that interferes with melee. But much worse, it very slowly procs 1 status type in a very small cone - a random gun (which Dragon Breath replaces) could do better than that, at zero energy cost. And if you have something like the Epitaph, the difference is just comical, they're not even in the same universe. As such Dragon Breath is always a downside to use. You are always better off ignoring it. Nice try trough. Fun is subjective, I experience precisely zero fun engaging with K-Drives. If I wanted to play any form of racing or skating, I'd play another game. Seriously. Archguns deal more damage than archmelee, a lot, a lot more. Like 100 times more (maybe 1000, I'm not going to check). I agree that archmelee is nice in theory, but they just don't work - unless maybe you're in the starchart, where it doesn't matter if you deal 1x or 1000x damage - but even then a rapid fire gun is just obviously better. Archguns same issue, normal guns are more effective (vastly so), have no cooldown, don't hamper movement, and don't require a lengthy summoning animation. I have to give you the infinite punch through though, which is very very rarely something you might consider (and then not bother with after all). So out of the things I mentioned, you have 1 theoretical point of usefulness (I didn't ask if you think K-Drives are fun), which is it might be possible to cheese some missions thanks to the infinite punch through of certain archguns.

Archmelee isn't useful. Deploying an archgun in normal missions isn't useful. K-Drives aren't useful. Dragon Breath isn't useful. Wanna dispute any of these?

Thermal Sunder will get nerfed, and it will be worse than my suggested 1 second cast delay. Mark my words (apparently people started using it to bot the game). Uncapping the armor strip on Fire Blast is the exact opposite of silly. Terror can already do that without LoS, and is also available in the Helminth. Currently there is no point in using Blood Altar when you can use Gloom instead. Even Garuda herself vastly prefers Gloom. The point you missed is that Blood Altar is a static object, you won't get 2 kills per second by standing in one place. And Nourish is stupid overpowered. It shouldn't give you 500% energy period.

No, you completely misunderstood. In my suggestion Helminth abilities are completely identical to their base versions, with very few exceptions (like Quiver, and Petrify not generating rubble). Also you may have noticed that I have suggested nerfs for the most powerful helminth abilities (within reason, unlike DE who tend to completely axe and bury anything they nerf), while suggesting numerous improvements to helminth abilities nobody ever uses or will even consider (because they objectively suck). The aim is to increase player choice by narrowing the gap between abilties.

I'd like to pose the exact opposite point of view, Mirage would be a very popular warframe if you could give her the suggested Quiver or Defy, and Eclipse was a damage buff only. The 2 reasons people don't play her is her lack of survivability and reliability, many people in fact love her theme and style. Gloom and Nourish are just completely overpowered abilities, and if you've ready my OP you'd see I suggested reasonable nerfs. And Thermal Sunder is weird, so I'll skip that one (I could write an entire page on this ability). But Gauss is actually fairly popular himself. I've never actually seen anybody use Fire Blast, ever. I'd have definitely noticed by enemies getting knocked away (or the huge wall of fire). And I see no reason to use this ability, ever, myself. So I'll need you to explain this one to me.

That can be done without issue via ability synergy - just as Wisp can teleport to her nodes via Breach Surge (and benefit from the augment) while other frames can't. If you just nerf an ability by 50% it's either too strong on the original frame, or too weak in the Helminth.

That's a fair point, but I actually think the ability is bugged and not supposed to have that goop in the first place. It's literally copy pasted from Nidus, and if I recall correctly, Xata's Whisper didn't have the goop on release.

It got capped because you could get literally 100% damage reduction via Invigoration or new arcanes. As far as the Helminth is concerned, I'm looking at this from a "fun" perspective - throwing around fancy concepts like "Corrosion of Warframe kit Identity" is nice and all, but putting cool abilities that you enjoy on warframes you like, and customization in general is just fun. And the game is struggling on a very basic level, we can worry about concepts like that when the basics are working. Right now you can put Gloom on a warframe and nothing moves anymore. The AI just gets turned off. That's bad, and my suggestion would change it. Having 3k armor (that decays over time, as I wrote) is a lot worse than shield gating - when was the last time you saw anybody play Valkyr? She has 3k armor with an Umbral set and Warcry, and this is not something players see as worth playing. Also you still die to a single slash tick with 3k armor. Steel path is already trivial and normal is already boring (and always has been). The goal of this post wasn't to change that (and changes to the Helminth can't possibly do that), it was to make the Helminth more fun by adding a semblance of balance. But that would be no fun. A lot of warframes have bugged garbage abilities, let me replace at least one of those garbage abilities with a fun one that isn't nerfed by 50%. Let's all be real here for a second; Nobody is going to use Fire Blast when Terrify exists (75% armor stip max, line of sight), having a decaying 3k armor from an ability (you can get roughly the same with 2 Arcanes!) doesn't break the game and neither do health / energy orbs. You can't just present a player with a choice between A) and B), when they do the exact same thing except B) is just clearly inferior in every way. That's not how choice works.

By the way, completely CC immune enemies are perfectly fine - as long as their attacks are telegraphed and dodgeable, or melee only. Making hitscan instakill enemies also immune to abilities is a bit... not smart, let's call it that.

While the Helminth is a great addition to the game, it suffers from wild imbalance regarding the available abilities - severely limiting variety and player enjoyment. Seeing how DE is unable or unwilling to spend the time needed to properly consider their balance, I thought I'd do it in 10 minutes: 〇 Shuriken: Now strips armor (as per augment) by default, both shuriken will home in on the target being aimed at (if any). 〇 Pertify: Fixed the bug where Petrify does not respect the players aim (instead apparently going where the warframes head points), 20% of damage bypasses targets armor. 〇 Silence: No change. 〇 Lull: The augment is now baseline part of the ability. 〇 Sentient Wrath: Changed the cast animation to be one handed, faster, and not force the warframe to the ground. 〇 Fractured Blast: Reverted the Helminth specific nerf. All it does is drop orbs, dude, chill it with the nerfbat. 〇 Elemental Ward: Reverted the Toxin variety to scale with duration instead of strength (including the damage buff), made the buff multiplicative instead of base damage. 〇 Fire Blast: Uncapped the armor strip - can now reach 100% via sufficient ability strength. 〇 Rest and Rage: No change. 〇 Radial Blind: No change. 〇 Ice Wave: The augment is now part of the ability by default. 〇 Spectrorage: Is now centered on the player and moves with him. 〇 Blood Altar: Every enemy killed within range gives allies 100 overguard (including the coming 0.5 second "overguard gate"). 〇 Thermal Sunder: Added a 1 second cast delay to dissuade overly aggressive spamming, slightly toned down the sound effect. 〇 Nourish: Extra energy is now +75% regardless of ability strength, retaliation always procs 1x viral (even for Grendel). 〇 Coil Horizon: Reduced the spheres weight so it can be thrown upwards too! 〇 Condemn: No change. 〇 Pillage: No change. 〇 Tempest Barrage: Now strips both armor and shields by default, removed the augment. 〇 Dissication: Increased the healing to 50 per second while enemies are affected, modified by ability strength. 〇 Quiver: Tap to cast Stealth Arrow as normal, hold to stick the arrow into yourself. People already do this with a sentinel, but it's clunky as eff. 〇 Ensnare: Added a mild (really mild!) line of sight check (ensnaring enemies through walls is actually a bit of a nuisance). 〇 Wrathful Advance: Now +100% crit by default, Helminth range nerf reverted (ability is identical both on Kullervo and in Helminth). 〇 Vial Rush: Adds a movement speed + cold damage buff after the ability is done casting. 〇 Banish: Banished enemies can still be damaged from outside the rift. 〇 Decoy: Added a 5 second invunerability / charge up phase, his shots now deal scaling damage in ralation to damage absorbed (think Mallet). 〇 Pull: Reverted the Helminth specific nerf. Greedy Pull is now an exilus mod. 〇 Shooting Gallery: No change. 〇 Eclipse: Removed the damage reduction part entirely, now only buffs damage at the reduced Helminth value (even for Mirage herself). 75% DR sometimes is useless. 〇 Terrify: No change. 〇 Fire Walker: Now offers 100% status immunity while active (I think it's supposed to, but it actually doesn't work reliably). 〇 Larva: Reverted the Helminth specific nerf. 〇 Null Star: No longer passively uses up particles, the augment Neutron Star is now part of the ability by default. Inceased energy cost to 50. 〇 Mind Control: Mind controlled enemies now have higher aggro rating. 〇 Smite: Projectiles now explode in a 5m radius (for the same damage). 〇 Resonator: No change. 〇 Dispensary: Reverted the Helminth specific nerf. 〇 Reave: No change. 〇 Roar: Now 35% damage increase (even on Rhino), costs 50 energy and has the augment Piercing Roar by default. 〇 Molt: The augment is now part of the base ability, also fixed the bug where the healing buff stops actually healing when Molt explodes. 〇 Gloom: Maximum slow is 80%, reduced energy cost. 〇 Tharros Strike: No change. 〇 Spellbind: The augment Spellbound Harvest is now part of the ability by default. 〇 Well of Life: The augment Pool of Life is now part of the ability by default. 〇 Warcry: Reverted the Helminth nerf. 〇 Tesla Nervos: Tesla Bank now deals true damage. 〇 Shock: Enemies affected by Shock have a 20% chance to drop an energy orb. 〇 Lycath's Hunt: Reverted the Helminth nerf. It drops orbs my dude, this doesn't break the game. 〇 Breach Surge: No change. 〇 Defy: Armor bonus increased to maximum 3000, decaying over time. 〇 Xata's Whispers: No change. 〇 Aquablades: Now also procs Cold and Puncture, in addition to Slash. 〇 Airburst Rounds: Changed the augment Airburst Rounds to be multiplicative instead of base damage, with a cap of 250%. As a bonus: 〇 Rebuild Shields: Now also gives an equal amount of overguard and clears status effects. 〇 Marked for Death: Now identical to the Stalker version. 〇 Masters Summons: Now revives completely dead pets, including sentinels.

Those damn players are gonna like Void Sling one day! Oops, wrong topic.

There are many different damage attenuations in the game, with archon having 2 different layers, one of which is global and the other per player.

Also thank you @[DE]Saske for censoring the word "effing". Wouldn't want to hurt any (very extraordinarily sensible) sensibilities!

Nice theory, but you are completely mistaken. Dread Mirror is not health steal or health loss (like Reave, for example), it simply deals 10% of max health as Slash damage. As such it would (very slightly) damage overguard with no special interaction if it could be cast on them.