September 5Th: Community Hot Topics!

[Vashna]

You wish these were the communities hot topics.

 

Nobody's buying it tho. 

[Phoenix86]

Cant wait to see the frame's reworks!!

 

and really hope Necro #3 gets REMOVED and CHANGED totally.

 

oh, and the new tileset

[Loswaith]

Survival Weekend

 

Congratulations Tenno, you survived the weekend! The feedback from the event has been awesome and it’s giving us great ideas for improvement. Many of you even said it was our best event yet (yay!). These events are great ways for us to determine what works for the game and what doesn’t. A majority of players loved Survival Weekend, but suggested a few tweaks be made. We discussed in our Stream the future of Survival mode, and can confirm that yes it will make its way as a permanent mission type in the game.  ...

 

Given raids are being removed because they are essentially the same as capture, are we realy getting survival in this form?

 

Survival as shown by the event are essentially defence with no fail conditions, making them like the old endless defence when you got full rewards for fails.

 

The end result is just Survival being to Defence what Raid is to Capture, which to me seems counter the purpose of removing one mission type because its too similare to another then adding one that is the same as an existing one.

 

Dont get me wrong I'm all for having new mission types if they arent just a simpler rehash of an existing one (esecially ones that lack any real purpose or goal other than to kill things as long as you can).

Edited September 6, 2013 by Loswaith

[SoulEchelon]

Given raids are being removed because they are essentially the same as capture, are we realy getting survival in this form?

 

Survival as shown by the event are essentially defence with no fail conditions, making them like the old endless defence when you got full rewards for fails.

 

The end result is just Survival being to Defence what Raid is to Capture, which to me seems counter the purpose of removing one mission type because its too similare to another then adding one that is the same as an existing one.

 

Dont get me wrong I'm all for having new mission types if they arent just a simpler rehash of an existing one (esecially ones that lack any real purpose or goal other than to kill things as long as you can).

 

I can see what you're saying. Frankly, I'd rather them replace the old Defense missions with Survival.

 

They DID state though that there will be other new mission types. Infact there will be one where we have to defend Lotus herself as she floats around in some sort of mech suit. I think that'll be interesting. And there's another one they mentioned that was all about escaping or something like that. It was in a livestream.

[scope007]

Don't know why you still call this Threads "Community Hot Topics" because all you did here is giving a TL;DR for the livestream.

 

I thougt the Hot Topic Threads are a reflection and confirmation of what the community brought up and that you, DE, read and maybe look into it.

 

/disappointed

^ This.

[Mr.Kazimir]

 

 

Warframes

 

If you tuned into Livestream #13 you would have seen Necro in all his terrifying glory! Not only did we show him in more detail, but we also mentioned his abilities. Many of you have already contributed to our discussion post about him and we love it. We have been seeing negative reactions with the third ability for Necro “Search The Dead”. We ourselves are not certain this will remain so stay tuned!

 

Necro isn’t the only Warframe in the spotlight. Nyx, Vauban, Ember, Trinity, and Mag will all receive changes to their powers.  To some this may be disheartening, but know our intentions are good! Warframes will continue to get tweaked until they’re just right.

 

 

What about Volt? Cmon, DE! Make Volt awesome again, give him a mobile shield, like the one in Dark Sector and I`ll be happy. Or at least buff his other skills, he`s still falling behind most of the frames. Also 50 armor, please. 

 

Other than that, I`m very excited about update 10. Can`t wait till I see what changes the Armor 2.0 system will bring. Also, I`m psyched about the scarves, can`t wait to see them in action.

[Muminidas]

So nice! Really, can't wait for U10, I am so thrilled about new Golem and Warframe. AAAnd ... damage model changed, yay DO WANT! ^^

[Othergrunty]

You don't read anything other than what you want to read, do you?

 

They're balancing her other skills to coincide with the rebalancing of Overheat. She's going to be doing more DoT damage - exactly what a FIRE character should have. But no, you and the other crybabies don't see this. Instead, you only see an overpowered ability getting "nerfed" while the rest of her abilities are totally nonexistant.

 

 

True. Problem is, Overheat and abilities like it only make what many of you call an "easy game" even easier. People scream for more difficulty, yet become snot-nosed brats when their overpowered abilities or weapons get rebalanced.

 

It doesn't make the game easier, it makes the game more survivable at higher levels.

 

Also Frost has an ice theme and yet they still gave him an ability which is more like a death star shield generator. Instead of "hit enemies with a wave of ice" which his other 3 abilities are.

Which after a certain level is actualy almost a requirement to beat defensive missions because of the silly aiming abilities from hordes of high power ranged enemies in this game.

Oh and of these defensive missions we now have 3 types (Defence, Mobile Defence, Survivial) with more versions of escort soon to come, meaning his shield is even more needed. Especialy when most of the alerts these days with the great rewards like Orokin Reactor/Catalyst and Forma, seem to be defensive missions with level 60+ enemies.

 

So why should Ember only be able to soley deal 4 ways of fire damage. What use does this has for the team except steal weapon kills?

 

Her description says she can super heat air monecules around her? Why should all her abilities just be "create flames" when she could have at least one defensive, buff, debuff, distraction, or utility skill based around heat instead, like how Frost has his defensive skill?

Edited September 6, 2013 by Othergrunty

[SoulEchelon]

It doesn't make the game easier, it makes the game more survivable at higher levels.

 

Also Frost has an ice theme and yet they still gave him an ability which is more like a death star shield generator. Instead of "hit enemies with a wave of ice" which his other 3 abilities are.

Which after a certain level is actualy almost a requirement to beat defensive missions because of the silly aiming abilities from hordes of high power ranged enemies in this game.

Oh and of these defensive missions we now have 3 types (Defence, Mobile Defence, Survivial) with more versions of escort soon to come, meaning his shield is even more needed. Especialy when most of the alerts these days with the great rewards like Orokin Reactor/Catalyst and Forma, seem to be defensive missions with level 60+ enemies.

 

So why should Ember only be able to soley deal 4 ways of fire damage. What use does this has for the team except steal weapon kills?

 

Her description says she can super heat air monecules around her? Why should all her abilities just be "create flames" when she could have at least one defensive, buff, debuff, distraction, or utility skill based around heat instead, like how Frost has his defensive skill?

 

I never stated that all she should do is kill things. You kind of missed the whole point of my post. And comparing Frost to Ember is like comparing an apple to an orange. Frost was built to be mainly a team based defensive warframe with ice-based crowd control abilities. Ember was built to be a fire based caster frame that focuses on DoT instead of direct damage. Infact, she's more akin to Saryn than anyone else because of this.

 

Speaking of Saryn, I can easily twist your example around by saying Saryn and all the other warframes with no invulnerability/damage reduction abilities should have them, because Ember (and Frost) do. But then that would make this game even more "easy" than it already is, wouldn't it? DE has been constantly working towards weeding out ALL the "godmode" abilities in this game. First was, interestingly enough, Saryn. Contagion had invulnerability. They rather quickly removed that, however. Then Rhino. Now comes Trinity and Ember. This shouldn't have come as a surprise. Also, PLEASE keep in mind that Overheat will still have damage reduction - just not as much. 90% reduction was overpowered and we all know it.

 

As for higher level enemies, am I the only one that don't use invulnerability while fighting in tier 3 void? Is it really that hard to just...oh I don't know, use actual tactics? There will be a huge armor update as well as enemy AI coming for update 10. This is a factor that alot of people are also totally ignoring.

 

This line made me rofl: So why should Ember only be able to soley deal 4 ways of fire damage. What use does this has for the team except steal weapon kills? <--- this kind of thinking is what's aiding in ruining this game. Stealing weapon kills? You're in a team - this isn't a competition. You get exp no matter who kills an enemy, as long as you're near where they died. What's funny, is that the same people who think this ends up contradicting themselves because they rely on frames that have such large AOE abilities to survive high level defense missions (as well as frames who have invulnerability). This is a crutch. A way to circumvent a flawed system, and DE is currently working to fix it. Hopefully, armor 2.0 is what we're all waiting for, and will stop people from focusing so much on overpowered and unbalanced abilities and frames.

Edited September 6, 2013 by SoulEchelon

[Shifty_Shuffler]

Trading

 

 We have a brief update on Trading:

 

“Most of the people who can work on trading, are working on the damage model changes, warframe buffs etc” -Steve

 

“The existing issues are damage models, certain Warframes not being viable, and certain weapon types not being viable. So the focus has really been on fixing those problems rather than taking a quantum leap [and adding trading]. I agree it is something that players ask for and we do need to have some trading in the game. The performance patch I’m hoping comes with Update 10.” -Steve

 

Good to hear. As much as I want trading I think you guys are doing the right thing. People would be more pissed if they sold a weapon/frame only for it to be updated and made good/viable.

[AyezRed]

I hope we get survival soon!

[Othergrunty]

-snips-

 

I used Frost as an example because he is on the opposite end of the "elemental" spectrum while being also mainly a caster unit. But while Frost dominates thanks to a good mix of offense and defense, Ember is lacking behind because she is squishy and seems like she will only have offense.

And that in a game which gets more and more defensive mission types.

 

Also Ember's overheat is not invulnerability, it offers high protection for a very limited amount of time.

Similar you seem to ignore that the wording they used the in the livestream makes it sound like the damage reduction from Overheat will be very small, more of an afterthought. We are not talking about 50 or 70% damage reduction we are talking about a scale of 10 to 20 with words like "still" and "a bit".

 

Ember closer to Saryn? Well i wish she would have similar good stats as Saryn. I really wouldn't mind the overheat change if they make Ember a bit beefier in stats and still give her an ability which can safe her hide like Molt does.

 

Caster good and fine, but Ember's design looks more like someone who should be in the middle of a fight rather than on the sideline throwing spells at the enemies, which the way her abilities work pretty much reflects. But like i said, she can't do that because she is too slow and squishy.

 

Tactics can not carry you when the enemy keeps killing you in seconds because you have left 2 pixels out of cover exposed, some ancient runs up to you and knocks you on the ground to allow his mates to shred you to pieces or your team mate got downed and you would need to run through fire to revive him/her. Tactics are only good if you have abilities which can back them up. The way the changes make ember sound she will be far less tactical usefull without that defensive ability.

 

But alas. You are right and we should wait and see if they still keep enemies as auto aiming brick walls with death rays.

 

Also i give you that the weapon kill steal comment was dumb.

Edited September 6, 2013 by Othergrunty

[blade257]

Suggestion for Necro's 3rd skill:

An AoE skill (whether thrown or around him) when enemies walk into it (similar to Frost's Ice Globe or Vauban's Bastille) which have one of the following effects:

1) Enemies take more damage from all sources

2) Armor debuff

3) Reduction of total HP by a certain amount

- when enemy leaves the AoE field, total HP will be brought back to normal. Any HP lost while in the circle will be proportional to this Total HP.

- Example: Say an enemy has 20 hp. When he steps into the AoE field, his total hp will drop to 10 hp (this is assuming that the field cuts the total hp by half). So if he receives 6 dmg in the field, he'll have 4 hp left.

When he exits the field, his total hp will be 20 again but his remaining hp will be 8. (proportional, everything x2 when he exits the field)

- for visual entertainment, when he enters the field, his bones will be revealed.

4) ...Stalker will kill your enemies for you. Basically, summon Stalker. (this is for fun and joy)

Just my approximate 2 cents.

[Fundance]

in...infested weapons?

 

Oh yes yes yes. Please make them better than the Mire.

[Tazmanyak]

Scarves- Mynki showed us on Livestream #13 what he has in store for the scarf cosmetics. Check out some of the images from Livestream #13 here https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/102173-thank-you-for-watching-livestream-13/

 

Erf, how uggly this is!

But, what the hell do you have in your mind?

Scraves? Really? We do play Space Ninjas with SCARVES? oÔ

 

Wow, i'm shocked ...

 

Everything else, cant wait, sounds and look good :D

[Yurinaga]

And what of Frost? I'm rather disappointed that apart from the premature profile video, he has had nary a mention lately because his powers clearly need buffing:

 

1) Freeze is easy to miss with sometimes, especially at mid-long range, far TOO easily cancelled by stray bullets, has only negligible damage (which is NOT why I use it anyway!) scaling with mod level, which makes anything above rank 0 wasted mod points and only works on one target for some arbitrary reason, all subsequent targets only being slowed a bit, which my weapons do anyway! Make it a hit-scan blast with an AoE effect where at least the primary target cannot be prematurely thawed. USELESS!

 

2) Ice Wave and Avalanche only have damage going for them and if any target happens to survive (which happens a hell of a lot more as of Update 9!) then it's wasted energy! Make them armour-ignoring! At the very least, give them some lasting CC effect, like Ice Wave ragdollises enemies (they were after all, just skewered on ice spikes!) because it's especially galling that survivors don't so much as flinch and just go back to shooting/clawing me unabated, like pressing 4 only made them briefly forget what they came in here for! USELESS!

 

I stopped using him about 2 months ago in frustration when I realised he's nothing but a one-trick pony! And please, for the love of the Lotus, do not pull a Bastille here; leave Snow Globe alone!

[Cpl_Facehugger]

And what of Frost? I'm rather disappointed that apart from the premature profile video, he has had nary a mention lately because his powers clearly need buffing:

 

1) Freeze is easy to miss with sometimes, especially at mid-long range, far TOO easily cancelled by stray bullets, has only negligible damage (which is NOT why I use it anyway!) scaling with mod level, which makes anything above rank 0 wasted mod points and only works on one target for some arbitrary reason, all subsequent targets only being slowed a bit, which my weapons do anyway! Make it a hit-scan blast with an AoE effect where at least the primary target cannot be prematurely thawed. USELESS!

 

2) Ice Wave and Avalanche only have damage going for them and if any target happens to survive (which happens a hell of a lot more as of Update 9!) then it's wasted energy! Make them armour-ignoring! At the very least, give them some lasting CC effect, like Ice Wave ragdollises enemies (they were after all, just skewered on ice spikes!) because it's especially galling that survivors don't so much as flinch and just go back to shooting/clawing me unabated, like pressing 4 only made them briefly forget what they came in here for! USELESS!

 

I stopped using him about 2 months ago in frustration when I realised he's nothing but a one-trick pony! And please, for the love of the Lotus, do not pull a Bastille here; leave Snow Globe alone!

Depending on how U10's damage rework treats cold damage, frost may not need many changes at all. Ice wave and avalanche aren't bad against targets who don't have much armor, so if the damage rework lets ice do better vs armor, he might not need anything but freeze buffed at all.

[RevenantPhoenix]

So wait, you tell me in the live stream that you're going to turn Ember from a tank into a dps, at a fundamental level. A dps who will not be competitive with other dps frames- not because of her damage values- but because of the way her abilities function. Furthermore, she will be a dps frame who must be in close quarters for 3 of her 4 powers to be most effective. And she will be there with presumably little damage reduction from Overheat, 10 Armor, average health and shield values, and slower than average movement speed. Additionally, you remove the one utility feature this warframe has in favor of having her use 4 damage abilities. Even Nova, the pinnacle of glass cannons, has a utility skill. Ember needs more utility, not less.

 

And now you have the audacity to tell me that all of this is with the best intentions? Am I supposed to be happy that I'm losing most of what makes my favorite warframe enjoyable? Am I supposed to be happy that the 2 worthless abilities that I haven't used for months are recieving damage buffs? Despite the fact that those abilities will still be functionally useless compared to WoF?

 

You're absolutely right that this is disheartening. Do you know how much I regret getting GM status on this game, seeing now how you approach a design review? Do you know how much I regret getting Ember, then using a potato and a forma to get her set up just right? Do you know how I, and many other people who GOT Ember BECAUSE of her defensibility are feeling right now?

 

It's like you're knowingly disappointing and disregarding Ember players on so many levels, and then claiming it's somehow with good intentions.

 

But hey, the scarves and the Necro frame look cool and I'm truly excited about those :)

[Ced23Ric]

It's like you're knowingly disappointing and disregarding Ember players on so many levels, and then claiming it's somehow with good intentions.

 

Let's not call the verdict before the jury is back. Rhino was invincible, then borked. Iron Skin came back and is now a sloid skill that is inline with the other abilities. Overheat is closer to old Iron Skin than new Iron Skin. Let's see what happens before your proclaim Ember dead.Even if the first reiteration is garbage, bring the feedback and explain the whys wand whats.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

Let's not call the verdict before the jury is back. Rhino was invincible, then borked. Iron Skin came back and is now a sloid skill that is inline with the other abilities. Overheat is closer to old Iron Skin than new Iron Skin. Let's see what happens before your proclaim Ember dead.Even if the first reiteration is garbage, bring the feedback and explain the whys wand whats.

I don't know man, new Iron Skin is better than immediate prenerf IS, but it still has serious problems above level 40. It's just that Rhino's other powers are good enough to make up for it now.

[Ced23Ric]

I don't know man, new Iron Skin is better than immediate prenerf IS, but it still has serious problems above level 40. It's just that Rhino's other powers are good enough to make up for it now.

 

What if something similar happens to Ember?

[SoulEchelon]

I used Frost as an example because he is on the opposite end of the "elemental" spectrum while being also mainly a caster unit. But while Frost dominates thanks to a good mix of offense and defense, Ember is lacking behind because she is squishy and seems like she will only have offense.

And that in a game which gets more and more defensive mission types.

 

I see your worry. In my opinion, Ember does need a full on rework. I don't think she should have a heavy damage reducing ability. Instead, I'd rather her be like what a true wild fire should be. Fast, surprising, as well as deadly. Her being slow makes no sense to me. More base speed, a touch more armor, and abilities that truly reflect her nature.... like Fireblast actually spreading around the area it hits, or Overheat leaving a trail of fire in her wake. That sort of thing.Now, DE_Scott is capable, and he has Sheldon hovering over him (since Sheldon loves our Ember too). I wish people can just vent their worries and then see what happens instead of raising pitchforks and forgetting to blow their noses from all the tears.

 

 

Also Ember's overheat is not invulnerability, it offers high protection for a very limited amount of time.

Similar you seem to ignore that the wording they used the in the livestream makes it sound like the damage reduction from Overheat will be very small, more of an afterthought. We are not talking about 50 or 70% damage reduction we are talking about a scale of 10 to 20 with words like "still" and "a bit".

 

I placed everything that gives some sort of high or full invulnerability into the same category, which I shouldn't have. But still - only 10% of damage is getting through when that ability is up. At the moment, that's on par or even stronger than Rhino (I don't want to give more ammunition to Rhinos, but eh. It's true.)

 

And I'm not ignoring the wording. Remember, I agree with tuning down the damage reduction because it's an overpowered crutch. I will add though, that the only reason it's overpowered and is a crutch in the first place is due to how this game and its enemies were implemented. I hinted a few times that people are only using these overpowered abilities because they practically have to in higher levels. That's no es bueno - not just to us players, but to the devs.

 

Ember closer to Saryn? Well i wish she would have similar good stats as Saryn. I really wouldn't mind the overheat change if they make Ember a bit beefier in stats and still give her an ability which can safe her hide like Molt does.

 

I only compared them together due to their DoT. After that, the similarities are little. Still, I do agree stronger stats is something Ember could definitely use - I hope at least base speed is boosted. But again, we have to keep in mind they're totally revamping the armor system in this game. Ember's squishiness might change. We won't know until it hits, though.

 

Caster good and fine, but Ember's design looks more like someone who should be in the middle of a fight rather than on the sideline throwing spells at the enemies, which the way her abilities work pretty much reflects. But like i said, she can't do that because she is too slow and squishy.

 

I think of caster frames as focusing on "magic" - not just on the sidelines. Nova? Though her strongest ability is best used in the middle of a group, I'd call her a caster because she truly can't take any punishment whatsoever. She needs to stay on the sidelines until she gets that chance to nuke. But I agree with what you're saying - Ember really should have the speed and defensive power to actually use her "Close Burst" abilities. I just don't think 90% damage reduction is the way to go.

 

Tactics can not carry you when the enemy keeps killing you in seconds because you have left 2 pixels out of cover exposed, some ancient runs up to you and knocks you on the ground to allow his mates to shred you to pieces or your team mate got downed and you would need to run through fire to revive him/her. Tactics are only good if you have abilities which can back them up. The way the changes make ember sound she will be far less tactical usefull without that defensive ability.

 

But alas. You are right and we should wait and see if they still keep enemies as auto aiming brick walls with death rays.

 

Also i give you that the weapon kill steal comment was dumb.

 

Tactics is more of a personal kind of deal. I really shouldn't have pointed it out, because it does change from frame to frame and situation to situation. I wouldn't say Ember will become less tactical. Remember, after Rhino's revamp, people actually had to start playing the game instead of pressing a button and slowly running through waves of enemies while shooting them in the face. People still gripe about losing their godmode, but I think Rhino is far more dynamic now and fun. Will this happen with Ember too? I think so. But it's all speculation - that's really all we can do until they divulge more information. And, though I know I sound like a broken record, there's armor 2.0 to look forward to.

 

Edit: I want to add that I'm saying "90% reduction" because I'm also calculating in mods. The actual amount for Overheat maxed is is 70%

Edited September 6, 2013 by SoulEchelon

[RevenantPhoenix]

Sorry, I'm not going to wait for them to break my frame before I start throwing feedback their way. Maybe if they gave me a value to work with, I could determine how bad/good these changes are. But the way they worded it in the stream I'm imagining a 20% DR or something like that on Overheat now.

 

I want DE to understand that Ember being anything less than a tank is unnacceptable.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

What if something similar happens to Ember?

That'd be good, I guess, but it'd be hard to avoid overlap with Nova, Saryn, and possibly Mag in terms of role.

[SoulEchelon]

Sorry, I'm not going to wait for them to break my frame before I start throwing feedback their way. Maybe if they gave me a value to work with, I could determine how bad/good these changes are. But the way they worded it in the stream I'm imagining a 20% DR or something like that on Overheat now.

 

I want DE to understand that Ember being anything less than a tank is unnacceptable.

 

Ember was never meant to be a tank. her 10 armor instantly proves that.

 

That'd be good, I guess, but it'd be hard to avoid overlap with Nova, Saryn, and possibly Mag in terms of role.

 

Why can't we have multiple frames having the same role, but different abilities? There are many different forms of wizards, many different forms of warriors, many different forms of rogues. Though I kind of hate using that analogy - Warframe wasn't actually meant to have a "holy trinity" going on. We have two different "ninja" style characters. According to you, we should axe Loki or Ash because they're overlapping each other.

Edited September 6, 2013 by SoulEchelon