Nyx : the body of a goddess , the abilities of a chicken

[Kontrollo]

6 hours ago, Xzorn said:

I'm narrowly focused on Nyx being a Defensive / CC frame which is what she is and always has been.

What meta weapons? I used mostly pure elemental and beam weapons for Nyx because her Pacifying Bolt Augment stops working if you proc Impact or any other animation status effect on an enemy or if another enemy does. Then again they ruined the Augment and the stun still ends abruptly when Chaos ends for no reason.

Weapon choices? Sure but at what level range? The range where you could pick anything anyways or the range where the Armor strip might make a difference but you're either perma Assimilate or you / another player are dead on the ground since they took vital CC out of her kit? It's quite redundant by comparison. She needs the CC they took to keep the team alive so the Armor strip can do it's work and they've made Assimilate mandatory for her.

I would prefer a revert myself. They only did one positive thing for her IMO and that was to make MC a one-hand action. They wanted to "Give Nyx some Love" but they took from her as well and the price she paid wasn't worth it.

See and that's why I usually don't bother talking to you, we just don't have the same perspective. 99% armour strip is quite noticeable at Sortie level already, especially with weaker guns.

Example: it takes 70-100 shots from a Prisma Gorgon (crit, Hunter Munitions, P. Shred, Corrosive, no CP) to take down a level 100 CHG. It takes ~20-50 when the Bolts are active, so that's at least a 2x multiplier already.

I agree, one-handed MC was the best thing that happened.

[ArcKnight9202]

18 hours ago, Vanilla_nuka said:

Her old passive was next to useless, because if your passive disarmed your mind controlled target, they were completely useless, and if it disarmed enemies when you wanted to use your absorb, it prevented you from being up any kinda damage to make absorb useful. Chaos is still fine as is, and her new passive is much much better then her old one.

Her QoL update was much needed, and changed her for the better, I wouldnt expect to get any nyx changes with the new skin, if it happens great, but it didnt happen with limbo or atlas

You seem to have a lot of faith in the enemies being able to damage one another. Their damage to themselves is often so trivial, it might as well not exist. The idea was to get them closer to each other so they weren't targeting the players and priority targets. The mind control target accomplished the same thing if they were disarmed. It was hardly much of a downside.

Chaos suffers as a result of this loss because instead of the enemies moving closer to one another, they now move away. This behavior often puts them in the proximity of players or priority targets.

Absorb is terrible and should be seriously overhauled or removed entirely.

To make my own point: The old passive literally removed weapons resulting in 100% loss of ranged accuracy. This benefited everyone on the team. How this is perceived as being inferior to the current one baffles me.

4 hours ago, Kontrollo said:

See and that's why I usually don't bother talking to you, we just don't have the same perspective. 99% armour strip is quite noticeable at Sortie level already, especially with weaker guns.

Example: it takes 70-100 shots from a Prisma Gorgon (crit, Hunter Munitions, P. Shred, Corrosive, no CP) to take down a level 100 CHG. It takes ~20-50 when the Bolts are active, so that's at least a 2x multiplier already.

I agree, one-handed MC was the best thing that happened.

I very rarely do any content over Sortie level and I find the bolts to be completely meaningless.

Speaking personally, my arsenal is usually a Tigris Prime and a Lesion. These things don't worry about armor at all. For bosses, a sniper rifle of any variety will do the job regardless of stripping their armor. Vectis Prime can 3-shot Sortie Vor without many problems. This is how I worked around her previous limitations. Now that they gave me access to a way to strip armor, I have to build in a counter-intuitive fashion to get it above worthless-to-cast. This likely has a detrimental effect to Chaos. So, I can either ignore it, and lament the loss of the skill entirely, or cripple my most important skill to boost one that wasn't even necessary to start. Why would I build for something I never needed before? With Absorb being trash, it makes her a 2-skill frame for me. I don't play with any augments(on all frames) so these don't even enter the equation.

I am not trying to argue with you or say that your way of playing is wrong or that you shouldn't enjoy it. I am really glad that you do. I love the Prisma Gorgon! It's just that, for me, these changes had an extremely adverse and negative effect.

[Kontrollo]

edit. sec

Edited May 10, 2019 by Kontrollo

[Kontrollo]

17 minutes ago, ArcKnight9202 said:

I very rarely do any content over Sortie level and I find the bolts to be completely meaningless.

Speaking personally, my arsenal is usually a Tigris Prime and a Lesion. These things don't worry about armor at all. For bosses, a sniper rifle of any variety will do the job regardless of stripping their armor. Vectis Prime can 3-shot Sortie Vor without many problems. This is how I worked around her previous limitations. Now that they gave me access to a way to strip armor, I have to build in a counter-intuitive fashion to get it above worthless-to-cast. This likely has a detrimental effect to Chaos. So, I can either ignore it, and lament the loss of the skill entirely, or cripple my most important skill to boost one that wasn't even necessary to start. Why would I build for something I never needed before? With Absorb being trash, it makes her a 2-skill frame for me. I don't play with any augments(on all frames) so these don't even enter the equation.

I am not trying to argue with you or say that your way of playing is wrong or that you shouldn't enjoy it. I am really glad that you do. I love the Prisma Gorgon! It's just that, for me, these changes had an extremely adverse and negative effect.

As I pointed out previously, if you don't care about the strip, at least the augment works again.

I was trying to illustrate how the devs arrived at what they did and why increasing the number of bolts would probably make it more expensive, and how that would be detrimental.

 

I never said I think it's great and that I enjoy it. I can make a build with the new ability again at least, which is a step above what we had when they had that hold-to-recast mechanic. I also said I wouldn't mind just reverting to the old Nyx from summer 2018 (several times, actually, because not only in this thread).

Edited May 10, 2019 by Kontrollo

[Xzorn]

5 hours ago, Kontrollo said:

See and that's why I usually don't bother talking to you, we just don't have the same perspective. 99% armour strip is quite noticeable at Sortie level already, especially with weaker guns.

 

We have varied opinions on the value of armor strip. That's fine.

I think we can maybe agree there was no reason to remove the AoE Rad proc and they could have at least fixed a single long standing bug?

Personally I'd don't think I'd have much room for complaints if the Rad proc was still there and her Bolts augment lasted regardless of the re-cast. The value of her passive aside the ability has almost no value unless you build a certain way where if they kept those things Bolts would have value regardless and we'd have a new way to build.

[Kontrollo]

11 minutes ago, Xzorn said:

We have varied opinions on the value of armor strip. That's fine.

I think we can maybe agree there was no reason to remove the AoE Rad proc and they could have at least fixed a single long standing bug?

Personally I'd don't think I'd have much room for complaints if the Rad proc was still there and her Bolts augment lasted regardless of the re-cast. The value of her passive aside the ability has almost no value unless you build a certain way where if they kept those things Bolts would have value regardless and we'd have a new way to build.

They said they'd make her two into some sort of debuff, and what we got was one that is not really useful in any kind of organised play, because of all the other options that trivialise the gameplay. Take her solo somewhere with one of the older weapons, and they help. Take her into a PUG, and they can help. But now that requires a stat she never used, and it still is the only ability that really benefits from it.

At least on paper, the +24% for 99% armour strip is indeed very powerful, and it does have some applications now, just not really for us who already have everything. Luckily, I stopped min-maxing a long time ago, so I can more or less live with that now. There is only really one mode in this game that is truly challenging, anyway, and I haven't even played that in years.

 

We can agree that there was no need to botch that rework (touch-up?) the way they did. After that I had to say I would've been happy with the one-handed MC cast and some synergy. Not to mention all the bugs that brought. But as I said, I don't think we were the target audience.

[ArcKnight9202]

8 hours ago, Kontrollo said:

At least on paper, the +24% for 99% armour strip is indeed very powerful, and it does have some applications now, just not really for us who already have everything. Luckily, I stopped min-maxing a long time ago, so I can more or less live with that now. There is only really one mode in this game that is truly challenging, anyway, and I haven't even played that in years.

 

We can agree that there was no need to botch that rework (touch-up?) the way they did. After that I had to say I would've been happy with the one-handed MC cast and some synergy. Not to mention all the bugs that brought. But as I said, I don't think we were the target audience.

I see where you're coming from now. On its own, the armor strip can be attractive. I also will admit it's much better at lower level play due to not having access to the more overpowered weapons.

I will also agree that the people who played Nyx a lot were not the target audience. There is a lot of evidence of that based on the feedback thread.

[(PSN)BenHeisennberg]

1 hour ago, ArcKnight9202 said:

I will also agree that the people who played Nyx a lot were not the target audience. There is a lot of evidence of that based on the feedback thread.

The amazing part to watch was Youtubers who don't play Nyx say "the rework was amazing!"... And then continue to not play Nyx.

[XenMaster]

Psychic Bolts increase damage taken by 500% on debuffed targets. Only Mind Control and Chaos deal bonus damage.

 

Psychic bolts force commands Mind control and chaos targets to attack debuffed targets.

 

These new mechanic will make her whole new mind manipulation warframe. It would also good vs Bosses considering the debuff remove 100% defenses and they take 500% more dmg from Mind Control and Chaos.

[DeliciousDoob69]

HAHA @Elon-Chan I love the title of this dude, so true. Nyx prime is probably one of my favorite looking frames, but she is deff lackluster in the abilities department.