Why no cover system?

[Hypermega]

I get that were supposed to be ninjas flipping and flopping hither and thither and most people just nuke or skip enemies altogether because 2 minute missions  races are life and the easy bullet jump mechanic combined with ridiculously high respawn rate makes it pointless to bother anyway unless required but outside of this the more i think about it the more i wonder why we cant use cover. we have automatic rifles, snipers, beam weapons, bows, im sorry but nobody looks like a ninja standing in the open while using this kit, idiots maybe but not ninjas lol.

And yes i get that the likes of frost and volt exist they are the exception not the rule in 2k plus hours i have never once seen a team use someone's shields, plenty die outside em tho!  

EDIT: just a quick note to say im not advocating a sweeping change to the entire game! a mod, deployable piece of gear, something that can be ignored by those who have no need im not out here trying to turn warframe into gears of war lol

Edited August 5, 2019 by Hypermega

[Corvid]

...

Crouch behind stuff? You don't need a sticky cover system to interpose terrain between yourself and the enemy.

Though I will confess to wanting the old vaulting animation back.

[Hypermega]

9 minutes ago, Corvid said:

...

Crouch behind stuff? You don't need a sticky cover system to interpose terrain between yourself and the enemy.

Though I will confess to wanting the old vaulting animation back.

if only it were so simple. sadly missiles, gap closers, AOE, flying enemies, a sticky system is a pretty obvious solution that we don't have when enemy damage reaches lethal numbers

[sleepychewbacca]

9 minutes ago, Hypermega said:

if only it were so simple. sadly missiles, gap closers, AOE, flying enemies, a sticky system is a pretty obvious solution that we don't have when enemy damage reaches lethal numbers

Pop operator, go into void mode. Ultimate simplicity. 

[Hypermega]

7 minutes ago, sleepychewbacca said:

Pop operator, go into void mode. Ultimate simplicity. 

and die the instant you pop warframe because enemies are hitscan aimbots with zero delay and inf range which are spawning in massive groups with eximus units and well above level 100 because your not loading up warframe just to run fissure missions as rhino. yes you can blink into a room or something but you still have to face them with your soma or whatever and good luck unless your cheesing. yes i get theres ways around it but options are few when enemies start hitting hard

[sleepychewbacca]

Just now, Hypermega said:

and die the instant you pop warframe because enemies are hitscan aimbots with zero delay and inf range which are spawning in massive groups with eximus units and well above level 100 because your not loading up warframe just to run fissure missions as rhino. yes you can blink into a room or something but you still have to face them with your soma or whatever and good luck unless your cheesing. yes i get theres ways around it but options are few when enemies start hitting hard

Then rip. 

No solution for you. :(

[Hypermega]

4 minutes ago, sleepychewbacca said:

Then rip. 

No solution for you. 😞

That's my point! why did you even click the thread? 

[sleepychewbacca]

1 minute ago, Hypermega said:

That's my point! why did you even click the thread? 

Because it's General Discussion? Does there really exist a rule where people can only comment if they're saying what the OP wants to hear? 

Also mostly because you seem to have made up your mind against contrasting opinions to yours about the issue of cover, so I figured a tongue-in-cheek reply would be best. 

[Hypermega]

6 minutes ago, sleepychewbacca said:

I figured a tongue-in-cheek reply would be best. 

No you figured you would look like a big cool guy by shutting someone down and instead have made 3 posts in a thread that contribute nothing to the conversation. Im happy to hear contrasting points, let me know when you have any.

Edited August 5, 2019 by Hypermega

[sleepychewbacca]

4 minutes ago, Hypermega said:

No you figured you would look like a big cool guy by shutting someone down and instead have made 3 posts in a thread that contribute nothing to the conversation. Im happy to hear contrasting points, let me know when you have any.

Not that I do have any since I figure you'd have a reply that renders such contrasting points 'invalid'.  

Corvid summed the whole thread well. Between that and Void Mode, if you still have any issues, another reasonable conclusion is that it's not the game. It's your playstyle. 

Edited August 5, 2019 by sleepychewbacca

[Guest]

Oh God please no, we don't need any more cover shooters.

[Hypermega]

1 minute ago, sleepychewbacca said:

Not that I do have any I figure you'd have a reply against that renders such contrasting points 'invalid'.  

Corvid summed the whole thread well. Between that and Void Mode, if you still have any issues, another reasonable conclusion is that it's not the game. It's your playstyle. 

Oh i get it so its my fault that i had answer for those points for having answers at all and because of that those original points that i answered still stand. Kden

[ant99999]

Tbh you remind me of those people suggesting adding stamina bar to PvP.

Cover system in pretty much every game always was a band aid for not being able to implement covering into the movement itself. It forcedly breaks the game into two 'games': normal and covered, and to switch from one to another you must perform some special action which goes totally off from common sense. You can make it as much 'seamless' as you like, but you will inevitably break the immersion and convenience as long as it is separate from regular movement.

Now since I'm yet to see a game where taking cover is indeed integrated into movement itself, I consider the absence of cover system to be better by deafult than it's presence. That way you never feel that your character is moving on some rails or being in a shooting range but rather is indeed in some simulated world controlled by you.

If you are so desperate about being instantly shot by the enemies in Warframe, you either a) have a wrong build in your frame (or a wrong frame) which doesn't provide enough survivability; or b) playing on the enemy level you are not supposed to and the game was never build for and thus just wasting your time.

[40PE]

1 hour ago, Hypermega said:

I get that were supposed to be ninjas flipping and flopping hither and thither and most people just nuke or skip enemies altogether because 2 minute missions  races are life and the easy bullet jump mechanic combined with ridiculously high respawn rate makes it pointless to bother anyway unless required but outside of this the more i think about it the more i wonder why we cant use cover. we have automatic rifles, snipers, beam weapons, bows, im sorry but nobody looks like a ninja standing in the open while using this kit, idiots maybe but not ninjas lol.

And yes i get that the likes of frost and volt exist they are the exception not the rule in 2k plus hours i have never once seen a team use someone's shields, plenty die outside em tho!  

There is, I use cover constantly, move and shoot from behind corner. By this, I minimize visibility toward big groups of enemies, control enemy movement so they need to "line up" and "move in one direction" to able to get to me -so they cannot attack me from 360-. You can use reloading snipers like this pretty nicely. Strafe to cover, your weapon reload, move out from cover, shoot, move back...

You get it...

I play division 2 and the cover system works there but the control sucks a$$ big time. One lousy button for rolling/dodging and moving in/out of cover. The sticky movement from corner in cover, but I still rather use this than the other option to mistakenly push a wrong directional button and my character stands up and moves out from the cover... Really bad, console control, I would rage if D.E. would try to implement something like this in WF. I hope they will never even think about this ever.

TL:DR.: There is cover system, use the cover, Line of Sight toward Enemies.

[Eklectus]

I'd kill for the option to send all the "spess ninja wif kewl gunz and osome animu stylez" drek out the airlock and play this like a more grounded, cover-based shooter. 

Make cover actually matter both for you and the enemy, while limiting the current movement mechanics to allow for rapid re-positioning to outflank entrenched positions rather than slidespamming around with a Scoliac.

Even if it was just solo, I'd probably be inclined to do more than just login for the daily reward and S#&$-talk with the clan for a few minutes.

[Loza03]

Ninja rarely fought in the first place, let alone used cover, so 'it not being very ninja' isn't really a convincing argument. At most, real Ninja considered cover as a place to hide to escape, not to fight from. Most Ninja in games also rarely use cover. Ninja Gaiden rarely gives you cover for example. 

 

The game offers a considerable amount of evasion, natural cover and survival options. You're expected to be almost always moving in combat, stopping only to focus fire on a single target. It's a learning curve, honestly.

[Hypermega]

11 minutes ago, ant99999 said:

Tbh you remind me of those people suggesting adding stamina bar to PvP.

Cover system in pretty much every game always was a band aid for not being able to implement covering into the movement itself. It forcedly breaks the game into two 'games': normal and covered, and to switch from one to another you must perform some special action which goes totally off from common sense. You can make it as much 'seamless' as you like, but you will inevitably break the immersion and convenience as long as it is separate from regular movement.

Now since I'm yet to see a game where taking cover is indeed integrated into movement itself, I consider the absence of cover system to be better by deafult than it's presence. That way you never feel that your character is moving on some rails or being in a shooting range but rather is indeed in some simulated world controlled by you.

If you are so desperate about being instantly shot by the enemies in Warframe, you either a) have a wrong build in your frame (or a wrong frame) which doesn't provide enough survivability; or b) playing on the enemy level you are not supposed to and the game was never build for and thus just wasting your time.

I have plenty of builds that scale but im alittle tired of cheesing. hiding behind a mag bubble, volt shield, stealth or being nidus for 2 hours doesnt entertain forever lol, maybe i just wish there was a bit more bck and forth in endgame fire-fights. i get where your coming from and you probably right but this game doesnt implement into the movement system at all, getting hitscanned by a corrupted crewmen (amongst others) from across the map the instant he peaks proves this time and again. also bombard missiles lol you can run but not hide 😛 

i don't think it should be incorporated to the whole game for exactly the reason you said. a mod or deployable piece of gear perhaps or just something for a future warframe!

 

Edited August 5, 2019 by Hypermega

[sleepychewbacca]

8 minutes ago, Hypermega said:

Oh i get it so its my fault that i had answer for those points for having answers at all and because of that those original points that i answered still stand. Kden

You can say whatever you like, and take it as your win simply because you'll consider any contrasting opinion to yours invalid. So, you've 'won' by default, whatever such a win is worth in epeen points given your stance.


 

[Hypermega]

Just now, sleepychewbacca said:

You can say whatever you like, and take it as your win simply because you'll consider any contrasting opinion to yours invalid. So, you've 'won' by default, whatever such a win is worth in epeen points given your stance.


 

If that's what you think then your just wasting your own time by continuing to respond yeesh if you wont listen to me will you follow your own wisdom? 

[HugintheCrow]

12 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

'd kill for the option to send all the "spess ninja wif kewl gunz and osome animu stylez" drek out the airlock and play this like a more grounded, cover-based shooter. 

Why are you playing warframe? Go and play Division 2. Not every game has to be to your taste, and it's totally fine (duh) to play things you like instead of things you don't.

[sleepychewbacca]

Just now, Hypermega said:

If that's what you think then your just wasting your own time by continuing to respond yeesh if you wont listen to me will you follow your own wisdom? 

But I'm literally here to burn time. Once I have something better to do, I'll head off to that. 

Conversely, you dont have to reply to me? Of course if you want the last word, so as to feel better... 

[Eklectus]

5 minutes ago, HugintheCrow said:

Why are you playing warframe? Go and play Division 2. Not every game has to be to your taste, and it's totally fine (duh) to play things you like instead of things you don't.

Because I've sunk time and money into it, and want to, at least, keep an eye on how it develops? As I've said, I do very little actual playing at this point.

Edited August 5, 2019 by Eklectus

[Hypermega]

1 minute ago, HugintheCrow said:

Why are you playing warframe? Go and play Division 2. Not every game has to be to your taste, and it's totally fine (duh) to play things you like instead of things you don't.

TBF warframe has a myriad of playstyles and option and i don't accept "why play warframe" if its low hanging fruit. the other side is the game can be played this way. at a certain level enemies have to be taken seriously and wont let you just flip past them because they have hitscan (some of them, enough of them!) and it seems to me that if enemies are able to pin us down and pelt us despite all the flipping and flopping we can do then there is a clear solution for the squishes even if its only temporarily effective. 

As the first response said you can crouch behind stuff but it doesn't work. (i actually tried it as equinox in vodyanoi). but if we even got something as small as enemy accuracy or damage reduction if they cant see the majority of our warframe that would be huge! for example id love to be able to crouch behind the railings in the void if DE made it so enemies had to see our center of mass to fire i could switch up my playstyle even more and take out more of my warframes and try different builds.

also they should improve movement based evasion! aim-gliding, bullet jumping and rolling etc are not as effective or reliable as they are said to be! 

[HugintheCrow]

7 minutes ago, Eklectus said:

Because I've sunk time and money into it, and want to, at least, keep an eye on how it develops? As I've said, I do very little actual playing at this point.

You do you, but I'm pretty sure you'd have more fun if you moved on.

[Hypermega]

19 minutes ago, sleepychewbacca said:

But I'm literally here to burn time. Once I have something better to do, I'll head off to that. 

Conversely, you dont have to reply to me? Of course if you want the last word, so as to feel better... 

 

You're the one coming to me but by all means keep playing the victim all because i had answer for your "tongue and cheek response" its nothing if not entertaining 🙂 

Edited August 5, 2019 by Hypermega