Daggers Are Garbage, Needs Tweaking And Buffing. + Swords Issue

[Makemap]

I finally finished the last Dagger, "Ceramic Dagger". It is the worst dagger of all 3, "Heat", and "Dark" due to lack of bonuses.

 

-> Please remove the -50% damage to infested.

-> Add higher critcal + critical multiplier as suggested from the bottom because this weapon doesn't come with 3x damage to infested.

 

Comparsions:

 

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Ceramic_Dagger

vs

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Sword

 

Reason for this is because the daggers only hit 1 enemy(like swords), they don't have any powerful bonuses unlike swords(triple damage to infested) and you would die before you even get close to the mobs due to lack of range compare to swords.

 

Also, single handed swords should hit 2 or 3 enemies(I say 2, unless, if it is a longer single hand sword then 3 like Amphis). While at it buff the damage of dual weapons.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Dual_Ether

 

Dual Skana should be 30 damage. All dualies should have 5 or 10 damage higher than the single version of the sword.

Edited October 2, 2013 by Makemap

[Aspari]

Imo all daggers need very high crit chance and crit damage.

[00zau]

Give daggers massive crit and give them additional multipliers for attacks from stealth and from invisibility.

[taiiat]

Give daggers massive crit and give them additional multipliers for attacks from stealth and from invisibility.

"-50% chance for Grineer lancer to stand back up after you've slit his throat and yell to his comrades to hit the panic button"

 

sounds legit. 

[Karma_Ghost]

-> Increase attack speed,(wth) even swords attack faster than this short range weapon.

 

Comparsions:

 

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Ceramic_Dagger 1.5 atks/sec

vs

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Dark_Sword 1.0 atks/sec(wth)

 

No wonder it felt slower than swords when I was using it.

 

In your example, the dagger has a 50% faster attack. I'm not sure how that makes it slower.

 

Armor piercing damage does full damage or more against everything but light infested.

 

Most long swords will only hit 1 target, same as daggers.

 

If daggers had higher base damage, armor piercing damage, faster attacks, and no penalty vs infested, they would make long swords even more obsolete than they already are.

 

That said, both daggers and long swords are practically useless in their current states.

Edited September 30, 2013 by Karma_Ghost

[Phunkiecrux]

Here's how I think melee should work. 

Daggers. Hits only one enemy. High crit chance and crit damage, and a damage modifier/crit modifier when sneak attacking or invisible.

Good for stealth gameplay, and people who use Loki/Ash.

 

Longswords. Hits up to 2-3 enemies per swing, 3-4 with charge attack. Decent base damage and charge damage, decent crit chance and damage. 

A middleground. Versitile.

 

Heavy weapons. Hits up to 4-5 per swing, 5+ with charge. High base damage and charge damage, low crit chance and damage. 

A good solid beatstick for plowing through enemies  (like infested)

Edited September 30, 2013 by Phunkiecrux

[Makemap]

In your example, the dagger has a 50% faster attack. I'm not sure how that makes it slower.

 

Armor piercing damage does full damage or more against everything but light infested.

 

Most long swords will only hit 1 target, same as daggers.

 

If daggers had higher base damage, armor piercing damage, faster attacks, and no penalty vs infested, they would make long swords even more obsolete than they already are.

 

That said, both daggers and long swords are practically useless in their current states.

Swords are not obsolete, they all deal 3x damage to infested. I agree with the bottom post how single swords should hit 2-3 targets instead one. Daggers are very short and should stay with one. We got heavy weapons dealing 3x damage to infested. There is no need for the -50% on light infested anymore due to planet level buffs(max level used to be 60, now it is going to lvl 100+).

 

I can't even kill lvl 40+ properly unlike swords due to lack of bonuses. Why would you bother trying to melee a group of Corpus or Grineer when they would just over run you. 50% more damage to Grineer isn't a lot. Single Swords lasted to lvl 80's infested because of 3x.

Edited September 30, 2013 by Makemap

[Dasmir]

Imo all daggers need very high crit chance and crit damage.

 

And a hight damage in backstab/stealth kill, they are dagger after all.

[Karma_Ghost]

Swords are not obsolete, they all deal 3x damage to infested. I agree with the bottom post how single swords should hit 2-3 targets instead one. Daggers are very short and should stay with one. We got heavy weapons dealing 3x damage to infested. There is no need for the -50% on light infested anymore due to planet level buffs(max level used to be 60, now it is going to lvl 100+).

 

I can't even kill lvl 40+ properly unlike swords due to lack of bonuses. Why would you bother trying to melee a group of Corpus or Grineer when they would just over run you. 50% more damage to Grineer isn't a lot. Single Swords lasted to lvl 80's infested because of 3x.

 

The only situation where daggers and long swords are preferable is against scattered individual targets. That typically means Corpus or Grineer. If you're using melee exclusively against infested, there's no reason to use anything other than a heavy or dual weapon. You not being able to kill infested with daggers isn't a design flaw. That's how they were intended to function.

Edited September 30, 2013 by Karma_Ghost

[Makemap]

The only situation where daggers and long swords are preferable is against scattered individual targets. That typically means Corpus or Grineer. If you're using melee exclusively against infested, there's no reason to use anything other than a heavy or dual weapon. You not being able to kill infested with daggers isn't a design flaw. That's how they were intended to function.

If it is design that way, then it is a bad design because getting blasted rather than being melee is a lot worst.
Have you even try running into a mob of Corpus or Grineer with the dagger with its poor range and inability to hit multple targets?
I've done this fine with swords or melee that hits muitiple targets(Amphis, Orthos, etc). The faster you kill the more likely you'll survive.
Dagger is poorly designed because of this -50%. Unlike the swords they have an extremely poor range and you have to run up super close just to hit 1 enemy.
Range = advantage
Ability to hit multiple targets = advantage.
Dagger cannot do none of those. They are best off to be able to melee infested who are actually melee.
Even the Fist weapons are more useful than Daggers. Edited October 1, 2013 by Makemap

[[DE]Rebecca]

The melee weapons as a whole are due for a balance pass. Thanks for added thoughts here.

[Archistopheles]

The melee weapons as a whole are due for a balance pass. Thanks for added thoughts here.

 

Oh my goodness. Thank you for finally acknowledging these threads <3

[Phoenix86]

The melee weapons as a whole are due for a balance pass. Thanks for added thoughts here.

 

A post from DE, yeeee!!

[Mohavon]

The melee weapons as a whole are due for a balance pass. Thanks for added thoughts here.

 

So glad to hear this. Thank you guys for being aware and working on these things.

[ASH_PRIME]

Fang and Fang Prime properly formaed and modded kick serious butt btw