Trace and the broken economy of relic farming

[Mad5cout]

For the love of God, please finally allow us to break down relics into trace without running entire missions to do so.

Every single one of your loyal fans who have been playing for more than a year has about 3948047 relics in their inventory with no hope of ever completing them all.

In addition, when farming specific items on specific relics, the time required is DRASTICALLY protracted by the need to farm trace, which is by far the most time consuming part of the entire process.  It is completely imbalanced with the time it takes to acquire specific relics and to run enough of them to get the roll that you want.

I would give my left nut to have it so where we could breakdown a relic for even 5 trace.  Maybe it requires an orbiter upgrade purchase from Baro that appears every week so it isn't a pain to get.  A relic decombobulator that costs 1000 Ducats or something. SOMETHING.

Community up-vote this so they understand how needed this is.

Edited April 1, 2020 by Mad5cout

[(PSN)f0l1v31r4]

I can vote yes for that... to help in something which can help ppl. But tbh I’m not going to use relics for traces.

Just a suggestion: isn’t better get rid of traces and just put a %chance to every kind of item?

like: common 60% / uncommon 30% / rare 10%

because the rest of the game it’s like that... idk just saying I don’t believe they going to touch it 

[Teridax68]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)f0l1v31r4 said:

Just a suggestion: isn’t better get rid of traces and just put a %chance to every kind of item?

I support this wholeheartedly. The whole trace and relic quality system was a bad idea from the start, as it's a needless layer of extra grind that divides the playerbase equally pointlessly, as can be seen with people swarming recruitment chat with requests for radshares and intact shares for the same relics. I'd much rather get rid of traces and relic quality, and simply have every relic have the same, fixed chance of giving each reward (ideally set to the level of a radiant relic), which would also save the playerbase a lot of grief surrounding people cheating on relic quality, or having the relic but lacking the traces to bring it to Radiant during a multi-relic run with a group.

[Marine027]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb Teridax68:

I support this wholeheartedly. The whole trace and relic quality system was a bad idea from the start, as it's a needless layer of extra grind that divides the playerbase equally pointlessly, as can be seen with people swarming recruitment chat with requests for radshares and intact shares for the same relics. I'd much rather get rid of traces and relic quality, and simply have every relic have the same, fixed chance of giving each reward (ideally set to the level of a radiant relic), which would also save the playerbase a lot of grief surrounding people cheating on relic quality, or having the relic but lacking the traces to bring it to Radiant during a multi-relic run with a group.

I mean i can see it is kidna good, sicne oyu get more influence on it, higherign the drop rate and takign 3 others with oyu with the option ot choose from a drop isntead of just living with something you not want at all, *coughs* 3 orokin cells on rota c in void towers *coughs*.

What i never got in this and i agree partly with the make almost all the same drop chance is, why are Forma in two categroys, they are both common and uncommon drops, what sense does that make?

Tho looking at some relics they can change oddly, having vaulted ones where one part is rare drop but in the recent relics the same part is a uncommon drop.

Each parts should be the same type honestly, if at best, main blueprints are rare, warframe blueprint parts are uncommon, while weapon parts are common.

[Teridax68]

4 minutes ago, Marine027 said:

I mean i can see it is kidna good, sicne oyu get more influence on it, higherign the drop rate and takign 3 others with oyu with the option ot choose from a drop isntead of just living with something you not want at all, *coughs* 3 orokin cells on rota c in void towers *coughs*.

You get the option to choose from a drop in groups regardless; it's just that the drop rates on Intact relics are so heavily skewed towards common rewards that you need to put in traces to have an adequate shot at a rare (and even then, ~33% chance when four people contribute a Radiant is itself not that amazing). I can very much agree though that the rarity of certain parts were not well thought through, and the same reward should always remain at the same rarity level (and Ducat value).

Edited April 1, 2020 by Teridax68

[Avienas]

1 hour ago, Teridax68 said:

You get the option to choose from a drop in groups regardless; it's just that the drop rates on Intact relics are so heavily skewed towards common rewards that you need to put in traces to have an adequate shot at a rare (and even then, ~33% chance when four people contribute a Radiant is itself not that amazing). I can very much agree though that the rarity of certain parts were not well thought through, and the same reward should always remain at the same rarity level (and Ducat value).

thats the thing, thar are WAY TOO MANY variable involved in fissures that make it an annoyance of a farm:

• Reliance on a relic sharing system when it was a simple rotational reward with void key where you could get multiple items from a single key, where you are burning a relic every round and likely picking other people`s stuff instead via the share. While also getting salty when people leave early or do not equip a relic at all.
• The randomness on fissure missions where you could get situations where you only have 1 annoying to do mission or NO fissure missions for a tier for a good several minutes, where one could of easily just do a survival or something void tower and just have a nice simple farm instead of having to change loadout based on the mission to optimize it, whether it annoying high level enemies or to speed thru the mission to reload it as many times as possible before it closes for that fissure. Frocking get rid of these time window gags already D.E.!
• The fact void traces get no scaling bonus based on the TIER of the fissure and the rotational rewards still insists on having credit, affinity and drop chance mini boosters in its ENDLESS BONUS pool. Where instead of stopping at the 4th round to repeat again, it has to make the 5th round be a bonus relic that just clogs up how long it takes to get extra bonuses on the ENDLESS BONUS pool. Which does not help the cap bonus is +200% for the mini boosters or you would need to do atleast 8 full five round rotations, just to reach maximum bonus gain value...P.S. that means 200 minutes or 3 and 1/3rd of a hour of survival. AKA, It honestly just needs to be +25% resource booster EVERY wave and you get ALSO a bonus relic on the 4th round on top of the resource mini-booster.

And so many more that i likely could cover a sizable building with all the text i pumped out repeatedly pointing out the issues and how i expanded on ideas on how to resolve this. I mean probably 2, technically 3, critical changes out of them all i think would make fissures instantly popular again alone,

1. Remove relic sharing & replace with a 3 roll stand-alone system so everyone can farm WHENEVER they want, regardless of party size. Its less of a social element and more of a cluch.
2. The REAL social element could come in void traces as in, EVERYONE gets bonus traces PER person present OR for each person who opens thar relic at the end of a round, not just whoever picks your relic. EVE.RY. ONE. since a +10% bonus with a 2 man party, +25% bonus with a 3 man party and a +50% bonus with a full party would make void trace farming while everyone chatters on discord mic could make things less of a tiresome mess.
3. Plus again, that thing i rambled again, fix the endless booster bonus. Which honestly the current one should just get moved to REGULAR endless game modes and have ones tailored towards other endless type game modes, like Arbitration, Kuva survival, index and so on.
4. Here`s a bonus one: Lets all get a RARITY scaling bonus. As in if you go longer into a endless mission, a PASSIVE % ADDITIVE bonus will get tacked on to your relic where the chance to get a common item decreases and the odds to get the RARE part increases. With maybe it could cap at some point, but i certainly feel like it would be a good way for people to learn to stock duplicates and long-run for better odds on the part they WANT or they could run junk relics first to build up the COMBO meter and try for the item they want at the peak bonus of the drop rate, Certainly would be way better then drop rate bonus on void traces honestly.

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by Avienas

[PunishedWelfare]

If you dedicate yourself to farming traces and running tons of missions, then burning all your relics is completely doable. Especially when you finish everything in the game and there's nothing left to do.

But everyone is too lazy for that. And I agree an easy solution for a lower amount of traces could be useful. Though it has been suggested many times, and it will be ignored many more times.

[Avienas]

5 minutes ago, zioxei said:

If you dedicate yourself to farming traces and running tons of missions, then burning all your relics is completely doable. Especially when you finish everything in the game and there's nothing left to do.

But everyone is too lazy for that. And I agree an easy solution for a lower amount of traces could be useful. Though it has been suggested many times, and it will be ignored many more times.

Hence why i rather a overhaul of the system then a super lazy and fix. HELL, my more drastic idea to solve it, would just to be to REMOVING fissures altogether, have relics be an equippable item, similar to dragon keys and have it where you fill them by affinity gain to open them instead(or better yet you can stock some kind of conversion gain based on affinity and you DUMP it in the relic and based on how much you put in determines the CHANCE of what you get when you open it immediately after). As in remove relic sharing, make it more a of a personal thing and put some tweaks to allow equipping new ones mid-mission or run multiple at a time for opening `farming`.

Cause if fissures and by proxy, void traces, are effectively removed form the equation, the system will have the grind & frustration drastically cut down. But i still rather the suggestion chain i just stated in my previous post instead.

Edited April 1, 2020 by Avienas

[Steel_Rook]

2 hours ago, Teridax68 said:

I support this wholeheartedly. The whole trace and relic quality system was a bad idea from the start, as it's a needless layer of extra grind that divides the playerbase equally pointlessly, as can be seen with people swarming recruitment chat with requests for radshares and intact shares for the same relics. I'd much rather get rid of traces and relic quality, and simply have every relic have the same, fixed chance of giving each reward (ideally set to the level of a radiant relic), which would also save the playerbase a lot of grief surrounding people cheating on relic quality, or having the relic but lacking the traces to bring it to Radiant during a multi-relic run with a group.

I would absolutely love that. I don't have any fundamental issues with the underlying Void Fissure system. It's a nice spread across most if not all types of content and it's a way to gate rewards behind playing content without just limping them all in the same pool. But Void Traces and Relic condition utterly sabotage the whole mode, as far as I'm concerned. The Void Trace grind feels like an unnecessary time sink, like Warframe not respecting my time and asking me to waste it if I want to even engage in the sodding system in the first place. At the very least, I say get rid of Void Traces entirely, set all Relics to Radiant and call it a day. You get to keep the repetitive grind of Fissures, just without the repetitive grind of running Fissures "for no reason."

 

1 hour ago, Avienas said:

Hence why i rather a overhaul of the system then a super lazy and fix. HELL, my more drastic idea to solve it, would just to be to REMOVING fissures altogether, have relics be an equippable item, similar to dragon keys and have it where you fill them by affinity gain to open them instead(or better yet you can stock some kind of conversion gain based on affinity and you DUMP it in the relic and based on how much you put in determines the CHANCE of what you get when you open it immediately after). As in remove relic sharing, make it more a of a personal thing and put some tweaks to allow equipping new ones mid-mission or run multiple at a time for opening `farming`.

Or that - I would love to do that, too. Like I said - I like the Void Relic system, but I can do without the actual Void Fissure modifications to game modes. You're likely going to have to set some limitations on it, though - an affinity cap per mission or some other prerequisite. Else you're simply going to push people into doing 24/7 Elite Sanctuary Onslaught instead of Fissures. Mind you, ESO can die in afire is in need of some rebalancing to put it more in-line with the rest of the game for Affinity gains independent of anything else. Logistics aside, though - letting me play content I enjoy while also opening Void Relics at the same time would be very welcome. You can even let me charge the relic multiple times to mimic the current Intact/Flawless/Radiant system. The more Affinity you sink into a Relic, the higher your chance for a gold drop, or you can open it early and probably get a copper drop out of it.

 

In either case: Void Fissures are one of the least fun, least enjoyable aspects of Warframe. They exist solely as busywork to keep us from actually playing the content we like or trying for the rewards we're after. The game would be better off without them.

[Mad5cout]

6 hours ago, zioxei said:

If you dedicate yourself to farming traces and running tons of missions, then burning all your relics is completely doable. Especially when you finish everything in the game and there's nothing left to do.

But everyone is too lazy for that. And I agree an easy solution for a lower amount of traces could be useful. Though it has been suggested many times, and it will be ignored many more times.

I once did the calculation for trying to get a Gold drop on a relic.  If you take the % chance you will get a particular relic from farming a mission, with the average runs to a sure drop on the gold drop for that relic, AND the amount of time it takes you to farm 100 trace, it is something like 6 hours or more of gameplay.  It isn't about being lazy.  That is just a #*!%ing stupid expectation for one PART of an item.

[(XBOX)TehChubbyDugan]

On 2020-04-01 at 8:57 AM, Mad5cout said:

For the love of God, please finally allow us to break down relics into trace without running entire missions to do so.

Every single one of your loyal fans who have been playing for more than a year has about 3948047 relics in their inventory with no hope of ever completing them all.

In addition, when farming specific items on specific relics, the time required is DRASTICALLY protracted by the need to farm trace, which is by far the most time consuming part of the entire process.  It is completely imbalanced with the time it takes to acquire specific relics and to run enough of them to get the roll that you want.

I would give my left nut to have it so where we could breakdown a relic for even 5 trace.  Maybe it requires an orbiter upgrade purchase from Baro that appears every week so it isn't a pain to get.  A relic decombobulator that costs 1000 Ducats or something. SOMETHING.

Community up-vote this so they understand how needed this is.

Is it time for this thread again already?  The seasons just fly by.

I need you to know I'm on your side.  In fact, I have made this exact suggestion before.  Thing is, it was years ago.  They flat out don't care.  Don't let the suckers and the lip service make you think otherwise.  DE does not care about the players, they care about engagement numbers.  It just happens that trying to increase the latter, occasionally makes it look like you care about the former.

[GKP_light]

you can use your old relics for new player.

and your relics they will becam old.

[TheLexiConArtist]

I'm still waiting for them to realise the whole Relic system is unsustainable and awful, with triplicate levels of grind and removal of no-downside sharing making for a wider delta of RNG influence, and just bring back my Void keys.

 

Or at least stop dumping unvault relics in the only reliable farming system we have (Bounties, where you know exactly which relic you will get) so we can cut out the most painful RNG wall. Because I never want to see Xini again after being stuck in there for an average seven solid hours between drops of a specific relic back in the Valkyr Prime release.