Railjack, any reason to use any weapon that isn't a zetki MKIII?

[EvilNeo]

i know zetki suffers mostly from heat being too high, but with a fully upgraded zetki polar coil avionic (which is now easier to get than before due to no avionic duplicates in different houses) and the latest changes to railjack which reduced the heat of all weapons including zekti, is there any reason not to use a zetki weapon?

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

Other brands can have more status or crits.   As well as basically letting you fire them infinitely or atleast a hell of a lot longer than zekti.  

You COULD use a lower damage brand and then NOT have to use Polar Coil.  This could free up a slot for Warhead or Ion Burn or Forward Artilery.

-------------------------------

Im not being to critical of DE.   I definately appreciate the enemies becoming easier.  Personally that makes the game ALOT more fun for me.  However instead of nerfed the enemy they could have buffed our weapons and made them more varied.    Zekti should be raw damage,  Lavan should be status,  Vidar should be crits.  (or swap zekti and vidar).  

But like you said there just is no real motivation to use anything other than zekti apocs now...   Carcinnox is my fav gun but those are one of the weakest, they have that insane RoF tho lol.  Pulsar were super super lame so im glad they got a little buff...  Im on ps4 so cant give any feedback there yet...   

The lasers should be way fatter in diameter so you dont have to be so accurate with them.  Or they should work like the galvarc beam/larkspur type beam.  

I never got to try Void Hole/Tether + GalvArc to see its chaining in action.  

I would do something like this......

Pulsar = Best Base damage (between guns).   Least max cc/sc (between guns)  (fact= slowest firing/ least RPM*.  Rounds per Minute*)

Apoc = 2nd best base damage (beween guns).  Medium max cc/sc (between guns) (Fact= medium firing/medium RPM)

Carcinnox = 3rd? Best base damage (between guns)  Highest max cc/sc (between guns). (Fact= fastest firing/highest RPM)

photors = ??#%?$%?@??  !!   

For example... A pulsar might be 2k damage but cap out at 25% crits or status.  Apocs might be 1k and max out at 50% crits or status.   Carcinnox would be about 500-600 damage and max out at 75-80% crits or status....    (this is taking into account using the correct brands  Only the Crit Brand would reach max crit chance,  Only the status brand would reach best status chance.)

Where does photor fit in... I'd probably slide it in between pulsar and apoc or between  apoc and carcinnox......  Or it could even goto the head of the class and deal massive base damage but max out at 10% cc/sc.  Or be weakest and have 100% cc/sc.   haha there is alot wiggle room if they use my system.  

[EvilNeo]

13 minutes ago, (PS4)AbBaNdOn_ said:

instead of nerfed the enemy they could have buffed our weapons and made them more varied

totally agree but for a different reason, arch-wing weapons are too effective in railjack now, hell my imperator vandal is barely modded and i can kill elite exo cutters with it, it doesn't feel right at all.

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

Ugh forgot about that.....  

I absolutely DREAD the archwing buffs coming to console.  I HATE when people use archwings to fight stuff in Railjack.   The enemy totally ignore the Railjack.   When enemies are not circling you it screws with your aim and timing and stuff.   Its just bogs the battles down so much.... 

I decided to endure the stupidity of an open squad and ran a bunch of gian point the other day trying to get vidar reactors (came up empty ....)  towards the end the guys started hopping off the boat and fighting in space.   This will happen ALOT more frequently now. 

People should probably just be smart and get rid of all their avionics for RJ damage and just start using AW avi/tacticals  

[TheMarty27]

31 minutes ago, (PS4)AbBaNdOn_ said:

Other brands can have more status or crits.   As well as basically letting you fire them infinitely or atleast a hell of a lot longer than zekti.  

You COULD use a lower damage brand and then NOT have to use Polar Coil.  This could free up a slot for Warhead or Ion Burn or Forward Artilery.

-------------------------------

Im not being to critical of DE.   I definately appreciate the enemies becoming easier.  Personally that makes the game ALOT more fun for me.  However instead of nerfed the enemy they could have buffed our weapons and made them more varied.    Zekti should be raw damage,  Lavan should be status,  Vidar should be crits.  (or swap zekti and vidar).  

But like you said there just is no real motivation to use anything other than zekti apocs now...   Carcinnox is my fav gun but those are one of the weakest, they have that insane RoF tho lol.  Pulsar were super super lame so im glad they got a little buff...  Im on ps4 so cant give any feedback there yet...   

The lasers should be way fatter in diameter so you dont have to be so accurate with them.  Or they should work like the galvarc beam/larkspur type beam.  

I never got to try Void Hole/Tether + GalvArc to see its chaining in action.  

I would do something like this......

Pulsar = Best Base damage (between guns).   Least max cc/sc (between guns)  (fact= slowest firing/ least RPM*.  Rounds per Minute*)

Apoc = 2nd best base damage (beween guns).  Medium max cc/sc (between guns) (Fact= medium firing/medium RPM)

Carcinnox = 3rd? Best base damage (between guns)  Highest max cc/sc (between guns). (Fact= fastest firing/highest RPM)

photors = ??#%?$%?@??  !!   

For example... A pulsar might be 2k damage but cap out at 25% crits or status.  Apocs might be 1k and max out at 50% crits or status.   Carcinnox would be about 500-600 damage and max out at 75-80% crits or status....    (this is taking into account using the correct brands  Only the Crit Brand would reach max crit chance,  Only the status brand would reach best status chance.)

Where does photor fit in... I'd probably slide it in between pulsar and apoc or between  apoc and carcinnox......  Or it could even goto the head of the class and deal massive base damage but max out at 10% cc/sc.  Or be weakest and have 100% cc/sc.   haha there is alot wiggle room if they use my system.  

This system sounds great, but...

 

What about Cryophon?

[D3RPAxios]

@(PS4)AbBaNdOn_ gonna have to disagree without on a few points. The different houses do have different stats. Vidar has the highest crit chance, Lavan is balanced, and Zetki has a slightly higher status chance. Zetki Apocs, despite being very potent, are not the strongest. They’re good, but Zetki Photor is better. It’s damage output is high, it’s heat accretion got lowered a lot with Railjack revised, and it’s hitscan with one of the longest ranges of all turrets. Even with the adjustment to Void Hole, it’s perfect for killing enemies caught in the center. It’s also probably best suited for it, because the damage and uptime are high enough that you don’t have to let off the trigger much. It also burns through ramsleds faster than anything else, and has more consistent damage than the Zetki Cryophon, and doesn’t need to crit to do meaningful damage. I run apocs on the sides for the convenience of my squad mates, but Photor is a much better option, and if I had another one, I’d use that instead.

[Nichivo]

I was running zetki carcinox before the update, only change is now I don't have to even try managing heat, no polar coil needed.

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

3 hours ago, TheMarty27 said:

This system sounds great, but...

 

What about Cryophon?

Haha totally forgot about cryophons.   Its speed dictactes its up at the top of damage.   But then with its short range that might could justify giving it more cc/sc on par with Apocs (50%)

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

3 hours ago, D3RPAxios said:

@(PS4)AbBaNdOn_ gonna have to disagree without on a few points. 

The problem with photor is they require a very high degree of accuracy.  Im not disagreeing with anything you said,   but in general....they are more difficult to use than apocs/carcinnox.  Thats why I or others may not think of them as best even if they perform better.

I have only built Zekti carc and ?? Pulsars....  I dont have experience using all the guns and or brands.   My system above is just theory crafting how to make ALL weapons viable.  

Whether its apocs or photors the system will be BAD if there is only ONE choice.  Agree/Disagree with that??

[D3RPAxios]

@(PS4)AbBaNdOn_ I can agree with that. With the current system, the Photor is very high performing, but not so much so that the other options aren't viable or good. Apoc's are my second favorite, and Carcinnox is great, and Pulsars are overall a great cc option. I think it boils down to a lot of what people are comfortable with and what works best for their Railjack. Using Void Hole, Photor is generally a better option. No Void hole, Apoc performs really well, probably even better. Carcinnox is great for being more aggressive with dogfighting, and Pulsar lets you provide extra cc to make killing fighters that much easier. Cryophon is Cryophon, it's just weird like that. Comparatively, a Zetki Cryophon has much higher damage output, with it's crit chance being high enough with Predator for fairly reliable crits, and those crits will usually one-shot. I think it will depend on the player and their avionics. I've been running Flexa solo (still need Pennant DX) and I've been able to solo it in about 30 minutes with no problem(extra time for looting, manual boarding and destruction of crewships, and killing literally all of the enemies for intrinsics) with Photors and Void Hole.

[anarchy753]

It varies from weapon to weapon. Lavan and Vidar are pretty consistent across weapon types, but Zetki changes whether it buffs status chance or crit chance per weapon, while always giving 1.5x damage.

Since the heat changes, I think the only weapon I'd really consider using a different house on would be Vidar Cryophon.

It has (at base) 4 shots before overheating compared to Zetki's 3. Since 3 shots is overheat, Zetki's RNG bonus of fire rate is pretty redundant, however Vidar gives up to +60% frost damage which makes it higher damage than Zetki.

It also has 1.4x the crit chance of Zetki. Status is largely irrelevant on the Cryophon now that it one shots everything, but even then 30% on Vidar compared to 45% on Zetki is a minimal difference.

Aside from that, the other houses either have worse stats boosted, or their difference is simply not high enough of a difference to outperform 50% higher damage from Zetki. Lavan has better status on the Apoc, but 14% compared to 10%? Who cares, they're dead already anyway.

[Jemmies]

When I am on the side turrets on another player's railjack, I usually secretly hope that it's a cryophon. I find myself being able to land more shots and kills with it than the other long range guns. I think my eyes and fingers are made for shotgun-like weapons.

And for cryophons, you might wanna consider the Vidar flavour as it comes with higher crit chance.

[Nichivo]

1 hour ago, Jemmies said:

When I am on the side turrets on another player's railjack, I usually secretly hope that it's a cryophon. I find myself being able to land more shots and kills with it than the other long range guns. I think my eyes and fingers are made for shotgun-like weapons.

And for cryophons, you might wanna consider the Vidar flavour as it comes with higher crit chance.

Until cryophons can knock down bubbles, they will remain in my trash and see no use.

[Jemmies]

4 minutes ago, Nichivo said:

Until cryophons can knock down bubbles

Err... which bubble?

[Nichivo]

5 minutes ago, Jemmies said:

Err... which bubble?

The healing bubbles the Crewships shoot out that expand and heal anything close to them. They will also block shots from the forward artillery.

Edited May 3, 2020 by Nichivo

[kaiwen99]

Railjack has been updated, as the fighter has lowered health and armor, the cryophon still good on it take down those bubble in one shot

[Nichivo]

1 hour ago, kaiwen99 said:

Railjack has been updated, as the fighter has lowered health and armor, the cryophon still good on it take down those bubble in one shot

I am going to call you John Snow, because you know nothing. None of the cryophons even with max stats, can knock down healing bubbles in one shot every cryphon would overheat before the bubble came down, plus there is damage fall off to consider. I have every house gun maxed have solo'd all railjack before, and after the update. The bubbles can block you using the forward artillery to down crewships, and nobody but a fool has got time to try and down those bubbles with a cryophon.

[kaiwen99]

52 minutes ago, Nichivo said:

I am going to call you John Snow, because you know nothing. None of the cryophons even with max stats, can knock down healing bubbles in one shot every cryphon would overheat before the bubble came down, plus there is damage fall off to consider. I have every house gun maxed have solo'd all railjack before, and after the update. The bubbles can block you using the forward artillery to down crewships, and nobody but a fool has got time to try and down those bubbles with a cryophon.

First thing, my intention is not angering you any and also we are just discussing about topic as shown not come here and flexing what you got.

Did you do really try on cryophon on any house when healing bubble is spawning?

What I solo'ed in all veil mission and I tried using only cryophon in-game without any battle and tactical avionics assistance but with a proper integrated avionic setup, Every node in veil proxima (especially ruse war field three times), I still able to easily take down the fighter with 1 or 2 shot with or without critical procs. The most important part is healing bubble as you mentioned, there isn't spawn any even I tried idling and no healing bubbles around.

Can you show me when you feel difficulties when you shoot in veil proxima? And the most important thing is when you faced healing bubbles.

Last thing, forum is a place feel free to discuss about the topic not toxic people even you saw the player has an "initiate" tag. 

[Jemmies]

4 hours ago, Nichivo said:

The healing bubbles the Crewships shoot out that expand and heal anything close to them.

Oooh that. Ok. Yup, it works like a nullifier bubble where you gotta keep hitting it until it gets smaller and disappear. High fire rate or beam weapon is best for that I feel.

[TheMarty27]

By the way, AFAIK the Cryophon is still kinda S#&$ compared to the other turrets and I thought, a great way to make it viable would be not to increase its stats or reduce heat buildup, but to increase the projectile's size, like drastically. This, I feel, would make it much more desirable, as it would negate what is at least in my experience its biggest drawback - it's way too hard to actually hit S#&$ with it reliably, while also giving it a niche in being the only AoE turret.

[Savire510]

On 2020-05-02 at 5:18 PM, (PS4)AbBaNdOn_ said:

Ugh forgot about that.....  

I absolutely DREAD the archwing buffs coming to console.  I HATE when people use archwings to fight stuff in Railjack.   The enemy totally ignore the Railjack.   When enemies are not circling you it screws with your aim and timing and stuff.   Its just bogs the battles down so much.... 

I decided to endure the stupidity of an open squad and ran a bunch of gian point the other day trying to get vidar reactors (came up empty ....)  towards the end the guys started hopping off the boat and fighting in space.   This will happen ALOT more frequently now. 

People should probably just be smart and get rid of all their avionics for RJ damage and just start using AW avi/tacticals  

Yeah, sometimes it really annoys me when people just randomly use archwing and fly around fighters. Its like they try to be useless.

Pull a sneaky on them and have a prepared hyperflux and seeker volley so there is nothing to fight for them : >

There is no way in hell that even the most skilled mlg archwing player will even know what is happening when 50 buffed seeker volley missiles start obliterating the map.

Seeker volley will nuke the fighters, you destroy the crewship engines, line up all of them in your LOS and fire your artillery. Tenno inside? Who cares! OPEN FIREEEE

Edited May 4, 2020 by Savire510