Third-Party Software and You

[CosmicHermitCrab]

Some players, even Warframe youtubers, get automatically banned from endless missions as well due to either playing too optimally (other games have this issue too) such as doing too much DPS of any sort or staying in a mission too long. This also includes the default automatic weekly trade bans as well for going past 2-3 hours in an endless mission.
Also, other players and I have experienced performance issues in this game with 8 GB of RAM or less. I have 16 GB of RAM and no longer have performance issues such as crashing on "performance-heavy" missions such as Profit Taker, but 8 GB of RAM is the official minimum requirement recommended by DE to play Warframe.

^ Even mentions the case of memory leaks...
 

With cross-platform being added soon, automated bans will become a bigger problem and as a result more and more players will keep complaining for more transparency and/or quit the game.

 

On 2022-12-05 at 1:09 PM, -ZeroStar- said:

So, I do have medical issues.  I cannot play Warframe without the use of the Logitech GHub macros, mainly for bullet jumping. I'm also curious about WFInfo and Omen Gaming Hub.  WFInfo is almost needed - the QoL is insane.  And the Omen Gaming Hub you're partnered with and even did giveaways with, can't imagine you'd ban people for using software you yourself have endorsed to use in conjunction with Warframe... 

I honestly would rather see a list of accepted programs. 

I couldn't imagine you banning players that have been playing Warframe for years and have spent thousands of dollars because they're using software that makes the game playable.

A list of accepted programs makes sense, but I also agree a list of unaccepted programs is not conventional. Other gaming communities give lists for accepted third party softwares such as Runescape Series with Runelite and Path of Exile with some of its (widely acceptable) third party softwares. However, these lists do change over time...

Since DE plans to never release an in-game auction house for assisting in-game trades, the least they could do is at least provide a very small list on acceptable softwares for assisting in playing Warframe, not only in regards to in-game trading. However, I do agree that it's possible someone could hack the game using one of the recommended acceptable softwares in the hypothetical list, so it is sort of a dilemma.

Thus, I view it more as an issue with DE on whatever they value security more than convenience or vice versa...

The best solution for DE is to implement both in-game market (real time) trading for players (DE already sorta done it for WF clans); without needing third-party softwares or websites because if players want third party software assistance for playing the game more effectively you could argue the game has overall bad game design, along with built-in macro features (part of the game features) for players with either medical or physical needs.

^ These options are the best solutions for such a dilemma, but obviously requires more work on DE's part...the question then is, is it worth it?
 

Edited December 11, 2022 by CrystalSpark
Clarity and Grammer

[CruasanX]

En 23/8/2022 a las 12:59, QUBITSKIE dijo:

I used this tool to manage my inventory and buy/sell in WF Market and I also use this to plan my relics runs to know which relics are profitable is this allowed?

 

 

Answer this pls, i found Alecaframe some recent and I LOVE IT, but now I'm afraid. The only thing that Alecaframe allows me is to manage my wfmarket transactions in a simple way and see some statistics such as the platinums I have earned and the relics I have recently used. Is this an unfair advantage? Can I be banned for something like this? I don't see why to be so mysterious and unclear with something that is as simple as one day saying "hello! We have made a list of the 10 most popular third-party software and we tell you if they are legal or not, by the way you can suggest another and Maybe we will review it in the future :D "I don't know, I don't see it as complicated, it would bring peace to many of us...

[PandamoniumBruu]

To this day, i don't understandt if Aleca is safe or not lol

[Luigispikachu]

Rule of thumb: if it's powered by overwolf then it bad. No exceptions.

[luthor112]

Any news on this topic from DE?

[MetalMechabolic]

On 2024-02-01 at 10:29 PM, CruasanX said:

Answer this pls, i found Alecaframe some recent and I LOVE IT, but now I'm afraid. The only thing that Alecaframe allows me is to manage my wfmarket transactions in a simple way and see some statistics such as the platinums I have earned and the relics I have recently used. Is this an unfair advantage? Can I be banned for something like this? I don't see why to be so mysterious and unclear with something that is as simple as one day saying "hello! We have made a list of the 10 most popular third-party software and we tell you if they are legal or not, by the way you can suggest another and Maybe we will review it in the future :D "I don't know, I don't see it as complicated, it would bring peace to many of us...

I'm curious about this in particular.  I just started playing myself and had so much of a blast I got my wife playing as well now and actually dropped a bit on some starter plat.  After seeing Alecaframe and how useful it is I really want to give it a shot but these sort of boiler plate statements on 3rd party tools isn't that crazy since it gives the devs some wiggle room in what is allowed and what isn't.  That said, the other poster who said that all of Overwolf is tainted makes me weary.  I don't want to lose my account over adding some QoL tools but knowing how rare or useful certain things I loot in game over alt-tabbing and doing the same thing sounds really nice.  Hopefully the devs will at least make a clarification with Alecaframe's case.

[Orokin]

@[DE]Dudley can you please explain how Overwolf does not break EULA given that it is accessing non public information? Specifically these terms:

Quote

b. use, or provide, any unauthorized third-party programs that intercept, emulate, or redirect any communication between the Services and us or that collect information about the Game;

g. attempt to reverse engineer (except as otherwise permitted by applicable local law), derive source code from, modify, adapt, translate, datamine, decompile, or disassemble or make derivative works based upon the Services or any Content;

h. remove, disable, circumvent, or modify any technological measure we implement to protect them or any of their associated intellectual property;

j. attempt to probe, scan or test its vulnerability or breach any security or authentication measures;

k. access, tamper with, or use non-public areas of the Services;

If there is an API that is public but nobody knows about it I'm sure there are many people that would find it useful and would love to know about it.

 

And regarding Overframe, is that illegal to use given that they datamine information as well? 🤔 Remember when Overframe leaked unreleased incarnon weapon information? Or how it exposes non public internal game data?

Kinda strange that they are endorsed... https://www.warframe.com/news/warframe-tools-and-resources-every-player-should-know-about

Edited April 23 by Orokin

[SpicyDinosaur]

On 2024-04-23 at 7:53 PM, Orokin said:

@[DE]Dudley can you please explain how Overwolf does not break EULA given that it is accessing non public information? Specifically these terms:

If there is an API that is public but nobody knows about it I'm sure there are many people that would find it useful and would love to know about it.

 

And regarding Overframe, is that illegal to use given that they datamine information as well? 🤔 Remember when Overframe leaked unreleased incarnon weapon information? Or how it exposes non public internal game data?

Kinda strange that they are endorsed... https://www.warframe.com/news/warframe-tools-and-resources-every-player-should-know-about

Alecaframe uses completely publicly available info, it's used in things like tennotools and what have you. A lot of its info comes from warframe.market, anyway.

[Orokin]

22 hours ago, SpicyDinosaur said:

Alecaframe uses completely publicly available info, it's used in things like tennotools and what have you. A lot of its info comes from warframe.market, anyway.

Overwolf reads your inventory data which is not public, and is impossible to get unless you are breaking one of the aforementioned EULA terms.

[johnno23]

DE at times seems to be both forward thinking on the left hand whilst the right hand is stuck in the middle ages of tech hardware.

Basically any gaming mouse designed for playing games has in built functionality that could or can break the rules DE sets. If we are gamers we buy gaming mice we are not office workers using a mouse that scrolls clicks and moves a pointer. Games and gaming mice have built in mechanics going hand in hand with the mouse software that have functions as tracking targeting multiple programmable/mappable input buttons etc.  Whilst I understand something like Hotkeys being banned as it circumvents actual gameplay using a logitech or razor mouse can be an issue which means that DE not being clear about the rules is stating Gaming mice for gamers playing Warframe = BAD.            

[iHeuksal]

DE has no clue what DE does. Seriously. How hard is it to determine, that ABC is allowed XYZ is NOT? Like, what the actual #*!%, guys? "It is on your own risk", excuse me please? "I am part of this game dev/staff team, I am ONE with the game product, but I have no clue what to tell you"?! Imagine people selling cars and not having any clue about them and selling a bloody ferrari to someone who has no clue about cars and wants to go on off-road tracks with it. The same nonsense happening here.

This is ridiculous. You guys are knowing nothing about your own game's behavior and rules, and leaving people this clueless, if they can or can not use Logitech, Frame Generators like Losless Scaling, 3rd-Party-Market Websites Software or whatever ... this just reeks of high incompetence.

[Bzy_theLegend]

.

[Nekomian]

On 2024-06-10 at 8:01 AM, iHeuksal said:

DE has no clue what DE does. Seriously. How hard is it to determine, that ABC is allowed XYZ is NOT?

They cannot endorse or approve specific software unless they know exactly what it does and approve every subsequent update / version; they'd need dedicated staff on hand to run and validate thousands of hours of tests every time any piece of third party software is available or updated, and that really isn't economical at scale. Ergo, use stuff at your own risk, and use common sense.

If a certain macro combination is being used to cheese or exploit the game in an unintended way, that's very obviously not allowed; if it's just to reduce repetitive movements or for mobility / accessibility reasons, it's probably fine. If a third party program is reading your inventory and giving you stats, it's probably not allowed, given it gives an advantage vs console and mobile players who cannot do the same automation. If it's just an overlay to show you WFM prices it's probably fine (depending on how it's implemented), as that's no different from having a web browser page open and searching.

It's not particularly difficult to ascertain which actions are and aren't allowed, but it's the actions themselves and not the programs, as software is being developed all the time and constantly changes / updates. I don't expect any other response on this because there isn't really one they can give without people pointing and going "but you said XYZ was fine!!!" by misinterpreting (either intentionally or unintentionally) context regarding statements, unless they're explicitly and strictly made about one software version at one point in time only. I would just use common sense and your best judgement, that's all this statement of "use at your own risk" feels like it's meant to be interpreted as anyways.

[Luigispikachu]

I'ma say it again for visibility: if it requires overwolf then it is bad. for your account, it's security, or any of the "can you please stop opening overwolf to do literally anything" related reasons