Silenced Weapons - Not so Silent

[CrownOfShadows]

So IDK if this has been asked for a bunch or if I'm the only one who cares, but adding Hush or other mods that silence weapons - it apparently has no actual effect on the weapon sound itself, which is a real shame. IDK how technical this gets, but it seems perfectly do-able. You guys surely have the ability to do this, based on Banshee's silence effect, or if nothing else simply cut the volume of the gun sound down.

Why do I want this when this is a totally forgotten mechanic that nobody even uses anymore? IDK. Stealth is dead, and silenced weapons are even deader than dead.

But, for the one or two weapons I have this equipped on, it would be great. It's an immersion thing, y'know?

[BiancaRoughfin]

Adding Hush to weapons does make them silent, it just doesnt make the shots you hit the enemy or ambiance with unnoticeable... The moment you start hitting an enemy or ambiance near one it goes on alert and alerts others which are faced towards it, they then start tracking the source so its better you kill it fast.

[Tiltskillet]

A very long time ago somebody at DE responded to the same question and said something to the effect that it was unlikely to happen as it would actually be a lot of work.    That answer surprised me at the time and still does, given the existence of muffling filters in game already. But it seems unlikely they wouldn't be honest about it. 

Perhaps there was some subtext to it.  Something like "would be a lot of work...for a feature we feel few would appreciate and many wouldn't notice." That's just a guess, but it seems plausible.  How many people bother silencing weapons?  How many people even play with the sound on?   How many care about that immersive effect in the first place?  It's easy to imagine that players who'd check off all three might be a tiny minority.

[(NSW)HedEmpTy]

I admit I'd love it if silenced weapons had a muffling filter applied. Something that's unlikely to be added, perhaps, but I can dream.

EDIT: On the topic of it being a lot of work, I wonder if part of the problem is DE having a dev kit that makes it user-unfriendly to re-do the sound filter - who knows how much work went into Banshee's Silence filter.

[CrownOfShadows]

33 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

A very long time ago somebody at DE responded to the same question and said something to the effect that it was unlikely to happen as it would actually be a lot of work.    That answer surprised me at the time and still does, given the existence of muffling filters in game already. But it seems unlikely they wouldn't be honest about it. 

Perhaps there was some subtext to it.  Something like "would be a lot of work...for a feature we feel few would appreciate and many wouldn't notice." That's just a guess, but it seems plausible.  How many people bother silencing weapons?  How many people even play with the sound on?   How many care about that immersive effect in the first place?  It's easy to imagine that players who'd check off all three might be a tiny minority.

27 minutes ago, (NSW)HedEmpTy said:

I admit I'd love it if silenced weapons had a muffling filter applied. Something that's unlikely to be added, perhaps, but I can dream.

EDIT: On the topic of it being a lot of work, I wonder if part of the problem is DE having a dev kit that makes it user-unfriendly to re-do the sound filter - who knows how much work went into Banshee's Silence filter.

Yeah... there may be a totally legit technical reason why this is too much effort for too little gain. Anyone who wants or even notices this is definitely a tiny, tiny minority too, and of that minority, so few actually use said silenced weapons with any real frequency, so ... hard to justify I suppose, regardless of technicalities. It's always bothered me though. It's one of those things I just sorta expect and then scratch my head when it's MIA.

[CephalonCarnage]

I'm not convinced of the argument that its too much work - after all, the sound filters are done already (Loki, Ivara etc all get muffled gun sounds when invisible) so the only work appears to detect that your gun has the hush modifier and changing the default sound file on startup. Perhaps the work is too much effort to implement and test for all cases, eg a silenced gun could have a filter applied at mission start if the gun has a silent modifier, then you go invisible, and when you leave invisibility the gun sound filter gets reset to loud normal. But again, its not much work as the hard parts are done already even the changing gun sounds when your frame goes invis.

I'd like it, I have been shooting enemies and wondering why they all stand around looking dumb. Then realise the gun has hush on it.

[shut]

On 2022-10-25 at 5:34 AM, CephalonCarnage said:

I'm not convinced of the argument that its too much work - after all, the sound filters are done already (Loki, Ivara etc all get muffled gun sounds when invisible)

To be fair, those sound filters make it sound like the player's head is underwater, rather than sounding like the sound effect itself is muffled at its source. Simply slapping those existing filters onto Hushed weapons would just sound weird ingame.

I would absolutely love for a "muffled" filter to be a thing for Hushed weapons, though. I don't have the faintest ounce of knowledge on how much work it would require, but hopefully it's not too difficult to do.

[Morteno]

On 2022-10-25 at 12:54 AM, Tiltskillet said:

A very long time ago somebody at DE responded to the same question and said something to the effect that it was unlikely to happen as it would actually be a lot of work.    That answer surprised me at the time and still does, given the existence of muffling filters in game already. But it seems unlikely they wouldn't be honest about it. 

Perhaps there was some subtext to it.  Something like "would be a lot of work...for a feature we feel few would appreciate and many wouldn't notice." That's just a guess, but it seems plausible.  How many people bother silencing weapons?  How many people even play with the sound on?   How many care about that immersive effect in the first place?  It's easy to imagine that players who'd check off all three might be a tiny minority.

How about now? That you are older and hopefully more wise in regards to DE?
I am not surprised at all anymore - nor do I think they are/were honest about it.
Actually use Hush and the other one a lot. Specially when I want to do no-alert spy. Besides there is often no good other use for the exilus slot.

On 2022-10-25 at 1:31 AM, CrownOfShadows said:

Yeah... there may be a totally legit technical reason why this is too much effort for too little gain. Anyone who wants or even notices this is definitely a tiny, tiny minority too, and of that minority, so few actually use said silenced weapons with any real frequency, so ... hard to justify I suppose, regardless of technicalities. It's always bothered me though. It's one of those things I just sorta expect and then scratch my head when it's MIA.

Not really any good excuses. Even something simple like "-80%" less volume on muzzlesound being played would be a great improvement.
Also. Speak for yourself instead of this "minority of a minority" claim. Which of course isn't help by how the game is stacked against it to the point of rarely making it worth the effort unless you go out of your way to play suboptimally. Even then enemies are often packed too close to make good use of it in a way that a unsilenced weapons would not do just as well. The big problem is of course having to play so so much slower. Specially if not in a stealth frame like Ivara.

On 2022-10-25 at 11:34 AM, CephalonCarnage said:

I'm not convinced of the argument that its too much work - after all, the sound filters are done already (Loki, Ivara etc all get muffled gun sounds when invisible) so the only work appears to detect that your gun has the hush modifier and changing the default sound file on startup. Perhaps the work is too much effort to implement and test for all cases, eg a silenced gun could have a filter applied at mission start if the gun has a silent modifier, then you go invisible, and when you leave invisibility the gun sound filter gets reset to loud normal. But again, its not much work as the hard parts are done already even the changing gun sounds when your frame goes invis.

I'd like it, I have been shooting enemies and wondering why they all stand around looking dumb. Then realise the gun has hush on it.

And finally someone points out the obvious. It is so low effort as to be next to flipping a switch or a few hours for a intern.
And don't worry about them knowing if "silenced" detected properly or not. It is. It is just the usual aversion to improve anything that is not the current pet project. Game is littered with so many missed opportunies for big gains (from user POV) for little effort (from dev pov).
Instead they have "pet ideas". One wants to be locked in the basement tinkering with the renderer, others want to make a entirely different game, etc. all old stuff is practially in "read only" state unless something big pops up, like efficient farming or a popularity spike.

[Tiltskillet]

13 minutes ago, Morteno said:

How about now? That you are older and hopefully more wise in regards to DE?

I feel the same about it as I did then.  Basically that there's no reason to give a false answer when it's simpler and completely risk-free just to ignore the question.  And DE definitely used the latter approach, and still does.  It's not like this has ever been an issue with a massive outcry behind it, forcing a PR response.

 I still don't understand why the issue would be difficult.  But I know nothing about the subject, so whether their answer was negative or positive or more detailed I wouldn't have understood it.

[CrownOfShadows]

8 hours ago, Morteno said:

Also. Speak for yourself instead of this "minority of a minority" claim.

Well unnecessarily-angry-poster who seems to be trying to pick a fight with everyone for simply participating in a conversation, I'm just speaking from experience. Lots of experience. You know how many pub spy missions I've run? You know how many of those spy missions actually had people with a stealth frame? You know how many of those stealth frames weren't wukong or loki? (because wukong doesn't care and loki auto-silences everything). And how many of those remaining players (Ivara) actually even bother with silencing their weapons? It is a minority of a minority. Actually, it's a minority of a minority of a minority. The general warframe population does not invest in stealth nor do they care about it. They don't really have a reason to. What's been YOUR experience, how does the landscape look from up there on your high, high horse?

Me? I'm an Ivara lover. And Ivara needs silenced weapons, hence my attention to this annoying detail. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that the only people who care about the silencing mechanic at all are people who play Ivara. One frame uses this.