Only need 3 more Umbral mods.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

“I'd like a proper caster alternative for warframes.

Fiber, vitality and intensify are good, but they build towards a particular archetype of frame. Eg. Chroma Prime is worth sticking Umbral Forma on since he health tanks, has high armour and uses lots of ability strength. Titania Prime is not for the simple reason that she gets far more use out of her abilities and so you would sacrifice duration/efficiency for... Armour?

Umbral Streamline, Umbral Continuity and Umbral Stretch (while still only stacking to 3x) might make for an interesting and diversified set of builds, since (if you hit the 3x set bonus) these would allow you to avoid the corrupted mods and the associated trade-offs. Umbral Stretch would be slightly worse than Overextended, but it wouldn't cost power strength. Umbral Streamline might hit efficiency cap (175%) but it wouldn't cost you duration like Fleeting Expertise. The trade-off, of course, is that you need Umbral Forma and all 3 Umbrals to make the most of it - so it's only worth it on Prime frames.

And, of course, these should be able to stack with the existing mods. Umbral Vitality, Umbral Intensify and Umbral Streamline ought to give you the 3/3 set bonus same as Umbral Continuity, Umbral Stretch and Umbral Continuity.”-Lady_Tadashi 
 

I endorse 100%, now the only question is how to balance them out. But I’ll leave that to DE. 

[Pizzarugi]

Umbral Stretch would be OP. The last thing this game needs is to give Saryn, Volt, Mirage, and Equinox more nuke cheese.

Also, imagine frames like Vauban with minmaxed power range. Vortex for days.

Edited December 21, 2023 by Pizzarugi

[The_Royal_Elf_Mika]

Umbral Redirection should be added atleast, so that way it covers all base stats.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

1 hour ago, Pizzarugi said:

Umbral Stretch would be OP. The last thing this game needs is to give Saryn, Volt, Mirage, and Equinox more nuke cheese.

Also, imagine frames like Vauban with minmaxed power range. Vortex for days.

I mean man, I’d argue that archon shards already opened that floodgate buddy. A good way to balance that thought would be you can’t use umbra stretch, stretch and overextended together. And umbra stretch could be a-little worse overextended. It’s pretty easy to balance man. 

1 hour ago, The_Royal_Elf_Mika said:

Umbral Redirection should be added atleast, so that way it covers all base stats.

Yep, I’m with that

[(NSW)Greybones]

I think it’d be pretty funny to have a reason to equip all of the Umbral mods; a reason to actually fill out every slot with Umbral polarity

[Qriist]

2 hours ago, Pizzarugi said:

Also, imagine frames like Vauban with minmaxed power range. Vortex for days.

On 2023-12-09 at 1:53 PM, Qriist said:

Max range Vauban (280%), plus invigoration (380%), plus relic crack (760%), makes for one hell of a group suck.

Oh, and +75% efficiency was the other side of that invigoration, because why the hell not spam a dozen of them at a time? lmao

 

[Sykar]

Il y a 4 heures, Pizzarugi a dit :

Umbral Stretch would be OP. The last thing this game needs is to give Saryn, Volt, Mirage, and Equinox more nuke cheese.

Also, imagine frames like Vauban with minmaxed power range. Vortex for days.

The difference between Intensify and Umbra version is... 14%. 14% more range on top of the range that already exists will make no practical change for frames with really high range to begin with. Archon Stretch also is nice if you can get electric procs for extra energy regeneration so there is that.

[--Leyenda-yight6]

I'm 100% sure they will never publish an umbral stretch.

Edited December 21, 2023 by --Leyenda-yight6

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

1 hour ago, --Leyenda-yight6 said:

I'm 100% sure they will never publish an umbral stretch.

I could live with a Umbral Redirection instead.

[Birdframe_Prime]

So... I'm almost with you.

The problem is that DE have this thing about both the Efficiency and the Range stat. Even Archon Shards don't touch those.

And the idea that they'd be 'Umbral' mods so that they would potentially combo and stack with the existing ones is not something I think that DE will go for. Look at all their other sets, they have limits ^^

How about we... uhhh... dial some of these back? Maybe instead of your base idea, we give one stand-out mod, like Umbral Intensify just straight up being better than Intensify, better than a Primed mod would be (if a Primed Intensify existed) and a viable alternative to a Corrupted mod because it has no negative stats even if it has a lower value. Then we put the other two as 'the same until you combine them'.

So let's think about this...

What if the next Umbral-style Warframe was... Ember. Ember Cinis. And the next set is the Cinis set (still use Umbral polarity) but matches her being more of a caster.

The mods are Cinis Redirection, Cinis Streamline and Cinis Continuity. Redirection because Shield Gating for Casters, then the Efficiency because that's a capped stat, and Duration because DE doesn't seem to mind that, without touching Range. All of them are exactly the same base stats as the others apart from Continuity.

Cinis Redirection stacks up the exact same way as Umbral Vitality does.

Cinis Streamline is a direct replacement for Fleeting Expertise with three Cinis mods as it's 30% base and stacks 10% per mod to 40% and then 60% So it has no drawback other than using the other mods, and we calculate that a Primed Streamline theoretically would have 55%.

Cinis Continuity is actually 40% Duration at base, so it's better than regular Continuity, and it stacks 15% per time to give 85% total. This makes it worse than a maxed Narrow Minded, but you don't have the negative Range drawback, which would make it the obvious choice for a high-duration Caster build, as you could even stack it with Narrow Minded for just a flat better duration than you would have had before at the same drawback as before.

This way you balance out the obvious mix-and-match from having them all contribute to the Umbral set bonus (because equipping 4, 5 or even 6 Umbral mods would still only stack to 3, but it would stack to 3 on all of the mods, which players would farm Umbral Forma to do, they definitely would), by instead making them two separate sets. If they can't contribute to each other, you must build with a bit of care.

Players would then have the option (albeit a very obscure one) to use the two sets in conjunction to increase six different stats to a massive value without any Corrupted mods as a drawback. Using a triple Cinis set would be ideal for a Caster, because they could not only have the high Shield value for Shield Gating, they would also have Efficiency and Duration with no detriment from the Corrupted mods, allowing them to opt for the lesser Range mods, and the basic Strength mods, to have positive stats they wouldn't have had before at no real down-side.

The only people that wouldn't be quite as happy would be the Shield Gate min-maxers, who prefer having negative Efficiency to power their Gating casts, but being able to go to maxed Blind Rage and still have positive Efficiency without using Fleeting? That would be amazing for the rest of the casters, and that mod for the old Shield Gating now exists anyway. On top of that, the players that want high Strength for builds on frames that don't need Gating would be lapping this up. Mag, Gara, Zephyr, Citrine, Dagath, Saryn, Qorvex, Revenant... A lot of frames would really enjoy this.

So how is that? Do you think it sounds fair?

Edited December 23, 2023 by Birdframe_Prime

[FeRixia]

I'm all for adding another range or eff mod, whether an upgrade to an existing with an Umbral or something else. It has been so long since any range improvements were added, and archon shards have ignored those 2 stats. I don't see anything wrong with giving it some love especially since we have so many shard buffs and incarnons already.