I'm sorry, what?

[PollexMessier]

On 2024-06-18 at 7:31 PM, -CRONO- said:

I think the actual "weird" and "messed up part" is players instantly going for the "fetish explanation"

It's because of how it was executed more than the idea of a pregnant warframe in the game.

The idea of a warframe maintaining a pregnancy from when it was human and having a warframe child as a result is really interesting. and could have been cool.

But, The devs made it weird by having the operator mentally linked with Jade and helping her through the process, and keeping jade's belly after reconstructing her. Reconstructed Jade is still pregnant, and you are now running around in a permanently pregnant frame. That's just completely unnecessary. That's when it really starts to feel like a barely disguised fetish from DE.

And it's made worse by two things, the fact we were promised stalker lore and got literally nothing we wanted to know about him explained, and that it was left on a cliffhanger. Also as an extension of the stalker thing, his whole backstory they gave us completely contradicts his hatred of the tenno. He and his girlfriend were turned into warframes over a forbidden love, and said girlfriend died because of it. But he's still loyal to the Orokin, and hates us because...? It's god awful writing. And writing like that is typically an indication that the writer is trying to crowbar a narrative they want into a hole it doesn't fit in. It really, REALLY feels like self-insert fan fiction. It's bad. And the cliffhanger means we're going to have more of this garbage forced down our throats later.

The whole pregnancy thing is just a glaring elephant in the room for people to latch onto who don't quite know how to articulate what the actual problems with it are.

[_Kit_Kat_Cat_]

46 minutes ago, PollexMessier said:

It's because of how it was executed more than the idea of a pregnant warframe in the game.

The idea of a warframe maintaining a pregnancy from when it was human and having a warframe child as a result is really interesting. and could have been cool.

But, The devs made it weird by having the operator mentally linked with Jade and helping her through the process, and keeping jade's belly after reconstructing her. Reconstructed Jade is still pregnant, and you are now running around in a permanently pregnant frame. That's just completely unnecessary. That's when it really starts to feel like a barely disguised fetish from DE.

And it's made worse by two things, the fact we were promised stalker lore and got literally nothing we wanted to know about him explained, and that it was left on a cliffhanger. Also as an extension of the stalker thing, his whole backstory they gave us completely contradicts his hatred of the tenno. He and his girlfriend were turned into warframes over a forbidden love, and said girlfriend died because of it. But he's still loyal to the Orokin, and hates us because...? It's god awful writing. And writing like that is typically an indication that the writer is trying to crowbar a narrative they want into a hole it doesn't fit in. It really, REALLY feels like self-insert fan fiction. It's bad. And the cliffhanger means we're going to have more of this garbage forced down our throats later.

The whole pregnancy thing is just a glaring elephant in the room for people to latch onto who don't quite know how to articulate what the actual problems with it are.

This person gets it. It's not about "what" it is (the theme itself), but rather HOW it was implemented. It's too much on the nose, bluntly and roughly in your face, rubbing it in. The idea could have been good, but it's the way it was presented to us that makes it weird and seem as nothing more than a preggo-fetish.

Plus yes, we were promised a Stalker-themed quest, to learn more about him. But instead we got Jade's quest instead, essentially. No old questions answered about Stalker, only new ones arise. While keeping things without answers is good on paper to give things an aura of "mystery"... Warframe over the years has left way too much stuff as "mysterious". People wanted answers at least about Stalker, especially after being promised that. But nope. Only more questions now.

But at least we now know his pre-Stalker name and that he had a gf/wife, who also became a warframe(ish?) like him. Buuuuuuuut... that's it. No answers as to why they are sentient like Umbra(or are they even same as Umbra?). No answers to having proper reasoning for hunting us (outside of cuz we killed Orokin?). No answers as to why or how he met with Hunhow and why their interest suddenly aligned (aside from just maybe a case of "enemy of my enemy", but then why does Stalker "serve" Hunhow?). And so many more questions... Both about Stalker AND now also the baby. Baby-warframe... BRUH.

[Snowbluff]

1 hour ago, PollexMessier said:

It's because of how it was executed more than the idea of a pregnant warframe in the game.

The idea of a warframe maintaining a pregnancy from when it was human and having a warframe child as a result is really interesting. and could have been cool.

But, The devs made it weird by having the operator mentally linked with Jade and helping her through the process, and keeping jade's belly after reconstructing her. Reconstructed Jade is still pregnant, and you are now running around in a permanently pregnant frame. That's just completely unnecessary. That's when it really starts to feel like a barely disguised fetish from DE.

And it's made worse by two things, the fact we were promised stalker lore and got literally nothing we wanted to know about him explained, and that it was left on a cliffhanger. Also as an extension of the stalker thing, his whole backstory they gave us completely contradicts his hatred of the tenno. He and his girlfriend were turned into warframes over a forbidden love, and said girlfriend died because of it. But he's still loyal to the Orokin, and hates us because...? It's god awful writing. And writing like that is typically an indication that the writer is trying to crowbar a narrative they want into a hole it doesn't fit in. It really, REALLY feels like self-insert fan fiction. It's bad. And the cliffhanger means we're going to have more of this garbage forced down our throats later.

The whole pregnancy thing is just a glaring elephant in the room for people to latch onto who don't quite know how to articulate what the actual problems with it are.

I agree. I think there is a world where some dev makes a game and has a pregnant woman with a tasteful role in the story. DE is not that dev. DE is the "gemussy" dev.


Furthermore, this really is just an awkward onion of issues. The problems have layers. On top of the weird use of a pregnancy and fridging Jade, we have a mission that is supposed to give us Jade and Stalker lore and literally gives us no explanation about their motivations. There are ways to tie all of this together, like making our tenno somehow personally responsible for harming Jade or the Stalker, justifying a distrust for us.

[-CRONO-]

2 hours ago, PollexMessier said:

But, The devs made it weird by having the operator mentally linked with Jade and helping her through the process (...).

I'm not sure how a character helping someone who is pregnant can be perceived as "weird".  I swear some people in the community have no idea what's part of nature and are only exposing their own taboos. 

3 hours ago, PollexMessier said:

(...) keeping jade's belly after reconstructing her. Reconstructed Jade is still pregnant, and you are now running around in a permanently pregnant frame. That's just completely unnecessary.

I think is of little importance if the design of a warframe is pregnant, besides, is just a "human" body, BIG DEAL (It won't bite you or insult you, I promise).

3 hours ago, PollexMessier said:

That's when it really starts to feel like a barely disguised fetish from DE.

If Jade had suggestive (18+) iddle animations involving her "pregnant belly" I could COMPLETELY understand the fetish idea...

BUT THERE'S LITERALLY NOTHING IN THE QUEST OR THE GAME TO SUPPORT THAT.

No, this whole thread is just a bunch of players exposing their own distorted views.

[-CRONO-]

2 hours ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

This person gets it. It's not about "what" it is (the theme itself), but rather HOW it was implemented.

The idea could have been good, but it's the way it was presented to us that makes it weird and seem as nothing more than a preggo-fetish.

I'm sorry... Are you suggesting pregnancy is such a "lewd" topic that it can only be approached with subtlety? Like, if you see a pregnant woman in real life your brain doesn't associate it with something beautiful and part of nature, but just the sexual act or something? 

2 hours ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

It's too much on the nose, bluntly and roughly in your face, rubbing it in.

"Too much on the nose, bluntly and roughly in your face, rubbing it in" would've been watching a cinematic of Stalker and Jade doing it (IF THAT WAS THE CASE I WOULD COMPLETLY UNDERSTAND YOU SAYING SOMETHING LIKE THAT). But that's not what happened, nothing truly graphic was shown... Not even the actual birth (that was just a bit of lights and voilà!).

If Jade had suggestive (18+) iddle animations involving her "pregnant belly" I could COMPLETELY understand the fetish idea...

BUT THERE'S LITERALLY NOTHING IN THE QUEST OR THE GAME TO SUPPORT THAT.

No, this whole thread is just a bunch of players exposing their own distorted views.

[Gaxxian]

hace 12 minutos, -CRONO- dijo:

If Jade had suggestive (18+) iddle animations involving her "pregnant belly" I could COMPLETELY understand the fetish idea...

You don't understand what a fetish is.

hace 4 minutos, -CRONO- dijo:

I'm sorry... Are you suggesting pregnancy is such a "lewd" topic that it can only be approached with subtlety? Like, if you see a pregnant woman in real life your brain doesn't associate it with something beautiful and part of nature, but just the sexual act or something? 

Same here -__-

hace 12 minutos, -CRONO- dijo:

I'm not sure how a character helping someone who is pregnant can be perceived as "weird".  I swear some people in the community have no idea what's part of nature and are only exposing their own taboos. 

Because our characters are the ones doing the "push". Thats why we have the minigame to syncronize with Jade.

Edited June 20 by Gaxxian

[-CRONO-]

1 minute ago, Gaxxian said:

You don't understand what a fetish is.

While one of the meanings of the words is "an unreasonable interest in an activity or a topic", players are CLEARLY using the one where the interest is of sexual nature (don't try to pretend otherwise). 

3 minutes ago, Gaxxian said:

Because our characters are the ones doing the "push". That we have the minigame to syncronize with Jade.

Again, nothing weird with that given how transference exists.

This just sounds like you think you're actually changing bodies in real life (it was just the story of a videogame, and it wasn't even from the point of view of the woman, grow up...).

[Gaxxian]

hace 1 minuto, -CRONO- dijo:

While one of the meanings of the words is "an unreasonable interest in an activity or a topic", players are CLEARLY using the one where the interest is of sexual nature (don't try to pretend otherwise). 

Im not trying to pretend otherwise, since thats exactly what we are talking about, yet you still not grasping how a fetish works for a person that, you know, it has that fetish.

Somebody with preggo fetish doesn't need that the pregnant lady does anything out of her way to do anything that you, person without the fetish, would consider extreme or sexy. Just her being there, touching and showing her preggo bump from time to time is enough for somebody with that fetish to have "feelings".

 

Look at 2B from NieR Automata for example. She is in a nearly eternal war against machines yet she is dressed in a gothic-like apparel and with high heels (even in the desert). It has any sense? No. Its a fetish from the author (and confirmed by himself). You are just fighting and moving like normal in the world, 2B doesn't do NOTHING by herself to incite you. Yet thats the fetish from the author. Take it or leave it. At least, 2B has more meat under her appearance that makes her a great character. Jade not.

 

hace 11 minutos, -CRONO- dijo:

Again, nothing weird with that given how transference exists.

You literally incarnate Jave within her body to make the pushes, so, living the process, yet you don't see anything weird. Ok.

[_Kit_Kat_Cat_]

34 minutes ago, -CRONO- said:

I'm sorry... Are you suggesting pregnancy is such a "lewd" topic that it can only be approached with subtlety? Like, if you see a pregnant woman in real life your brain doesn't associate it with something beautiful and part of nature, but just the sexual act or something?

Yes. Yes, it is supposed to be approached with subtlety. Its a natural thing of life, yes, but it's not something that you rub into everyone's faces. It's a private matter.

Also, the literal birthing process is for sure a very private thing too and is not supposed to be "shown off in full detail to everyone". ESPECIALLY if we're talking in context of a quest in a looter-/horde-shooter game about space ninjas. A quest with a "birthing" mini-game simply has no place here.

"There is a place and a time". Warframe is definitely NOT a place for it.

34 minutes ago, -CRONO- said:

"Too much on the nose, bluntly and roughly in your face, rubbing it in" would've been watching a cinematic of Stalker and Jade doing it (IF THAT WAS THE CASE I WOULD COMPLETLY UNDERSTAND YOU SAYING SOMETHING LIKE THAT). But that's not what happened, nothing truly graphic was shown... Not even the actual birth (that was just a bit of lights and voilà!).

If Jade had suggestive (18+) iddle animations involving her "pregnant belly" I could COMPLETELY understand the fetish idea...

BUT THERE'S LITERALLY NOTHING IN THE QUEST OR THE GAME TO SUPPORT THAT.

No, this whole thread is just a bunch of players exposing their own distorted views.

Bruh... There is literally a "birthing" mini-game. Or you have missed that part entirely? The whole... "Push" thing? Where you press spacebar over that line and such? That is CLEARLY simulating the process of birthing and pushing the baby out, as indicated by the result of "winning" in this mini-game, when Jade turns into dust(dies when giving birth), while a baby appears in Stalker's hands.

This is inappropriate. This is too much. This has no place to be in the game. It's not subtle. It's not done with care, class or style. It's tone-deaf, overly blunt, rubbing it in players' faces. Which is exactly why people percieve it as nothing more than someone's preggo-fetish fan-fiction, rather than a well-written part of a quest.

Edited June 20 by _Kit_Kat_Cat_

[-CRONO-]

1 minute ago, Gaxxian said:

Im not trying to pretend otherwise, since thats exactly what we are talking about, yet you still not grasping how a fetish works for a person that, you know, it has that fetish.

Look at 2B from NieR Automata for example. She is in a nearly eternal war against machines yet she is dressed in a gothic-like apparel and with high heels (even in the desert).

You're just proving my point...

"An unreasonable interest in an activity or a topic" is what happened in NieR Automata... The gothic fashion was the center of attention for the entire game, but Jade's belly isn't even noticable (or the main focus) of the update.

We didn't spend an unreasonable amount of time dealing with the pregnancy either... 

10 minutes ago, Gaxxian said:

You literally incarnate Jave within her body to make the pushes, so, living the process, yet you don't see anything weird. Ok.

No, nothing weird because that would be part of what "transference" can involve... After all, everytime we take control of a warframe we're basically taking control of what once was a human body.

Look... I no longer see the point of discussing this, have a nice day!

[-CRONO-]

4 minutes ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

It's not subtle. It's not done with care, class or style. It's tone-deaf, overly blunt, rubbing it in players' faces.

Knowing full well what the process of giving birth involves I think the mini-game was by definition "subtle".

So I guess we'll have to agree to disagree...

Anyway, have a nice day!

[PollexMessier]

1 minute ago, -CRONO- said:

but Jade's belly isn't even noticable (or the main focus) of the update.

Jade being pregnant is literally the entire plot of the quest. So much so that they forgot they were suppose to give us actual lore.
And it's a big glowing ball on her stomach. Literally, glowing. It's not even a "they might as well have put up a big neon sign" situation, its a "they literally did put up a big neon sign" situation.

It couldn't be more the focus of the update if it was just a 24 hour stream of her stomach.

are you blind?

[_Kit_Kat_Cat_]

3 minutes ago, -CRONO- said:

Knowing full well what the process of giving birth involves I think the mini-game was by definition "subtle".

So I guess we'll have to agree to disagree...

Anyway, have a nice day!

It should not have been in the game in the first place. In no shape or form at all. It's that simple.

[-CRONO-]

26 minutes ago, PollexMessier said:

Jade being pregnant is literally the entire plot of the quest.

I'm clearly talking about the character design, not the pregnancy and what it entails.

26 minutes ago, PollexMessier said:

are you blind?

I am, actually.. Almost completely blind from my right eye to be more precise (some medical issues which I won't discuss on a public forum) while the left one is thankfully almost all good. Are you planning on making fun of that or something?

Word of advice... Be careful when using that phrase, because every once in a while you can, in fact, be speaking to someone who is blind (like me). :) 

Have a nice day!

Edited June 20 by -CRONO-

[_Kit_Kat_Cat_]

5 minutes ago, -CRONO- said:

I'm clearly talking about the character design, not the pregnancy and what it entails.

Character design is an entirely different topic and is not discussed here. This thread is about the quest and how absolutely inappropriate and out of place it is. But it ALSO surely includes Jade's design as a "pregnant warframe" too. Which wouldn't have felt as horrible, if it weren't for the quest, which rubs it all in your face. None of this should have been in Warframe. Period.

7 minutes ago, -CRONO- said:

19 minutes ago, PollexMessier said:

are you blind?

I am, actually... Almost completely blind from my right eye to be more precise (some medical issues which I won't discuss on a public forum) while the left one is thankfully almost all good. Are you planning on making fun of that or something?

Word of advice... Be careful when using that phrase, because every once in a while you can, in fact, be speaking to someone who is blind (like me). :) 

It's the Internet. Nobody owes you anything, especially since they don't see you in person. Especially when it comes to a simple figure of speech such as "are you blind", implying you not seeing something very obvious. If an ages old figure of speech present in any English dictionary hurts your feelings - it's a you problem. Nobody would make fun of your disability, once people know about it (and now we do, since you told us), but up until that happened? Nobody owes you anything. And certainly shouldn't "be careful". It's a figure of speech, not a personal attack. Stop victimizing yourself.

And I'm pretty sure you're already just trolling at this point.

[0bsi]

1 hour ago, -CRONO- said:

I'm sorry... Are you suggesting pregnancy is such a "lewd" topic that it can only be approached with subtlety? Like, if you see a pregnant woman in real life your brain doesn't associate it with something beautiful and part of nature, but just the sexual act or something?

It isn't that pregnancy itself is lewd.  The Jade design is (thankfully) not suggestive or sexualised in any way.... that's fine.

The reason people argue that it seems like a fetish thing is that ... well.... the internet is the internet.....  there is a part of the Warframe community that already sexualises frames  (Remember "gemussy" and all the thirst for "Mommy Hildryn" etc.) 

Remember when someone in a devstream chat literally asked about pregnant warframes.....  Yeah.... that happened....   And now here we are.  

 

[PollexMessier]

1 hour ago, -CRONO- said:

I am, actually... Almost completely blind from my right eye to be more precise (some medical issues which I won't discuss on a public forum) while the left one is thankfully almost all good. Are you planning on making fun of that or something?

Word of advice... Be careful when using that phrase, because every once in a while you can, in fact, be speaking to someone who is blind (like me). :) 

Have a nice day!

And so you weaponize it to (try to) win an argument you couldn't come up with an actual counter for.

Really gaining my sympathy with that one.

The intention of the saying is "are you (completely) blind" which is pretty clear in nearly every context it's used in. You can still see the big glowing green blob that makes up 20% of Jade's model tho. And it's only that small of a percentage because of how large her dress is.

Edited June 20 by PollexMessier

[EclipsePhrase]

On 2024-06-19 at 2:48 AM, Larrell said:

I love Yareli but I've said since day one, "How did he explain this one to the council?"

I'd put down money for just an audio log of that conversation. Even if it just consists of the council pleading with him to explain the justification and Ballas responding with variations of smoking a blunt and reminding everyone that he is an Orokin, which makes it the best idea ever.

[_Kit_Kat_Cat_]

Some extra food for thought.

• Why there is a "Content warning" at the beginning? Warframe is a 18+ game already as it is. There shouldn't be any warnings of "sensitive materials", aside from warnings of being locked into the Quest and unable to interact with the rest of the Warframe content (same as how it was with the New War).
• Why this Content warning mentions "Scenes of trauma related to motherhood"? I haven't seen any such things in the quest. Wanna know why? Because there are none. The "mother" - Jade - has 15 seconds "screen time" and spends it laying in bed. That's it.

Instead, there are other trauma-related scenes, which I'll explain further down below. Let's see...

• "Loss of your significant other" - which is a universal thing for men and women, and can happen to anyone, not only "mothers". Stalker lost his lover and it's a traumatic event;
•  "Becoming a single parent" - which is a universal thing for men and women, and can happen to anyone, not only "mothers". Stalker lost his lover and is now a single parent, which is for sure another traumatic event;
• "Parenthood", in general - yes, for some people it can be traumatic, life-altering, especially if this person is not ready or is someone like Stalker... an immortal murder-machine who's hell-bent on a mission of killing all Tenno and such - quite the traumatic event for him to now having to get out of his "comfort zone" (where he's been for centuries of murder) and having to change, in order to parent his child.

But I guess, according to DE's writers, men - Stalker, in this case - have no feelings, right? And thus, none of the trauma can be applied to him? Which is why all the trauma is - for some reason - instantly attributed to "trauma related to motherhood" aka "oh no, poor Jade, gave birth and died, how traumatic". Or something like that, I suppose?

Which leads me into the next thing:

• This quest was advertised to be as a "more Stalker lore quest". Only for it to be fully hijacked into becoming a Jade-centric quest with an absolutely unnecessary pregnancy minigame shoved into it, in an absolutely careless, blunt and tone-deaf fashion. Which is EXACTLY WHY this whole thing feels as "nothing more than someone's preggo-fetishistic fanfic" - it's all about the way it was all presented, not the topics themselves.
• The only "more lore" about Stalker we actually got was his name before he became Stalker AND the fact that he had a lover/gf. That is literally it. Every other question we had about Stalker(and there are a lot) is left untouched and unanswered... While the quest only gives us even more unanswered questions now instead.

 

And ok, you know what? You're right. We shouldn't attribute this to "someone's fetish". No. But then another question appears: Who's at DE is pregnant and used this quest as a "pregnancy announcement" of theirs? Because if it's not a "fetish thing" (with how it all was shoved in our faces), then it must be some other thing. And "pregnancy announcement" (for the whole Warframe player base to know, I take it?) comes to mind as the "next best thing" for being a reason as to why we even got this quest in... the way it was presented.

 

Presentation is the problem. Not the themes themselves.

Edited June 20 by _Kit_Kat_Cat_

[Bearssi]

6 minutes ago, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

Which leads me into the next thing:

• This quest was advertised to be as a "more Stalker lore quest". Only for it to be fully hijacked into becoming a Jade-centric quest with an absolutely unnecessary pregnancy minigame shoved into it, in an absolutely careless, blunt and tone-deaf fashion. Which is EXACTLY WHY this whole thing feels as "nothing more than someone's preggo-fetishistic fanfic" - it's all about the way it was all presented, not the topics themselves.

The pregnancy minigame also implies our teenager or almost child Operators transference into Jade to deliver the child, as girl or boy operators. 

[_Kit_Kat_Cat_]

18 minutes ago, Bearssi said:

The pregnancy minigame also implies our teenager or almost child Operators transference into Jade to deliver the child, as girl or boy operators. 

/sarcasm_mode on

But... Muh ETERNALISM! And alternate realities/dimensions/timelines! Where through Void shenanigans, our Operator is of the opposite gender to the "main" one! So, boom, more void shenanigans, even if you're playing as a male Operator, the whole "birthing" thing is performed by the "alternate reality" version of him - a female instead!

/sarcasm_mode off

Yeah, I don't know either.

Edited June 20 by _Kit_Kat_Cat_

[NameLessFreak]

On 2024-06-20 at 9:39 AM, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

It should not have been in the game in the first place. In no shape or form at all. It's that simple.

Because it doesn't suit your sensitivities? 

[_Kit_Kat_Cat_]

9 hours ago, NameLessFreak said:

Because it doesn't suit your sensitivities? 

No, because it does not suit the game - it's identity, it's tone, it's gameplay, it's logic and literally everything else. "There is a time and a place". And Warframe is not the place for a literal birthing mini-game. Has nothing to do about someone being sensitive. I said it before and I'll just quote myself:

On 2024-06-21 at 12:36 AM, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

Presentation is the problem. Not the themes themselves.

Childbirth (even if in relation to warframes / technocite virus infected people, I suppose) by itself is not a problem - it's normal, it's biology, it's natural. But it's also a private topic and shouldn't be rubbed in our faces. Let alone implying that our own Operator is "participating" in that via Transference - and we all know how that works by this point, where our Operator is directly "jumping into", "possessing" a warframe like some spirit... or a demon. Which means controlling it directly. Which is why we get to experience and "play" through this birthing mini-game.

So yes. Presentation is the problem.

[Nekomian]

On 2024-06-20 at 5:36 PM, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

Why there is a "Content warning" at the beginning? Warframe is a 18+ game already as it is. There shouldn't be any warnings of "sensitive materials", aside from warnings of being locked into the Quest and unable to interact with the rest of the Warframe content (same as how it was with the New War).

Just an FYI, this game is 13+ - ESRB (or most organizations that rate games) is not law, it's just a body that rates games according to a review that may or may not be regularly updated. The only requirement to create an account is be 13+. Content warnings also serve an important purpose - to let people know that specific content may be triggering for people who have trauma related to it. It's meant as a warning for the person to either disengage with the content or to prepare for it mentally.

On 2024-06-20 at 5:36 PM, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

Why this Content warning mentions "Scenes of trauma related to motherhood"?

Maybe it's just me, but I read that and immediately knew it would be related to birth, miscarriage, or death of some sort related to pregnancy. It's specifically differentiated in this way because while death in general can be traumatizing, this game has a lot of that; this warning is specific to pregnancy, without saying it outright since that would spoil it. It's also independent of the duration - it could be 5 seconds or 5 minutes of time that the content occurs in, but that doesn't make the warning any less valid to be applied.

It also felt like they pulled punches here a bit knowing that, making Jade just disappear and not showing a lifeless body or lingering on it for too long (it went by very quickly), because it's likely a very sensitive topic for those who may have lost loved ones, had complications with pregnancy, or other numerous situations.

On 2024-06-20 at 5:36 PM, _Kit_Kat_Cat_ said:

But I guess, according to DE's writers, men - Stalker, in this case - have no feelings, right? And thus, none of the trauma can be applied to him? Which is why all the trauma is - for some reason - instantly attributed to "trauma related to motherhood" aka "oh no, poor Jade, gave birth and died, how traumatic". Or something like that, I suppose?

To reiterate - all of the things you listed can still cause trauma, and Stalker likely has some from experiencing this death as well, it just did not have a content warning associated. The game already flippantly throws around deaths, so a warning every time there is one would seem excessive. It tends to use warnings sparingly, and for scenes that can connect emotionally with players (i.e. emotional abuse in TNW, pregnancy and giving birth / sacrificing oneself for their child in this one, etc.), specifically very similar situations that they may have experienced personally that have caused them much stress.

I'm also quite confused by the whole "operator delivering the child" discussion - I saw it as more of a midwife situation, providing assistance for contractions, like someone there holding your hand or walking you through it. It's shown that Jade still has autonomy, and the operator is not controlling them, only helping guide them. I suppose it's rather vague what specifically the operator might feel during transference, but they have experienced many other forms of abuse (even literal death) and emotional pain both in and out of frames, and it's a bit unclear to what degree they feel these things or how intensely (it's seemingly not agreed upon or consistent, let alone lore vs gameplay) during it. Researching about this discussion yields like 20+ different definitions of what transference is to individuals and how operators feel during it, so I guess the reception to this is going to vary depending on how people view it.

[Traumtulpe]

Really now? *This* is where you people draw the line? We've had worse writing that this quest (poor pop culture imitations), and Stalker putting his hatred aside so he can be a father was pretty cool.

I'm so curious what's gonna happen with the kid too. You just know it's gonna have super powers beyond what has been seen so far.