The one issue with new cold - Defense

[Void2258]

New cold is excellent. However, there is one knockon effect that needs to be dealt with. New cold makes Defense missions difficult and longer. In defense you want units to come at you as fast as possible; this is why Speedva exists. Faster enemies = faster mission. Frozen enemies = stalled mission.

Defense is the only mission in the game that actively punishes CCing enemies. It's past time for defense to move from wave based to timer based, so you can CC and the mission can proceed. Ironically, Frost is both the best AND worst at Defense currently.

Edited June 23 by Void2258

[Balegrim]

Smart suggestion. I like. 5 minute intervals like survival. Keep the objective alive that long and leave or press on for the next tier of rewards. 

[vixenpixel]

28 minutes ago, Balegrim said:

Smart suggestion. I like. 5 minute intervals like survival. Keep the objective alive that long and leave or press on for the next tier of rewards. 

Yeah make it more like Mirror Defense. Poor on the waves instead of the trickle of enemies we see in normal defense missions. I actually go out of my way to not do defense missions. In my eyes, it's the worst mission design in the game. Stand in one spot and fire in direction until everything is dead. It's like anti fun. Plus you end up with khoras using cage or wisps with electrical motes occasionally and they make the timer twice as long. I think defense missions should follow the mirror defense recipe because that is fun.

[Zakkhar]

20 hours ago, Void2258 said:

Defense is the only mission in the game that actively punishes CCing enemies.

Not if you cc them in very narrow radius around the Defence Target.  Plus, I do not like the usage of word punish here. It is simply communicating that it is not intended way of playing it. And it is not the only one. Any other mission that is based on KPM and not timer will work worse if you cc the whole map. Netracells, Survival, Void Armageddon (if you fail to kill enemies in time and have to move to other point (eg B) they will nuke the previousr point (eg. A)., SO/ESO, Void Flood also technically, Excavation (enemies with batteries stuck away from obj etc.

20 hours ago, Void2258 said:

Frozen enemies = stalled mission

Do they freeze passively or is there a player input needed? If there is a player input needed, have you tried, dunno, not doing it?

Edited June 24 by Zakkhar

[alchemyisreal]

There is a reason why the meta for arbitrations defense is 2-3 dps with kuva ogris the OP is clearly playing a different game.

[keTch-uP]

Strongly against this proposition. The majority of defense missions can be cleared way faster than 1 minute per wave, this would probably prolong the mission time by a lot. Maybe add two clear conditions, either killcount or the suggested timer.

Edited June 24 by keTch-uP

[0_The_F00l]

20 hours ago, keTch-uP said:

Strongly against this proposition. The majority of defense missions can be cleared way faster than 1 minute per wave, this would probably prolong the mission time by a lot. Maybe add two clear conditions, either killcount or the suggested timer.

I think this is more reasonable ,

DE has already introduced means to cut down some of the fixed timer missions (survival , mirror defense) by taking out unique enemies. Something similar can be introduced.

[Lord_Drod]

Mirror Defense exists already.  It shouldn't replace defense just because people are using too much CC.  Defense is also far from the only mission where you don't want map wide CC.

Defense actually can be fun.  It is all up to the user, but if it's timer based, the option of fun goes away.  Unless you find the most fun standing around, doing nothing and chatting with your squadmates, there will be nothing to do with time based defense.  Not only that, but you will pay a huge luxury tax for the ability to play the game this way. 

It's okay that Mirror Defense exists as an option, but it doesn't feel anything like normal defense, even if the collecting was removed, which I don't think would improve that mode at all.  I'd like to see some ways to speed it up maybe through collecting or kills or a mini boss.  There needs to be an incentive to do something.  I'd also like more than 2 different defense tiles in the same rotation and more transition rooms.

The irony, you want to save time, by forcing an arbitrary timer on everyone and are willing to give up the option of ever getting rewards fast and also eliminating a major portion of the gameplay.  And in the end, you will end up losing way more time since every instance of defense would be less rewarding per actual time spent in mission.  Since there is no way DE will actually give a mission that is on timers comparable rotation rewards to those that are user influenced.

I'd also like to see maybe some endless 3 wave eximus stronghold variants of defense around outside of duviri.

[(PSN)BAM-BAM-73]

Maybe treat frozen enemies as incapacitated and start the next defence round automagically?

I believe enemies that nekros adopts already do this.

Personaly I don't want timers in defence missions.

[Famecans]

On 2024-06-23 at 10:26 AM, Void2258 said:

It's past time for defense to move from wave based to timer based

Citrine farm is so boring.