SnakeWildlife Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) One word to sum this...IMPOSSIBLE Me and my friend took in 2 UBER-MAXED Mag Primes, whilst using a Vermillion anti-toxin. We entered with 400 Energy-Fill pads. We continueously and infinitely spammed Crush with OverExtended, Stretch, Blind Rage, Focus (all mods maxed), using energy pads to refresh our energy. This is a VERY VERY costly and expensive strategy to put together. ... and around 78% we failed the mission, enemies were nearly instant killing us and there is no good place for cover. So spamming crush infinitely doesnt work, what does? THIS IS NOT POSSIBLE with 2 people. And you designed this for one person? Get serious and take a good hard look at it. Edited December 21, 2013 by SnakeWildlife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIL0S Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Bigger numbers! Bigger grinding! Bah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slaskia Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 I haven't tried the defense part yet *wants to finish the codex of the plants first...just the moonlight one left*, but I do know that, at least for a couple of patches, the hellions were spawning two jetpacks upon death. Don't know if they still are or not (haven't really been paying attention as the last few runs I was more focused on killing everything and hunting for those stupid jadeleaves), but if they are, that would certainly make the defense more difficult for soloers. I'm a soloer, but I don't have NAT problems, so when it comes time for me to do a vermillion run, I'm going with a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogueweapon Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 defending solo in a game made for 4 people , what could go wrong ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIL0S Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Guys! I know what the problem is. It just came to me.The problem is... You're not using Oberon!... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pendragon1951 Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 I myself had the same problem of trying to do it solo. I think a lot of it is the lack of information that you have to find out on the fly or from other players in chat or in the forum. Here is an example, as you all know they very specifically mention that solo play can also be done for this event, with that in mind and the knowledge of previous events with scoring I went in three times once with the Topaz Anti-toxin and twice with the Beryl Ant-Toxin. So after the third run I check my score and I only have 15 points? Now I know that the other two were 10 point anti-toxins I should see 35 points. So I went on Twitter and mentioned it to DERebecca and it was then she informed me that the event was not additive, no where on the original event posting did it mention this. Which of course for a solo player ment they were never going to see 100 points because of the big Stric-Nat problem, trust issues with trolls or simply rather playing solo. Now let me back up a sec, those three runs never lasted more than 10% before lotus told me I could go to extraction, so with that info in mind and assuming the balance would be different for a solo player I farmed all the extracts for the Vermillon anti-toxin and went in alone as Rhino. Now mind you this was before all these posts about which Warframe was better to use for this event. Long story short I realized by the point of 70% that even as a solo player they were going to make me do it to 100%. I got mission failed at 74% and to me I don't think the amount of enemies attacking was any different than if I had gone in with a four man team. I personally think the biggest problem for this event is balance, I hope I will be able to team up with my son and clan mates if the Stric-Nat problem doesn't prevent it. I did not read everyone of these posts has any of you done it solo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost_Cartographer Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Apathy is a terminal illness for any community. Jadeleaf and the lily's could stand to have at least ONE spawn per run. Literally the only reason DE would have chosen to make them rare spawns is to get people to run a map filled with a mere 34 guys over and over and over again for the LOW CHANCE a precious weed has spawned. You know, that WOULD make sense if this was a pay-to-play game... but it's not. Stupid developer decision #I-lost-count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Methanoid Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) didnt OP try what most ppl on defence do? take a frost with an ignis/glaive and autowin? but yeah the system is a bit whack. Edited December 21, 2013 by Methanoid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphyx Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 yea, right. They literally increased the chances of finding these plants. YOU HAVE 16 DAYS to complete this event. 16 bloody days, I was lucky enough to complete it within the first 5 hours because i had an amazing day cycle run but there is no need to rush, hell you can even trade for these toxins now. I have no intention of siding with OP especially when they made this event as easy as it is. He has all the methods of clearing the event but he chose the hardest route. his fault and no one else. And regarding you post about orokin keys, they dont get used up because they are way harder to find than plants you have to take scans of. Worst two comparisons you could have made... Orokin keys are hard to get? I don't know how you're farming them but you're doing it very wrong. I get them almost constantly from all survival and defense rewards... It is not harder than dealing with crappy lighting/colors that make them practically camouflaged in certain situations and the insanely zoomed in scanner. Not to mention the event is incredibly tedious, especially if you have bad luck. Go around at a snails pace looking around for flashy orange lights, make your way to it, then repeat. THAT is not fun, farming for keys you are at least doing what you play games for, killing S#&$. Yeah it's likely the hardest path but again, it should still be a viable option for the people who play solo if they are going to try and cater to solo players at all rather than the whole "oh it's possible you just need this very specific warframe with these very specific weapons and mod it in this specific way because currently it's the most op build." People may have time to get that done if they can manage getting absolutely everything required for the solo mission to be doable but even then the chance of failure is likely still high, you have one chance, then back to the boring and tedious scanning process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archistopheles Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) So spamming crush infinitely doesnt work, what does? Spamming infinite snow globe, blessing, bastille, vortex, chaos, Radial disarm, Radial Blind, and whatever Saryn's ability is called. Edited December 21, 2013 by Archistopheles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
es.iiden Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Orokin keys are hard to get? I don't know how you're farming them but you're doing it very wrong. I get them almost constantly from all survival and defense rewards... It is not harder than dealing with crappy lighting/colors that make them practically camouflaged in certain situations and the insanely zoomed in scanner. Not to mention the event is incredibly tedious, especially if you have bad luck. Go around at a snails pace looking around for flashy orange lights, make your way to it, then repeat. THAT is not fun, farming for keys you are at least doing what you play games for, killing S#&$. Yeah it's likely the hardest path but again, it should still be a viable option for the people who play solo if they are going to try and cater to solo players at all rather than the whole "oh it's possible you just need this very specific warframe with these very specific weapons and mod it in this specific way because currently it's the most op build." People may have time to get that done if they can manage getting absolutely everything required for the solo mission to be doable but even then the chance of failure is likely still high, you have one chance, then back to the boring and tedious scanning process. To get a void key, you must spend 15 minutes in survival or hope you get one in defense. in this event, you have the potential to get every type of plant in its cycle in one go and you can do many runs within 15 minutes, hell DE even boosted the rate at which rarer plants spawn and fixed the color issue. This event was NOT meant to be a solo run, it was meant to be a group event. SOLO was only for personal best. Yes I clearly understand that some people cant play in groups due to internet problems and that sucks for them but when they do put in the option for solo players to do the event and they fail then what, blame goes to dev? in a DEF mission always expect a challenge and always come prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphyx Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 To get a void key, you must spend 15 minutes in survival or hope you get one in defense. in this event, you have the potential to get every type of plant in its cycle in one go and you can do many runs within 15 minutes, hell DE even boosted the rate at which rarer plants spawn and fixed the color issue. This event was NOT meant to be a solo run, it was meant to be a group event. SOLO was only for personal best. Yes I clearly understand that some people cant play in groups due to internet problems and that sucks for them but when they do put in the option for solo players to do the event and they fail then what, blame goes to dev? in a DEF mission always expect a challenge and always come prepared. Look, I said it before and I'll say it again. If it's not meant to be a solo event then they should have NEVER gave solo players an option. Say tough luck like other group content in MMOs and move on, make a REAL solo-friendly event in the future don't throw it in as an afterthought. If you are going to try and cater to solo players in ANY way then don't half &#! it and make it reasonable rather than just flat out punishing them for not grouping, regardless of the reason (technical or preference). Keys being harder to get, whatever, that's your opinion. I find them infinitely easier and more enjoyable to get than slowly walking around in circles in fear that I may miss the one jadeleaf that spawns. In most cases from last night missions would take anywhere from 10-20 minutes in a group and still not find a jade. I'll take farming for keys in defense or survival any day over doing these codex scanning ones for something that's consumable regardless of completion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnakeWildlife Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) Spamming infinite snow globe, blessing, bastille, vortex, chaos, Radial disarm, Radial Blind, and whatever Saryn's ability is called. Lets see that happen with 1 or 2 players. Get it on youtube for us. Edited December 21, 2013 by SnakeWildlife Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archistopheles Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Lets see that happen with 1 or 2 players. Get it on youtube for us. Will do. Shadowplay is pretty sweet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mak_Gohae Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Topic basically says it all. Having to farm for 4 of each type of jadeleaf to only get a single chance to defend a point for seemingly roughly 20-30 minutes full of enemies whose jetpacks fly at the defense point etc. strikes me as absolutely absurd. If you really wanted it to be an option for solo players, why the hell does it expire after one failed try? I'm not going to farm for a few hours to just try to grind out a very long defense mission full of enemies that make it near impossible to keep the core's health up (And if you think a solo player can REALLY shoot all the jetpacks off these guys' backs while keeping eviscerators away and the regular swarms etc, sorry, we can't all be gods at this game like you must be to maintain that for 20+ minutes). Am I alone in thinking this is a joke if this is supposed to enable solo completion of the event for the weapon? It expires for everyone. You are not the only person that has failed. You have two weeks to get this going so try again. You dont have to farm for 5 hours straights just do a couple of missions when you log in and a couple of missions when you log out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kagumin Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) This thread is a prime example of QQ: "I could make you a sandwich, give you 100, 000$, and massage your back and you would still complain about the type of bread I used." Relevant. Edited December 21, 2013 by Kagumin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genuinetheo Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Are toxins not consumables? I don't see my rifle ammo packs refilling every time I fail a mission, either. It sucks &#!. Nothing should get used if you fail the mission, it's like it never happened. While we're at it let's make it so if we do complete the mission we get twice the consumables back! ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UFOLoche Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 If it's co op then remove single player from the game. If they are going to make an effort to cater to solo players AT ALL they may as well do it right and not punish them more than the game already does. Orokin keys do not get used up if you fail the mission and the are a million times easier to get than these toxins so why should the toxins be any different? There could be explanations for that. Like how the keys are linked to a single space in the void. You keep the key if you fail the mission because there's still work to be done. With the antitoxin, you use it and that's it. If you go in solo, you have to accept that there's a chance you'll lose. It sucks for people restricted by NAT, but even then, the mission isn't that hard. Frankly, I'd be happy DE even listened at all. In other MMOs I've played, the devs probly would've just laughed at you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hydrium Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 God forbid failure has real consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valiant Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) Yeah solo will naturally be harder. However, the fact you lose the jade leaf isn't entirely right at all. We never had that situation with previous events. Though that's why co-op should be attempted anyways, for more of a chance of success. It isn't that hard to obtain anyways and everyone, not just people who solo. It's just down to - for some - choice. Edited December 21, 2013 by Naith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphyx Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 There could be explanations for that. Like how the keys are linked to a single space in the void. You keep the key if you fail the mission because there's still work to be done. With the antitoxin, you use it and that's it. If you go in solo, you have to accept that there's a chance you'll lose. It sucks for people restricted by NAT, but even then, the mission isn't that hard. Frankly, I'd be happy DE even listened at all. In other MMOs I've played, the devs probly would've just laughed at you. I would rather they have not done anything for solo players if it's implemented poorly. Don't get me wrong I am grateful that they DO seem to care about people who play solo but I still don't like the fact that it was just added in as an afterthought. Also, nothing else in game that I remember for this kind of event is consumed upon failure. I could be wrong, it's been a while. What about the corrupters? Were those also consumed on failure or disconnect? I don't recall failing one of those missions so I don't know but I never heard any complaints about that. If I am correct in thinking this then many people could have just been screwed out of the vermillion toxin assuming it would work like the rest of the consumable "event"/special location items (void keys). Consistency would be nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KinkyHamster Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 If you're not a god, then you have no place in solo-tier. Good day sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UFOLoche Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) I would rather they have not done anything for solo players if it's implemented poorly. Don't get me wrong I am grateful that they DO seem to care about people who play solo but I still don't like the fact that it was just added in as an afterthought. Also, nothing else in game that I remember for this kind of event is consumed upon failure. I could be wrong, it's been a while. What about the corrupters? Were those also consumed on failure or disconnect? I don't recall failing one of those missions so I don't know but I never heard any complaints about that. If I am correct in thinking this then many people could have just been screwed out of the vermillion toxin assuming it would work like the rest of the consumable "event"/special location items (void keys). Consistency would be nice. But it's NOT implemented poorly is the thing. Solo players wanted it to be changed to accommodate them. Are defense missions done poorly because co-op players have a easier time than solo players? Also, to answer your point on what I assume are the Dragon Keys, from the wiki itself: "Keys are only consumed when used to open a vault, and will remain in your possesion(sic) until you do so." Edited December 21, 2013 by UFOLoche Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seraphyx Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 (edited) But it's NOT implemented poorly is the thing. Solo players wanted it to be changed to accommodate them. Are defense missions done poorly because co-op players have a easier time than solo players? Also, to answer your point on what I assume are the Dragon Keys, from the wiki itself: "Keys are only consumed when used to open a vault, and will remain in your possesion(sic) until you do so." No, I'm referring to normal void keys (tower 1,2,3). Those are not consumed upon failure. The corruptors from the fomorian event are what I was referring to in the second part of the post. If those were also consumed regardless of failure then nevermind. If they weren't consumed upon failure (just like normal void keys are not consumed if you go in and fail the mission) then it would be nice if the toxins weren't either. I don't find solo play even remotely viable unless you are using a handful of frames or have ridiculously powerful gear. The game does not cater very well to solo play at all in my opinion and this event is no exception. You should not be having an even harder time solo than you would if you played online. I don't find it to be balanced at all and until it CAN be balanced properly I think that yes, maybe things should be a bit easier if you're playing in solo mode. Just the fact that you have three other team mates who can revive you is massive. If you make one mistake playing solo you're done, that's it. Either waste a revive if you have one and hope it's not too late or start over completely. I'm not asking to be able to solo hours of survival or defense missions but it would be nice if it were easy enough for the average player to finish this mission solo on most frames with good gear. If you believe it's not implemented poorly then I'd like to know what you think they did specifically for this event that helps solo players finish the mission with 100 points, excluding simply making it a possibility. Edited December 21, 2013 by Seraphyx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anarties Posted December 21, 2013 Share Posted December 21, 2013 Putting a toxin into a machine and having it get destroyed means you lose the toxin in real life. Why should this be any different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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