Tr1ples1xer Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Yes and DE tried to avoid a outcry when they gave us LC's instead they have even more people crying HAHA, today i realised mostly young kids play Warframe and I'm getting old... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LazyKnight Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) I've been trying to avoid this whole controversy because, frankly, I've been absolutely disgusted by the sentiments expressed by my fellow veterans. I am for reducing grind and increasing the fun elements of the game, but why give so many core to people that only by luck had the mods in position ahead of time to take advantage of it? Personally, I would rather had DE unveiled these new cores in some type of event or alert, so it would have been an equal opportunity to acquire them. I have 4 L-cores and do not have any mods left that I want to max out. Also, I could careless if new player got better mods, because how this was handled inevitable gave the most mods to older player with stock piles, and to rich players buying in that 4-hour window. Edited February 21, 2014 by LazyKnight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryMouse13 Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 It has nothing to do whether it diminishes my enjoyment or not. Contrary to what you might think, players have the ability to think of things other than themselves. When I say it's a stupid @(*()$ move, I'm looking further than just "Oh, other players get stuff fast" I'm talking about how much it completely ruins any of the tiny amount of "Endgame" we had. Rare 10 mods were described by Steve on a livestream as "These mods are designed to take a very long time to level up. They aren't aimed at new players. They are aimed at those who have been here for a while" What does a Legendary Fusion core do? Oh, completely negates that quote. Look. Warframe has very little content. Prime Trading and Legendary Fusion cores gave players the ability to instantly bypass the majority of what Warframe has to offer. No matter what game you are playing, instant content bypasses are never a good thing, ever. They do nothing other than allow players to burnout quicker. I'm all for an option to accelerate the process (xp boosters, for example). But, allowing players to skip content is a horrible move and should never have happened. First, what you fail to take into account is that LCs are a finite resource, you use it and it's gone, there is no way to earn another. Anyone joining Warframe from this point on will have no way to obtain these, unless by some miracle the devs decide to hand them out again. Second, you apparently fail to take into account that someone still has to run the void in order to get the BPs needed, the reason you see so many cheap BPs being sold in chat right now is because people have built up massive stores of the things over the course of grinding for that last piece of whatever. Come the next Prime I think you'll quickly find that the asking prices will be much steeper, and push people to earn things the old fashioned way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruriko Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I realize that I am in the minority when it comes to this particular discussion, but I still feel the need to say something to those of you crying fowl. Let be begin by saying the most important thing: You're not wrong. You are acting on impulse fear that is based in logical reason. You saw what happened as being a giant slap in the face as it sent the player base into a scramble to profit from changes that occured in the last patch. You see the legendary core as the ultimate slap in the face, the penultimate cure-all to 'issue' of spending so much time and effort to actually achieve that max rank Redirection, Serration, or Vitality. They were your badge of honor, the symbol of your dedication. You feel as if it has been reduced to nothing for no reason. But this is where you are wrong. No matter what they did, if players out there were like I am (Having 1 of every mod at every rank for the sake of being highly flexible), they would have profited anyway and people would still cry foul. "Why do they get rewarded!? That's not fair!". That argument really means nothing at all. It's a whine. Yes, making the announcement ahead of time sent the player base into a bloodthirsty frenzy as everyone and their grandmother sought an opportunity to make the rest of their days easy and content. You're looking too short sighted. I look at the Legendary Fusion Core with a mixture of curiosity and fear. It isn't because of what they do (which is completely awesome and somewhat gamebreaking, but limited to a single use per core and currently extremely limited in number and therefore making it balanced). It is because what they represent. How many of you have actually giving pause to the fact that this is the first LEGENDARY mod? The very inclusion of this new status paves the way for a whole new tier of mods the likes of which we cannot presently fathom. We know how rare the rare mods are. This legendary tier goes beyond that. If this were MtG and followed a simple 3:1 ration from tier to tier, it would mean that you get 1 Legendary mod per 3 Rare (or 9 Uncommon or 27 Common), but it isn't. The chance of a Rare mod is fairly low, though not as Rare as to make you tear your hair out in a fit of rage because you didn't get it. We also know how powerful these mods can make us. Look beyond the fusion core and look at the big picture: Are you ok with this new Legendary Tier? Are you prepared for the frenzy it will bring forth as Legendary Mods become part of the game? Will you cry foul over that? I don't care if there are more Legendary Fusion Cores to come. They'll most likely be rewards given out (ultra rarely) during LiveStreams, as a possible rare/random Boss Rare Drop (Stalker/Harvester/Whatever the Grineer finally get), or by some divine circumstance of the RNG in game. No matter how these will become available, nothing will change. Players will continue to act as they do, seeking only to achieve maximum power with minimal effort. This was true before the patch, and it will remain true going forward. We are all testers in the game. If we don't like something, we can cry about til doomsday. Your actions are the only data that needs to be examined. If you don't like your Legendary Cores because of what they stand for, sell them from your inventory for credits (Pretty sure they're probably 2k-ish credits per core, unless DE was feeling generous). Don't sell them to other players and don't use them for yourself. Those of you that have them, if you can honestly tell me you don't want to use it, I'll be surprised. We are all human. We all crave the easiest path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminati07 Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 First, what you fail to take into account is that LCs are a finite resource, you use it and it's gone, there is no way to earn another. Anyone joining Warframe from this point on will have no way to obtain these, unless by some miracle the devs decide to hand them out again. Second, you apparently fail to take into account that someone still has to run the void in order to get the BPs needed, the reason you see so many cheap BPs being sold in chat right now is because people have built up massive stores of the things over the course of grinding for that last piece of whatever. Come the next Prime I think you'll quickly find that the asking prices will be much steeper, and push people to earn things the old fashioned way. You're right, they are a finite resource, and in the big picture, very few made it into the game. However, with each single Legendary Fusion Core, that is hundreds of hours of gametime gone. Literally. With dozens and dozens of players getting 20+ of these cores, it hurts more than you may think. In regards to your second point, I am taking that into account. However, there's one big thing. Even though some players will still be playing the Void to get parts, you have to think about how many players will not go there any more, and I am willing to bet that it's a LOT. Irregardless of whether players still need to go there, DE just lost a whole lot of gametime for players. DE should be thinking of ways to keep players here, not give them the opportunity to make 1-2 plat purchases and have everything in the game. Prime gear and maxed mods included. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl_Facehugger Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) It has nothing to do whether it diminishes my enjoyment or not. Contrary to what you might think, players have the ability to think of things other than themselves. Okay. I'll give you benefit of the doubt. When I say it's a stupid @(*()$ move, I'm looking further than just "Oh, other players get stuff fast" I'm talking about how much it completely ruins any of the tiny amount of "Endgame" we had. You're deluding yourself if you ever thought getting Serration 10 was a form of endgame. You're also deluding yourself if you ever thought the Void was a form of endgame. Rare 10 mods were described by Steve on a livestream as "These mods are designed to take a very long time to level up. They aren't aimed at new players. They are aimed at those who have been here for a while"What does a Legendary Fusion core do? Oh, completely negates that quote. ZOMG DE changes their mind on something. News at 11. Warframe has very little content. I don't really agree with that. Warframe has a huge breadth of content. It just has a fairly shallow depth of content. Hopefully that's something the three 'endgame' plans they've told us about will rectify, but I get the feeling you're defining content in a way that is, quite frankly, wrong. Like, serration 10's grind. That's not content. It's grind to make your pretty white numbers slightly larger pretty white numbers. Borderlands did much the same thing, but the difference is that they never claimed the higher numbers were content. Things like new quests and missions, that's content. Prime Trading and Legendary Fusion cores gave players the ability to instantly bypass the majority of what Warframe has to offer. I think you're being too histrionic here. No matter what game you are playing, instant content bypasses are never a good thing, ever. Except these aren't content bypasses. They're grind bypasses. Which are how F2P games make their money if they don't go the P2W route. Void towers have always been optional and bypassable, akin to side dungeons in more conventional RPGs. Fact is, most people are going to check out the void a bit just to see what it's like. Some people will spend time there whether it's because of the gorgeous architecture, the somewhat more challenging enemies, or the parkour obstacle courses and puzzles. What prime component trading does is mean you don't have to wear yourself out running void runs over and over again ad nauseum... Unless you want to. I mean, I rather like the orokin derelicts in terms of visual design. I like spending time there. They've got a real vibe of fallen majesty, and really make an awesome contrast with normal void towers. But after grinding for Burston Prime, I burned out and couldn't bring myself to go back for a long while because I was thoroughly sick of it due to repetition. What this does is let me bypass that repetition and prevent burn out for future prime grinding. And that is a fundamentally good thing in my view. They do nothing other than allow players to burnout quicker. How does "I don't have to run the same mission 12-200 times to get what I want" equal players burning out *more* quickly? I mean, what, is it entirely rooted in the idea that players play just to get the guns and not actually play with them? I can't agree with that. It's not why I play. I play to shoot things and zoom around a map at a pace that no other shooter that isn't Tribes quite equals. By that logic I'd have shelved my Burston Prime after getting it. But, allowing players to skip content is a horrible move and should never have happened. Better take all the frames and guns off the market then because they do exactly the same thing. You don't have to grind those neurodes and control modules when you can just buy a gun, and when grinding is the game... Welp. Fortunately, to some players, grinding isn't the game. Edited February 21, 2014 by Cpl_Facehugger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Letter13 Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I can agree with a lot of the things being said in the thread. I think the change (and especially the compensation) was really quite rushed... It would have been better if DE announced it a week in advance and said something along the lines of "We're thinking of compensating players in this fashion, what do you think?" and then change the compensation based on player feedback. I would also like to take a moment to remind everyone to please observe the Community Rules and Guidelines when posting. Let's avoid calling each other names, using unnecessary profanity and making personal attacks against other players or the developers so that this discussion may proceed in a civil fashion. tl;dr I think DE could have handled the situation a lot better, also please follow the forum rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapnFusterCluck Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 This will be known as the Great Depression of Warframe. So they unexpectedly crashed the market same thing or worse nearly happened IRL. Back in 2010 a single human or computer error caused the DOW to drop over 1000 points in an instant. But, but... America's economy now sucks #$^@*. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CapnFusterCluck Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) You're deluding yourself if you ever thought getting Serration 10 was a form of endgame. You're also deluding yourself if you ever thought the Void was a form of endgame. What's end-game for you? LOL. Running Pluto? I think Void is pretty challenging compared to all the other planets on the Star Map. Edited February 21, 2014 by ikillyou8196 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpl_Facehugger Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) What's end-game for you? LOL. Running Pluto? Finishing off my codex and getting everything to level 30. As far as shooty goes, I'd have to say Nuovo on Ceres solo. All dem napalms. Exhilarating. Though given how the corpus are getting pushed out of Pluto, maybe I'll move to Palus when the grineer take that node and set up their mass napalm spam there due to higher starting levels. I never said it was good endgame, mind. It's definitely something DE should fix. Fortunately, DE's working on that. I don't know how well the three systems they've told us about will work in practice, but at least they should provide something to actually do that isn't just leveling gear to 30 and shelving it like we've got now. I think Void is pretty challenging compared to all the other planets on the Star Map. Oh, yeah. Certainly. But I don't think just "most challenging" automatically qualifies something for endgame status. Edited February 21, 2014 by Cpl_Facehugger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skynin Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Burning butts, they are everywhere. With no reason, which is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlayn Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 First suddenly refunding everyone at the same time might be impossible... if you have been here long enough you would know the mass passing out of prizes takes a very long time... Putting in a mass code to reverse all that... good grief there is bugs they could be fixing over that issue... If WoW allowed trading of that magnitude I might actually consider paying for an account... Also they are not a free to play... so not really sure where your going with that. Also they have been in sync with me... A good majority of the ideas they released are nearly identical to my fan concepts... Which in my book whether I inspired it or not is still a plus on my end. Also you know they have plans to turn the game into a sim ninja game right? Also this is Open Beta EVERYTHING is subject to change... its a reality we all have to deal with. Even though the changes have been wonderful so far. Also I have already gotten used to the HUD... by ignoring it LOL... I just know when I am dying, or not now without seeing it. Oh well... I still think THIS is one of the best updates ever... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OkamiMilo Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Heres; https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/182094-steel-charge-update/ Thank you man.! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkenSnake Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I spend more than 1000 in game hours to maxed out all of the mod that exist and collect every prime parts. and suddenly BOOM . even 10hour player can get more than i have.. what a waste of time. im so freaking mad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlayn Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I spend more than 1000 in game hours to maxed out all of the mod that exist and collect every prime parts. and suddenly BOOM . even 10hour player can get more than i have.. what a waste of time. im so freaking mad 10hour is exaggerating... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihadanoffensiveusername Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 they basically killed the game. Now you have exploiters that got rich and you have poor people that didn't exploit. Now if this was Arenanet, massive ban waves even if it's there mistake, too bad this is a small market game, massive ban wave would mean 50% of the population gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkenSnake Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 10hour is exaggerating... yes i did exaggrate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X3Evanescence Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I am.... Surprised. I was completely unaware of this, as I have disappeared from Warframe from U10 until now. As a player who also went through all the hours and hours of rigorous grinding to get the stuff while being at the mercy of the RnG, I actually welcome some way to help alleviate the RnG problem, although Nugget_ makes a valid point that it allows one to bypass content. I feel that... Yes, this RnG grinding is content, but this is not the kind of content that DE wants, don't they? I think they are trying to move away from the RnG route, to some other form of content, possibly in preparation, to pave way for DE to implement a new form of end-game to keep our interest in this game. P.S. But bypassing and ranking a Rank0 mod to Rank 10? Without credit cost? Thats INSANE ._. (Disregard) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skynin Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I spend more than 1000 in game hours to maxed out all of the mod that exist and collect every prime parts. and suddenly BOOM . even 10hour player can get more than i have.. what a waste of time. im so freaking mad Such a win Much achievement Wow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlayde Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Why did DE suddenly decide to compensate only for the Steel Charge nerf? Where's my Legendary Forma for all the weapons DE nerfed? If you're telling me it's because they would've lost cores and credits then why did they just not refund back the cores/credits they lost? I'm still completely baffled by this. Could you imagine if another company like CCP gave out an item that maxed any skill to level 5 just for having a certain skill at lvl 2? That's basically what Legendary Cores are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MechaTails Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Are we playing the same game here? Because I don't see the world crashing down around my head like all these samey topics suggest. Granted, I haven't been here long, but I rarely see any topic worth reading more than 2 sentences into because I can already guess what the repetitive, sometimes hateful, and opinionated drivel is that comes after. I hope it hasn't always been this way, and I hope you folks at DE aren't taking suggestions from the forums too seriously. I'm disappointed to say that this place isn't fun to browse through. It always triggers a red light in my head when a game forum isn't fun. It's as depressing as walking through my city and seeing graffiti everywhere, on mailboxes, on burger wrappers, on baby strollers, it wears you down. Oh well. I'll just stick to the Fan Art section and making bad puns in Region Chat from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xveganrox Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I'm still completely baffled by this. Could you imagine if another company like CCP gave out an item that maxed any skill to level 5 just for having a certain skill at lvl 2? That's basically what Legendary Cores are. I think it would be more like maxing TWO skills for having one at level 2 :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gobo_McFly Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I do believe that it was pretty short sighted when they announced their intentions of regarding 2 Legendary cores for EACH Steel Charge mod. I also believe it was a mistake to make them and the mods they augment, tradable. If they had done the opposite of either, and made the reward one time per account and/or make the cores and their maxed offspring non-tradable, this problem would not be as compounded as it is now. They have the capabilities to do this as was evidenced by the changes to mods that were exploited a couple patches ago. Whether it will turn out ok or prove to be a major blunder is anyone's guess. Either way, they did remove countless hours of gameplay that can be bought using cash. I'm personally surprised they didn't see this kind of thing coming a mile away, based on one of the Dev's reactions. Then again maybe they counted on that for some short term monetary gain....who can say for sure, as we'll never know. On that note, I am not a conspiracy theorist by any means IRL. I'm just shocked that they didn't see the massive exploitation coming by saying that people would get 2 per CHARGE, not 2 per account as I was expecting. And on a side note, I only had 1 Steel Charge as did my mate at rank 6+, so we got the "proper" amount rewarded =p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
megaorange Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I spend more than 1000 in game hours to maxed out all of the mod that exist and collect every prime parts. and suddenly BOOM . even 10hour player can get more than i have.. what a waste of time. im so freaking mad So does this mean there is a steel charge alert every ten hours and they all were able to level it to level 6? So how many "newbs" do you guys think were able to get a steel charge? When was the last alert for one? And how many do you think bothered or were able to level it far enough? I think most of the people who where able to take advantage of this had already been playing for a good amount of time. So those of you complaining, would you feel better if you had one back in your early days? Would you have used it? Would you have cared? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrunkenSnake Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 (edited) dont get me wrong im not mad about giving out legendary core or prime part trade. eventally knew that prime parts are coming since the trade system started however,im mad about that DE announced and gave some people time to exploit. and 2 core per a steel charge is just insane. Edited February 21, 2014 by DrunkenSnake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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