Wow! The Dragon Nikana Is Really- ..weak?

[Ryden]

Not joking here, I'm hitting 4.8k non-critical hits on Grineer in Earth with a Dakra Prime, sitting at 384 slash dmg, using Crimson Dervish.

With my Dragon Nikana, using the same mods, clocking in at 578 slash dmg, I only hit 1-1.8k per strike on the same enemies in the same map.

 

I used channeled strikes on both tests. What I've come to understand is that Crimson Dervish increases the damage output of longswords by a substantial amount. I'm dealing more than twice the damage I do with Iron Pheonix, which hits for anywhere between 600-1200 slash per hit. The whopping 4k hits that are coming out of my Dakra Prime with Crimson Dervish really puts the Dragon Nikana to shame. So, what's left to be said for this Rank 8 "Master's Weapon"?

 

There's no way around it. Why is the Dakra Prime out-damaging this very demanding weapon? I don't see why Tranquil Cleave couldn't provide the damage boost that Crimson Dervish so generously boasts.

[ConejoDeLaMuerte]

I don't really care for the damage, what matters to me is that it's so f--king majestic :-D

Edited April 21, 2014 by ConejoDeLaMuerte

[Cemges]

You should be using it wrong because I get 20k crits and 5k regular hits on ceres.

Also I have 157 k finisher headshot crit on t3 heavy gunner.

Edited April 21, 2014 by Cemges

[Blatantfool]

 I haven't really been having a damage problem using the one I have. Hits hard enough to be lethal when I need it.

[VKhaun]

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/217252-buff-dragon-nikana-now-with-a-little-math-and-videos/

 

This guy did some interesting testing with weapons. I disagree with his original assertion that Dragon Nikana should automatically out DPS Dakra Prime hacking on one target with identical builds, I see them as entirely different weapons with different strengths and weaknesses, but I can find no fault in the way he goes about testing the DPS difference.

 

Apparently a combo in Crimson Dervish is really nasty, and translates to excellent DPS gains on top of Dakra's already impressive stats.

 

 

 

Single swords were promised a buff for months and months, it's only natural they got some good stances. 

 

Since it comes with a D polarity and higher base damage I suspect it's meant as more of a defensively slanted weapon than a DPS machine, and expect it to do significantly better with executions. I know some people have reported differences in blocking stamina costs between weapons, maybe it's cheap to block with?

 

Or they could toss out Nikana Prime tomorrow and have it blow away Dakra Prime and make me look like a fool. 

 

Who knows? :/

Edited April 21, 2014 by VKhaun

[Ryden]

I don't know what to say, guys. I mean, my whole mod setup is about maximizing my damage in a single hit. As I've mentioned, my slash damage is at 578. I'd say that's a rather high number. In the field, however, I'm not seeing this shine.

[Cemges]

That noob you talk about should go to hell for his build.

Max build: Pressure point, spoiled strike, jagged edge, corrupt charge, killing blow, fury, focus energy, one element, and tranquil cleave of course. Been using since the day it came out ( without stance at first) and even peoples choicegaming after so many builds , came to same conclusion.

And life strike is useless.. I mean, come on...

Edited April 21, 2014 by Cemges

[ZephyrPhantom]

What mods do you currently have on your Dragon Nikana?  EDIT : Slowpoke'd.

 

I've been having the same issue - constantly seeing people do 4-5k damage on normal swings and 10-15k on crits but I've only been having 1k normal damage and 4-5k dmg crits. (Then again, having wasted a slot for Reflex Coil to compensate for Rank 1 Life Strike's -70% channel efficiency might have something to do with that...)

Edited April 21, 2014 by ZephyrPhantom

[[DE]Momaw]

Why is the Dakra Prime out-damaging this very demanding weapon? (...) Crimson Dervish

 

You answered your own question.  Dakra Prime isn't a problem. Dragon Nikana isn't a problem.  The problem is that Crimon Dervish gives a 300% damage boost which is just unbelievably massive. This is like giving longswords another 3 or 4 slots worth of damage mods.  How is the Dragon Nikana, which plays fair, supposed to compete with that?

[Kharn-The-Betrayer]

The dragon nikana is better than the dakra prime, on all the points, this thread should be deleted

[Blatantfool]

The dragon nikana is better than the dakra prime, on all the points, this thread should be deleted

 

 Incorrect. Dakra can copter. Dragkana can't.

[Cemges]

You answered your own question. Dakra Prime isn't a problem. Dragon Nikana isn't a problem. The problem is that Crimon Dervish gives a 300% damage boost which is just unbelievably massive. This is like giving longswords another 3 or 4 slots worth of damage mods. How is the Dragon Nikana, which plays fair, supposed to compete with that?

He isnt capable of using d nikana, thats a problem. But if this is true, i will have to test dakra p with my max build and see whats going on. Theoretically dakra should go 10 k regular hits. I will test and post, however sounds unlikely.

Edited April 21, 2014 by Cemges

[faustias]

OP, Nikana is on-demand just because of its cool-factor.

 

That's why people have been flooding the Whining-Tears dam when they crash, disconnects or have their data unsaved after getting Tranquil Cleave. It's the cool factor of the katana.

 

 

...but, you know. There are people here giving better infos.

Edited April 21, 2014 by faustias

[Kharn-The-Betrayer]

 Incorrect. Dakra can copter. Dragkana can't.

My bad, you're right =)

[VKhaun]

That noob you talk about should go to hell for his build.

Max build: Pressure point, spoiled strike, jagged edge, corrupt charge, killing blow, fury, focus energy, one element, and tranquil cleave of course. Been using since the day it came out ( without stance at first) and even peoples choicegaming after so many builds , came to same conclusion.

 

That's because the player base is used to a low skill cap and they're mostly still just holding down the channel button the whole time. You can stack a lot more damage and screw efficiency if you only channel the OP hits and finishers/executions. Not that we need max damage builds. I run mine with Parry and Finishing Touch and no elements just so it looks clean, and I still cleave through whatever I need to, haha.

 

Jagged Edge doesn't make sense in your context though.

What are you attacking that you want that on your weapon for a max damage build?

Edited April 21, 2014 by VKhaun

[Ryden]

I've incorporated elemental damage to my build, which really made a difference in its strength. I've landed a 36k crit on a headshot, and average on 19k crits in general. Though this is a much better result in comparison to my old build, the dakra prime still has the edge on damage with Crimson Dervish.

 

But now we have Decisive Judgment.

 

Where both Tranquil Cleave and Crimson Dervish suffer (agility and range), Decisive Judgment delivers. And now that the effectiveness of having a stance worth using, I feel like the Nikanas now have worth.

Edited April 27, 2014 by Ryden

[Cemges]

That's because the player base is used to a low skill cap and they're mostly still just holding down the channel button the whole time. You can stack a lot more damage and screw efficiency if you only channel the OP hits and finishers/executions.

Jagged Edge doesn't make sense in your context though.

What are you attacking that you want that on your weapon for a max damage build?[/quote

Mostly infested. For grineer jagged edge can be swapped for another elemental. Slash still works fine for corpus or you can use toxin too

Edited April 21, 2014 by Cemges

[Guest]

maybe because the dakra prime attacks primarily vertically and more single target oriented

 

while the nikana can hit multiple targets in a wider arc?

 

tell me im wrong because i've yet to use a longsword with the new update

Edited April 21, 2014 by Guest

[Ryden]

maybe because the dakra prime attacks primarily vertically and more single target oriented

 

while the nikana can hit multiple targets in a wider arc?

 

tell me im wrong because i've yet to use a longsword with the new update

Crimson Dervish uses wide strikes with 360 degree combo finishers.

[H.Katsura_999]

maybe because the dakra prime attacks primarily vertically and more single target oriented

 

while the nikana can hit multiple targets in a wider arc?

 

tell me im wrong because i've yet to use a longsword with the new update

No, you're correct. dakra prime scores head shots while nikana has a wider arc and can damage multiple enemies making it a good infested weapon. 

 

have you tried an elemental build for your Nikana? I mostly run with elementals and pressure point and in terms of high level game my dakra can only dream of matching my dragon nikana in terms of speed and damage.

[Kharn-The-Betrayer]

For grineer: 

 

 

 

 

 

For corpus: 

 

 

 

 

And for infested: 

 

[Ryden]

No, you're correct. dakra prime scores head shots while nikana has a wider arc and can damage multiple enemies making it a good infested weapon. 

 

have you tried an elemental build for your Nikana? I mostly run with elementals and pressure point and in terms of high level game my dakra can only dream of matching my dragon nikana in terms of speed and damage.

No, you're correct. dakra prime scores head shots while nikana has a wider arc and can damage multiple enemies making it a good infested weapon. 

 

have you tried an elemental build for your Nikana? I mostly run with elementals and pressure point and in terms of high level game my dakra can only dream of matching my dragon nikana in terms of speed and damage.

From what I understand, you're not using Crimson Dervish on your dakra prime. If this is true, everything you've said is invalid.

[zebar1313]

 Incorrect. Dakra can copter. Dragkana can't.

in this regard, i don't bother with the copter anymore... rhino prime duration/power build... rhino charge, skin, and roar all day. I run tower captures faster than my friend using his speed built loki with his 3 best copter weapons, dakra/prova/zorens... 

But if i were to copter.... well... just use dakra with a valkyr.... warcry then zoom zoom zoom 

[NoGONinja]

I thought it was confirmed that stances have hidden multipliers and crimson dirvish has a particularly strong one in comparison to Tranquil cleave

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/217252-buff-dragon-nikana-now-with-a-little-math-and-videos/

[zebar1313]

That noob you talk about should go to hell for his build.

And life strike is useless.. I mean, come on...

Not exactly, use it on my valkyr immortal build, Use rage/equilibrium/life strike

I managed to get to 71 minutes against grineer just using melee solo. 

Lots of time on my hands? yes. Using a useless mod on a melee frame, no