DoomFruit Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) As I said, still a work in progress, they discussed how once again they've shot themselves in the foot for the T4 errors and are obviously working to address them as you've seen in the recent stream. They acknowledge the S#&$. But the tables themselves are not half bad. I can see why there'd be frustration from a rare 5 pack of five, but DE still wants it to where prime parts still have value, aka, not every time five minuets rolls around you get a Prime. T1 and the like are addressed accordingly as the rewards scale as the targeted audience is newbs. It's like reading a kids book and expecting a Tom Clancy cliffhanger. Newbs will need those O cells. I can get orokin cells much easier on Saturn. And if they were working to address it, they would have taken out every duplicate and evened out the probability distribution for item drops. Why is the boar prime receiver 10 times as likely to appear as the bronco prime blueprint? I could fix this in 30 minutes. EDIT: and you wouldn't end up getting a prime item every 5 minutes. You still need a crapton of orokin cells to build primes (which you find elsewhere) and even with equal item drop chances, it's not a fixed rotation through the drop list and you're still going to have to do the mission several times. No, this is deliberate. Go read up on some history, back when Forma was given a 0.67% drop chance: http://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/1mrr5j/1007_datamined_reward_tables/ and DE's response: http://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/1o3jzr/1030_rewarddrop_tables_where_are_they/ Edited June 21, 2014 by DoomFruit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeduSalem Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) People are actually telling others to stay away from Warframe.. how sad is that? Actually that's what I'm telling most of my friends/people already. A year ago I would have tried to convince them to give Warframe a shot, but now I'm telling them to stay away from it because at this point Warframe has no appeal other than grind for massively unbalanced bugs. (3 words that pretty much sum up Warframe's current state). :s As much fun as I have with Warframe now and then the only thing that really keeps me going the distance is probably because I've dumped an *ssload of money into DE in the hopes that Warframe might become one of the best games in the Sci-Fi-Genre (At least it had the potential back then). But since Damage 2.0 the game fails to impress me to be honest, even I've had fun with the events the past months. Probably it's because I almost own everything already and I'm burned out and all that's left is seeing the same problems over and over not being addressed in a satisfactory manner. Edited June 21, 2014 by MeduSalem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXultra Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Put in useful QQ reports and quality suggestions. That's just the point. I joined in U6 or 7. I and many others used to contribute great ideas here on the forums. But when you spend an hour or two doing a well thought out write up, giving brilliant suggestions for fixes and additions (all for free I might add), and then it goes nowhere... well, it's a little disheartening. When you see other people write up similar ideas months later, see a majority of the community agree with those suggestions, and see it still go nowhere... you gotta wonder what the point is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Count_Dante Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 So why do you care so much? It's clear you support every decision DE has made, but to mindlessly defend a company like it's your momma... are they slipping you plat under the table? un1337ninj4, it's an ongoing thing. This business model made DE antagonize the players. Whatever the new content is, they have to put it behind an exremely repetitive and annoying process. The idea is to get enough people to just cave in and buy it. I'm arguing that it doesn't have to be that way. And we can all hold hands and sing Kum-Bah-Ya while all companies cater to your individual whims and incredible business savvy. Your post, is chalked full with nothing but disdain, misunderstanding, and whine. Are we to look at it as enlightened? If you dont like the company and dont like the game, DONT GIVE THEM MONEY. If you feel you are being ignored, DONT GIVE THEM MONEY. It is just that simple. I ask again, what is your purpose? What are you attempting to accomplish with your original post? What post from a [DE]Handle is going to appease you? I will answer for you, there is none. It is simply you wanting to *@##$ and moan. And you have done so. So your purpose is fulfilled? Can we get that lock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Un1337ninj4 Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Iteration is crucial to development of a game. The f2p early development of Warframe compromises this by pushing the need for new content to keep the game fresh for players. If all we got was month after month of tweaks, players would revolt. In the scheme of things, DE has done a good job of balancing the need to push both of these requirements, while having beta product be criticized brutally. As a paying player you do have a right to have your word, but try it as a partner. Put in useful QQ reports and quality suggestions. ^ This I can get orokin cells much easier on Saturn. And if they were working to address it, they would have taken out every duplicate and evened out the probability distribution for item drops. Why is the boar prime receiver 10 times as likely to appear as the bronco prime blueprint? I could fix this in 30 minutes. EDIT: and you wouldn't end up getting a prime item every 5 minutes. You still need a crapton of orokin cells to build primes (which you find elsewhere) and even with equal item drop chances, it's not a fixed rotation through the drop list and you're still going to have to do the mission several times. No, this is deliberate. Go read up on some history, back when Forma was given a 0.67% drop chance: http://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/1mrr5j/1007_datamined_reward_tables/ and DE's response: http://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/1o3jzr/1030_rewarddrop_tables_where_are_they/ I know my history. None the less I also realize... It's history, every time they release something I wait a bit to partake because there's ALWAYS something up with it, we all know this. You've seen the devstream, let us await what Sheldon has planned for unneeded P parts before we speculate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)MoRockaPDX Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) That's just the point. I joined in U6 or 7. I and many others used to contribute great ideas here on the forums. But when you spend an hour or two doing a well thought out write up, giving brilliant suggestions for fixes and additions (all for free I might add), and then it goes nowhere... well, it's a little disheartening. When you see other people write up similar ideas months later, see a majority of the community agree with those suggestions, and see it still go nowhere... you gotta wonder what the point is. Thats fine. Now like a good producer, put your time and energy elsewhere and let the devs do there work. Want a bigger say find a project where you can have a bigger stake. Play something else or go outside. Come back every few weeks and have some fun, and rinse and repeat. Issue have and do get addressed. Just not always in the order or rate everyone would like. Or don't, just convince yourself that this is unjustifiable and go nuts, its your party. Another point. EVE Online just went from a 12 or 6 month update cycle to a quarterly one, and that I am pretty sure would drive this community crazy. [DE]Sheldon mentioned that they could operate with release dates and just sit on updates, but they don't, they give you them asap, and hot fix, and patch. Edited June 21, 2014 by (PS4)MoRockaPDX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXultra Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Your post, is chalked full with nothing but disdain, misunderstanding, and whine. Are we to look at it as enlightened? My post is full of disdain, I can admit that. Where is the misunderstanding? Where is the whine? Do you see my crying about Loki Prime parts? I haven't asked for anything. You've got no argument, you're just repeating the fanboy dismissal "whining, entitlement". To any moderator that reads this, I'll ask that you not lock this because it is legitimate criticism and that Count_Dante's posts be deleted as he is the one that is contributing nothing to the conversation negativity and disrespect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomFruit Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 I know my history. None the less I also realize... It's history, every time they release something I wait a bit to partake because there's ALWAYS something up with it, we all know this. You've seen the devstream, let us await what Sheldon has planned for unneeded P parts before we speculate. Knowing him, it'll most likely be transmutation costing 4 parts for a re-roll on the same horribly skewed drop tables. Or maybe they'll decay like those stupid argon crystals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Un1337ninj4 Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 My post is full of disdain, I can admit that. Where is the misunderstanding? Where is the whine? Do you see my crying about Loki Prime parts? I haven't asked for anything. You've got no argument, you're just repeating the fanboy dismissal "whining, entitlement". To any moderator that reads this, I'll ask that you not lock this because it is legitimate criticism and that Count_Dante's posts be deleted as he is the one that is contributing nothing to the conversation negativity and disrespect. I can agree to that. I feel we need to lighten this place up a bit, I love this community so I shall not bear such a heavy weight on my shoulders in place of a calm (though with all due intensity), morning tea. Don't watch the vid, just listen to the tunes ^-^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Un1337ninj4 Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Knowing him, it'll most likely be transmutation costing 4 parts for a re-roll on the same horribly skewed drop tables. Or maybe they'll decay like those stupid argon crystals. You just copy, pasted that, as I said, before speculation. There have been various things implemented by Sheldon that start out terrible that he continues work to improve instead of being OP and disappointing everyone with a nerf he goes backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Count_Dante Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 My post is full of disdain, I can admit that. Where is the misunderstanding? Where is the whine? Do you see my crying about Loki Prime parts? I haven't asked for anything. You've got no argument, you're just repeating the fanboy dismissal "whining, entitlement". To any moderator that reads this, I'll ask that you not lock this because it is legitimate criticism and that Count_Dante's posts be deleted as he is the one that is contributing nothing to the conversation negativity and disrespect. Then again I ask, what are you attempting to accomplish? Thus far, all you have done is come across as someone who is whining that this game or company is not going in a direction that YOU want them to? Perhaps YOU dont know anything about running or working for a gaming company. Perhaps YOU are speaking of a place of ignorance. Or is it just that you didnt get invited onto Scott's yacht? There is not one ounce of legitimate criticism in your post, no matter how self-righteous in a land of video game posts that you feel to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXultra Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) The reason I wrote this up and the reason I put up with kids like Dante is because I do like this game and want it to get better. Edit: "It's OK, you're new, you probably think DE is the coolest developer ever. But if you still like them in 2 months, it will be because they listened to players like me." Edited June 21, 2014 by MXultra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Un1337ninj4 Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 (edited) what are you attempting to accomplish? "un1337ninj4, it's an ongoing thing. This business model made DE antagonize the players. Whatever the new content is, they have to put it behind an exremely repetitive and annoying process. The idea is to get enough people to just cave in and buy it. I'm arguing that it doesn't have to be that way." (MXultra) I (along with others), enjoy the grind. I understand it can be repetitive, but I find it worth it on most accounts. The "Pay for Convenience" is better than "Pay to Win". They've ceased with Argon requiring bp's and are likely to only use it on powerful weapons a la Dragon Nikana/Angstrum in the future. I also understand it's easy to get bummed, at around the 1500 hour mark I felt I wasn't to return, took a few months off and here I am. I only regret not buying some Founder goodness :P I did miss out on a couple of events in that time too. Edited June 21, 2014 by un1337ninj4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Count_Dante Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 The reason I wrote this up and the reason I put up with kids like Dante is because I do like this game and want it to get better. Edit: "It's OK, you're new, you probably think DE is the coolest developer ever. But if you still like them in 2 months, it will be because they listened to players like me." HAHAHAH Riiiiight, that is EXACTLY why you wrote it up... for the good of the game. Your sacrifice and insights are a marvel to behold. I stand in awe of your reflection and introspection. Is this the attention you seek? Because if they just listen to YOU they will be successful! Oh wait... I think they have been around prior to you! NO! They cant be!! I will take that Warning Post and Lock now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoomFruit Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 You just copy, pasted that, as I said, before speculation. There have been various things implemented by Sheldon that start out terrible that he continues work to improve instead of being OP and disappointing everyone with a nerf he goes backwards. He doesn't have much of a good track record when it comes to non-frustrating drop tables. Please excuse me if I don't immediately forget all past history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosyPigeon Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Agree with op. i thought the whole point of crowd funding was so that the developers can actually make decisions that benefit the game without publishers ruining it for the sake of profit, I am disgusted to discover that as developers, DE are WORSE than PUBLISHERS when it comes to balancing game play against profitability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXultra Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 HAHAHAH Riiiiight, that is EXACTLY why you wrote it up... for the good of the game. Your sacrifice and insights are a marvel to behold. I stand in awe of your reflection and introspection. Is this the attention you seek? Because if they just listen to YOU they will be successful! Oh wait... I think they have been around prior to you! NO! They cant be!! I will take that Warning Post and Lock now. Yes, that is why I wrote it up. Believe me, your constant adoration is merely a side perk. Many players are complaining about certain aspects of the game. You may not be bothered by these things, but that does not make them invalid complaints, it means you just have low standards. I've made specific suggestions, I've made general suggestions. Check these points and explain how they are invalid. https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/245463-de-listened/ EXPLAIN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Count_Dante Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Yes, that is why I wrote it up. Believe me, your constant adoration is merely a side perk. Many players are complaining about certain aspects of the game. You may not be bothered by these things, but that does not make them invalid complaints, it means you just have low standards. I've made specific suggestions, I've made general suggestions. Check these points and explain how they are invalid. https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/245463-de-listened/ EXPLAIN Make no mistake my adoration is sincere and never-ending. No, not gonna read another pointless drivel ranting about how you care too much about a video game. But I will watch THIS thread go... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeduSalem Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Make no mistake my adoration is sincere and never-ending. No, not gonna read another pointless drivel ranting about how you care too much about a video game. But I will watch THIS thread go... Wow... Trolling and Whiteknighting at the same time. Haven't seen that in a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeoffFromAccounting Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Make no mistake my adoration is sincere and never-ending. No, not gonna read another pointless drivel ranting about how you care too much about a video game. But I will watch THIS thread go... I agree with MeduSalem, now I'm busy getting the popcorn because I have a feeling I'm going to laugh at this conversation. on a more serious note, I'm inclined to agree. As much as I like DE they just fail at certain essential gameplay aspects such as balancing and making content that's not locked behind a RNG driven grind wall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXultra Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 The devs do not need to be protected from the players. The players that offer criticism need to be protected from fanboys. Harsh criticism can be respectful and valid, and if it is those things (which mine is) then it should be permitted. If the moderators lock/delete this post, they'll have helped Count_Dante hurt the conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Count_Dante Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Protected? From what? You realize this is anonymous, yeah? Count_Dante isnt my real name nor do you need protection from me. Such a drama queen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SIDESTRE4M Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 The moderators aren't here to judge your opinions but the form of discussion. I'm not one of the earliest players, but I'm long arround enough to see enough changes that changed the game for the better and hopefully set the foundation for greater things in the future. Step by step. Warframe is somewhat unpolished and still has flaws, but it depends on the individual how much weight these flaws have. Of course it is also a business. No Surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeoffFromAccounting Posted June 21, 2014 Share Posted June 21, 2014 Protected? From what? You realize this is anonymous, yeah? Count_Dante isnt my real name nor do you need protection from me. Such a drama queen... DE doesn't need protection from white knights like yourself, that's what he's saying unless you're so blind to other opinions you miss simple sentences Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MXultra Posted June 21, 2014 Author Share Posted June 21, 2014 Protected? From what? You realize this is anonymous, yeah? Count_Dante isnt my real name nor do you need protection from me. Such a drama queen... Of course I don't physically fear you. But you do realize you are relentlessly trolling? You have no argument. No point. No purpose beyond trying to get me to stoop to your level of maturity to get the thread closed. If you could put the ego on pause, you'd realize that several people have been able to agree and disagree respectfully and that we might actually be able to have a conversation without you interjecting "WHINING, ENTITLEMENT, LOCK THREAD!!" every few posts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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