What Would You Like To See Buffed / Nerfed?

[weirdee]

those mods are a leftover from the early days where progression was tied to exp, so they're a replacement for overall strength like the other mods that everybody uses

 

either we keep those, or we say goodbye to just having things governed by mods entirely and move all of this over to the....was it called prestige or something? the other system they're planning to implement where exp past max equipment rank is used to gain more benefits

 

ofc, this introduces further complications in the already convoluted dark sectors pvp

Edited September 2, 2014 by weirdee

[BrazilianJoe]

Buff: 

 

Glaxion (read feedback at the forum)

Lex Prime (to current Marelok dmg level)

Glaive Prime (damage, status)

Torid (radius, duration)

 

 

Nerf:

 

Marelok (to current Lex dmg level, reduce accuracy)

[fatpig84]

Honestly, this is a good point that a lot of people don't want to address.

 

+damage and multishot mods are bad design.  Serration/split chamber are auto-included on literally every rifle build, no matter the weapon style.  It is poor design to have these kinds of auto-include "customization" options.

 

They should really get rid of those types of mods altogether.  We'll see more variety in builds that way.

 

And DE better start paying 250 plat for base damage mods

Because I know of a lot of idiots who paid for theirs.

 

 

Thankfully I maxed Serration and Hornet Strike LONG before it was tradable.

[Arabaxus]

If we are to remove things like Hornet and Serration, the only thing that would change is that we now have literally no weapon progression besides leveling for mod points, which everyone knows can be done within an hour or two. 

 

Welcome to free-to-play model. Grind has to be somewhere, or you can pay to skip grind. In this case, you either grind for fusion cores to max rank Serration/Hornet, or you buy cores or ranked mods with platinum from other players. Simple as that. 

 

I can't understand why people don't want any form of progression in this game. Every time there is a new event or something, the level of enemies never get higher. The problem with this game is everyone wants access to everything at an outrageously short period of time. Meanwhile, without new enemies, new weapons cannot be better than anything already released because there will be whiners of power-creep, which are always louder and more obnoxious than the people suggesting buffs to things. Overzealous nerfing is the next thing that happens, which has been proven again and again, especially recently.

 

You play almost any other MMO, Diablo and WoW, as some of the most prominent and successful (as a business) all have expansions later on that increase the level cap, thus introducing new, stronger weapons, and alongside them, new, stronger enemies. Warframe has hit a stagnant point with weapons and enemies, but the standing issue is weapons hit that point later than the enemies, so there are even pre-existing weapons that seem overpowered.

 

Of course, if you want to further invalidate "low" tier weapons, you can remove Serration/Hornet Strike and such. We have the luxury to be able to pull shenanigans like completing Pluto Ext. with MK 1 weapons, but even so you would have to be well on your way to being a veteran, considering your access to a diverse catalog of ranked up mods, or have paid for the mods with platinum, which fits again perfectly to the free to play business model. We could tie progression to specific weapons and make it so that at higher levels all you see are the "best" weapons with the best stats, but frankly I'm starting to believe if we did that, and introduced stronger enemies, it could quell the incessant whining that is caused by this minority.

[Jahadaya]

If we are to remove things like Hornet and Serration, the only thing that would change is that we now have literally no weapon progression besides leveling for mod points, which everyone knows can be done within an hour or two. 

 

Welcome to free-to-play model. Grind has to be somewhere, or you can pay to skip grind. In this case, you either grind for fusion cores to max rank Serration/Hornet, or you buy cores or ranked mods with platinum from other players. Simple as that. 

 

I can't understand why people don't want any form of progression in this game. Every time there is a new event or something, the level of enemies never get higher. The problem with this game is everyone wants access to everything at an outrageously short period of time. Meanwhile, without new enemies, new weapons cannot be better than anything already released because there will be whiners of power-creep, which are always louder and more obnoxious than the people suggesting buffs to things. Overzealous nerfing is the next thing that happens, which has been proven again and again, especially recently.

 

You play almost any other MMO, Diablo and WoW, as some of the most prominent and successful (as a business) all have expansions later on that increase the level cap, thus introducing new, stronger weapons, and alongside them, new, stronger enemies. Warframe has hit a stagnant point with weapons and enemies, but the standing issue is weapons hit that point later than the enemies, so there are even pre-existing weapons that seem overpowered.

 

Of course, if you want to further invalidate "low" tier weapons, you can remove Serration/Hornet Strike and such. We have the luxury to be able to pull shenanigans like completing Pluto Ext. with MK 1 weapons, but even so you would have to be well on your way to being a veteran, considering your access to a diverse catalog of ranked up mods, or have paid for the mods with platinum, which fits again perfectly to the free to play business model. We could tie progression to specific weapons and make it so that at higher levels all you see are the "best" weapons with the best stats, but frankly I'm starting to believe if we did that, and introduced stronger enemies, it could quell the incessant whining that is caused by this minority.

It's just that the mod system is so game-breaking (which, don't get me wrong, is an absolutely amazing and unique thing that DE has done), that it's nearly impossible to scale enemies properly. That's the reason our frames and our weapons drastically outpower enemies as we progress.

 

The only way to fix this would be to buff all mods to the god tier level that Redirection and Serration are at and then buff enemies accordingly, or to nerf all the amazing essential mods and then nerf enemies according to that. One way, it's large power scaling, and the other way, it's a small amount of power scaling.

 

It's so much easier for other games to scale + balance properly because they don't have a modding system that can quadruple the power of 1 weapon with 1 click. 

[Thrax119]

Very few weapons need to be nerfed at this point in the game. Yes, I understand that Boltor Prime on earth is going to be a bit overpowered, but does than mean it needs a nerf? No.  Instead of crying for nerfs or buffs people need to level weapons and mod them to maximum capacity, then see how high into the star chart/void/direlect you can take them. Use judgement where due so that you are taking slightly less insane weapons on low level missions and taking that lovely Boltor Prime of yours to high level void missions. After all, some of us enjoy running void survival missions past 20 minutes. And at this point, the only weapons viable after 20 minutes in a t3-4 survival are the synapse, paris prime, and boltor prime. Stop acting like mindless watermelons and begging for nerfs when you haven't even used said weapon to its fullest potential.

 

Please.

 

like seriously.

[Jahadaya]

 the only weapons viable after 20 minutes in a t3-4 survival are the synapse, paris prime, and boltor prime. 

And alot of other weapons. Soma, no?

[Snydrex]

I just posted in another thread that the lex prime needs a damage buff. It's outclassed by the marelock by a longrun.

[Sasquatchias]

Heavy Weapons need higher base damage, and it feels like they aren't hitting nearly as far as they should.

 

Silva and Aegis needs to encourage people to make use of the shield, right now the shield (Aegis) is simply in-effective, and arguably worse to use than swords or daggers for blocking.

 

Soma, Brakk, Boltor Prime, and all the other "OMG OP please Nerf" weapons do deserve to be brought down to most other weapon's levels.

 

Kronen could do with a small range increase.

 

Any weapons that use the Machete stance and animations could stand to have better quick attack animation(s), right now you just do a quick awkward swing through the air.

[Arabaxus]

Heavy Weapons need higher base damage, and it feels like they aren't hitting nearly as far as they should.

 

Silva and Aegis needs to encourage people to make use of the shield, right now the shield (Aegis) is simply in-effective, and arguably worse to use than swords or daggers for blocking.

 

Soma, Brakk, Boltor Prime, and all the other "OMG OP please Nerf" weapons do deserve to be brought down to most other weapon's levels.

 

Kronen could do with a small range increase.

 

Any weapons that use the Machete stance and animations could stand to have better quick attack animation(s), right now you just do a quick awkward swing through the air.

 

 

No on the bold. Brakk/Boltor Prime are rare for a reason. Soma doesn't compare to Boltor/Latron/Paris Prime/Brakk power levels due to it being a shop weapon, and it is perfect as it is because it provides a method for players that don't want to farm for Prime weapons to have a viable, all-around, decently powerful weapon.

[Jahadaya]

No on the bold. Brakk/Boltor Prime are rare for a reason. Soma doesn't compare to Boltor/Latron/Paris Prime/Brakk power levels due to it being a shop weapon, and it is perfect as it is because it provides a method for players that don't want to farm for Prime weapons to have a viable, all-around, decently powerful weapon.

Yeah lol I accidentally +1's his when reading the first part, but I agree with you.

 

 

But then I accidentally +1'd you b4 reading that Soma diss >:3

[Sasquatchias]

No on the bold. Brakk/Boltor Prime are rare for a reason. Soma doesn't compare to Boltor/Latron/Paris Prime/Brakk power levels due to it being a shop weapon, and it is perfect as it is because it provides a method for players that don't want to farm for Prime weapons to have a viable, all-around, decently powerful weapon.

 

We'll agree to disagree then. 

 

Personally I just feel even given the rarity/acquisition methods the Brakk and Boltor Prime are too powerful. (I'll admit I'm a bit iffy on Soma itself.)

Edited September 15, 2014 by Sasquatch180

[Arabaxus]

We'll agree to disagree then. 

 

Personally I just feel even given the rarity/acquisition methods the Brakk and Boltor Prime are too powerful. (I'll admit I'm a bit iffy on Soma itself.)

 

It's fine if we have different opinions. What irks me is, and you are not the only one that does this, people claim the Boltor Prime to be overpowered but consider Latron Prime and Paris Prime, relative to Boltor Prime, to be completely balanced when they have greater damage potential and other perks. The way I see it, Boltor Prime is equal to the other two, but is simply the user-friendly fully automatic "end-game" weapon, with the other two as precision alternatives.

 

 

Yeah lol I accidentally +1's his when reading the first part, but I agree with you.

 

 

But then I accidentally +1'd you b4 reading that Soma diss >:3

 

I'm not trying to diss the Soma, it is a fantastic weapon. But simply in terms of damage output and versatility, Boltor Prime is simply statistically superior, due to its nature of not requiring the critical mods, allowing greater build flexibility, greater damage per bullet, which involves better ammunition economy, and simply greater on-paper theoretical DPS.

Edited September 15, 2014 by Arabaxus

[Sasquatchias]

It's fine if we have different opinions. What irks me is, and you are not the only one that does this, people claim the Boltor Prime to be overpowered but consider Latron Prime and Paris Prime, relative to Boltor Prime, to be completely balanced when they have greater damage potential and other perks. The way I see it, Boltor Prime is equal to the other two, but is simply the user-friendly fully automatic "end-game" weapon, with the other two as precision alternatives.

 

I never once claimed I thought those were balanced. Really I don't have too much of an opinion on most Prime weapons, never really cared for them or really ran into people using them.

 

The only Prime I've ever had an issue with is Boltor Prime, mainly because I see people come into the "regular" content (non-Void stuff or the scaling shenanigans that happen in Defense or Survival) with this gun and see them decimate everything (I've even done so myself.) 

 

(And this is with them either having mods that are appropriate for the mission's scaling or are a tad too low for it.)

[Arabaxus]

I never once claimed I thought those were balanced. Really I don't have too much of an opinion on most Prime weapons, never really cared for them or really ran into people using them.

 

The only Prime I've ever had an issue with is Boltor Prime, mainly because I see people come into the "regular" content (non-Void stuff or the scaling shenanigans that happen in Defense or Survival) with this gun and see them decimate everything (I've even done so myself.) 

 

(And this is with them either having mods that are appropriate for the mission's scaling or are a tad too low for it.)

 

I just mean how the only complaints that ever arise are about Boltor Prime, and never the other two, even though they are just as powerful. I guess its easier to the power difference of Boltor Prime in low levels because all three overkill, but Boltor fires the most bolts and thus hits the most enemies at once.

[BrazilianJoe]

Nerf Marelok's accuracy.

Buff Lex Prime crit chance/damage.

[vleessjuu]

Personally, I think that in a game like WF nerfing is only needed when it makes the game more interesting. Trinity's invulnerability blessing is a good example: invulnerability simply isn't interesting. Invulnerability is boring, especially if you can have it constantly. It takes all of the excitement out of the game. Other than that I'd say: let powerful weapons and frames remain powerful. Needless nerfing just &!$$es people off and only makes a few people happy. If you want people to use other weapons, then make those weapons viable. It's much more fun to try a new gun after it has been buffed than it is to throw away your old one because it has been nerfed.

What I'd like to see buffed, are some of the currently useless mods. There are so many mods that are simply beyond situational while some others are so powerful you can hardly do without. Take Fast Hands and Magazine Warp, for example. These mods are already sorta weak because raw damage will pretty much always be better than faster reload or a larger clip size. Clipsize and reload only affect sustained DPS, damage affects burst DPS, sustained DPS AND ammo economy. Taking that into account, you'd expect reload/clip size mods to give relatively large bonuses to compensate for their innate weaknesses. But guess what: Serration gives +15% damage/rank while Fast Hands and Magazine warp give +5%/rank. There's just no contest here.

These kind of imbalances just narrow down builds so much. When would you ever consider giving up a serration mod to make room for a bigger clip? Only when you use a weapon purely for status procs and then it's still iffy.

[Sasquatchias]

Personally, I think that in a game like WF nerfing is only needed when it makes the game more interesting. Trinity's invulnerability blessing is a good example: invulnerability simply isn't interesting. Invulnerability is boring, especially if you can have it constantly. It takes all of the excitement out of the game. Other than that I'd say: let powerful weapons and frames remain powerful. Needless nerfing just &!$$es people off and only makes a few people happy. If you want people to use other weapons, then make those weapons viable. It's much more fun to try a new gun after it has been buffed than it is to throw away your old one because it has been nerfed.

What I'd like to see buffed, are some of the currently useless mods. There are so many mods that are simply beyond situational while some others are so powerful you can hardly do without. Take Fast Hands and Magazine Warp, for example. These mods are already sorta weak because raw damage will pretty much always be better than faster reload or a larger clip size. Clipsize and reload only affect sustained DPS, damage affects burst DPS, sustained DPS AND ammo economy. Taking that into account, you'd expect reload/clip size mods to give relatively large bonuses to compensate for their innate weaknesses. But guess what: Serration gives +15% damage/rank while Fast Hands and Magazine warp give +5%/rank. There's just no contest here.

These kind of imbalances just narrow down builds so much. When would you ever consider giving up a serration mod to make room for a bigger clip? Only when you use a weapon purely for status procs and then it's still iffy.

 

On the issue of Mods I don't think the Utility Mods being too weak is the problem - its the damage mods being far too strong. If there were more penalties introduced for building only damage, or if the way damage is calculated was changed up a bit I'm sure there might be more creative builds compared to what we have now (Serration, Elemental/Multi-shot, Crit.)

[vaugahn]

I just mean how the only complaints that ever arise are about Boltor Prime, and never the other two, even though they are just as powerful. I guess its easier to the power difference of Boltor Prime in low levels because all three overkill, but Boltor fires the most bolts and thus hits the most enemies at once.

I think the reason why the Boltor Prime comes up so much is its sheer statistical superiority across all categories. Ostensibly it's an assault rifle, yet it outperforms marksman weapons at range and shotguns up close. If it was simply the best rifle people wouldn't have a problem, but it outshines every ranged primary by a significant margin.

[GSDAkatsuki]

I think the reason why the Boltor Prime comes up so much is its sheer statistical superiority across all categories. Ostensibly it's an assault rifle, yet it outperforms marksman weapons at range and shotguns up close. If it was simply the best rifle people wouldn't have a problem, but it outshines every ranged primary by a significant margin.

Except realistically when you factor in its bolt spread and travel distance it loses some of its DPS getting to a target at mid to long ranges. The Boltor P is indeed powerful as it has raw damage, but it lacks any sort of versatility. It is strictly a close range weapon and into later stages of defenses and survival it runs out of ammo fast. Marksman rifles are accurate hitscan weapons, and with their consistent headshot potential they will be getting much more longstaying power than a Boltor P. If you want to nerf the Boltor P, then go ahead, but you shouldn't be doing any drastic value changes.

[vleessjuu]

On the issue of Mods I don't think the Utility Mods being too weak is the problem - its the damage mods being far too strong. If there were more penalties introduced for building only damage, or if the way damage is calculated was changed up a bit I'm sure there might be more creative builds compared to what we have now (Serration, Elemental/Multi-shot, Crit.)

Fair enough. I'm guessing that a nerf to the damage mods wouldn't be too bad since it would affect everyone equally (rather than just a small group). But you're right. When I started playing this game, I was amazed at how easy it is to rack up damage bonuses. In most games, a +25% damage bonus is already really significant. In Warframe you can easily surpass the +100% mark after just a few hours of play and it just keeps going from there. It's pretty insane, actually.

[Seanjuju]

Please stop spreading these rumors about the galatine. It's already one of the best melee weapons in the game.

[vaugahn]

Except realistically when you factor in its bolt spread and travel distance it loses some of its DPS getting to a target at mid to long ranges. The Boltor P is indeed powerful as it has raw damage, but it lacks any sort of versatility. It is strictly a close range weapon and into later stages of defenses and survival it runs out of ammo fast. Marksman rifles are accurate hitscan weapons, and with their consistent headshot potential they will be getting much more longstaying power than a Boltor P. If you want to nerf the Boltor P, then go ahead, but you shouldn't be doing any drastic value changes.

We don't really have very many tiles large enough to cause a problem as far as accuracy goes, and the bolts are very fast. Also, by the time it looses ammo efficiency so has every other weapon, so that's not really a good balance factor.

It just needs one downside to make up for how strong it is. I'd give it a large accuracy penalty and a greater travel time, but that's just my 2 cents on the issue.

Please stop spreading these rumors about the galatine. It's already one of the best melee weapons in the game.

LOL

Edited September 15, 2014 by vaugahn

[(PSN)MrNishi]

I would like to see melee weapons gain greater Crit damage.

Maybe even some Rank 10 mods for melee damage or a combo Crit damage/chance or status chance/damage boost

Since they added Aura-boost like Stance cards for melee weapons there has been little incentive to Forma a melee weapon.

If they granted some Rank 10 melee mods that boosted Crit damage or possibly a Phantom/Shadow strike (Melee multi-shot) that would be just dreamy.

And yes Heavy Weapons should innately have a higher base damage +1

[Arunafeltz]

Shotguns. Neglected for far too long now, and honestly the damage falloff is needlessly harsh- especially when tilesets are getting more and more spacious. We're no longer in the days where the confined spaces of Asteroid Base and Corpus vessel were all we had- and even these have been getting bigger and bigger tiles.

 

Snipe rifles. The 'rework' was sad, lazy and absolutely disappointing. I don't want to sound mean DE, but you really failed to deliver on this one. Snipers are still not a particularly good option for taking down high priority targets like Eximi, held back by way too many weighted coin flips. They need another pass.

 

Miter. Another case where a bug should have become a feature. Also please fix the ridiculously tiny charged projectile.

 

Lex Prime. My main weapon, please buff its critical chance. I'd also appreciate it if the Aklex Prime would not completely invalidate the Lex Prime like the Aklex did for Lex. I will collect the entire family as a fan, but DE's logic of 'two guns being better than one' in every significant trait is kinda lame, to be honest.