Bladestorm In Conflicts Is Broken And You All Abuse It

[TotallyLagging]

Doesn't mean it shouldn't be fixed.

 

Did I say that it shouldn't be fixed? No.

 

I'm just pointing out that the whole "YALL BLADESTORM NOOBMAGICBUTTON USERS" is wrong. Most of us don't care about PvP. Pointing fingers at us won't do anything other than making yourself look like an idiot.

[Trayzerlol]

so you want balanced pvp?

 

here you go:

 

- disable all abilities in pvp missions

- set the same stats for all frames while in a pvp zone (health, armor, shields, movement speed...)

- optional: diable all mods for even more balance. enjoy your third person counter strike.

 

orrrrr we could just scrap pvp and get some fun and interesting raids with huge bosses and actual rewards in the game which are challenging and offer decent rewards at the same time so this game gets some sort of endgame...

Edited October 1, 2014 by IlIIlII

[crafturtoemc]

Please nerf them for PvP, really needed. But please don't nerf them on the PvE side.

[Ailissa]

so you want balanced pvp?

 

here you go:

 

- disable all abilities in pvp missions

- set the same stats for all frames while in a pvp zone (health, armor, shields, movement speed...)

- optional: diable all mods for even more balance. enjoy your third person counter strike.

 

orrrrr we could just scrap pvp and get some fun and interesting raids with huge bosses and actual rewards in the game which are challenging and offer decent rewards at the same time so this game gets some sort of endgame...

 

This I agree with.

 

PvP easily fixed by disabling all abilities on PvP maps.

 

Everyone is equal and nothing in PvE is affected.

 

But I mainly agree with scrapping PvP altogether. It serves no purpose and shouldn't have been added in the first place.

[snrd3r]

1. Saying PvP should just be removed because you only play PvE makes no sense. How does the existence of a feature you don't make use of affect your experience in the game? And if you think they should have spent the time building PvP to make more PvE content: Clearly the PvE content hasn't stopped coming, and besides, it's also pretty evident DE didn't spend that much time on PvP anyway because of how broken it is.

 

2. Correct me if I'm wrong but they've already nerfed Hysteria only for PvP (the power stayed the same in PvE). Why can't the same thing be done for Bladestorm?

 

PvP is a broken mess that should be fixed but it's a lot of fun when you're not stunlocked or lying on the ground for 90% of a match. Fixing Bladestorm will be a big step towards making it more consistently fun instead of frustrating. And you're welcome to keep playing PvE only; I'll keep playing with the same dozen other people, and we'll enjoy the occasional quarter-million battle pay by ourselves.

[Ailissa]

Did we upset some PvP'ers?

 

I see quite a few comments got deleted.

 

Well, we'd rather they took away the comments that hurt their feelings than have to call in a whaaambulance.

[TMHowler]

Who needs Blade storm when you can have Smoke bomb + teleport + fang Prime/ether daggers/other fast melee weapon?

And I'm saying that as a PvE player, mind you.

[xXRampantXx]

so you want balanced pvp?

 

here you go:

 

- disable all abilities in pvp missions

- set the same stats for all frames while in a pvp zone (health, armor, shields, movement speed...)

- optional: diable all mods for even more balance. enjoy your third person counter strike.

 

orrrrr we could just scrap pvp and get some fun and interesting raids with huge bosses and actual rewards in the game which are challenging and offer decent rewards at the same time so this game gets some sort of endgame...

I don't think pvp should be scrapped altogether, however, I don't think it should be in the Dark Sectors.  Keep the conclaves, Keep the dueling rooms, DS conflicts though, they don't belong, at least, not as they are now.

[DeadX65]

 balanced PvP in a primarily PvE game with few variables, like specific classes is difficult. something like warframe with multiple frames and multiple abilities set up more towards PvE would be...nightmare.

 

solution, either a map specific rule set beyond what they have now where they can buff or debuff frames, abilities, and/or weapons to find balance. something like bladestorm could have specific rules attached to it in the PvP tileset/map that aren't applied in PvE.

 

alternately, a new frame with multiple skills, not just 4 only usable in PvP. it's skills would cover tank, healer, damage dealer with support thrown in as well for buffs/debuff effects. that would make PvP much more skill based since everyone involved could only use that frame with a set number of skills (max 4) selecting what skill loadout and additional mods would be very important. balancing would be easier as nothing that happens to the PvP frames and mods would affect PvE, same as with specific rule sets for PvP maps.

 

both are time consuming. the pure PvP frame even more so.

 

benefits for either are obvious...never again would PvP balance affect PvE.

[PookieNumnums]

you realize that in ds maps it activates from left to right top to bottom as far as mods are concerned. its why all the mirages are using prism so early on. 

[RebornsAlmark]

Is Warframe a popular game for pvp? No, it's a co-op pve game. Don't ruin a pve game for its minor pvp counterpart, thank you.

 

 

As long as your nerfs don't drag over into PvE combat, I'm fine with them. Please try to keep them out of it.

 

 

And here you have the problem in a nutshell. All those calling to nerf bladestorm please look at yourselves. Your suggesting nerfing an ability in general to make it balanced in PvP. No thanks. 10 second charge up on bladestorm, lacking invulnerability during the ability. How many people would use an ability with a 10 second charge up time in PvE (heres a hint, none at all). Shall we rebalance tesla, since early game it wrecks people in PvP, shall we rebalance shuriken since early game it wrecks people in PvP. This is a PvE game with PvP tacked onto it almost as an afterthought. DE will never completely change an ability on a frame just to balance it in PvP sorry but thats not the way it works.

 

 

Had a good laugh when i saw the title.. amazing how a few bad apples spoil the bunch.. suuure.. nerf bladestorm.. make it useless for most of the players.. so you few individuals can PvP in a PvE game ;)

 

Remove it altogether if that is the case.. we don't need it anyway..

 

That being said.. this thread is pointless + whine.. you're in the minority mate.

 

I love how anywhere from 20-40% of comments in the PvP feedback section is essentially "I don't PvP, so this doesn't concern me" which is essentially spam in a PvP feedback fourm (the first two replies to this thread are exactly this). Ironically these comments are often upvoted due to the general Warframe official fourms populace being greatly against PvP of any sorts (it's like heresy or something). The equivalent of this is going to the Dojo feedback section and posting in a random thread, "I don't have a Dojo or plan to get one, so this thread doesn't concern me." Although I do understand these comments were made when the thread was posted on a wrong fourm (probably General Discussion).

 

Now onto addressing these above quoted comments which are misconceptions I have seen over and over again regarding criticism of PvP balancing, if you've ever read some of the previous patch notes regarding PvP changes, you would know that all PvP changes to abilities and weapons have ZERO effect on PvE and ONLY apply to Conclave and Dark Sector Conflicts. For example, in the Update 14.7.0: Operation Gate Crash patch notes, it explicitly states :

• PvP Change: Ash’s Bladestorm reduced to 0.25 damage multiplier from 0.5.

Please be informed before posting about PvP balance changes. DE has shown that they are willing to balance Warframe abilities and weapons speciifically for PvP without any changes of said frames or weapons in PvE, if this were not the case, DE would have never touched the mulipliers of certain weapons and abilities in PvP.

 

Now that being said, yes, Bladestorm needs another nerf of sorts as it is almost unplayable against except for some set-ups or tactics such as :

- Oberon with Renwel already active

- Valkyr with Hysteria already active

- Nyx with Absorb already active

- Staying away from the target radius of the Bladestorm

 

While one could "easily" snipe a Bladestorming spamming Ash from afar, dealing with 2, 3, or even 4 Bladestorming Ashs who have at least a little bit of wit would be incredibly hard to do; especially if they manage to push your whole team back to the spawn area and camp. Moreover, Ash's Bladestorm can single-handily kill anywhere from 1-4 players in one casting (including a few spectres and mobs, which result in a burst of xp for Ash and his team), no ability have that much utility alongside power in PvP.

 

Additionally, camping is sort of a large issue as well; there should be turrets that deal moderate to heavy damage near spawn areas similar to fountains in MOBA games (no enemy should be near the spawn area anyway as the objectives and battlefield are in the center of each area).

Edited October 1, 2014 by RebornsAlmark

[Tali]

Agree...

 

...Agree...

 

...And more agree, If I do pvp, it's only with good friends, so that we always set specific boundaries to how we play (Such as banning specific powers), I almost never play Dark Sector pvp.  The fact that it even is pvp has ruined Dark Sector conflicts for me.  That being said, I agree that in pvp only players should not be invincible when using Bladestrom.

Agreed

[MonasotE]

First.-Long ago I played a game which was, in some way, similar to Warframe, but it had PVE and PVP. In that game ALL clases had two effect on every skill, one for pvp and one for pve (in pvp the abilities had less damage, more cooldown, etc). So, i've been reading forums and every dude who likes PVE is afraid thinking that if they improve(balance) PVP their experience will change, one thing is completely different to the other. 

Second.- I started playing this game like a month ago and i noticed that this game REALLY need a pvp feature, i mean, a big pvp feature, apart from 4 man squad, Warframe should host pvp rooms where u can go in and start fighting with random ppl for prizes or something. (PLEASE NOT HOSTED BY PEOPLE, IM CHILEAN AND MY HOSTING SUCKS!), plus, whats the point of getting really good weapons or really good mods from killing monsters just to kill the same monsters faster in the future, thats weird, but testing them (weapons, frames, mods, etc) with other ppl who wants to prove that their gear is better makes the game much more interesting, adding an EndGame feature.

Thats more or less what they should do, in my opinion. (sorry for bad englando)

[Rakshal]

First.-Long ago I played a game which was, in some way, similar to Warframe, but it had PVE and PVP. In that game ALL clases had two effect on every skill, one for pvp and one for pve (in pvp the abilities had less damage, more cooldown, etc). So, i've been reading forums and every dude who likes PVE is afraid thinking that if they improve(balance) PVP their experience will change, one thing is completely different to the other. 

Second.- I started playing this game like a month ago and i noticed that this game REALLY need a pvp feature, i mean, a big pvp feature, apart from 4 man squad, Warframe should host pvp rooms where u can go in and start fighting with random ppl for prizes or something. (PLEASE NOT HOSTED BY PEOPLE, IM CHILEAN AND MY HOSTING SUCKS!), plus, whats the point of getting really good weapons or really good mods from killing monsters just to kill the same monsters faster in the future, thats weird, but testing them (weapons, frames, mods, etc) with other ppl who wants to prove that their gear is better makes the game much more interesting, adding an EndGame feature.

Thats more or less what they should do, in my opinion. (sorry for bad englando)

Agreed, PvP should be endgame content that shows how skilled a player is at shooting, parkouring, dodging, and modding.

[Epicness500]

Remove invulnerability and 100% forced stagger and we'll start seeing Ashes get shot down midair by truly skilled shooters, otherwise the abuse continues.

I think that the removing invulnerability is a great idea.

[REDHOOOD]

Just wait until I finish my current PvP thread and this will be the least of your worries... MUAHAHAHAHAHAHA 

[Shad0wWatcher]

Ash is already an underrated frame and you guys wanna shoot him down even more? Geez players never seem to be happy. All i want for bladestorm is for it to be controllable, i want to be able to stop when i press 4 again. That would be delightful.

 

P.S. 

Let it also be known that i don't spam blade storm, I rarely even use it, i rely a lot more on shrunken and smokescreen if anything, the rest just go down with my weapons.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Shad0wWatcher

[Shad0wWatcher]

I think that the removing invulnerability is a great idea.

Then i guess Valkyr's Hysteria and Rhino's Iron Skin should have that removed as well then.

[Adorable_Ookami_Momiji]

Then i guess Valkyr's Hysteria and Rhino's Iron Skin should have that removed as well then.

 

You can copter away from a Valkyr, her claw slide attack in Hysteria will just slow her down and she won't catch up. She's limited to melee only when using this, that's a perfectly reasonable downside.

 

You can use corrosive damage and do a lot more damage to Rhino's Iron Skin (Since it's Ferrite Armor added onto the alloy base of a frame). You do have a chance to take it down, just depending on what you use, you may or may not get past. Also Iron Skin doesn't have an actual offensive use. I'd like to think a Tysis with viral/radiation added onto it might do something, I don't do conclave/PvP much so I've no clue.

 

Now with Ash, you can use bladestorm, do a great amount of damage on multiple people, and not be taken down in the meantime. It's in a whole different tier.

Edited October 2, 2014 by Adorable_Ookami_Momiji

[Shad0wWatcher]

You can copter away from a Valkyr, her claw slide attack in Hysteria will just slow her down and she won't catch up. She's limited to melee only when using this, that's a perfectly reasonable downside.

 

You can use corrosive damage and do a lot more damage to Rhino's Iron Skin (Since it's Ferrite Armor added onto the alloy base of a frame). You do have a chance to take it down, just depending on what you use, you may or may not get past. Also Iron Skin doesn't have an actual offensive use. I'd like to think a Tysis with viral/radiation added onto it might do something, I don't do conclave/PvP much so I've no clue.

 

Now with Ash, you can use bladestorm, do a great amount of damage on multiple people, and not be taken down in the meantime. It's in a whole different tier.

I was mainly talking about PvE and the invulnerability part, but yeah sure i don't mind bladestorm being nerved in PvP. I rare do PvP anyway. 

[Adorable_Ookami_Momiji]

I was mainly talking about PvE and the invulnerability part, but yeah sure i don't mind bladestorm being nerved in PvP. I rare do PvP anyway. 

 

Well it's all fine for PvE really; Iron Skin isn't a total "IDGAF" mode, would still like to see an enemy that could possibly use corrosive that goes through it, the ability is strong but it's not invulnerability mode.

 

Hysteria you are melee limited, lose your melee weapon (can be bad if you have one for coptering), and if you are close to a mob when it ends, you'll receive damage back that was taken while invul I believe.

 

Bladestorm is fine for PvE in the sense that you can take out a giant group of enemies, if you build for more damage you sacrifice other options with corrupted mods/different builds etc. It's just that for PvP it makes no absolute sense to keep it like it is, even with the multipliers reduced.

[Shad0wWatcher]

Well it's all fine for PvE really; Iron Skin isn't a total "IDGAF" mode, would still like to see an enemy that could possibly use corrosive that goes through it, the ability is strong but it's not invulnerability mode.

 

Hysteria you are melee limited, lose your melee weapon (can be bad if you have one for coptering), and if you are close to a mob when it ends, you'll receive damage back that was taken while invul I believe.

 

Bladestorm is fine for PvE in the sense that you can take out a giant group of enemies, if you build for more damage you sacrifice other options with corrupted mods/different builds etc. It's just that for PvP it makes no absolute sense to keep it like it is, even with the multipliers reduced.

Now see those are statements i can agree with, no anger or raging. Yeah Ash can be nerved in PvP for all i care, like i said i don't mind it since i don't get involved too much with PvP. It just builds up more frustration when you keep getting killed in the same manner. I get where the OP is coming from, but still...there are plenty of more important faults in this game that need to be fixed. Best thing to do IMO is to just disable the ability to use skills in PvP. That way the battles are at least balanced out between players and are then determined by who can move faster, aim better, who's a better judge of the situation, ect.

 

Keep cool and play Warframe like this^ guy up here.

[MoonlightAngel]

Blade storm need to be fix. it s way too op in PvP