New Hacking Ui Has Ridiculously Low Clarity

[Barhandar]

* Colors blend into each other: as a result it takes more time and effort to correctly identify required position.

 

* It now takes most of the screen: human eye physically can't focus on entire screen at once unless it's sufficiently far away. PC screens are NOT sufficiently far away - this design is clearly influenced too much by consoles.

Please understand that PC requires different qualities of the UI for best experience, and current diegetic UI is console-specialized and as such doesn't have them.

 

* The new menu is off-center, worse on non-widescreens and significantly increasing time to react because most of the time the focus is on the crosshair in the center of the screen, not on the side.

[Innocent_Flower]

I thought it was better than the old one. The lines glow to tell you you're doing it right. DE did something well. 

 

- it doesn't take up most of the screen and I have no trouble focusing on it. 

 

- The game is primarily a PC game ported to consoles. 

Edited October 25, 2014 by Innocent_Flower

[WolfyDashy]

In addition to all that, bringing the hacking mastery test ciphers to consoles everywhere means ciphers are significantly harder already, there's no need to also make the elements themselves harder to see if players are to be able to, well, still solve these ciphers.

[Frostosti]

although i ve done almost 1500 ciphers and never failed any of them, and with this change never will fail any either.

I will keep using my intruder mod, oops, i mean, i will support your idea.

[H.Katsura_999]

When I first saw the new hacking interface I just used one of my ciphers like always, since I haven't got a clue what I was supposed to do back then.

 

But if you get the hang of it they're pretty much ok and can be considered as an improvement.

[Barhandar]

I thought it was better than the old one. The lines glow to tell you you're doing it right. DE did something well. 

 

- it doesn't take up most of the screen and I have no trouble focusing on it. 

 

- The game is primarily a PC game ported to consoles. 

* Not everyone has extremely high resolutions, which DE have started to forget. On my screen there's less space between upper and lower edges of the screen and the cipher matrix than one pin/hex of said matrix by height.

 

* Which means that interface should be optimized for PCs first, and for consoles second - or even have consoles use entirely different UI. Currently it's significantly more optimized for console use, with limited (controller) buttons and big everything to see things on far-away TV screen, than for PC use which demands smaller elements and more of them on the screen, because you're MUCH closer and you don't need them to be big, barring special circumstances like disabilities.

 

In addition to all that, bringing the hacking mastery test ciphers to consoles everywhere means ciphers are significantly harder already, there's no need to also make the elements themselves harder to see if players are to be able to, well, still solve these ciphers.

 

Yes. Full-grid Mastery Corpus cipher is a complete mess now, because lines are barely distinguishable and you need to NOPE your neck away to see it in entirety.

 

When I first saw the new hacking interface I just used one of my ciphers like always, since I haven't got a clue what I was supposed to do back then.

 

But if you get the hang of it they're pretty much ok and can be considered as an improvement.

I'm okay with Grineer ciphers, they're a good change. I'm also okay with ciphers becoming diegetic (in-world), since ciphers are ingame and do not go contrary to the usability like entirety of Liset and associated UI changes does. I'm not okay with how they were made diegetic.

[DSpite]

* Colors blend into each other: as a result it takes more time and effort to correctly identify required position.

 

* It now takes most of the screen: human eye physically can't focus on entire screen at once unless it's sufficiently far away. PC screens are NOT sufficiently far away - this design is clearly influenced too much by consoles.

Please understand that PC requires different qualities of the UI for best experience, and current diegetic UI is console-specialized and as such doesn't have them.

 

* The new menu is off-center, worse on non-widescreens and significantly increasing time to react because most of the time the focus is on the crosshair in the center of the screen, not on the side.

 

If anyone would of complained by now it would have been me, since I whinge everytime DE does something drastic with visuals.

 

Funny thing is, the hacking console, to me, is better then the old one.

 

I'm running a 42" TV which is sitting about 40cm from my face, and the size of the grid is fine. Better contrast with the connector lines would be good, especially if when they "connect" they could go brighter, and offer instant feedback you connected the lines.

 

For the record, you can just build cyphers. I'm not saying "use them all the time" but I am saying use them in situations where because of a weird angle or lighting you have a hard time seeing the cypher.

[Barhandar]

Funny thing is, the hacking console, to me, is better then the old one.

 

I'm running a 42" TV which is sitting about 40cm from my face, and the size of the grid is fine.

Your situation is nearly exact opposite of mine: the old hacking was small and didn't scale well, so you had trouble and I did not because it fit nicely, now it's big and you don't have issues because you can quickly change focus by moving your head, but I can't because it's TOO big for my screen. Also, for that, ability to manually change scale, dimensions, and position of diegetic elements would be nice.

[Innocent_Flower]

If anyone would of complained by now it would have been me, since I whinge everytime DE does...

You do, But not in the way you'd like to think. 

 

But, awaiting the dragons that end the world, I agree with you.Though I'm 40cm away from a 17 inch laptop though. Anyhow; The lines glowing to show you your connected is a huge buff. I agree with the "maybe a little more contrast" thing. On the whole It's bigger, It feels more connected to the game and I see it as a small, perhaps unnecessarily, upgrade. I don't bother with ciphers. 

 

 

Thread should be in UI. 

[DSpite]

You do, But not in the way you'd like to think. 

 

But, awaiting the dragons that end the world, I agree with you.Though I'm 40cm away from a 17 inch laptop though. Anyhow; The lines glowing to show you your connected is a huge buff. I agree with the "maybe a little more contrast" thing. On the whole It's bigger, It feels more connected to the game and I see it as a small, perhaps unnecessarily, upgrade. I don't bother with ciphers. 

 

 

Thread should be in UI. 

 

The complete sentence was "since I whinge everytime DE does something drastic with visuals", so your cutting away what I said and adding "..." makes the sentence lose it's meaning. Oh wait, that's what you were aiming for, right?

 

And you need to explain what you mean with "You do, But not in the way you'd like to think.", because if that is some kind of sarcastic attack, you will lose what tiny speck of remaining patience I have with you.

 

If the hacking UI was hard to see, I would have noticed a big difference immediately. The only thing I can't account for is the varied differences in graphics settings that everyone might have, as I keep mine fairly simple, because, you guessed it, it makes it easier to see. If you have 30 types of Bloom and other weird stuff going, it would make sense to tone them down "for testing purposes", before reporting "something is hard to see".

 

I have done MY tests regarding "visibility" in this game. I have tried every option possible, including downloading third party tools that mess with FX, like MSI Afterburner, or GEM (http://gem.codeusa.net/), and so on, and THAT is what I base my opinion on. Feel free to explain what you did, if it was more then squint at the screen and say "looks fine".

Edited October 25, 2014 by DSpite

[Gelkor]

Are we talking about the new Corpus UI (which is the old one only bigger) or the new Grineer hacking UI, which is a whole new system (It's pretty much the decursing interface from Kingdoms of Amalur).

Edited October 25, 2014 by Gelkor

[Xylia]

It took me about 2-3 seconds to realize WTF was going on the first time I loaded up a hacking attempt on Corpus.

 

Haven't tried the Grineer yet.

 

With the Corpus hacking minigame, I honestly don't see a problem with it. I use a 27-inch widescreen TV that sits barely arm's length away from me (I can reach up with my arm and almost touch the screen while leaning back and sitting comfortably in my chair). The TV is up against the keyboard I'm actually typing on.

 

I use 1360x768 resolution (the only resolution this TV likes), and I don't screw with the game's settings using after-effects programs like the ones mentioned above. I have the settings modestly high, but I have Bloom and such turned off (because I like to be able to actually see what's going on and not have fog turning everything white).

 

Looks fine to me, but it took me a few hack attempts to get used to it. Now, my eyes automatically zip to the right when I'm about to hack a computer and I've already gotten used to the new style.

[LukeAura]

I'm on a middle to lower end laptop, and I have no problem with either hacking game. 
The corpus one was a little disorienting at first because it zooms in to it now, but once you get used to that it's not a problem. 

[Barhandar]

Are we talking about the new Corpus UI (which is the old one only bigger) or the new Grineer hacking UI, which is a whole new system (It's pretty much the decursing interface from Kingdoms of Amalur).

Both, but primarily Corpus, because it's not only bigger, it also has lost the contrast between background, rotateable hexes, and lines.

[vaugahn]

It takes up less than half of the screen, so I think it's fine size-wise.

 

If I could change one thing, it would be making the light rays in back a little less bright. Other than that it's a straight upgrade over the old one.

[eksby]

I think it would be fine if it was only centered in the screen. As of now, I always have a moment where I have to look for the hacking minigame on my screen whereas before I wouldn't need to actively figure out where it was.

[Numerikuu]

You sorta get used to it, but to be honest it's pretty damn obnoxious.

[LegendXCarisso]

I personally love the aesthetics... but I will admit they should be shrunk down a bit. The old one was good as I could move my mouse quickly to each node to unscramble it. The Grineer puzzle makes no sense, and I just have to pop a cipher to solve it. How in the nine do you solve the Grineer puzzle anyway?

[Eggzodiya]

I welcome the change (pretty much any change, really). It's a new challenge every time... until it's done repetitively, which eliminates said challenge.

[OneMember]

For me it's way too big atm... So hard to get "the big picture" of what is required for it.

 

Will blame consoles for this as guessing it was made for console platform and not for pc users.

Edited October 25, 2014 by OneMember

[K_Shiro]

...bringing the hacking mastery test ciphers to consoles everywhere means ciphers are significantly harder already,...

 

Would be neat if we actually saw those mastery test kind of ciphers. Since this doesn't seem to be too hard:

 

 

OMG NEW CIPHERS 2HARD CAN'T BEAT THEM GOTTA BE A ROBOT TO BE ABLE TO SOLVE THEM

 

 

In all seriousness though, what are everyone's thoughts on the new ciphers?

 

I haven't tried the new Grineer ciphers, but I'm liking the Corpus ciphers. Although the translucent cipher is really hard to see clearly against lighter backdrops.

 

I've been hearing complains in parties from others who seem to be stumped by the larger, more complicated ciphers. And the Grineer ciphers seem to take a long time to solve, judging from party members.

 

Honestly guys... we (I and many others certainly) asked for harder ciphers, like those in the mastery test but... grineer one is harder this time but... ah lemme quote myself:

 

 

Ah the Grineer Cipher, like a sunshine in my heart. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I need some glasses, might've gone blind.

Yea, those pictures shine some light on the problem. Had the same bug when I was hit during the cipher.

 

As for feedback on the ciphers...

 

Ciphers have always been way too easy. That's true. What we have now is a new cipher type for grineer that:

- Has nothing to do with logic thus is not a cipher.

- Takes longer than the other and is stressful especially when you are shot at.

- Original ciphers became even easier.

 

I think DE might have some reverse-sindrome where whatever we say they do the opposite.

Corpus ciphers are proper puzzles and while grineer ones can be considered fun too in a way, they are based purely on logic and when you are shot at, lag, etc. that's not funny. AT ALL.

I want the original ciphers from the cipher mastery test. This was mentioned many many many times, not just by me, yet they are nowhere to be found.

Would be neat if Master Thief would effectively allow us to break into any locked container IF we can do a cipher. If we mess it up, container locks for us and only the others (with master thief) can try. Higher ranked master thief, easier test or more tries.

 

Also ciphers would be neat to open locked doors that lead to "secret" rooms, armories, caches. Honestly, right now I have trouble finding void keys, especially sabotage ones (obviously) - I wanted to try them but my main reason was to get oxium since the new Grineer melee seems to use more of that rare Corpus resource than any corpus of tenno stuff (including a fully powered Warframe which tends to be a bit bigger than a freaking axe...).

 

Another question: Intruder is there for extra time. So... what do U use that mod for on a grineer map? Okay, nobody used that mod, like ever, since it was a dead idea to begin with. But seriously guys...

 

Hell, I'm annoyed.

[HvcTerr]

I preferred the older hacking sizes because I didn't have to move my mouse as far.

[K_Shiro]

I preferred the older hacking sizes because I didn't have to move my mouse as far.

 

It's pretty tiring actually - for me not so much the extended range I have to move my mouse over but looking at the whole damn thing, and let's face it, most people do sit pretty close to their screens (and have bigger screens than a freakin' mobile phone) thus such huge ui elements being a single entity you have to look at as one... that's bothersome, especially knowing how little information it holds. Seriously, why that size? Normal menus in-game are smaller... the old size was better.

[HvcTerr]

It's probably decisions that make more sense for consoles leaking over.

 

The new size is probably better for those playing on a living-room TV.

Edited December 13, 2014 by HvcTerr