Why Does Archwing Even Exist?

[Zanukacola]

I don't get it. Warframe is a good game. You've got a large, varied selection of guns. A group of characters (warframes) with powers diverse enough to cater to just about any kind of player. Warframe as a game is better than its ever been.

 

So why on earth would you introduce archwing? You create what is basically a minigame that renders a huge amount of the existing Warframe framework useless; the minimap becomes confusing at best or outright misleading, the existing AI is useless, a new set of tilesets is used that is of far lower quality than the existing ones. The new gameplay mode fails to integrate any of the existing content: your guns, your melee weapons, even your warframes themselves are all dead weight in the vacuum of space. Nope, you have to use a totally new pool of content, with a grand total of 2 melee weapons, 2 guns, and 2 archwings. 

 

I know that the first response I'm going to get here is going to be "well if you don't like archwing then don't use it."

 

I'll put aside the fact that Limbo is gated behind Archwing, and most likely future content will be too. 

No, my main problem is that its evident that DE is putting a serious effort into this. They created totally new tilesets. They implemented a new set of mods. They designed the equivalent of two new warframes. And as they've done this much already, they're practically obligated to continue putting out content for Archwing. And guess what? That content is going to come at the expense of content for the main game.

 

Archwing is a tumor. Warframe is a great game, but DE is kneecapping themselves by committing to this colossal waste of resources that contributes nothing to the core Warframe experience. I get that it's 'cool'. I agree, space ninjas flying IS cool. But why introduce this now? I'm tempted to cynically say that this whole new content pool is introduced to make veteran players start fresh (and buy plat) while offering new players a shiny new gimmick to be lured in by. I don't presume to know what motivates the developers, however, so I'm not going to vilify them unnecessarily.

 

Regardless, Archwing is a gimmick. When the dust settles and the novelty wears off, players are going to realize that the Archwing mode is inferior in every way to normal gameplay. Archwing is going to be revealed as what it truly is: a huge mistake.

 

DE is heading into a field they know nothing about and siphoning resources from something they're already doing very well. And what have we gained? A sh**ty minigame that's only going to drag down the Warframe we know and love.

 

I don't think this post is going to make a difference at all or that anyone from DE will read it, but I really want to know:

Why did this get greenlighted?

 

tl;dr: Archwing is a waste of DE's time and resources that adds nothing to the core values of the game

Edited October 27, 2014 by qujokun

[Letter13]

Why did this get greenlighted?

Probably because it's fun.

[PsychedelicSnake]

Probably because it's fun.

Fun isn't allowed. Or something.

[Anatolius]

Probably because it's fun.

My response in a walnut

[Vargras]

I don't get it. Warframe is a good game. You've got a large, varied selection of guns. A group of characters (warframes) with powers diverse enough to cater to just about any kind of player. Warframe as a game is better than its ever been.

And this is why Archwing was introduced. Yes, Warframe has a lot of guns and warframes, but many of them have been around for a very long time, and only a few are often deemed "good enough" to take into end-game content. For many veteran players, they had seen and done all there was to do -- they logged on every week to check out potential new weapons in the various updates, but there wasn't much else for them.

 

Archwing is something new. There's actually new weapons and such to get. There's new mechanics. There's new mods. I remember the first time I got Serration or Split Chamber and how awesome I thought it was. Getting them now is just... eh. Archwing kinda brought that back, in a way -- I'm getting new things I've never seen before.

 

That, and it's fun.

[vaugahn]

Just because you think it's a waste of time doesn't mean it's actually a waste of time.

[Imaru]

Because its FUN. This is the second thread like this one I've seen today. I honestly don't understand why you are complaining about new content, especially something so awesome as Archwing. It is not a tumor, it is a change. Until now, all gameplay has taken place in a largely two dimensional environment. Now we have three dimensions. This makes the gameplay (in my mind at least) far more interesting. Yes, the minimap is borderline useless in Archwing missions, but that highlights a flaw in that part of the game, not Archwing.

[Arvenski]

huge freaking textwall of crap

*facepalm*

[Fundance]

Archwing is actually really fun and really quite similar to controlling a Tenno on land. I see it as more of an extension of the regular gameplay really.

Also, all good games have sections that mix up the controls. Just look at how Platinum make their games - they introduce unecessary flight and shooting sections any time they want and it's great.

Edited October 27, 2014 by Fundance

[EliteRider]

it looks fun to me, i just have to finish building my archwing. :/

Edited October 27, 2014 by EliteRider

[FREQ1989]

Every game need to evolve to keep the player base interested and to bring in new players. Just because you happen to dislike it, it doesn't mean it is bad. Archwing is one hell of an ambitious update, and your complaint of the tileset not being as good as all the others, only getting 2 archwings, 2 guns, and 2 melee weapons, is completely nullified when you realise that they have to essentially create another game to match your expectations. This update, like everything else in the game, will be expanded upon and it will take time. Making a hate post simply because of your personal distaste is despicable. DE has been working hard to make the game not the same old boring levels run time and time again, and people just need to understand the game need to change to stay relevant.

 

Edit: The fact that this whole argument is invalidated by simply one person saying that it is fun for them, is the best example of why this hate post is irrelevant.

Edited October 27, 2014 by FREQ1989

[Flamingfighter]

I'm gonna add my voice to the general thread consensus: It's really fun. I think Archwing freshens the experience, two completely different ways to play that still retain many core elements of each other. If I get bored of regular Warframe missions, Archwing is there to satisfy me, and when Archwing gets a tad bit boring, I can return to the base game with renewed vigor. As someone who was only logging in to Warframe to check out the new guns because I had done everything else, Archwing made the game fun to play, not just because it in itself is fun, but because the way it is placed in the game can serve to freshen the entire game for me.

[Varzy]

Archwing is a ton of fun and feels like a natural evolution of the main game.

 

If you don't like playing it, that's fine I guess, but the majority of the playerbase is loving the new system. It's not a tumor, so don't be so dramatic.

[Zanukacola]

Probably because it's fun.

 

 

And this is why Archwing was introduced. Yes, Warframe has a lot of guns and warframes, but many of them have been around for a very long time, and only a few are often deemed "good enough" to take into end-game content. For many veteran players, they had seen and done all there was to do -- they logged on every week to check out potential new weapons in the various updates, but there wasn't much else for them.

 

Archwing is something new. There's actually new weapons and such to get. There's new mechanics. There's new mods. I remember the first time I got Serration or Split Chamber and how awesome I thought it was. Getting them now is just... eh. Archwing kinda brought that back, in a way -- I'm getting new things I've never seen before.

 

That, and it's fun.

It is fun! I agree! But it's not Warframe, it's basically a different game.

 

You're acting as if Warframe *with gravity* is a space that's totally played out, but there's alot yet to be explored: actual stealth gameplay, real end-game content, AI improvements, and so on. Diverting efforts from improving those elements in favor of creating a novel mode that adds nothing to core gameplay is a cop-out, and as much as you like that it's sparkly and new, it's going to suffer from the same problems that frustrate you in the rest of Warframe.

[Implodingbanana]

Archwing is AMAZING idk what your talking about! the quest was AMAZING Archwing in general is AMAZING. i love the feel of it and how different it is to what we usually play :D Archwing is love, Archwing is life

[-Mr.Meeseeks-]

Archwing is probably one of the best things DE has added to Warframe in quite a while. In my opinion at least. It's so much fun and feels like a slightly more open Zone of the Enders.

 

Sorry you don't enjoy it? I mean i'm 99% sure that the general consensus is that it's fun as hell.

[KairaSilvermist]

I love the ARchwing. One of the things that brought me to Warframe was the "Space' theme, but so far, all I've seen are very earthen-looking levels. Grineer Asteroids look like the inside of a large cave, Venus is all in a ship, Jupiter could be various above-atmosphere cloud-cities...

 

To me, the Archwings definately make you feel like you're in space. Not QUITE as much as Rodina does, but certainly quite a bit more than Warframe used to feel like.

 

Archwing adds new things, and even answers a massive question I had. Go read Mag Prime's Codex entry. Those "Wings" mentioned are the Archwing, though that codex entry has existed since Mag Prime came out, a FAR cry before Archwings were even announced.

 

This isn't a mini-game, it doesn't feel like it to me, instead,  it's rather fleshed-out. Considering DE's current track-record for releases, Archwing has a LOT more content than I was expecting. Lore-Wise, the Archwing fits, and this is a way to introduce us to teh Archwing before we get underwater tilesets. This is opening up more mission types, more possibilities, and certainly more mechanics. Later on, I can see us darting in and out of an asteroid, and debris, carving our way through infested. Archwing is FAST, and it's smooth as well, barring a couple of minor bugs.

 

It's fun.

 

Fun.

 

Not many games devs these days know how to incorporate that.

 

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'mma go gather the parts to make the other Archwing, and the axe.

 

Edited October 27, 2014 by Mewfan

[Vargras]

It is fun! I agree! But it's not Warframe, it's basically a different game.

 

You're acting as if Warframe *with gravity* is a space that's totally played out, but there's alot yet to be explored: actual stealth gameplay, real end-game content, AI improvements, and so on. Diverting efforts from improving those elements in favor of creating a novel mode that adds nothing to core gameplay is a cop-out, and as much as you like that it's sparkly and new, it's going to suffer from the same problems that frustrate you in the rest of Warframe.

But again, I feel part of the reason it was added was because it's new. Stealth, AI improvements, and other facets of the core gameplay are indeed important, but they're still things that have largely already been seen. Players already attempt stealth runs in modes such as Rescue (or just for fun), AI improvements aren't immediately noticeable, and syndicates are supposed to fill the spot of end-game content. If you've been playing for a while, this is all stuff that would be appreciated, but I doubt it would immediately drag you back in like a new gamemode would.

 

I'll note that several players still think of the event introducing Survival as one of the best in Warframe's history.

[Llyssa]

Other than the obvious bugs, most people seem to like it a lot. Some people have taken up to playing only it.

 

You seem to have missed the giant stacks of posts going "all we ever do is run around indoors shooting things, we need something different. This game is boring."

 

AW is variety. It's something new. It's something different. It's an expansion of the engine and the mechanics and the game. It's also a generic upgrade of the system--things they had to figure out to make AW affect the rest of the game(like PBR).

 

There have been tons of people bemoaning "all they ever add are new guns and slightly-different things to run past while doing the same old mechanics", and, well, they've got a point.

 

Plus, this is a building block. The number of possible game ideas and modes and viable concepts just spiked dramatically. This is, technically, our first vehicle/mount. People have wanted those for a long time. There's a ton of things people have been requesting for years that are now possible.

 

Further, your complaint about "old stuff being irrelevant", well, that's been another constant rage--old players find no challenge in acquiring new stuff. Some people take days or weeks to farm up and build things. They have to hunt and chase and whatever. Old players build 1/2 of the new stuff 5 minutes after release, and the other half 3 days and 5 minutes after release(when the dojo is done researching it), and can't even tell you how many resources it cost them, or where to find those resources.

 

This sort of thing makes releases odd. The older players don't notice/complain about things they should be(example: I had 197 morphics when they had the 200 morphics BP glitch--if I hadn't recently been building stuff, I'd not have realized it cost that much), and newer players don't understand what's wrong, or how to properly convey "SOMETHING IS UP". I've heard cases against every new addition to the game being a "mistake" and "waste of resources". Gosh darn it, they're not making whatever it is you think is most important.

 

So, you're entitled to your opinion, that, personally, you don't care for this and will never play it. Other players think this is the greatest thing ever, or that it would be the greatest thing ever if they can get rid of some of the dramatic bugs. Some players particularly like flight sim games, and will be tempted to try warframe *specifically* so they can try the "flying space ninja" version.

 

Try to see the "big picture".

[Zanukacola]

Archwing is a ton of fun and feels like a natural evolution of the main game.

 

If you don't like playing it, that's fine I guess, but the majority of the playerbase is loving the new system. It's not a tumor, so don't be so dramatic.

Drama for attention; but I digress. It's not necessarily a horrible thing on principle, but as it is it's totally removed from the rest of the game. If we saw something like new tilesets with archwing segments or the ability to use 'land-guns' in space that attempted to actually extend the existing gameplay, I'd be all for it. Instead, it's totally separate from existing content instead of being an actual expansion of what already exists. It doesn't make sense.

[Pavelord]

didn´t you heard?, they just had a foreign company invest in them,they got more resources to keep updating the game, having archwing is not gonna take much from the teams developing other sections of the game.

[Prod_Crewman]

did you call yourself archwing?, if so, i dunno

[Implodingbanana]

It is fun! I agree! But it's not Warframe, it's basically a different game.

 

You're acting as if Warframe *with gravity* is a space that's totally played out, but there's alot yet to be explored: actual stealth gameplay, real end-game content, AI improvements, and so on. Diverting efforts from improving those elements in favor of creating a novel mode that adds nothing to core gameplay is a cop-out, and as much as you like that it's sparkly and new, it's going to suffer from the same problems that frustrate you in the rest of Warframe.

it was never said that warframe was restricted to being played in a ship planet or mining base was it? no. warframe is what the Devs and community want it to be and both parties wanted Archwing. (the large majority of the community wanted Archwing). Archwing is new and it brought new life into the game plus it's not like the WHOLE dev team is working on archwing....we clearly see different groups within DE working on different mechanics, ai, bosses, etc.

[Fundance]

But it actually isn't all that different to the regular controls when you get right down to it. It still 'feels' very much like Warframe.

[Implodingbanana]

Now, if you'll excuse me, I'mma go gather the parts to make the other Archwing, and the axe.

 

 

HOW DO YOU GET THE OTHER ONE! i don't know how D: