Synoid Gammacor: The New Absolute King

[Evanescent]

People getting worked up and crying NERF! at numbers....

 

It's just that: NUMBERS. IN AN IDEAL SITUATION.

 

Effective damage is still alright.

 

It has: limited range, and you'll run out of ammo in a few seconds if you run with that build. Not to mention the crapton of effort you need to get that gun.

 

So....as an end-game, syndicate weapon....I'd say it's perfect.

Now we just need to bring Rakta Ballistica and Secura Dual Cestras up to the same level.

 

And it's a weapon you earn from Syndicates, of course you'd expect it to be powerful.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Evanescent

[InvaderMEEN]

Don't forget that the

False. The critical checkbox simply factors in crits on the weapon: turning it off assumes that the weapon crits 0% of the time instead of (in this case) 10%. Turning off the crit chance makes the weapon go down... by about 2k DPS, to 38k, but that's still technically lower than its effective DPS.

Odd, I thought it assumed that the weapon crit 100% of the time because of how wonky the numbers got when it calculated damage for the Dread. It got nowhere near the right amount, under shooting it by a significant margin.

[NullCurrent]

The most effective DPS build goes with 2 fire-rate mods, both Anemic Agility and Gunslinger, and then add three 90% elementals on that. It ends up at 43k sustained DPS with a build like the one in the OP according to my DPS calculator.

 

In all honesty, the weapon is supposed to be good, but not THAT good. It is like you have AkSoma pretty much, except with limited range. I would welcome a damage nerf to something like 120-140 magnetic per ammo, instead of the 210 it has now, that will place its DPS squarely between 25k and 30k which is where it belongs.

 

As for people claiming that burst DPS is interesting, it is not. I wholly agree with the people claiming that burst DPS is an almost useless measure for the actual power of a weapon. The problem with the burst DPS as a measure is that it favors weapons with small magazines and that it also does not apply well in practice. Against a single enemy, sure, if your aim is to kill it before you have to reload then burst DPS is fine, but if you have multiple enemies or really really tanky enemies then you will inevitably have to reload before you are done killing all of them. This means that for actual high-level play sustained DPS is much more important than burst DPS.

 

People getting worked up and crying NERF! at numbers....

 

It's just that: NUMBERS. IN AN IDEAL SITUATION.

 

Effective damage is still alright.

 

It has: limited range, and you'll run out of ammo in a few seconds if you run with that build. Not to mention the crapton of effort you need to get that gun.

 

So....as an end-game, syndicate weapon....I'd say it's perfect.

Now we just need to bring Rakta Ballistica and Secura Dual Cestras up to the same level.

 

And it's a weapon you earn from Syndicates, of course you'd expect it to be powerful.

 

Well, in comparison it deals twice the DPS of the Vaykor Marelok at 21k DPS. If you expect that all syndicate weapons are going to be that powerful then the Vaykor Marelok actually needs a bit of a buff to something like 30k DPS to be comparable. This is just plain powercreep, even worse than the Soma, in my opinion.

 

Edit: The DPS numbers of my DPS calculator is slightly different from that what the warframe-builder is spitting out. Sometimes mine gives slightly larger numbers and sometimes it gives lower numbers. I am yet unsure why.

Edited December 4, 2014 by NullCurrent

[Divinehero]

Stay 60 min in a Surv 4 and it won't be broken. Needs balance for pvp, but why can't we enjoy its power in coop game?

 

ppl love to whine about anything they percieve as OP... which blows my mind in a game that's 95% PVE

[HAYABU5A]

gets given nice new weapon to enjoy

 

immediately complains on forums that the weapon is too nice

 

seems legit

 

this is why we cant have nice things

[HollowExistence]

Strong weapons are necessary! Awesome weapon love it. Great move De!

[Sea_Wall]

It's the max rank super bfg faction weapon people have been asking for. 

 

I really don't see it as that much better to the Phage. On paper it seems superior but the phage has double the range and can achieve Viral+Corrosive simultaneously which is the bee's knees for Voids. Also it's post  25M DPS is 0 burst 0 sustain.

 

Edit: Also OP made a convient non-seeker build. With seeker its 35K-31K. 

Edited December 4, 2014 by LegitBeastin

[SwiftPotato12]

Tatersail, on 04 Dec 2014 - 08:39 AM, said:

brakk has falloff, and Akbronco primes have more burst dps up to 90k ...

Telos Akbolto does about 55k burst damage and doesn't have the range limitations of Gammacor with a solid 42 clip.

but its true that Gammacor will have more sustained and better ammo economy.

tho I only see about 37k burst dps on this weapon so not sure how you got 47k!

and consider Akvasto and Akmagnus also have 40k burst damage

The random buffing of normal weapons and re-release does seem a bit strange balance wise.

nice to see some considerable buffs on bad weapons, like Hind

Not sure where you are getting those numbers... Infested Alad V's @$$ maybe? I can only get a good 55k burst out of Ak-Bronco Prime. Share your build please.

As for Synoid Gammacor, when I first saw this weapon I was like 'Damn I picked the wrong syndicate' as I wanted Vaykor Marelok or Rakta Ballistica. Now seeings its damage potential, and having tried out regular Gammacor, I'm really looking forward to it. Yes its a lot of standing. Yes its not another Brakk. What you all forget is, the game isn't just about numbers. Am I the only one that plays a game to have fun?

For comparison reasons, here is my Synoid Gammacor build: http://goo.gl/tVZ0rA And Sibarian's Brakk build: http://goo.gl/pSySF2 And my Ak-Bronco Prime build: http://goo.gl/hmQXZI

Edit #2: Ok now I'm seeing the 55k burst you spoke of with Telos Akbolto

Edited December 4, 2014 by SwiftPotato12

[letir]

We just need button to kill everything - that will be soooooo funny.

Edited December 4, 2014 by letir

[SwiftPotato12]

We just need button to kill everything - that will be soooooo funny.

Don't bring that argument here please...

[SwiftPotato12]

'DE NERF PLS'

[9IR_nullfield]

It's the max rank super bfg faction weapon people have been asking for. 

 

I really don't see it as that much better to the Phage. On paper it seems superior but the phage has double the range and can achieve Viral+Corrosive simultaneously which is the bee's knees for Voids. Also it's post  25M DPS is 0 burst 0 sustain.

 

Edit: Also OP made a convient non-seeker build. With seeker its 35K-31K. 

1. Nope, Phage and Gammacor have the same range (25m).

2. While Phage does have innate punchthrough (which is less than 0.5m, barely enough to go through a Shield Lancer's shield) and an inarguably better base damage type in Viral, its overall burst/sustained DPS is consistently half or less than that of the Synoid Gammacor. It's even lower if you factor in that the Phage has to waste time winding up, during which the damage is diluted into an AoE effect.

3. If you don't want to waste time focusing on every enemy, you have to walk around with the beams up, which is incredibly wasteful due to the scarcity of shotgun ammo. Meanwhile, the Synoid Gammacor can run max attack speed without any problems.

4. Don't forget about the Synoid Gammacor's built-in faction proc, which can restore 25% of your energy every minute or so.

5. Seeker is helpful on pistols, but not mandatory if you want more damage. On shotguns, Seeking Force can be difficult to slot due to all of the required mods shotguns have (Point Blank/Vicious Spread/Hell's Chamber/Blaze/Shotgun Spazz are all indispensable).

 

I love the Phage and it's by far my most used weapon, but it and the SG simply aren't in the same class. The focus time is a killer and can make it very hard to use effectively without sacrificing DPS or wasting all your ammo.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Rebulite

[letir]

Don't bring that argument here please...

It's solid argument. With new "one-shot-kill" weapon you will be free from all stupid restrictions, such as targeting, build constrution, etc.

 

It's about fun, not this boring stuff.

[democrator]

its not OP. considering that high DPS can only be achieved by high fire-rate, you will run need to reload often and the range is a nice limiter. if modded properly, brakk easily beats suda's gammacor

[R34LM]

The weapon gets a buff, now people yell nerf because the favorites are getting contenders...

[ra9una]

And this thread is why I didn't potato my gammacore when the buff came. I am clairvoyant (shut up I am!). So yes, I am saying I don't want it nerfed. It's fine. It's over the top, but it's a syndicate weapon, it should be over the top(according to me, but what do I know).

 

But, just, for fairness sake: Limited range, beam weapon, needs  340, 000 standing to get, magnetic damage.

[Tostov]

its not OP. considering that high DPS can only be achieved by high fire-rate, you will run need to reload often and the range is a nice limiter. if modded properly, brakk easily beats suda's gammacor

Spectra

Deals two fifths of the damage on burst, at ten less meters of range, for two and a half times the ammo consumption. It deals about a third of the sustained damage.

The poor spectra is useless compared to it.  

 

 

The weapon gets a buff, now people yell nerf because the favorites are getting contenders...

Well no. I mean, I'd love to see other pretty bad weapons get a buff too, but that's called power creep. Nerfing one thing a little is a lot easier than buffing every secondary bar 5 or so.

[democrator]

Spectra

Deals two fifths of the damage on burst, at ten less meters of range, for two and a half times the ammo consumption. It deals about a third of the sustained damage.

The poor spectra is useless compared to it.  

 

 

Well no. I mean, I'd love to see other pretty bad weapons get a buff too, but that's called power creep. Nerfing one thing a little is a lot easier than buffing every secondary bar 5 or so.

I can get spectra easily. Is it that simple to get SG? No, ofc not. And if its at the same level as spectra, Why would I bother spending time to get it? 

 

You can't have all the weapons doing the same DPS..some weapons have to be powerful depending on their mastery rank and difficulty to acquire them..just bcoz you have a contender for top spot doesn't mean it needs a nerf..either way, brakk is still powerful (and i agree to this since RNG farm is still harder)..and considering the amount of time and days that need to be spent to acquire SG, i think it deserves the stats..

 

And, by your argument - lets ask for buff to skana and put it in the same tier as dragon nikana.. mastery rank and difficulty to acquire don't mean anything, right?

Edited December 4, 2014 by democrator

[RiouHotaru]

The weapon doesn't have any kind of innate punch-through however, unless you're willing to sacrifice a mod-slot for Seeker.  Sure it can brutalize a target, but only a single target at a time, which doesn't help you when the infested are swarming.

 

Sure, theoretically this thing out-damages a lot of things, but I can hit more targets with the Brakk, and can hit things at longer range with Despair.

 

Pure numbers is great and all but hardly an indicator that this thing is the best secondary ever.

[alif3]

I dont understand this, why do kids have to scream nerf, why cant we just have something op and say ok this is op I like it, it fulfills the laser beam dream, is hard to get, and is the upgraded little brother to opticor please leave my lasers alone. We left soma and boltor primes op asses alone so we can certainly let a laser have fun for once

[Sea_Wall]

Yes it is superior to other beams weapons, as it should be.

 

It's max rank Syndicate weapon that shouldn't have to be on par with spectra or phage. It's competitors the Telos Akbolto and Mega Marelok both have infinite effective range and allow you to self rez with the proc.If anything this thread should be about buffing the Rakta Ballistica. 

[9IR_nullfield]

I can get spectra easily. Is it that simple to get SG? No, ofc not. And if its at the same level as spectra, Why would I bother spending time to get it? 

 

You can't have all the weapons doing the same DPS..some weapons have to be powerful depending on their mastery rank and difficulty to acquire them..just bcoz you have a contender for top spot doesn't mean it needs a nerf..either way, brakk is still powerful (and i agree to this since RNG farm is still harder)..and considering the amount of time and days that need to be spent to acquire SG, i think it deserves the stats..

 

And, by your argument - lets ask for buff to skana and put it in the same tier as dragon nikana.. mastery rank and difficulty to acquire don't mean anything, right?

I'll believe that power should be dependent solely on difficulty of acquisition when the Hate and the Boar (the regular Boar, not the Prime variant) are able to oneshot the Earth itself.

 

And, of course when the Rakta Ballistica, the Sancti Castanas, the Telos Akboltos, the Secura Dual Cestras, and the Vaykor Marelok are anywhere near the same power tier.

[Tostov]

I can get spectra easily. Is it that simple to get SG? No, ofc not. And if its at the same level as spectra, Why would I bother spending time to get it? 

 

You can't have all the weapons doing the same DPS..some weapons have to be powerful depending on their mastery rank and difficulty to acquire them..just bcoz you have a contender for top spot doesn't mean it needs a nerf..either way, brakk is still powerful (and i agree to this since RNG farm is still harder)..and considering the amount of time and days that need to be spent to acquire SG, i think it deserves the stats..

30k a day yeah? (I'm MR 14)

5k

22k

44k

99k

100k

Total: 270k rep

9 days. A forma, A blue potato, a glave prime blade and probably some annoying prime helmet (oh wait, frost prime, nvm, easy)

That is, assuming you're not already at max rank with cephalon, in which case it's 4 days.

"But 930 k for the rank increases"

730k if you get the shield restore for free and sell it.

Then 4 more days for getting a sheild restore 4 times and selling it, which convienetly has 5k left over each time, which shaves a day off the overall ranking.

13 days, so two 7 day boosters, with a bit under 3 hours of play each day gets you it. From a pretty much stationary standpoint.

Now, we'll excuse the fact that you need to get a lab and the associated research for the spectra, which will literally take nine or more days (fieldron, dera, spectra, 3 days each. Also requires a forma, 3 fieldrons (another day an a half of waiting, which doesn't really count). We need to make this assumption, because, if we don't, it immediately looses the acquisition race, that, and if you're MR 14, you should already have a energy lab.

Now that syndicate weapons are tradeable, you can buy the syndroid gammacor. Instant. Not even sure there's a MR limit on it either, so have fun with that.

Now then, which one is harder to obtain? Which one is more damaging? Which one is more ammo efficient? The Gammacor pretty much wins all three.

And to those who complain that its fine and we should just buff other weapons? Okay, there's about thirty or so that are completely obsoleted by it. Please buff them too. They don't have to do the same dps, but they do need to actually perform within any region of the syndroid gammacor.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Tostov

[democrator]

Now that syndicate weapons are tradeable, you can buy the syndroid gammacor. Instant. Not even sure there's a MR limit on it either, so have fun with that.

 

Yea, the syndicate weapons should be made untradable unless you achieve max rank in atleast one of them, IMO.. that's a different argument though..

 

If you got to MR14, I assume you had a clan and have all the research complete. Atleast that's how it is for me. You assumed that its easier to get SG because currently, you are MR14. If you are a new players, you don't have the same affinity cap. So it takes much longer and not to mention things like - blue potato is rare (unless bought). Forma is quite easy to get but the other parts have a certain amount of RNG involved. Compared to this, spectra is easier to get which does not involve spending any plat to rush/buy anything.

Edited December 4, 2014 by democrator

[Tatersail]

Not sure where you are getting those numbers... Infested Alad V's @$$ maybe? I can only get a good 55k burst out of Ak-Bronco Prime. Share your build please.

 

 

http://goo.gl/Y1fuJd 120k vs ancients, but it quickly becomes about killing in clip, and in reality you would use a 68k dps http://goo.gl/dn5I5l build with longer burst.

 

Your using an Impact mod in your build.

general rule of thumb, sell your Impact Puncture and Slash mods, they don't work in this game.

only the 120% event IPS mods add any meaningful damage, and only on a very few weapons vs a specific faction.

 

Telos akbolto is amazing because it has really high burst for such a long time, also the reason Gammacor is so strong.

 

 

the burst damage vs sustained damage is an old argument, and is really level based.

Burst beats sustained till the moment your forced to reload with something still alive (eg Akvasto always beats Marelok till health scales up and forces akvasto to reload)

 

I would argue that Lanka has the highest "damage in the game" because till quite high levels its simply a 1 shot, and instant death in my opinion is high dps!

 

 

we don't fight raid content that takes 5-10 mins to kill a single target so sustained dps is mostly meaningless.

Edited December 4, 2014 by Tatersail