I Dearly Hope The Soma Prime Isn't More Powerful Than The Other Prime Weapons.

[Tostov]

I'm pretty sure that PvP is near the bottom on DE's list of priorities.

 

What's wrong with the invincibility reworks?

 

Power creep is just the negative and buzzword-esque way of saying power progression. Power progression is not inherently bad. The issue is that DE hasn't set up a clear tier list so everyone just arbitrarily draws lines and and compares weapons that are clearly not on the same tier.

In the case you're wondering why weapons getting better and better is a poor idea, at least specifically for warframe, is pretty simple.

Warframe durability isn't getting better and better over time. Its constant. Enemies aren't getting better and better over time (debatable of course, considering tar moa) (endless modes don't count, because the way they scale in them isn't getting stronger and stronger over time). Warframe abillites aren't getting better and better over time (infact, most are getting worse and worse).

And that's the issue. Only weapons are creeping up in power over time. We're not really getting difficult content to balance it out either. And if we did? Well, then it takes the same time to kill as earlier weapons, but now we die to them five times as fast, because we're not getting any survivability upgrades. Frames without utility are useless against new content, because their abilities aren't scaling with our better and better weapons.

And that's why better and better weapons isn't good for warframe.

[Innocent_Flower]

Prime/dragon weapons on one tier. 

Wraith/vandal weapons on another

Tenno weapons on... A fat tier. They're supposed to be weapons for elite warriors so It'd make sense for them to be created with masterful craftsmanship. A lot of tenno weapons are balanced well against eachother. There are a few outliers (soma, skana) but they're otherwise similar in strength. 

 

Outdated weapons on a tier (braton, burston) 

Mk-1 weapons on a tier. 

 

Grineer,corpus and infested weapons everywhere based on how much they cost and who uses them. A weapon used by officers/elites (marelok) would be different in quality to a weapon used by fodder (grakata)

 

It's reasonably simple. Or at least it should be. 

Edited December 6, 2014 by Innocent_Flower

[sanj66]

Yeah man. I totaly wanted mk1 to be equal to dragon aksoma prime.That's what I meant by balance

 

Sheesh.

Weapons with similar crafting difficulty should be equal. 

Also: it'd make story sense to have all prime weapons equal to each-other, and all tenno weapons equal to eachother (at least the ones without dex or dragon or vandal or whatever) It'd make gameplay sense to have prime weapons equal to eachother; Since they're about as difficult to build as eachother (or would be, were drop tables not so skewed) 

 

 

The further apart the power levels, the less accessible the game becomes, both to new players who can't play the newer, increasingly powerful content and the old players, who have to make amendments to their gear if they even want a challenge on a lower level game. 

this is the problem no one is looking at, you cannot have prime variants being comparable when the non prime versions are not. that would mean possibly either a huge buff for some, or a nerf for others, to bring it down to the level of a "lower" prime weapon. then the question would be asked, why would i bother with a lamer prime version if my non prime version is better? you cannot have prime variants being equal to each other if the non prime versions are not, it would be either too much of a buff, the boltor being the elephant in the room here, or you would have to nerf a weapon where it is either not worth getting as a prime. the way i look at it is the prime versions were meant to be re worked and improved version of existing weapons, if the original weapons are not comparable, cant expect the prime versions to be on the same level. also you cant expect all tenno weapons to be on the same power level either as the whole mastery lock on weapons would be pointless other than play style and would be unfair to those who prefer the play style of the higher mastery locked weapon.

[MirageKnight]

I feel it would be safer to say that new weapons being improvements over older, established, and existing ones, isn't a good idea.

[Rorgal_Sina]

Guys guys guys. Progression is good. Some weapons obviously need to be better than others. Mk1 Braton should never be on par with Prime weapons.

 

 

But we can't just have ONE weapon that is WAY better than everything else. In this case, a set of guns.

 

Out of the nearly 200 weapons we have ingame, less than 30 is considered "viable".

 

The very fact that people consider the rest "mastery fodder" tells us why too much powercreep is BAD.

 

Trivalizes content that DE is trying to aim for. Makes a large percent of the game even more grindy (mastery fodding).  Reduces variety and diversity.

 

Just so people can have more numbers. I have no idea why players would want powercreep. Yes, there can be progression, but most weapons should be viable in one way or another.

 

Shotguns don't have their use.

Snipers don't have their use.

Energy Weapons don't have their use.

80% of the melee don't have their use.

 

 

If you guys want powercreep so much, why not just ask for a weapon with these stats?

 

Base Damage: 10000000000000000000

Firerate: 20

Accuracy: 100

Crit Chance: 200%

Crit Damage: 10x

Status: 100%

Magazine: Infinite

Ammo: Infinite

[MirageKnight]

Bit of an exaggeration there, but I do see your point.

[sanj66]

Guys guys guys. Progression is good. Some weapons obviously need to be better than others. Mk1 Braton should never be on par with Prime weapons.

 

 

But we can't just have ONE weapon that is WAY better than everything else. In this case, a set of guns.

 

Out of the nearly 200 weapons we have ingame, less than 30 is considered "viable".

 

The very fact that people consider the rest "mastery fodder" tells us why too much powercreep is BAD.

 

Trivalizes content that DE is trying to aim for. Makes a large percent of the game even more grindy (mastery fodding).  Reduces variety and diversity.

 

Just so people can have more numbers. I have no idea why players would want powercreep. Yes, there can be progression, but most weapons should be viable in one way or another.

 

Shotguns don't have their use.

Snipers don't have their use.

Energy Weapons don't have their use.

80% of the melee don't have their use.

 

 

If you guys want powercreep so much, why not just ask for a weapon with these stats?

 

Base Damage: 10000000000000000000

Firerate: 20

Accuracy: 100

Crit Chance: 200%

Crit Damage: 10x

Status: 100%

Magazine: Infinite

Ammo: Infinite

well you forgot to look at it from the converse, if only a set of guns and less than 30 weapons are considered viable, then ever thought it isnt the problem of those 30 odd but the 170 odd? to me this is hte solution the mastery ranking of weapons need to be redone, for the current weapons they need to be redistributed between mr 1-10, and newer weapons added for above mr10. you would more find the higher mr players wanting to do the longer runs as they have been there done that, so to do the endless stuff etc you make the guns available to the higher mr players, its both a reward for reaching that high, it sticks within the whole mr tiering of weapons they had set out for plus it gives you something to go further into endless missions and play more and push your wave count/survival time more.

[SquirmyBurrito]

Guys guys guys. Progression is good. Some weapons obviously need to be better than others. Mk1 Braton should never be on par with Prime weapons.

 

 

But we can't just have ONE weapon that is WAY better than everything else. In this case, a set of guns.

 

Out of the nearly 200 weapons we have ingame, less than 30 is considered "viable".

 

The very fact that people consider the rest "mastery fodder" tells us why too much powercreep is BAD.

 

Trivalizes content that DE is trying to aim for. Makes a large percent of the game even more grindy (mastery fodding).  Reduces variety and diversity.

 

Just so people can have more numbers. I have no idea why players would want powercreep. Yes, there can be progression, but most weapons should be viable in one way or another.

 

Shotguns don't have their use.

Snipers don't have their use.

Energy Weapons don't have their use.

80% of the melee don't have their use.

 

 

If you guys want powercreep so much, why not just ask for a weapon with these stats?

 

Base Damage: 10000000000000000000

Firerate: 20

Accuracy: 100

Crit Chance: 200%

Crit Damage: 10x

Status: 100%

Magazine: Infinite

Ammo: Infinite

 

1. Most weapons are actually perfectly fine when assigned an intended content range (maybe level 10-15?).

2. When most people say 'viable' and 'mastery fodder' they're referring to how the weapon holds up in late-game content.

3. Those weapons are considered viable because they are part of the top tier weapon group and can perform well in high-end content.

4. Mastery rank is largely irrelevant so the grind associated with it is too.

5. No, most weapons should not remain viable in late-game content. If that was the case most weapons would completely steamroll the entirety of the game with the one exception being long T4 and endless game modes. There needs to be progression, and with progression comes mastery fodder.

 

Shotguns are in need of re-balancing.

Sniper Rifles are honestly just out of their element in this horde mode-esque game.

The Synoid gammacor disagrees.

See point #2. A melee weapon that can remain viable in late-game content is going to be massively overpowered when compared to the rest of this game's content.

 

No, we want power progression, not power creep. The only ones bringing up power creep are the people (like you) with the inability to understand what progression is and how it is necessary in this game. 

[fatpig84]

I will laugh really hard if Soma Prime gets base 35% crit rate.

 

Because that is how the old Soma used to roll.

[sanj66]

1. Most weapons are actually perfectly fine when assigned an intended content range (maybe level 10-15?).

2. When most people say 'viable' and 'mastery fodder' they're referring to how the weapon holds up in late-game content.

3. Those weapons are considered viable because they are part of the top tier weapon group and can perform well in high-end content.

4. Mastery rank is largely irrelevant so the grind associated with it is too.

5. No, most weapons should not remain viable in late-game content. If that was the case most weapons would completely steamroll the entirety of the game with the one exception being long T4 and endless game modes. There needs to be progression, and with progression comes mastery fodder.

 

Shotguns are in need of re-balancing.

Sniper Rifles are honestly just out of their element in this horde mode-esque game.

The Synoid gammacor disagrees.

See point #2. A melee weapon that can remain viable in late-game content is going to be massively overpowered when compared to the rest of this game's content.

 

No, we want power progression, not power creep. The only ones bringing up power creep are the people (like you) with the inability to understand what progression is and how it is necessary in this game. 

i never thought i would ever agree with you but i do on this. mastery rank relevance though needs to be reworked and something done to post mr 8 is it? the highest mr to get a weapon atm, there is also only one way to make mr relevant to game play and that would be a storyline where the mr works similar to like questing level so your weapons are relative to the content you play and balanced around that. however de tries to adopt a sort of sand park theme where they do not force you through specific channels to get to "late game" which then makes mastery rank above a level irrelevant, for now, or with buying weapons with plat irrelevant. certain weapon types need reworking, shotguns and snipers, i would even say bows, being the one change i would make would be similar to the opticor, make the bow able to shoot an arrow with minimal if any draw time but at a reduced damage. but the mr system and weapon mr locks also need to be revisited, some were done before but they need to be revisited now. oh btw intended content range is the star chart so max around level 40 or so.

Edited December 6, 2014 by sanj66

[Davoodoo]

1. Most weapons are actually perfectly fine when assigned an intended content range (maybe level 10-15?).

2. When most people say 'viable' and 'mastery fodder' they're referring to how the weapon holds up in late-game content.

3. Those weapons are considered viable because they are part of the top tier weapon group and can perform well in high-end content.

4. Mastery rank is largely irrelevant so the grind associated with it is too.

5. No, most weapons should not remain viable in late-game content. If that was the case most weapons would completely steamroll the entirety of the game with the one exception being long T4 and endless game modes. There needs to be progression, and with progression comes mastery fodder.

 

Shotguns are in need of re-balancing.

Sniper Rifles are honestly just out of their element in this horde mode-esque game.

The Synoid gammacor disagrees.

See point #2. A melee weapon that can remain viable in late-game content is going to be massively overpowered when compared to the rest of this game's content.

 

No, we want power progression, not power creep. The only ones bringing up power creep are the people (like you) with the inability to understand what progression is and how it is necessary in this game. 

Ive been running with mk1 braton into t4 def few times already to prove a point, non endless t4 missions are balanced around 3k dps, thats when i found them somewhat difficult.

 

and i cant honestly agree with your 1st point, its pretty normal to use best possible weapon no matter what. 100lvl on any mmo wont pick 15lvl green just to go into 15lvl instance, that would be insane. It natural to strive for the best so unique niche weapons which arent top tier are wasted and top tier also doesnt even have most generic guns

 

and also im not sure if 4th is what you really want, you really want for new player to go into game, see that nice weapon he wants and then be forced to play all this crap he never wanted?? i cant imagine anyone being happy with mastery rank locking, this system should be replaced by something else.

Edited December 6, 2014 by Davoodoo

[sanj66]

Ive been running with mk1 braton into t4 def few times already to prove a point, non endless t4 missions are balanced around 3k dps, thats when i found them somewhat difficult.

 

and i cant honestly agree with your 1st point, its pretty normal to use best possible weapon no matter what. 100lvl on any mmo wont pick 15lvl green just to go into 15lvl instance, that would be insane. It natural to strive for the best so unique niche weapons which arent top tier are wasted and top tier also doesnt even have most generic guns

 

and also im not sure if 4th is what you really want, you really want for new player to go into game, see that nice weapon he wants and then be forced to play all this crap he never wanted?? i cant imagine anyone being happy with mastery rank locking, this system should be replaced by something else.

if there is no mastery rank lock then what is the point of progressive acquiring of higher tiered weapons? then that means a mastery rank 0 person can be running around with a marelok, opticor/soma/boltor prime/penta/ogris etc and a dragon nikana, then what would be hte point of progressive game play. there would be none as from the beginning you can already get the best gear and the play time of the game would diminish along with its player base. the mastery rank lock system is the method de used to replace the level lock system in traditional games, lvl 10 gear, lvl 20 etc, the mastery rank system doesnt need to be replace it really needs to be reworked, weapons redistributed and newer weapons added to make higher mastery relevant other than showing off a high mastery rank number.

[DSpite]

Better now than after realease where everyone's like "I paid 5151 plats for the parts and got to mastery rank x and grinded 310 hours and rankied the gun to 40 and put potatoes and formas on:  YOU CAN'T NERF MY GAME BRAKINGLY OP GUN Cause I put money and effort in

 

Besides. It's not really a "complaint" thread. More of a suggestion/Feedback thread. 

 

None of your threads are feedback. Also "feedback" needs SOMETHING to feed BACK on.

 

Not having any data? and still starting a thread? not feedback.

[JakeRobber]

Soma Prime should be high MR locked from the jump.  I don't like how Soma's MR was changed after people already had it, and I don't like the idea of increasing Boltor Prime's MR.  If it's high MR locked when it's released, then it's fair for everyone.

[Innocent_Flower]

We don't need more "power progression". 

 

We don't need another 'tier' of content; We need the current 'tiers' of content to be more interesting. 

[SquirmyBurrito]

i never thought i would ever agree with you but i do on this. mastery rank relevance though needs to be reworked and something done to post mr 8 is it? the highest mr to get a weapon atm, there is also only one way to make mr relevant to game play and that would be a storyline where the mr works similar to like questing level so your weapons are relative to the content you play and balanced around that. however de tries to adopt a sort of sand park theme where they do not force you through specific channels to get to "late game" which then makes mastery rank above a level irrelevant, for now, or with buying weapons with plat irrelevant. certain weapon types need reworking, shotguns and snipers, i would even say bows, being the one change i would make would be similar to the opticor, make the bow able to shoot an arrow with minimal if any draw time but at a reduced damage. but the mr system and weapon mr locks also need to be revisited, some were done before but they need to be revisited now. oh btw intended content range is the star chart so max around level 40 or so.

 

I guess there is a first time for everything.

 

Ive been running with mk1 braton into t4 def few times already to prove a point, non endless t4 missions are balanced around 3k dps, thats when i found them somewhat difficult.

 

and i cant honestly agree with your 1st point, its pretty normal to use best possible weapon no matter what. 100lvl on any mmo wont pick 15lvl green just to go into 15lvl instance, that would be insane. It natural to strive for the best so unique niche weapons which arent top tier are wasted and top tier also doesnt even have most generic guns

 

and also im not sure if 4th is what you really want, you really want for new player to go into game, see that nice weapon he wants and then be forced to play all this crap he never wanted?? i cant imagine anyone being happy with mastery rank locking, this system should be replaced by something else.

 

And what point is that? I could take a Lato into a T4 def and kill stuff, that doesn't make the Lato any less trash tier.

 

Your statement does not contradict my first point. My first point was a statement of fact. The Lato isn't all that bad is you only compare it to how well it does against really low level enemies.

 

Yes, I do. Otherwise there is no reason for anything other than the absolute top tier weapons to exist. If a new player can immediately get and use whatever top tier weapon they want, DE would either need to buff all weapons to fit that top tier (and would then need to do another massive enemy level compression) or they need to delete all weapons that aren't top tier. As you said in your second 'paragraph', it is pretty normal to use [the] best possible weapon no matter what. I do not disagree with the Mastery Rank system needing to be replace (or revamped).

Edited December 6, 2014 by SquirmyBurrito

[Davoodoo]

if there is no mastery rank lock then what is the point of progressive acquiring of higher tiered weapons? then that means a mastery rank 0 person can be running around with a marelok, opticor/soma/boltor prime/penta/ogris etc and a dragon nikana, then what would be hte point of progressive game play. there would be none as from the beginning you can already get the best gear and the play time of the game would diminish along with its player base. the mastery rank lock system is the method de used to replace the level lock system in traditional games, lvl 10 gear, lvl 20 etc, the mastery rank system doesnt need to be replace it really needs to be reworked, weapons redistributed and newer weapons added to make higher mastery relevant other than showing off a high mastery rank number.

Im not saying that progression is bad, im saying that progression in warframe is bad.

 

If there is no mastery rank lock, then maybe we can introduce something that would be easier accepted by new player, no matter how much you want to bash typical lvls, they wont force players to play with what they dont want.

If you want to keep mastery system elements then gr8, make progression which is boosted by using stuff you havent yet used.

[sanj66]

Im not saying that progression is bad, im saying that progression in warframe is bad.

 

If there is no mastery rank lock, then maybe we can introduce something that would be easier accepted by new player, no matter how much you want to bash typical lvls, they wont force players to play with what they dont want.

If you want to keep mastery system elements then gr8, make progression which is boosted by using stuff you havent yet used.

the problem would be easiest solved if lets say every 2 mr you have a weapon of each type for a player to pick from, so there is mr 2 assault rifle, burst rifle, rocket launcher, grenade launcher, cross bow, etc that way all play types are satisfied and you can progress through your play style, you rank up to get better assault rifles or a better bow etc, i honestly like the weapon system of blacklight, sadly yea its a pwe game, one gun can be built into any type of gun you want, but to revamp weapons into parts would be a bit too drastic for de, the best choice would be to fill out weapon types for low to high tiers, and mastery rank lock them relevantly so that at each progression of mr you can suit your play style and not be forced to adopt a particular gun not because you have to but because you want to.

[Davoodoo]

the problem would be easiest solved if lets say every 2 mr you have a weapon of each type for a player to pick from, so there is mr 2 assault rifle, burst rifle, rocket launcher, grenade launcher, cross bow, etc that way all play types are satisfied and you can progress through your play style, you rank up to get better assault rifles or a better bow etc, i honestly like the weapon system of blacklight, sadly yea its a pwe game, one gun can be built into any type of gun you want, but to revamp weapons into parts would be a bit too drastic for de, the best choice would be to fill out weapon types for low to high tiers, and mastery rank lock them relevantly so that at each progression of mr you can suit your play style and not be forced to adopt a particular gun not because you have to but because you want to.

Thats tiering and thats what ive been asking for past year and a half on these forums.

 

But does it really solve the problem, even if every tier consists of all weapon types, you wont rank up by using only 2 or 3 weapon types which you might like, you will probably go through half of the types to get to high rank.

This is the thing i would like removed from game, if someone likes shotguns let them acquire better ones without forcing him to play sniper.

 

To get to mr18 i needed to lvl every weapon and frame in game, if i would rate experience it would range from @(*()$ awful disaster to ive never had better time, i would like everyone to have ability to choose "ive never had better time" as their overall experience.

Edited December 7, 2014 by Davoodoo

[sanj66]

Thats tiering and thats what ive been asking for past year and a half on these forums.

 

But does it really solve the problem, even if every tier consists of all weapon types, you wont rank up by using only 2 or 3 weapon types which you might like, you will probably go through half of the types to get to high rank.

This is the thing i would like removed from game, if someone likes shotguns let them acquire better ones without forcing him to play sniper.

 

To get to mr18 i needed to lvl every weapon and frame in game, if i would rate experience it would range from @(*()$ awful disaster to ive never had better time, i would like everyone to have ability to choose "ive never had better time" as their overall experience.

well the thing is each weapon i would like to believe requires the same amount of affinity to rank from 1-30,and gives a specific amount of points to your mr bar right. it could be converted to an xp based system, as the profile shows how much xp you weapon has attained through use. there fore based off of your xp mastery points can be awarded, that itself though would have some minor or just plain and simple issues to iron out i guess. that way using your example if i like shotguns and i get to mr2, i obtain the first tier above the mk-1 shotgun, and i can continually gain mr points through the continual xp i gain from continual use of my mr2 shotgun if i so desire to stick to that alone.

Edited December 7, 2014 by sanj66

[Davoodoo]

well the thing is each weapon i would like to believe requires the same amount of affinity to rank from 1-30,and gives a specific amount of points to your mr bar right. it could be converted to an xp based system, as the profile shows how much xp you weapon has attained through use. there fore based off of your xp mastery points can be awarded, that itself though would have some minor or just plain and simple issues to iron out i guess. that way using your example if i like shotguns and i get to mr2, i obtain the first tier above the mk-1 shotgun, and i can continually gain mr points through the continual xp i gain from continual use of my mr2 shotgun if i so desire to stick to that alone.

And thats what i consider solid progression system and improvement over mastery ranks as we have them now.

Edited December 7, 2014 by Davoodoo

[Sakatchi]

I like threads like this.

 

The games progressing, and that means enemines are getting stronger, so we need stronger weapons right? But people think thats power creep isntead of progression, and want everything to be the same as it was in closed beta.

So what, are we to all use mk1 brantons in t4 survival and plink at heavy gunners and hide behind cover while we run out of air, because every gun needs to be the same to cater to your idea of balance?

 

God forbid weapons scale along with the enemies in those modes, actually completing missions is op.

[ADJCENT]

It's going to be Boltor Prime all over again.

[Rorgal_Sina]

Is there ever a gun you really liked, because of its stats, uniqueness, look, or function? Do you ever feel sad that you won't be able to take it throughout the game just because it's rated "trash" tier?

 

It's a shame that interesting weapons like Dera, Dragkoon, Miter, or Ignis will never be used due to their "tier", and everyone will be using generic assault rifles with no weaknesses at all. Funny thing is, even the Soma Prime is going to be overshadowed by something even stronger, and eventually all your "favorite weapons", like Brakk, Synoid Gammacor, Vaykor Marelok, Latron Prime, Paris Prime, Boltor Prime, Penta, Ogris, and Dread are going to be overshadowed.

 

Look, they have just become mastery fodder, because something is going to be "superior" in every way possible, and maybe even more generic. Don't even say that their tier isn't high enough. Every player strives to reach high level content. No one stays at low level content for long, eventually meaning that no one isn't going to use anything else other than the "best" either.

 

Enemies get powerful, by coordination and utility. Look at the new Infested units. They aren't bullet soakers, they're more unique. Basing  difficulty on enemy level will mean that DE intends to balance tiering way past wave 50 or 50 minutes. The idea of Damage: 100000000000000 won't seem that bad then.

 

Why do Snipers suck when Bows don't? Why don't they have a place when Bows do? Why do Bows do more damage?

By energy weapons, I was given the Synoid Gammacore. Out of all energy weapons, I was given a this gun as an example. That means we are forgetting about the Dera, Supra, Flux Rifle, Spectra, Prova, Tetra, Lanka, Cestras, Glaxion.... Yes, just because those are considered "trash" tier, let's not even care. Lets just care how a "few" boring weapons are good, while everything else, no matter how unique, should stay bad. Look at the Gorgon. A unique light machine gun with high recoil, low accuracy, big magazine, and a satisfying spool up time. Oh wait, DE just released a Soma with more damage, less recoil, high accuracy, bigger magazine, and shorter spool up time. And that's the story of how the Gorgon would never shine again, and left forgotten with the excuse that is should remain "trash" tier.

 

80% of the melee don't have their use. Because they're almost the same. Slightly different damage, slightly different speed. What, we have like, Dark Sword, Heat Sword, Ether Sword, Pangolin Sword, Jaw Sword, Cronus, and Skana? I can't tell much difference between those weapons. Oh yeah, the daggers and dual daggers. Lets not even talk about those. But forget about them, because they're "trash" tier.

 

Progression is good, ok? But it appears you guys intend to base it on infinite survival or defence modes, making it so that you can continuously make better guns until it scales with lvl 9999 enemies. You guys talk about power progression, when there isn't even balance within the "same" tiers.

 

Burst weapons don't match up to other weapons of the same tier. Look at the Burston. Compare it to a Latron. Welp.

 

Energy weapons (projectile) don't have a use when hitscan weapons do the same. Look at Dera vs. Karak. Dera is even clantech, and requires forma.

 

Snipers are considered useless, while Bows have punchthrough and more crit. Just these two factors make the Bow good. That means Snipers can be improved, no?

 

These different classes of weapons aren't even balanced amongst each other, but yeah, lets just ask for a weapon that scales "slightly" better in "infinite" Survival or Defence. Oh wait, lets not even consider balancing at all. (At least Braton Prime got what it deserved.)

 

PS: No sane person longing for "balance" expect EVERY weapon to be balanced with each other. There should obviously be tiers, so don't even try to bring that up as a counter example.

[MirageKnight]

God forbid weapons scale along with the enemies in those modes, actually completing missions is op.

 

I'd rather see enemies scale in more interesting ways, such as increased accuracy, awareness, using abilities more often, using more varied weapons, etc....as opposed to what we have now which merely amounts to just adding tacking on HP and damage to make them more "challenging" and calling it a day.

 

The Grineer Trooper you can easily kill on Mercury is a real bullet sponge once you start hitting higher level maps, which is just a bit silly and only helps perpetuate the weapon problems we have.