The Kohm Is Barely A Shotgun Now.

[CHunterX]

I can't think of any other way to describe it. It's just stupid. Sure, the damage was doubled, but it barely functions as a shotgun now. Anything below max wind-up has almost zero spread, and at full wind-up being only five "pellets" means you won't be hitting anything. All without Tainted Shell, mind you. Can you just nerf the visual effects more rather than destroy what made the gun unique?

Otherwise, RIP Kohm, you're just another generic gun.

[DiabolusUrsus]

And it worked as a shotgun before? 

 

Further increased ammo efficiency = good.

 

The Hek only has two more pellets per shot and *isn't* automatic.

 

It's still perfectly possible to hit enemies with the Kohm. Have you actually tried it out, or are you just reading the paper changes? 

[CHunterX]

And it worked as a shotgun before? 

 

Further increased ammo efficiency = good.

 

The Hek only has two more pellets per shot and *isn't* automatic.

 

It's still perfectly possible to hit enemies with the Kohm. Have you actually tried it out, or are you just reading the paper changes? 

It was amazing as a shotgun pre-15.13, are you high? Did you even use it? Ammo efficiency wasn't even remotely an issue with Ammo Mutation. That thing spread hot lead everywhere, now its a puny trail of 3 "pellets" unless wound up to max.

And yes, I've been testing it post-patch. Even with Shotgun Spazz the thing fires way too slowly for a max of only 5 "pellets" that spread like nonsense.

Edited February 6, 2015 by CHunterX

[Cat_Jam]

That guy using Hek as an example made me rofl.

 

Bet he doesn't even realise the Hek has a syndicate mod, either.

[egregiousRac]

That guy using Hek as an example made me rofl.

 

Bet he doesn't even realise the Hek has a syndicate mod, either.

 

The Kohm is one of the most powerful weapons in the game. It far outclasses any other automatic primary. As such, damage output is not an issue.

If the issue is the usability of five pellets, the comparison with the seven-pellet Hek is entirely justified.

 

I feel that the Kohm is not as effective as it was before because you are no-longer filling hallways with clouds of death, but it is still extremely strong.

[VKhaun]

Not much difference between a ton of pellets and an inaccurate LMG with a higher fire rate.

 

It was never a shotgun IMO.

[bl4ckhunter]

now it'an assault rifle with multishot but you don't need a mutation anymore wich is good and should result in a straight dps buff, besides they had no choice but do it like this since it was messing with the game's engine

[MetalDead]

Not much difference between a ton of pellets and an inaccurate LMG with a higher fire rate.

 

It was never a shotgun IMO.

So essentially a shotgun.

[MechaTails]

I don't care what you guys want to call the weapons in this game, the point is Kohm isn't the same weapon anymore.

 

It used to be a broken fire hydrant that melted mobs like piles of sugar, accuracy be damned, you didn't need it. Now it's a spittling garden hose.

 

It feels like crap, not fun to use or look at anymore.

 

I am totally exaggerating out of grief. lol

Edited February 6, 2015 by DarkTails

[VKhaun]

So essentially a shotgun.

As much a shotgun as any other LMG. Yes. Essentially.

[Noble_Cactus]

I don't care what you guys want to call the weapons in this game, the point is Kohm isn't the same weapon anymore.

 

It used to be a broken fire hydrant that melted mobs like piles of sugar, accuracy be damned, you didn't need it. Now it's a spittling garden hose.

 

It feels like crap, not fun to use or look at anymore.

 

Perhaps you're just exaggerating and using the weapon ineffectively.

[MechaTails]

Perhaps you're just exaggerating and using the weapon ineffectively.

 

Yes, I was exaggerating and using it ineffectively. Now that I had a sandwich and had time to tweak it, it's still a sweet weapon, just not as visually satisfying.

 

"Maybe you're just not enjoying the weapon effectively."

 

FFFFFFFFFFFFF- lol

Edited February 6, 2015 by DarkTails

[geninrising]

+1 op.

 

My kohm lost 14k damage in this nerf.

[DiabolusUrsus]

It was amazing as a shotgun pre-15.13, are you high? Did you even use it? Ammo efficiency wasn't even remotely an issue with Ammo Mutation. That thing spread hot lead everywhere, now its a puny trail of 3 "pellets" unless wound up to max.

And yes, I've been testing it post-patch. Even with Shotgun Spazz the thing fires way too slowly for a max of only 5 "pellets" that spread like nonsense.

 

Didn't say it wasn't an amazing weapon. I just think it functioned more akin to a machine gun than a shotgun. Rapid-fire low damage-per shot rather than lower rate-of-fire high damage per shot. Yes, I used it. You're grossly exaggerating about ammo efficiency, unless you're talking a Kohm that's been potatoed and Formaed to reach its highest damage potential. As a weapon in its own right, though, I don't think it really qualified as a "shotgun," and it needed both a maxed ammo mutation and shotgun scavenger to keep up with its ammo consumption when fully spooled. 

 

That guy using Hek as an example made me rofl.

 

Bet he doesn't even realise the Hek has a syndicate mod, either.

 

So the Hek isn't a shotgun? The Syndicate mod doesn't change the context, either, given that with the OP mentioning "five pellets per shot at max" we're not including multishot in the consideration. I'm not trying to say that one weapon is better or worse than the other, just that the Kohm functions more closely to what one would expect of a "shotgun" now than it did before. 

[Blaze200]

Didn't say it wasn't an amazing weapon. I just think it functioned more akin to a machine gun than a shotgun. Rapid-fire low damage-per shot rather than lower rate-of-fire high damage per shot. Yes, I used it. You're grossly exaggerating about ammo efficiency, unless you're talking a Kohm that's been potatoed and Formaed to reach its highest damage potential. As a weapon in its own right, though, I don't think it really qualified as a "shotgun," and it needed both a maxed ammo mutation and shotgun scavenger to keep up with its ammo consumption when fully spooled. 

 

By that logic boar prime isn't a shotgun either. Or its just an automatic shotgun which is how the Kohm basically was with a special mechanic tied to its rate of fire. All shotguns dont have to be slow rate of fire high single shot damage weapons, other than that I feel that could of lowered the effects of the pellets instead of reducing the number, or removed the wind up time to get the max number of pellets.

[CHunterX]

You're grossly exaggerating about ammo efficiency, unless you're talking a Kohm that's been potatoed and Formaed to reach its highest damage potential. As a weapon in its own right, though, I don't think it really qualified as a "shotgun," and it needed both a maxed ammo mutation and shotgun scavenger to keep up with its ammo consumption when fully spooled.

I compare all weapons at their maximum capability, not their base, unpotatoed form. That would be nonsense. If spraying 10 "pellets" per click isn't a shotgun, then I don't know how you possibly define "shotgun."

[Hatzeputt]

Derp post 

Move along nothing to see

Edited February 6, 2015 by Hatzeputt

[OvAeons]

the pellet nerf was WAY too harsh, from the moment i used it on second iteration i loved the gun. Sure the damage is still there but it barely functions now... i have used new Kohm for a few hours (previous one used for a lot longer) and 90% of the pellets miss on full wind up, you use to be able to get it wound up then shoot it semi auto would concentrate the pellets into a nice volley, that is how i used it and it was effective without being over powered. I never spray and prayed with it on full auto wind up, no skill in it so not really fun..

 

Kohm is still decent at best, lost A LOT of damage even if the numbers are there, it is not Kohm anymore. Does not feel pleasing to use anymore with the bullet count... kohm was almost the only reason i still played cause it was actually fun to use!

Edited February 6, 2015 by OvAeons

[Nerevar22g]

hek has only 2 more projectiles, but it is hitscan and very accurate, considering how  "accurate" kohm is, plus slow travel time, means you cant hit a damn thing now -.-

[DiabolusUrsus]

I compare all weapons at their maximum capability, not their base, unpotatoed form. That would be nonsense. If spraying 10 "pellets" per click isn't a shotgun, then I don't know how you possibly define "shotgun."

 

I'd argue that it's people who go around using min-maxed gear as a baseline for performance are a large part of why the game is so unbalanced right now. DE has said multiple times before that the game isn't supposed to be adjusted around the higher levels found in endless scaling, which is the only place on the starchart you'd need that sort of resource investment in your weapons. 

 

I didn't say that "spraying 10 pellets per click isn't a shotgun," but spraying five pellets per click isn't any less of a shotgun. You said that it "barely functions as a shotgun now," which isn't true. You also said [we] wouldn't be hitting anything on account of it having fewer pellets, which also isn't true. Your entire premise is ridiculous.

 

Pellet count? Both the Sobek and Tigris have fewer pellets, Sweeper only has six, and Hek only has two more. The Boar/Prime, Strun/Wraith, and Drakgoon all have more, but those weapons are either discontinued, Prime, or semi-automatic.

 

Damage? It still has 77 damage - more damage per pellet than the Boar Prime. 

 

Mechanics? It's still got innate punch-through, pellet bounce, and a complete lack of damage falloff. 

 

Uniqueness? Before it was basically just an automatic Drakgoon that came with a spool-up instead of a charge mechanic. 

 

 

By that logic boar prime isn't a shotgun either. Or its just an automatic shotgun which is how the Kohm basically was with a special mechanic tied to its rate of fire. All shotguns dont have to be slow rate of fire high single shot damage weapons, other than that I feel that could of lowered the effects of the pellets instead of reducing the number, or removed the wind up time to get the max number of pellets.

 

I haven't used the Boar Prime, so I can't comment on it. I have used the Boar, but that was many, many patches ago. Once again, I'm not saying that the Kohm isn't a shotgun. I'm saying that its recent changes can't really be labeled as making it less like a shotgun, as implied by the title: "The Kohm is Barely a Shotgun Now." That's ridiculous. It still has multiple pellets fired without multishot. It still does respectable damage. As far as I can tell, it still retains its starting accuracy if you tap-fire to auto instead of hold down LMB, and it's more ammo efficient before. That's closer to a shotgun in my book. 

[CHunterX]

I'd argue that it's people who go around using min-maxed gear as a baseline for performance are a large part of why the game is so unbalanced right now. DE has said multiple times before that the game isn't supposed to be adjusted around the higher levels found in endless scaling, which is the only place on the starchart you'd need that sort of resource investment in your weapons.

So the Soma is complete garbage, because the baseline gun is nearly useless, according to your logic. I'm not even gonna bother reading the rest.

[DiabolusUrsus]

So the Soma is complete garbage, because the baseline gun is nearly useless, according to your logic. I'm not even gonna bother reading the rest.

 

Real productive of you. Basline Soma is far from complete garbage. As long as you put the proper Point Strike + Vital Sense (18pts) + some sort of elemental damage (minimum 7 pts) on it does just fine. Serration is less important for the Soma because its base damage is so low to begin with. If you play with mod ranks a bit, you can even fit on ammo mutation within 30 points. So spare me your empty handwaving. Sure, that's not 40min survival tier, but it's a perfectly respectable weapon. 

 

Forgot that the Soma came with two V polarities at base, too, so that makes it even easier to piece together a viable build. 

Edited February 6, 2015 by DiabolusUrsus

[Keltik0ne]

Use it as mastery fodder and move on, that's the DE way.

 

Something new and shiney will come out, then be nerfed, soon enough.

[Ventura_Highway]

I think I'm going to stop playing until the Kohm is buffed again.

[4RT1LL3RY]

The did succeed in making the Kohm cause 0 frame drops.  I can understand the 2x dmg for 1/2 pellets.  I don't get why they ALSO dropped the firerate even more.

 

The change from 5.0 to 3.7 was a big drop.  Now its 2.7.  I can't get away with a Shotgun Spaz + Mid rank Tainted Shell because the fire rate is so damn low now.

 

It is now ammo efficient enoughb to not need a mutator it seems.  20 seconds of continuous fire with a ROF build to empty 1 mag.

 

Revert the Rate of Fire nerf and its fine, thats the only real problem I have with the change.  I'll miss you Mirage confetti party time.