May 15Th: Hot Feedback Topics

[Charismo]

Actually it is a justified worry. Again, just because they say they won't balance things because of PvP being introduced, doesn't mean they can't take that promise back. It is their game and in the long run they can do whatever they please. It really doesn't matter how long they have been promising. With it going to be a consensual duel set up, that may help. But that will not stop people getting overly frustrated and raging on the forums about how OP something is. I'm not saying this is what will happen, I am saying that I am worried at the chance that it may happen, no matter how small that chance is.

 

Everything you've said about community backlash makes sense in a non consensual PvP environment. But as the dojo's are going to be between clan members with each players consent, there is no pressure. Don't want to fight a Rhino because he's OP in 1v1? Then don't. It doesn't have ay effect on you. You gain nothing, you lose nothing. 

[YggdrasilUmbrX]

It really is exciting to see a new update  (seeing as I've only been playing for about a month now). I share the same feelings as others about it being pushed back but really excited to see new features like the 1 on 1 pvp in dojos.

[ProfessorMeeseeks]

Everything you've said about community backlash makes sense in a non consensual PvP environment. But as the dojo's are going to be between clan members with each players consent, there is no pressure. Don't want to fight a Rhino because he's OP in 1v1? Then don't. It doesn't have ay effect on you. You gain nothing, you lose nothing. 

Alright since nobody is understanding where I'm coming from I'll try to explain this in a much more simple manor.

 

Kid's will cry about anything. They sign up for a PvP match (even with consent), if they get 1-2 hit by an ult or by a hek or whatever, they will get frustrated. Without thinking they will try again therefore causing more frustration. The cycle will become never ending. I'm not saying that mature people will go off and cry about how OP something is, sure it could happen, but I'm more worried about the younger players of warframe. The ones who cannot restrain themselves from a rematch or whatever. THIS is why I am slightly worried. Yes this PvP thing has great potential, but at the same time I can see a few things that can go wrong, as I've already mentioned.

 

One other worry I have is that once this is introduced, who is to say that people will want full squad based PvP? The people who do will push for it and that could become a reality as well. 

 

I'm not stating these will happen instantly. I'm talking about later down the road.

Edited May 16, 2013 by ikillyou1990

[LoRDxDeMoN]

these Alerts will not be as rare as Catalyst/Reactors.

 

Always thought all ? alert items had equal chances. Guess that's just another urban legend.

[ValhaHazred]

Kid's will cry about anything. They sign up for a PvP match (even with consent), if they get 1-2 hit by an ult or by a hek or whatever, they will get frustrated. Without thinking they will try again therefore causing more frustration. The cycle will become never ending. I'm not saying that mature people will go off and cry about how OP something is, sure it could happen, but I'm more worried about the younger players of warframe. The ones who cannot restrain themselves from a rematch or whatever. THIS is why I am slightly worried. Yes this PvP thing has great potential, but at the same time I can see a few things that can go wrong, as I've already mentioned.

Who cares what a bunch of immature people whine about? The Devs aren't going to listen. Every community has a vocal minority that everyone ignores and I've seen worse bunches than that.

[Gestalt]

Alright since nobody is understanding where I'm coming from I'll try to explain this in a much more simple manor.

 

Kid's will cry about anything. They sign up for a PvP match (even with consent), if they get 1-2 hit by an ult or by a hek or whatever, they will get frustrated. Without thinking they will try again therefore causing more frustration. The cycle will become never ending. I'm not saying that mature people will go off and cry about how OP something is, sure it could happen, but I'm more worried about the younger players of warframe. The ones who cannot restrain themselves from a rematch or whatever. THIS is why I am slightly worried. Yes this PvP thing has great potential, but at the same time I can see a few things that can go wrong, as I've already mentioned.

 

One other worry I have is that once this is introduced, who is to say that people will want full squad based PvP? The people who do will push for it and that could become a reality as well. 

 

I'm not stating these will happen instantly. I'm talking about later down the road.

 

It won't be a big a problem if they restrict dueling to purely for fun.  "Here, pvp.  Go knock yourselves out." type of thing.  As soon as they start adding in reputation system, ranking system, any sort of rewards for the pvp, all hell will break lose.

 

This is not to say that if there's no reward for dueling, nobody will complain.  You're right, people will complain about anything.  But if they have a non-consequential pvp, the complaining will be minimal -- and more importantly, negligible.  Tying any reward will open the floodgate.

 

Hope they keep the dueling purely for fun.

Edited May 16, 2013 by Gestalt

[ProfessorMeeseeks]

It won't be a big a problem if they restrict dueling to purely for fun.  "Here, pvp.  Go knock yourselves out." type of thing.  As soon as they start adding in reputation system, ranking system, any sort of rewards for the pvp, all hell will break lose.

 

This is not to say that if there's no reward for dueling, nobody will complain.  You're right, people will complain about anything.  But if they have a non-consequential pvp, the complaining will be minimal -- and more importantly, negligible.  Tying any reward will open the floodgate.

 

Hope they keep the dueling purely for fun.

This is one of the few things that worries me about this.

[Gregio]

Ah, okay.  Can you tell us if they're considering the community response to what the dev team proposed in the last livestream? The community lost a lot of faith in the development team from that one.

 

Thanks again!

 

Cryptic much...? I have no idea what you're talking about.

 

On a different note:

I still think it's sort of a bad idea to add PvP of any kind, because as said, it will lead to people wanting more PvP modes, they will want team deathmatches, they will want free for alls, they will want and ask for more, and ask for PvP prizes, and rankings and PvP leaderboards, and then the game will turn PvP and I'll be very disappointed with the investment I put up for the Master Founder package.

I hope DE will hold their ground on casual clan-based PvP duels and nothing else, no balancing, etc.

 

[muccmaster]

What about weapon prestiging? This really should be implemented soon since it's pretty lame and counter productive when you spend so much time and money powering up mods to max and then you can't even use them together because of point restrictions.

[Vorpalstryke]

Here's a great idea for the login rewards - You can keep ammo boxes in the mix for the lower tier log ins but for those of us who log in for several days in a row, change ammo boxes to rare/uncommon materials! Like 25 to 50 Rubedo or Alloy Plates, or 1 orokin cell or neural sensors, etc. This way, we have better incentive to log in because we get stuff that's useful. 

[Deek]

Who cares what a bunch of immature people whine about? The Devs aren't going to listen. Every community has a vocal minority that everyone ignores and I've seen worse bunches than that.

 

well we've gone from no pvp to ok pvp within clans, due to community pressure, so the path is being made.

 

 

 

@ ikillyou,

(had to lol at your name for your anti pvp posts) yeh ive understood all your posts and clearly see your opinions, at this stage im not pro or anti pvp but your spot on with what will happen community wise, if it follows the course of so many other game genres expect nerfs on warframes weapons etc due to community pressure over time from the pro pvp players. I dont care if there is pvp as long as its not an open pvp on any map and our gear and attacks dont get nerfed because 20 tenno cant kill one good built frame, i enjoy my pve and if it gets nerfed to the extreme i cant enjoy it it will be time to move on.

 

its started at clan level, next will (could be) clan verses clan, then 1v1, then open, and out of all that we will see people complaining about the over powered warframe they dont have and demand nerfs. been there done that on other games. one game in particular had a pvp server and pve servers. the pve server had a very higher population. pvp maps were introduced to the pve server and they pressured for nerfs and won, leavin the pvp server with absolute trash characters after years of work. i certainly hope the pvp somewhat stops at clan level or clan verses clan on a want to basis not a were big and were going to grief you.

[WhiteCopain]

Rebecca, could you please talk about how often we'll see things just be ? Alert style for finding them? 

 

I can sorta understand it for a time, but can we expect every new Warframe (and interesting weapon such as the Glaive, something different than the norm) to be random alert based and stay that way? WIth this new frame I get that he is alert for now, but will he never switch off that style? Will this happen always with every new frame and we'll never be able to get the next thirty without them being from alerts?

 

I'm not complaining here, I'm just curious about what I can expect. If you guys plan to move on from this or let frame Blueprints eventually drop normally (Such as when another one comes out), that's great and understandable, but are we never going let people get it outside of alerts (Along with all the other frames that come out?)

Edited May 16, 2013 by WhiteCopain

[ralwn]

Here's a great idea for the login rewards - You can keep ammo boxes in the mix for the lower tier log ins but for those of us who log in for several days in a row, change ammo boxes to rare/uncommon materials! Like 25 to 50 Rubedo or Alloy Plates, or 1 orokin cell or neural sensors, etc. This way, we have better incentive to log in because we get stuff that's useful. 

its been hinted elsewhere that this is likely what they are going to do

[drunkpunk222]

 

 

7.The Dojo! 1v1 Duels! PVP?

No, no Tenno. The Dueling Room in the upcoming Dojos is for 1v1 spars between clan members, a friendly duel. If a clan feels up to it, they can impose their own rules (i.e no powers, melee only!) , we will not be balancing any PvE elements of the game for this.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Screw this pvp, dont waste time on crap, stick with pve content better!

Edited May 16, 2013 by drunkpunk222

[Phoenix86]

I love these "Hot feedback topics" it keeps the track of what DEs are thinking of, i like it!

 

Thx for writing this stuff down everytime!

[Tulzscha]

 

4. Login rewards suck Corpus Screws!

DE_Steve agrees. http://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/1e8mk8/so_these_login_rewards_is_getting_kind_of/c9xvad6

 

 

Yes! Just a subtle change like crafting materials being included would be a big help. Rubedo, Alloy Plate in 100-200's, Neural Sensors, Neurodes, Control Modules in 1's. I really don't need this stack of unused shotgun ammo boxes in my inventory... :)

[Juncboks]

Anyone from DE, I'm dead-serious when I ask you to read what I have to say.

 

 

 

This is not good and I will be as clear as possible in explaining why.

With banshee there was some psychological strain as hunting for BP in random missions rather than boss farming feels like searching blindfolded (though it is fairly possible, I have crafted a Banshee my self). However having to find the Vauban BP parts in alerts will be far far worse, not only will we not be able to focus on a type of mission, we won't even be able to choose when or how often to attempt getting these BPs, it will be a slow torture.

But psychology aside even if the chances are a lot better than for orokin potatoes we will still need to find 3 different BP parts, which will exponentially decrease the chances to actually complete a Vauban; just for comparison we had 3 or 4 glaive alerts so far, if those were Vabuan BP parts then most likely one of the BP parts still wouldn't have appeared. Add to this that as humans we aren't online 24/7 and I cannot imagine many average players will craft a Vabuan before 2 or 3 months, unless these BP parts will be stupid-common.

 

I don't know how much time you devs have spent to come to this decision, but I can see only 2 outcomes:

A) If the BP isn't common enough there will be a ton of malcontent, much more than there was for the glaive. Unlucky players might not ever be able to craft a Vabuan as much as they'd like it because they cannot resort to farming it. The community was exaggerating when they said that because of the glaive alone the game was straying from free to play, but they might not be exaggerating once update 8 comes...

B) If the BP parts will be very common there will be an overflow of Vabuans in every game because so many players who might not have farmed it will find them selves with these BP parts and use them eventually. The BP parts will also reduce the chances to get other random rewards, so you will still get a ton of malcontent.

Wow. Butthurt. I would like to propose a counter view to this... obscene gesture...

 

I am stoked that you have made a Frame that will truly be rare. A trophy to those who take the time and dedication to the game. A person with this means that they have given the effort to wield it. "regular gamers" will/should understand this and cherish the day they finally get all the pieces. As for us extreme gamers who hardly let their phones rest while checking for Alerts will be *rewarded*. That's right; this frame is a -privilege-. Gamers will have plenty of time to obtain it while gathering the other frames. Games need things like this so that the veteran gamers have things that they can point at and say, "Hey, I've put in the work. I'm dedicated to this game." Rather than have all of the veterans shrug off the fact that a newbie player that just started can get what they want with a little effortless grinding for a week. Not everything should be handed freely on a silver plate. This will bring out the real players and while the non-dedicated ones cry about putting in effort, the ones who care will just put in the time and reap just desserts.

[Kamahl]

Here's a great idea for the login rewards - You can keep ammo boxes in the mix for the lower tier log ins but for those of us who log in for several days in a row, change ammo boxes to rare/uncommon materials! Like 25 to 50 Rubedo or Alloy Plates, or 1 orokin cell or neural sensors, etc. This way, we have better incentive to log in because we get stuff that's useful. 

^ This guy is a genius!

[CubedOobleck]

Wow. Butthurt. I would like to propose a counter view to this... obscene gesture...

 

I am stoked that you have made a Frame that will truly be rare. A trophy to those who take the time and dedication to the game. A person with this means that they have given the effort to wield it. "regular gamers" will/should understand this and cherish the day they finally get all the pieces. As for us extreme gamers who hardly let their phones rest while checking for Alerts will be *rewarded*. That's right; this frame is a -privilege-. Gamers will have plenty of time to obtain it while gathering the other frames. Games need things like this so that the veteran gamers have things that they can point at and say, "Hey, I've put in the work. I'm dedicated to this game." Rather than have all of the veterans shrug off the fact that a newbie player that just started can get what they want with a little effortless grinding for a week. Not everything should be handed freely on a silver plate. This will bring out the real players and while the non-dedicated ones cry about putting in effort, the ones who care will just put in the time and reap just desserts.

So being a real player is about being lucky enough to be online during alerts or having a twitter account for said alerts?

 

That's a nice view you have there.

Edited May 16, 2013 by CubedOobleck

[Charismo]

Alright since nobody is understanding where I'm coming from I'll try to explain this in a much more simple manor.

I understand you. I just disagree.

Your argument is based on speculation, and the course the Devs of an unrelated game took. Firefall also had way more going wrong for it than PvP, from what I've seen.

You're implying that the inclusion of PvP is a slippery slope leading to the introduction of PvP elements into the PvE gameplay. There is frankly little to no demand of this within the community that I've seen. Why would I assume that the devs would take this route when they show no interest in it and in fact have been vocal about their opposition to the concept themselves? Why would they go against the vocal majority of players like you who are adamantly against the idea?

No one wants the game to go down the route your arguing against. The Devs don't want to go down that route. The vocal players don't want to go down that route.

[Vabla]

Really hope what pvp there is will stay to the 1v1 sparring with zero pvp balance. I've played one too many games that sucked out all the enjoyment out of it by "balancing" pvp at the cost of everything else.

[Incursum]

I think that if the Vauban BPs you receive aren't set globally - in other words, it depends on the BPs you have - Many people would have no problems with the process to acquire this frame. But I might be wrong. But if it were like that, unlike the other frames you'd have the guarantee to receive a brand new BP and wouldn't get disappointed over it being something you already had.

Either way, I'm not one to complain over the time it takes to build a a frame. As It's in their essence, kind of.

[Stalphyr]

I would Like to take the time to thank all of you for "Doing it Right"! If people only did things half way we would have never made it to space, travel across our seas, and many other accomplishments. Those that did it in a rush soon learned the error of not doing it right if you look back through history. So keep on Doing it right DE's.

Edited May 16, 2013 by Stalphyr

[Metou]

Can't wait

[Maeka]

Sounds good.