Steve Confirms On Twitter, Ash's Blade Storm Getting Interactive Rework.

[rockscl]

To me BS feels like Akuma's rising demon ultimate in Street Fighter. That is a game that prides itself on fine control, yet it allows for super combos where you can just sit back and watch the action. i see nothing wrong with that.

 

Landing Akuma`s raging demon is a thing that only a good player can do, thats where BS is very different in the practice, it does all the job for 1 button of participation

Edited November 4, 2015 by rockscl

[Hypernaut1]

Landing Akuma`s raging demon is a thing that only a good player can do, thats where BS is very different in the practice, it does all the job for 1 button of participation

you're still missing the point. Im not discussing the power or ease of doing BS. Im responding to the claims that having a "cutscene" ultimate is the game taking away control in a game where we have like to have control. A fighting game is all about having control, yet no one complains about ultimates "taking away" control. 

 

Sure, power spam and damage is an issue in this game- but that doesnt mean having an ultimate with a short automated sequence is removing player control.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Hypernaut1

[Kripion]

you're still missing the point. Im not discussing the power or ease of doing BS. Im responding to the claims that having a "cutscene" ultimate is the game taking away control in a game where we have like to have control. A fighting game is all about having control, yet no one complains about ultimates "taking away" control. 

 

Sure, power spam and damage is an issue in this game- but that doesnt mean having an ultimate with a short automated sequence is removing player control.

And furthermore this short animated sequence is what many of us love and enjoy even after 2 years of watching it:)

[BattledOne]

And furthermore this short animated sequence is what many of us love and enjoy even after 2 years of watching it:)

That's more of a fetish though. I don't really think imposing it on others is that good of an idea.

[Kripion]

That's more of a fetish though. I don't really think imposing it on others is that good of an idea.

Oh please. Read at least 3 of current topics about BS and then tell me: am I the only current BS fan?

"many of us" never mean all of us:)

 

Dont be so scared to admit that quite many ppl dont want current BS to be changed:)

Edited November 4, 2015 by Kripion

[AKKILLA]

Oh please. Read at least 3 of current topics about BS and then tell me: am I the only current BS fan?

"many of us" never mean all of us:)

 

Dont be so scared to admit that quite many ppl dont want current BS to be changed:)

 

I dont want it to be changed if the Change Ruins Ash.

 

If DE get this Right and make this Epic, hear our cries of preserving Ash like Keeping Ash as the Main focus of Bladestorm and the Clones exist only to accompany Ash then Im open for the Evolution.

 

All with consideration to what Bladestorm offers in game now, Invincibility, Best Trickery Proc in Game, Crowd Clearer.

The feel of preserving the Teleporting Rampage seems easy yet difficult to accomplish with cut scenes.

 

Im sure this will be Epic, but what about shuriken smoke screen and teleport? No QoL for them? Lets ask Steve on Twitter xD

[MrForz]

You call Yourself a Ash fan and dont like Shadow Clones?!

 

 

One can be an Ash fan while not being an ultimate ninja fanboy you know. In a world where powers take more and more importance over weapons, Ash is amongst the frames I rely on when looking to do some gunplay, it's offensive and I've grown very fond of the 3 first skills. Shadow Clones feel rushed.

 

Then I realize I haven't used Bladestorm for a long while and I'm like. "Why am I even bothering taking cover, moving around the battlefield, shooting down targets and impaling finisher-sensitive targets when I can simply use Bladestorm?". I don't think I can be disappointed at the final outcome of the Ash Warframe because I simply enjoy shooting things while making maneuvers such as sliding and so on. My only request is that it doesn't brutally stops the gunplay or melee play.

Edited November 5, 2015 by MrForz

[ThePredicament]

There goes Trickery builds.

[aerosoul1337]

"Will ash ult just create 2 clones to kill while ash stays normal? because that's what i always wanted !"

 

steve: "That's the idea... so far :)"

 

No fu*king way!

Lose all the concept and uniqueness. :(

After the Saryn 2.0 rework.

I am really worried about Ash now.

[fatpig84]

There goes Trickery builds.

 

Feed on the tears people.

[bubbabenali]

After what they've done to Saryn - godspeed you Ash it was a nice time.

[(XBOX)lotus503]

No fu*king way!

Lose all the concept and uniqueness. :(

After the Saryn 2.0 rework.

I am really worried about Ash now.

Yup were about to get a trickery &  invulnerability Nerf. Good thing I have a ton of other frames to play, guess its time to get Loki geared up.

[Autongnosis]

There goes Trickery builds.

I might have lost something, but where did you get this from?

[aerosoul1337]

Yup were about to get a trickery &  invulnerability Nerf. Good thing I have a ton of other frames to play, guess its time to get Loki geared up.

 

FFS

Can we just tune the camera and improve killing animation

And leave the blade storm concept alone?

:(

[Judgebanks]

Ash is going to get an Interactive nerf at this rate.

[Draciusen]

So many people have a love and hate relationship with Bladestorm.

 

On one hand:

-Looks badass when the camera actually works

-Lethal damage

-Invulnerability (without a doubt my favorite part about it, but also what makes it boring)

-High range and number of targets

 

On the other hand:

-Camera doesn't always make it look badass

-No longer feels as good once the enemies stop dying to it, still pretty good though

-Trivializes his other abilities:

Shuriken for extra damage? Why not Bladestorm?

Smokescreen when you're in danger? Bladestorm makes you invincible.

Teleport to finish an enemy? Why not Bladestorm and kill all the enemies?

Bladestorm? Bladestorm.

-Animation lock, can't do anything while he's performing it (can't even chat)

-Target picking is finicky, less useful in high swarm situations where he can't kill fast enough

 

The biggest argument over Bladestorm is the lack of interaction. You can't have cool cutscenes if you manually attack, but you can't do other things if you're going to watching a cool cutscene. But what about the simplest solution, why not have both?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ash activates Bladestorm on a targeted enemy to instantly send out [x] number of clones that begin automatically attacking the area in an [x] radius, dealing slash damage and adding to Ash's melee combo counter with every strike.

-Their damage is also increased by Ash's melee combo counter. 

-No target limit, they attack anything that enter the radius. Each clone can only attack one enemy at a time though, so it's not instant AoE nuke tier.

-Clones will attract enemy fire, but have a lower priority than things like Molt/Decoy/Chaos.

-This can either be toggle or duration based, I honestly don't know. Looking at DE's energy efficiency recently though, I'd rather a duration based than a toggle.

 

Reactivating or allowing the duration to run out on Bladestorm allows Ash to instantaneously teleport to the area and begin the cutscene killings (no target required), dealing finisher damage while also becoming invulnerable. AKA the same thing now, but the camera should get some polish.

 

Ash now has significantly stronger scaling on Bladestorm (especially with augment), the ability to still do other things while killing with Bladestorm, and keeps the invulnerable cutscene finishers that we've all grown used to by now. The only potential problem is that you can't instantly enter the invulnerable cutscene because he has to send out the clones first, but I guess you could mash that 4 button really hard? If they wanted to get really crazy, the duration when the clones are attacking Ash could be using his wrist blades in a stance; but I think that's a bit much.

 

tl;dr version:

-ASH SEND SUPA NINJA CLONES 2 ATTACK 4 HIM WHEN USE BLADESTORM

-NINJA CLONES ADD TO SICK MELEE COMBO COUNTER

-ASH CAN DO THING WHILE SUPA NINJA CLONES ATTACK

-ASH CAN THEN DO SUPA CUTSCENE ASSASSINATION (LIKE HE DO NOW) WHEN HE USE BLADESTORM AGAIN

Edited November 6, 2015 by Draciusen

[Hypernaut1]

Fan concepts are useless at this point, the ball is already rolling. The best we can is try to slow it down so DE doesn't completely wreck Ash and turn him into Atlas.

[aerosoul1337]

Wow, I can't believe people are asking for blade storm nerf in Saryn rework thread.

 

"Why can Ash keep blade storm dps since Miasma nuke is no more?"

"Ash deals too much damage and can remain stealth..."

"Ash is next!"

Edited November 6, 2015 by aerosoul1337

[Judgebanks]

Wow, I can't believe people are asking for blade storm nerf in Saryn rework thread.

 

"Why can Ash keep blade storm dps since Miasma nuke is no more?"

"Ash deals too much damage and can remain stealth..."

"Ash is next!"

You act as if there isn't a good chance of that happening.

[Hypernaut1]

You act as if there isn't a good chance of that happening.

its already happening.

[--Sensei--]

So many people have a love and hate relationship with Bladestorm.

 

On one hand:

-Looks badass when the camera actually works

-Lethal damage

-Invulnerability (without a doubt my favorite part about it, but also what makes it boring)

-High range and number of targets

 

On the other hand:

-Camera doesn't always make it look badass

-No longer feels as good once the enemies stop dying to it, still pretty good though

-Trivializes his other abilities:

Shuriken for extra damage? Why not Bladestorm?

Smokescreen when you're in danger? Bladestorm makes you invincible.

Teleport to finish an enemy? Why not Bladestorm and kill all the enemies?

Bladestorm? Bladestorm.

-Animation lock, can't do anything while he's performing it (can't even chat)

-Target picking is finicky, less useful in high swarm situations where he can't kill fast enough

 

The biggest argument over Bladestorm is the lack of interaction. You can't have cool cutscenes if you manually attack, but you can't do other things if you're going to watching a cool cutscene. But what about the simplest solution, why not have both?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ash activates Bladestorm on a targeted enemy to instantly send out [x] number of clones that begin automatically attacking the area in an [x] radius, dealing slash damage and adding to Ash's melee combo counter with every strike.

-Their damage is also increased by Ash's melee combo counter. 

-No target limit, they attack anything that enter the radius. Each clone can only attack one enemy at a time though, so it's not instant AoE nuke tier.

-Clones will attract enemy fire, but have a lower priority than things like Molt/Decoy/Chaos.

-This can either be toggle or duration based, I honestly don't know. Looking at DE's energy efficiency recently though, I'd rather a duration based than a toggle.

 

Reactivating or allowing the duration to run out on Bladestorm allows Ash to instantaneously teleport to the area and begin the cutscene killings (no target required), dealing finisher damage while also becoming invulnerable. AKA the same thing now, but the camera should get some polish.

 

Ash now has significantly stronger scaling on Bladestorm (especially with augment), the ability to still do other things while killing with Bladestorm, and keeps the invulnerable cutscene finishers that we've all grown used to by now. The only potential problem is that you can't instantly enter the invulnerable cutscene because he has to send out the clones first, but I guess you could mash that 4 button really hard? If they wanted to get really crazy, the duration when the clones are attacking Ash could be using his wrist blades in a stance; but I think that's a bit much.

 

tl;dr version:

-ASH SEND SUPA NINJA CLONES 2 ATTACK 4 HIM WHEN USE BLADESTORM

-NINJA CLONES ADD TO SICK MELEE COMBO COUNTER

-ASH CAN DO THING WHILE SUPA NINJA CLONES ATTACK

-ASH CAN THEN DO SUPA CUTSCENE ASSASSINATION (LIKE HE DO NOW) WHEN HE USE BLADESTORM AGAIN

Ash's bladestorm already adds to the melee combo multiplier. You can do 13k bleed tick dmg, equip your melee and bladestorm then watch as your combo multiplier rises.

[Numbsky1]

Ash next on the butcher's list?

[Hypernaut1]

Ash's bladestorm already adds to the melee combo multiplier. You can do 13k bleed tick dmg, equip your melee and bladestorm then watch as your combo multiplier rises.

In fact, he has an augment to extend multiplier time

[(XBOX)lotus503]

FFS

Can we just tune the camera and improve killing animation

And leave the blade storm concept alone?

:(

I wish!, However I highly suspect were getting a big fat nerf stick instead. 

 

Yesterday I started playing my Trinity prime & Loki Prime again. Im sure those will be the next frames people whine about and get nerfed.

[enJohneering]

tl;dr version:

-ASH SEND SUPA NINJA CLONES 2 ATTACK 4 HIM WHEN USE BLADESTORM

-NINJA CLONES ADD TO SICK MELEE COMBO COUNTER

-ASH CAN DO THING WHILE SUPA NINJA CLONES ATTACK

-ASH CAN THEN DO SUPA CUTSCENE ASSASSINATION (LIKE HE DO NOW) WHEN HE USE BLADESTORM AGAIN

 

Your first analysis of Bladestorm and why it both overshadows the other abilities and then becomes much less effective at higher levels is great. However, your idea for the BS rework sounds like a copy of Ember's WOF and even though it finishes with a repeat of the BS we have now, it doesn't really seem like the kind of improvement we are after. It's reasonable, but I'd rather be able to teleport around to enemies dropping smoke bombs and murdering them with finisher damage that be stuck with what's essentially an AOE damage aura. But maybe that's just me. 

 

Perhaps we could get at least invisibility during the clone murdering stage so that it has more utility? Then even if the clone inevitably do less damage than we hope for, the ultimate still adds so excellent survivability.