This Event... De Do You Even Learn From Previous Mistakes?

[matto]

Hello there.

 

I was away from this game for a very long time and I came back around October 2015.

 

I quit Warframe in 2014 so I missed a lot of events. So I can't really compare this new one with the most recent events (even if I heard that there was only one real event in 2015).

 

However, this Shadow Debt reminds me of The Cicero Crisis.

 

Do you remember the first week in the Cicero Crisis? When the best way to farm for plant scans was to launch a mission, check the first map tile to see if the right plants were here, and leave if they weren't? Effective farming, launch game/check first room/leave.

 

Well, it's kind of the same thing here. Launch mission -> go a few rooms ahead (except for defense etc.) -> kill -> check reward -> leave.

 

And with this come the same issues. New players trying to play the event are left alone for those playing in public. It would be kind of okay if it was like Extermination/capture/sabotage only. But when an alcolyte appears on a defense or interception mission... Especially when it is medium hard level (pluto for example)... It sure is impossible for not experienced players to complete such missions alone.

 

I am not having fun at all playing this event solo. Well, sometimes I accept the challenge and play the interception even if I already got the mod. But damn, when did Warframe turn into a solo game?

 

And you know what? I am here thinking that if DE fixes the event the way they were thinking, making the mod available only at the end of the mission, this is going to turn into a massive and painful RNG. I mean, I am already around 60 runs, no rare mods dropped at all. And you think I am going to play the full mission multiple times if you fix the event?

 

You decided to give us community-based goals. Fine. So I think that what it should have been is : alcolytes drop common and uncommon. Rare mod is awarded to the whole community playerbase involved in this event WHEN the alcolyte gets killed.

 

Or, you know, just how you did a few times before. Goal achieved (one alcolyte killed) -> playerbase gets its mods.

 

I don't know DE, I've been away for such a long time and I see so many issues still here. And then we get this event which COULD have been fun. Instead, by some bad design moves, you turn it into a giant grind with bad quit behavior. Again.

 

I swear, if I didn't have some other purposes in this game right now, and if I wasn't addicted to the lore and visual, I would be out again, leaving for good.

 

[Coach-Aprax]

No they don´t .Another grinding fest where skill doesn´t matter, just luck.After 3 years I´m loosing faith.

[Endrance]

So, lets see if i get this straight, you guys are complaining about an Extra reward from the event?

 

The event add 5 new units, that each have a loot table, so yeah, it's normal that you don't do 1 or 2 runs and get what you want. The event rewars is Wraith Vulkar and if 15 waves on the final Challange you get Lacera Acolyte skin.

 

Not to mention the Reactor and Catalyst from the first part.

 

 

Those are the event rewards, the mods? Well, that's a bonus. A bigger incentive to play the game, which is what DE actually wants and needs.

[Drufo]

I think the problem is not DE, it's the average gamer. I don't understand why everybody can't do missions as normal, have fun and at the same time get the new mods... With every event, players turn it to a farm-fest istead of enjoying it. 

Yes, maybe DE needs to change approach seeing the result, but maybe they still have faith in humanity (misplaced, appearently). Maybe it's not only DE that needs to change...

[matto]

Those are the event rewards, the mods? Well, that's a bonus. A bigger incentive to play the game, which is what DE actually wants and needs.

 

 

I don't understand why everybody can't do missions as normal, have fun and at the same time get the new mods... With every event, players turn it to a farm-fest istead of enjoying it. 

 

Because we don't know yet how those new mods will be available after the event. If it's a random encounter with 2% drop chance... Rng with Rng on top, better farm it now this way than having to pray that one alcolyte shows up and drops the right mod.

 

No communication about the consequences of the alcolytes release, no communication of future drop location or even availability of the mods.

 

When played solo, it doesn't have consequences on other players. Only consequence is your quit rate. But who cares honestly?

[Genitive]

While I can agree that the mods could drop the other way, it is mostly the players' mentality that is to blame.

 

And it seems your pleads have been listened to:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/600655-shadow-debt-event-mods-should-be-end-of-mission-rewards-instead-of-dropping-mid-mission/?p=6791160#entry6791160

[matto]

While I can agree that the mods could drop the other way, it is mostly the players' mentality that is to blame.

 

And it seems your pleads have been listened to:

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/600655-shadow-debt-event-mods-should-be-end-of-mission-rewards-instead-of-dropping-mid-mission/?p=6791160#entry6791160

 

Actually it could be worse if the fix is that you have to complete the mission to see the reward. With the current reward chances, playing 50 defense/interception/etc (for each alcolyte) missions is going to be a pain. That's why I hope the rare mod will either gets an increased drop chance, or will be a community based reward for killing the alcolyte.

Edited January 27, 2016 by matto

[GDSK-NXS]

Or, you know, just how you did a few times before. Goal achieved (one alcolyte killed) -> playerbase gets its mods.

 

God hear your prayers.

 

I think the problem is not DE, it's the average gamer. I don't understand why everybody can't do missions as normal, have fun and at the same time get the new mods... With every event, players turn it to a farm-fest istead of enjoying it. 

Warframe has leap over the "enjoyable farm" right into the "Grind basket". It is not fun to do 200 missions for one mod. it is simply not fun, and everyone that can skip even 50 of those missions will. The exploit lets the player get the reward in less than half the time, since you farm twice as fast.

Blame everyone involved in it, but the true fail here is the design of the event.

[(PSN)aiptekfanboy]

Eeeh if i am unable to get this mod then i will just sell 50 or 100 r5 fusion cores at 1p each then buy the mod in trade chat since i know that my probability of getting r5 fusion cores is 100 percent when doing missions that drop them

[Cluele55]

And to add insult to injury . . . you get lucky with RNG . . Yes! the rare mod I was looking for . . . close to the end of a survival mission the Acolyte spawns and you are very happy because he drops the mod you are looking for. . . . . . . . Extraction is announced . . . Reach extraction . . . . Host disconnects . . . . Host migration. . . Needless to say . . . Progress is lost . . . Mod and all . . . . :((

[CrazyCatLad]

Ehh, just do other missions. You don't have to assassinate the Acolyte every single time they appear.  More than half of the mods don't appeal.  If we get utility slots for weapons, then maybe. But I'd much rather Fast Hands or something over a weird if/then/else mod.

Edited January 27, 2016 by Lanieu

[-dicht.Amducias-]

No they don´t .Another grinding fest where skill doesn´t matter, just luck.After 3 years I´m loosing faith.

Theres literally nothing in warframe which needs skill.. warframes skill is speed and knowledge

[Syln]

Because we don't know yet how those new mods will be available after the event. If it's a random encounter with 2% drop chance... Rng with Rng on top, better farm it now this way than having to pray that one alcolyte shows up and drops the right mod.

 

No communication about the consequences of the alcolytes release, no communication of future drop location or even availability of the mods.

 

When played solo, it doesn't have consequences on other players. Only consequence is your quit rate. But who cares honestly?

 

The lack of communication is probably due to the fact that DE want to keep the surprise on what will happen after the event (in my opinion it's a risky choice with good intention).

[DelialFallen]

Although I do agree with some points you brought up, especially with part about Join Mission, Explore, Kill, Abort, I'm sure the feedback could have been given with a bit less whining.

Edited January 27, 2016 by DelialFallen

[matto]

The lack of communication is probably due to the fact that DE want to keep the surprise on what will happen after the event (in my opinion it's a risky choice with good intention).

 

Indeed. They don't want to reveal whether the alcolytes will stay or won't. But saying that "players will be able to get those mods after the event" would be a start.

[Culaio]

The lack of communication is probably due to the fact that DE want to keep the surprise on what will happen after the event (in my opinion it's a risky choice with good intention).

 

Problem is that there are still mods from previous events that were never added to game, this lead to people being prepared for the worst, the fact that for some mods we had to wait half to full year for them to be added makes it worse.

[Dobermann92]

So, lets see if i get this straight, you guys are complaining about an Extra reward from the event?

 

The event add 5 new units, that each have a loot table, so yeah, it's normal that you don't do 1 or 2 runs and get what you want. The event rewars is Wraith Vulkar and if 15 waves on the final Challange you get Lacera Acolyte skin.

 

Not to mention the Reactor and Catalyst from the first part.

 

 

Those are the event rewards, the mods? Well, that's a bonus. A bigger incentive to play the game, which is what DE actually wants and needs.

The problem is some of the new mods are mandatory for weapon builds, so you must get them to be the strongest. You have to deal with massive RNG to get them.

[CapedBaldy]

They are learning. Look at all the trading going on!

[matto]

The problem is some of the new mods are mandatory for weapon builds, so you must get them to be the strongest. You have to deal with massive RNG to get them.

 

Well, while I understand the mods bring something new to our shooting experience, I don't think they are mandatory at all.

 

Except if it's supposed to be part of damage 3.0.

 

I'm trying to get them to experience them, not really to be the strongest. I'm still using the same builds I was using when I quit in 2014. Maybe with one or two exceptions. Not using forma and everything.

 

I'm still thinking... What's the point of getting stronger when you can already play all content available?

 

But that's another issue :D

 

Anyway, 115 runs atm. Just got my first rare. Pressurized Magazine from Angst.

[matto]

You did the right move DE. Still thinking we lost some precious time. Hope we'll be able to get the already-dead-alcolytes' mods during the last stage. /close thread.

 

EDIT : Still testing the drop chances though.

 

EDIT 2 : "the right first step". But hum... 200 runs for 4 rare mods. That's 2% drop chance. Such drop rates shouldn't be part of an event. It's killing all the fun. Hope you'll do things right with Misery...

Edited January 30, 2016 by matto

[matto]

About drop chances. Managed to get everything except Argon Scope.

 

Less than 30% left on Torment. I think I am around 80-90 runs for Torment itself. More than 50 post hotfix.

Edited January 29, 2016 by matto

[Salenstormwing]

The problem is some of the new mods are mandatory for weapon builds, so you must get them to be the strongest. You have to deal with massive RNG to get them.

 

Brand new mods; mandatory for weapons.

 

Last week must have been horrible, when these mandatory new mods didn't exist.

 

The simple, simple fact is mods aren't mandatory for weapons. There is no King Mod Build who rules across all the weapons in game and decrees what is best to use.

 

Are some of the new mods good? YES. Mandatory? NO.

 

You might not get all your DPS you want because you're missing a mod, but the mods don't disappear if you don't get them. The devs already said the Acolytes will be back, and the last part of the event when Daddy Stalker shows up, the mods will be dropping there as well.

 

The only thing making these mods MANDATORY is OCD and the desire to MIN/MAX.

 

[goatwithbenefits]

Your bad luck with mod drops I can understand, yet I'm expecting people to pop up telling you to stop acting entitled because they obtained everything in just a couple runs. The issue is pretty clear here. With such wide margins that players can experience this event thanks to RNG it's hard to find common ground here.

 

A great deal of frustration would be taken off this whole ordeal (and by that I mean the game in its entirety) if grinding was more consistent, for lack of a better word. An event token system, why not. Void tokens. Sortie tokens. Make players take effectively longer to obtain enough for an item but give them the choice to obtain what they want. An integral part of 'enjoying' grinding is counting how many more runs one takes to get an item they want. There is no anticipation for what you're looking forward to. The event potatoes are good examples of what I'd like to see more of though.

[matto]

Well, first token system will be introduced with season 4 sorties hopefully. (Let's pray it won't follow the last Baro appearance with a catalyst for 700 ducats and I don't remember how many credits exactly. It was insane).

 

I hope DE is taking all the prevailing criticism into account.

 

Sorties system.

Baro.

This event.

Stances.

 

Their RNG model is getting more and more questionned and they definitely need to rebalance the grind aspect of the game. It's too tedious.

 

One more time an event shows the current state of the game. People will probably forget about all of this in a few weeks though.

Edited January 29, 2016 by matto

[Lost_Cartographer]

The problem is some of the new mods are mandatory for weapon builds, so you must get them to be the strongest. You have to deal with massive RNG to get them.

We've been playing this long without them - none of them are mandatory.