Pay-to-play with Micro-transactions

[iwoply]

9 minutes ago, Mephiste said:

 

 

 

My opinion on the matter.

Games with a purchase fee for the game itself shouldn't introduce micro transactions at anytime throughout it's life, for example Payday 2. I was happy buying each DLC when they were released but for a game like that to add micro transactions just overstepped its boundary and in my strongest opinion on the matter, the only way Paid games should make their money after launch is from DLC's.

F2P games like Warframe however and it's platinum system etc, allows players to have nearly everything without heavily restricting players from progressing in the game, if more F2P games followed this 'micro transaction/payment' system I would personally enjoy other F2P titles more.

[Flames21891]

1 minute ago, TheGuyverOne said:

My apologies, I'm posting from my phone and I got you two mixed up. Also, it still doesn't unlock the weapon attachments so I don't see where I was wrong.

The packs say they unlock weapon accessories, I assumed those were attachments. However, I may be wrong as I've never actually purchased one to find out.

[Mephiste]

Just now, Eggplants said:

This happened on a post a while back as well, so yeah best advice here.

 

My opinion on the matter.

Games with a purchase fee for the game itself shouldn't introduce micro transactions at anytime throughout it's life, for example Payday 2. I was happy buying each DLC when they were released but for a game like that to add micro transactions just overstepped its boundary and in my strongest opinion on the matter, the only way Paid games should make their money after launch is from DLC's.

F2P games like Warframe however and it's platinum system etc, allows players to have nearly everything without heavily restricting players from progressing in the game, if more F2P games followed this 'micro transaction/payment' system I would personally enjoy other F2P titles more.

The problem with Overkill and PAYDAY2 is that they not only lied to their playerbase saying they would never add microtransactions, which they did. But the fact that they literally smothered a Pay to Play game with DLCs is also a very poor choice of actions. It's why I dropped out of PAYDAY2, shame too, it was a great game.

R.I.P PAY2DAY.

[(XBOX)Eli and Niti]

25 minutes ago, .Zefir said:

I always get those farming/selling mods and parts. I net 20p and buy those. It's like "farming" for potatoes too. I also don't put them on just any weapon/frame, only the ones I play the most.

I mean, this isn't all that bad, is it ?

This and this and this. I choose to buy the prime access from DE simply because I support their business model due to this fact.  I usually give the plat I get away to friends, buy all the cosmetics, and gift stuff to people who have "real" lives and dont have the time or spare money to buy what they need to play with me. Warframe is honestly the best and least money orientated game I have ever played, so I pay to support the devs. I certainly never buy plat outside of the prime access, and take it that prime access is me buying a game (since it costs roughly the same).

Out side of the plat I get from prime access, every purchase I make for Orokin potatoes, slots, and incubation chambers, I do by farming mods, and selling them.

Some of the BEST equipment in this game can not be bought via the market place (ok it can be bought via trading, but still). You cannot BUY a Vaykor Marlok, you cannot BUY a Synoid Gammacor, You cannot BUY a Vakor Hek... these must be played for. Unless you want to PAY another player for their time... I got my new loka weapons by trading mods to the guy for the weapons, so technically, I didnt even pay him for those. I traded TIME.

Warframe is the least "Pay to win" game I have ever played from the Free to Play market. It is however "Pay if your impatient".

Regarding the subject however, I hate the fact that Pay to Play games are getting more Pay to Win. It sickens me that the games industry is trying to make games for Profit over Fun. The head of activision stated that games were not meant the be fun, they were meant to be profitable... as an Indie developer, I disagree with this person to such a large degree. I make games to be fun, if they sell, great, I can pay my bills, if they dont, oh well... the ones that do cover the ones that dont. I only ever make games for ME, if someone else likes it enough to buy it, great.

DE are one of the few white knights left in the games industry, them and CD Projekt Red.

 

Down with oppression, down with profit, free the prolitariate... wait... sorry thats wednesdays meeting...

 

[TheGuyver]

1 minute ago, Flames21891 said:

The packs say they unlock weapon accessories, I assumed those were attachments. However, I may be wrong as I've never actually purchased one to find out.

The accessories listed were the m320 grenade launcher and m26 rail shotgun I believe, my cousin purchased the bundle shortcuts for 3 and 4 and he didn't receive any attachments.

 

2 minutes ago, Mephiste said:

The problem with Overkill and PAYDAY2 is that they not only lied to their playerbase saying they would never add microtransactions, which they did. But the fact that they literally smothered a Pay to Play game with DLCs is also a very poor choice of actions. It's why I dropped out of PAYDAY2, shame too, it was a great game.

R.I.P PAY2DAY.

Nuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu. The worst part about the microtransaction update was the weapon rebalance. They put a lot of emphasis on the 100 stability/accuracy system, and ended up nerfing most of the guns in that department leaving you with skins as the only option to make them viable again without having to mod them specifically for sta/acc.

[(XBOX)Eli and Niti]

1 minute ago, TheGuyverOne said:

The accessories listed were the m320 grenade launcher and m26 rail shotgun I believe, my cousin purchased the bundle shortcuts for 3 and 4 and he didn't receive any attachments.

 

Nuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu. The worst part about the microtransaction update was the weapon rebalance. They put a lot of emphasis on the 100 stability/accuracy system, and ended up nerfing most of the guns in that department leaving you with skins as the only option to make them viable again without having to mod them specifically for sta/acc.

A friend of mine bought the unlock pack and got all the "base" attachments, only a few were not unlocked (those you get from golden boxes). So, no bf4 turned very pay to save time. Which from a pay to play is disgusting. The worst offender imo is Destiny... sorry thats Fridays meeting...

[iwoply]

Just now, TheGuyverOne said:

The problem with Overkill and PAYDAY2 is that they not only lied to their playerbase saying they would never add microtransactions, which they did. But the fact that they literally smothered a Pay to Play game with DLCs is also a very poor choice of actions. It's why I dropped out of PAYDAY2, shame too, it was a great game.

Just now, TheGuyverOne said:

Nuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu. The worst part about the microtransaction update was the weapon rebalance. They put a lot of emphasis on the 100 stability/accuracy system, and ended up nerfing most of the guns in that department leaving you with skins as the only option to make them viable again without having to mod them specifically for sta/acc.

There are a lot of things wrong with the way Overkill & Payday do business, but they are a prime example on how not to do business if you're a Pay2Play developer.

When they introduced the micro transactions it affected the players more than it should have, instead of just being cosmetic they added gun stats and all that jazz to the skins and if more Pay2Play games took this motion I'm pretty sure it would have been a larger deal that it currently is.

If they added more time in between each DLC Release, Lowered the Price and added more items to the pack then I don't think the player base would react to the game they do now.

[(XBOX)CitrusTheNile]

20 minutes ago, Eggplants said:

 

 

My opinion on the matter.

Games with a purchase fee for the game itself shouldn't introduce micro transactions at anytime throughout it's life, for example Payday 2. I was happy buying each DLC when they were released but for a game like that to add micro transactions just overstepped its boundary and in my strongest opinion on the matter, the only way Paid games should make their money after launch is from DLC's.

F2P games like Warframe however and it's platinum system etc, allows players to have nearly everything without heavily restricting players from progressing in the game, if more F2P games followed this 'micro transaction/payment' system I would personally enjoy other F2P titles more.

I 100% agree. 

[(XBOX)sh3kvothe]

There is literally nothing on warframe other than fashionframe items that you have to pay for. You can get reactors and catalysts free during alerts. They are few and far apart, but you still get it. And that is one of their top ways of earning money for the game yet they still make it possible to get them for free. Also...you don't even have to pay to get fashionframe half the time. Someone might,but not you. Trade chat, they make it possible to trade the in game currency. You DON'T have to pay to win, you DON'T have to pay for anything. Ever. For any reason. I do though to support the game. 

[AsianLyf]

1 hour ago, (XB1)CitrusTheNile said:

I am basing my prices off Xbox prices. It's 50 dollars for 1000 plat and 150 dollars for 3210 plat. Ember is selling for 1100 plat equating the 50 dollar price tag I mentioned. Its around 300-400 just for her BP.

Man, you must suck at finding deals then, Glaive Prime's set was suppose to be worth over 200 and yet I managed to get mine for 30p within an hour of wanting one....I farmed for both Ember and Frost while they were in the loot tables so I can't say the same for those two. 

[Rakosta_Kai]

If it's a buy to play game that's online and with persistent updates, I see nothing wrong with a cash shop in place for stuff (GW2, BDO).

New seasons/chapters of an existing game are other good options if it genuinely adds content.

 

But a buy-to-play game with micro-transactions/cash shop for necessities from the start?

Gotta say no to that.

 

[MagPrime]

Just now, (XB1)sh3kvothe said:

There is literally nothing on warframe other than fashionframe items that you have to pay for. You can get reactors and catalysts free during alerts. They are few and far apart, but you still get it. And that is one of their top ways of earning money for the game yet they still make it possible to get them for free. Also...you don't even have to pay to get fashionframe half the time. Someone might,but not you. Trade chat, they make it possible to trade the in game currency. You DON'T have to pay to win, you DON'T have to pay for anything. Ever. For any reason. I do though to support the game. 

On PC, you can also get potato BP's and Forma BP's via invasions.

Really, the only things that patience and diligence wont get you, for free, in this game are Slots and cosmetics. Everything else can be obtained without plat if you play long enough.

[(XBOX)sh3kvothe]

1 minute ago, Noamuth said:

On PC, you can also get potato BP's and Forma BP's via invasions.

Really, the only things that patience and diligence wont get you, for free, in this game are Slots and cosmetics. Everything else can be obtained without plat if you play long enough.

My point. They aren't aiming to force anyone into buying anything. They simply offer it and if the people appreciate the game enough they might buy it to help support them some. I've played a lot of free to play games, and I've come across a few that do only focus on cosmetic items, but I've also come across others that push you into a corner and you end up having to pay something out in order to get any where. I enjoy some WoW but after level 20...you gotta pay. 

[MagPrime]

1 minute ago, (XB1)sh3kvothe said:

My point. They aren't aiming to force anyone into buying anything. They simply offer it and if the people appreciate the game enough they might buy it to help support them some. I've played a lot of free to play games, and I've come across a few that do only focus on cosmetic items, but I've also come across others that push you into a corner and you end up having to pay something out in order to get any where. I enjoy some WoW but after level 20...you gotta pay. 

That thing with WoW makes me angred. : / 

[(XBOX)sh3kvothe]

Yea, I mean they tell you before hand and all which is appreciated but it's like going into sams club with no money. Test our food and make yourself more hungry but if you aren't loaded then go away after.

[Zari2015]

1 hour ago, (XB1)CitrusTheNile said:

You can't buy everything in Warframe for $50 dollars at top tier. Ember prime alone costs 60 dollars if you buy her set. Potatoes cost 20 plat so they only cost about $1.25. How would you feel if you had to pay to play Warframe then pay all of these micro transactions?

Say what? I put 12 more $; 62$ and i play World of Warcraft for 6 months with fully and super well contoured content. Also micro-transactions are just for look.

Now i'm thinking after i played a few years WoW, how you can pay for this game? Even when i trading prime parts for platinum i'm still feel stolen when i look in the market.

Ivara 325 platinum =  ~19.5$ i'm feel like i'm paying for slot and reactor too.

Reactor and slot are 1.2$ each. Robbery! Outrageous!

Edited April 14, 2016 by Zari2015

[(XBOX)sh3kvothe]

3 minutes ago, Zari2015 said:

Say what? I put 12 more $; 62$ and i play World of Warcraft for 6 months with fully and super well contoured content. Also micro-transactions are just for look.

Now i'm thinking after i played a few years WoW, how you can pay for this game? Even when i trading prime parts for platinum i'm still feel stolen when i look in the market.

Ivara 325 platinum =  ~19.5$ i'm feel like i'm paying for slot and reactor too.

Reactor and slot are 1.2$ each. Robbery! Outrageous!

Why would you feel like they are stealing from you when you can easily go get her for free. This post is pointless. It's an argument between those who farm and those who are too lazy to want to. That's all this is. Like I said there is literally nothing in this game that you HAVE to pay for other than cosmetics. I have Ivara and didn't pay a dime. I got the reactor for her from a "Gift from the Lotus" alert. >.>You can also  now get them from Sortie missions. So they offered up MORE ways to get one of their top dollar products. But because it isn't cosmetic you can get it for free. 

[Sloan441]

2 hours ago, Ellthan said:

Dota, team fortress, trove, smite and a slew of others are also free to play games. You don't see them milking the fact to this extent.

Yeah, and you don't need to buy any of that stuff to progress through the game. You can get along with what you get in the game. Nothing is necessary. Not to say a lot of that stuff is nice to have and it's convenient to pick up it when you want, but you can get along without spending money.

All of this is besides the fact that no one cares what you do in the game and nothing you do affects anyone else. There's no 'win' to pay for.

[TrickshotMcGee]

As far as I'm aware, there's nothing game-altering that's only available with plat. Many of the best guns are syndicate, clan, or BP in the market for credit purchase, so there is absolutely no incentive to buy plat for weapons. Prime frames aren't necessary in any sense, as they don't offer enough of an advantage to actually change your experience. 

Slots and potatoes are 20 plat each. Spending 30 minutes in avoid mission for Prime parts nets you twice that. Grinding Moon missions gets even more with the mods you can get. Platinum is readily available without excessive time being sunken into it, and certainly without spending money. Aside from that, slots aren't necessary for gameplay, as you can get by with only a few frames and weapons. 

I personally have no issue with paying for plat, as I've got no problem supporting the devs, but it's not necessary, or even unreasonably easier to buy it than earn it. You get items worth plat multiple times every time you play, especially if you do sorties or high-tier void missions, so it's not like you're ever short on the means to obtain it. 

You can't call it "stealing" or "unfair" if it's 100% obtainable without ANY money spent. 

[(XBOX)Eli and Niti]

This is quickly turning into a debate between those to lazy to farm, those who dont understand that you can trade for plat, and those who farm.

On topic, If you pay upfront for a game (p to p), other than expansions (and I dont mean horse armour here), that should be it, save for cosmetics.

[AEP8FlyBoy]

This game's money making model is to "Let the players pay if they wish to progress FASTER", they aren't shoving their methods down our throats, and personally I think it is an okay way to go.

I've spent quite a bit on this game, a great deal more than a standard game's release cost, but that was up to me. I don't mind supporting them and I like having that choice in the matter.

But that said, the choice is yours... whether you want to farm for something or get it right away, whether you want to spend 4-5 hours ranking and re-polarizing gear, or cutting that time in half with a little bit of boosters. And the great thing about this game, is you can earn them as well.

Prime parts are easily accessable and earnable while just playing as a normal guy would (Void Farm for days...) and if you run higher end missions such as Excavations on Pluto, or Spy missions on Neptune and whatnot... you will earn quite a bit of stuff that other players... would buy! For Platinum... imagine that?

In summary, this game is not pay to win, since you can earn everything without spending a dime. It's pay to play/earn faster.

And all in all, it isn't a bad system, and you guys shouldn't be racking on them for that. If you don't want to spend any money, then don't. If you have some spare cash/steam wallet money lying around, by all means. Just don't complain, they have to make a bit of extra money somewhere. Where would they be if they didn't have support like ours? Especially back in the closed beta. (you Founders are awesome btw.)

Edited April 14, 2016 by AEP8FlyBoy

[(XBOX)sh3kvothe]

3 minutes ago, (XB1)Eli and Niti said:

This is quickly turning into a debate between those to lazy to farm, those who dont understand that you can trade for plat, and those who farm.

On topic, If you pay upfront for a game (p to p), other than expansions (and I dont mean horse armour here), that should be it, save for cosmetics.

[(XBOX)CitrusTheNile]

30 minutes ago, Ankoku_no_Hime said:

Man, you must suck at finding deals then, Glaive Prime's set was suppose to be worth over 200 and yet I managed to get mine for 30p within an hour of wanting one....I farmed for both Ember and Frost while they were in the loot tables so I can't say the same for those two. 

I am not buying the prime parts for those prices. That is the asking price on Xbox. I wait until I get a deal just like you do. I got my synoid simulor for 25p. 

[ashrah]

yes its free to play game and u can get almost everything for free just playing game...but u must understand that ppl who  keep this game going must eat pay bils

[(XBOX)sh3kvothe]

1 minute ago, ashrah said:

yes its free to play game and u can get almost everything for free just playing game...but u must understand that ppl who  keep this game going must eat pay bils

Besides if we starve Steve he might nerf everything T.T