Health orbs should restore a percentage of missing HP

[Shuuro]

So, here's a thought, would it really be that bad to have health orbs drop from enemies on a, say, oh I don't know. Maybe half, or a quarter of a chance of an energy orb drop from an enemy?

As it is now, healing is purely left to healing frames, life strike, winds of purity, Equilibrium, loot box/lockers, syndicate procs, don't know if I'm missing anything else.

Would it really be that game changing to have even a slight chance of getting health orbs from enemy drops? Considering enemies can directly attack your health through slash and toxin procs, it would be nice to have health drops from enemies.

In my personal opinion, this wouldn't exactly be a game changer to long time players. As enemies get more difficult, health orbs will get less meaningful due to larger amounts of damage being done to us. In exchange though, it would make the game less punishing for new players, giving them the initiative to press on, heal up, and complete a mission. It would help out on that initial learning curve of the game, and keep new players more interested instead of pushed away on seemingly impossible odds at times.

[AdunSaveMe]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

While I really do think that a lot of things should become multiplicative based over additive based (changing to percentages of things), I don't think health orbs is something that is needed. As part of a mission, I take the time to restore my health by opening up lockers, or using Warframes capable of healing me. 
Personally, I find Nekros's health orb drops to be the perfect go between of OP (Trinity immortal blessing build) and tactical healing.

Not that I find this change to be unbalanced, I just don't find it to be necessary.

In a lot of missions opening up lockers isn't something you can do all the time, nor is it something you can rely on. Just like Nekros' health orb RNG, which even if you luck out, you'll only get a minuscule smidgeon of health that can be gone instantly and does nothing to heal you back up to where you need to be. This is especially true if you don't have a nekros and aren't playing nekros, and don't have the time to find lockers until you feel better.

[Godiz]

i said depending on how new it took me a week of selling Vault mods to get 350-400p and why would a new player be doing missions that can 1 shot them anyways? and you dont have to sit in a corner, you can do some classic wow and hit and run.

[Rociel]

Yes, there are tons of way to restore your HP, e.g. Life Strike, but I'm with OP on this one.

Health orbs are useless, everyone finds it annoying how oberon and nekros spawn them in huge numbers, haven't heard a single player being happy about that in my team.

And yes, almost certainly people will start asking for other stuff to work the same way. Well, that's a job for DE to decide weather it's needed or not and yes, it's not an argument.

[Torhque]

Maybe if enemies dropped health orbs more often this wouldn't need to be implemented. Has DE ever discussed why enemies don't drop health as often as they drop energy?

/sidenote

What's with the antagonizing posts on the first page of this thread? I feel like the attitude and general nature of General Discussion and General Feedback forums are getting worse and worse each day lol. Can't be only me that sees/feels this.

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

2 minutes ago, AdunSaveMe said:

In a lot of missions opening up lockers isn't something you can do all the time, nor is it something you can rely on. Just like Nekros' health orb RNG, which even if you luck out, you'll only get a minuscule smidgeon of health that can be gone instantly and does nothing to heal you back up to where you need to be. This is especially true if you don't have a nekros and aren't playing nekros, and don't have the time to find lockers until you feel better.

 

Which is two sides of the same coin. While I disagree that Nekros isn't as reliable as you make it out to be,as there has never been a time I've run a Despoil build and didn't have health orbs to spare while spamming, I don't feel this change would add anything more to the gameplay than it would take away. 

It would take away some tactical choice, but also speed up the game. It would help higher health frames, but possibly screw over frames that have lower health. I'm not seeing a clear win/loss. It just feels... unnecessary.

[AdunSaveMe]

5 minutes ago, GunDemon said:

i said depending on how new it took me a week of selling Vault mods to get 350-400p and why would a new player be doing missions that can 1 shot them anyways? and you dont have to sit in a corner, you can do some classic wow and hit and run.

If you really think trying to scrounge together 400p to buy a bandaid arcane that doesn't solve any problems is actually a valid point, I don't know what else to say to you at this stage. It's simply not a concept that works, nor does it solve any problem. It's like saying "buy a plane so you can avoid traffic accidents".

[Troll_Logic]

Nope.  I think that makes no sense.  A flat amount of HP makes sense to me.

[AdunSaveMe]

1 minute ago, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

Which is two sides of the same coin. While I disagree that Nekros isn't as reliable as you make it out to be,as there has never been a time I've run a Despoil build and didn't have health orbs to spare while spamming, I don't feel this change would add anything more to the gameplay than it would take away. 

It would take away some tactical choice, but also speed up the game. It would help higher health frames, but possibly screw over frames that have lower health. I'm not seeing a clear win/loss. It just feels... unnecessary.

The win is that health orbs become relevant, especially to frames that are in the fray. It wouldn't be as useful to low health frames which don't rely on health and defenses, but would still benefit them in recovery. Team comps no longer have to rely on a trinity to have good healing. Nekros becomes more relevant to frosts with 1k HP and don't specifically have to build to spam desecrate just to get the most 25hp orbs to drop.

[AdunSaveMe]

Just now, Troll_Logic said:

Nope.  I think that makes no sense.  A flat amount of HP makes sense to me.

Would you like me to list everything that doesn't make sense in this game?

Though I would love to hear why something has to 'make sense' to you when the intention is to improve on a mechanic. There's nothing illogical about it.

[Rociel]

1 minute ago, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

Which is two sides of the same coin. While I disagree that Nekros isn't as reliable as you make it out to be,as there has never been a time I've run a Despoil build and didn't have health orbs to spare while spamming, I don't feel this change would add anything more to the gameplay than it would take away. 

It would take away some tactical choice, but also speed up the game. It would help higher health frames, but possibly screw over frames that have lower health. I'm not seeing a clear win/loss. It just feels... unnecessary.

If you are saying that Valkyr's Hysteria or Ash's Bladestorm aren't broken, I disagree.

Nova and Rhino would gain from this. Can't imagine a frame that would rise to be supopular because of this change. Mostly squishy frames are just that, they aren't frames that can't heal, they just one-hit-die. And like I mentioned before, there is always Life Strike. Did Life Strike make Valkyr, Ash, Rhino or Chroma less valuable?

[LordOfScrugging]

So far Medi-ray is pretty useful to me. the whole "hiding in a corne" thing is a really bad excuse. You can CC, damage, and regain heath in the amount of time it took you to sit in a corner and wait. (though i'm mainly playing as excal prime so blind is perfect for these situations) All in all, don't dismiss an alternative. 12% of max health over 4s (i think it's of max) every 15 seconds or so is more reliable than hoping to find a health orb.

[jjpdn]

While we wait for the change, a Medi-Ray can help you for the moment. 

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

2 minutes ago, Rociel said:

If you are saying that Valkyr's Hysteria or Ash's Bladestorm aren't broken, I disagree.

Nova and Rhino would gain from this. Can't imagine a frame that would rise to be supopular because of this change. Mostly squishy frames are just that, they aren't frames that can't heal, they just one-hit-die. And like I mentioned before, there is always Life Strike. Did Life Strike make Valkyr, Ash, Rhino or Chroma less valuable?

 

I'm not sure where I said any of that at all?

[AdunSaveMe]

1 minute ago, LordOfScrugging said:

So far Medi-ray is pretty useful to me. the whole "hiding in a corne" thing is a really bad excuse. You can CC, damage, and regain heath in the amount of time it took you to sit in a corner and wait. (though i'm mainly playing as excal prime so blind is perfect for these situations) All in all, don't dismiss an alternative. 12% of max health over 4s (i think it's of max) every 15 seconds or so is more reliable than hoping to find a health orb.

Even if this was the case (subjective, I suppose) there's still the fact that health orbs are lacking.

[Troll_Logic]

1 minute ago, AdunSaveMe said:

Would you like me to list everything that doesn't make sense in this game?

Sure.  Feel free.

1 minute ago, AdunSaveMe said:

Though I would love to hear why something has to 'make sense' to you when the intention is to improve on a mechanic. There's nothing illogical about it.

And here we go.  You posted in the feedback section.  I replied with my feedback.  It makes no sense to me that a health orb can heal one player a certain amount of health but another player 20X (200hp vs. 4000hp).  That's completely illogical to me.

I'll let you in on a little life tip.  People can disagree politely.  Stop acting like I kicked your dog because I don't agree with you on this.

[Rociel]

8 minutes ago, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

but possibly screw over frames that have lower health.

 

1 minute ago, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

I'm not sure where I said any of that at all?

I see it as implications. Of course I apologize, if your actual opinion contradicts that.

[AdunSaveMe]

1 minute ago, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

I'm not sure where I said any of that at all?

I think he's just misunderstanding.

You make a good point, but I disagree with it completely. Especially the part about taking away tactical choice; having to rely on taking one or two specific frames or using one specific piece of gear removes tactical choice. Having the ability to heal fast and reliably gives you more options and doesn't punish you for not taking trinity.

[Perral]

Thing is, in the long run, DE HAS stated that they think that it shouldn't be necessary to have a specific build for a task. There are too many things in the game for that, and it just leads to everyone using the same builds, ignoring everything else.

 

You shouldn't need to have arcanes, You shouldn't need Trinity, Nekros, or some other healing frame to survive in the long run.

Things like life strike are also out purely because of how rare it is.

 

Having health orbs give percentage makes perfect sense, since it would make little difference in the beginning, but keep them relevant at the end, while not needing anything specific that requires grinding to get to it.

Saying "Ah yes, but with this specific weapon and mod combination, I am fine!" does not help one bit, as not everyone is using "this specific weapon and mod combination".

[LordOfScrugging]

2 minutes ago, AdunSaveMe said:

Even if this was the case (subjective, I suppose) there's still the fact that health orbs are lacking.

Very. i posed this same issue when that health conversion mod or whatever was released. it is completely useless outside of nekros and oberon. why release a mod that is SOOOOO situational it will never be in a build.

Edited May 1, 2016 by LordOfScrugging

[AdunSaveMe]

4 minutes ago, Troll_Logic said:

And here we go.  You posted in the feedback section.  I replied with my feedback.  It makes no sense to me that a health orb can heal one player a certain amount of health but another player 20X (200hp vs. 4000hp).  That's completely illogical to me.

I'll let you in on a little life tip.  People can disagree politely.  Stop acting like I kicked your dog because I don't agree with you on this.

I didn't act that way at all. You just said "no, it doesn't make sense". You responded to a feedback thread but didn't actually contribute anything that we can discuss. You just essentially said "no" and didn't give a reason. "It desn't make sense" is not a reason, because it has no reasoning behind it, and you didn't provide anything beyond that, which means the comment can't be added to the pool of viable arguments.

I simply wanted you to elaborate on your comment so it could be discussed.

You didn't even do it politely. You weren't impolite until this post, but you weren't all cupcakes and cream either.

Edited May 1, 2016 by AdunSaveMe

[(PSN)IIIDevoidIII]

2 minutes ago, Rociel said:

 

I see it as implications. Of course I apologize, if your actual opinion contradicts that.

 

I mean it in the way that, depending on how large the percentage health regain is, a low health frame would find much less use for it (arguably the frames that would need the health the most when hit). 

For example, if the percentage is, say, 6%, a 400 health frame would feel no difference from the change and receive 25 health, but my 225 health Loki would now only receive 13.5 Health on pickup.

[-Mr.Meeseeks-]

39 minutes ago, GunDemon said:

get arcanes that restore hp or use the new sentinel mod there are plenty of ways to restore hp including rejuv

No one is disputing that there are other ways of restoring health. The point being made here is that health orbs don't work as well as DE probably intends them to considering all the new content added to the game (Inaros for example).

[Azrael]

1 minute ago, Troll_Logic said:

People can disagree politely.

Well, sir, I politely disagree.

 

5 minutes ago, LordOfScrugging said:

So far Medi-ray is pretty useful to me. the whole "hiding in a corne" thing is a really bad excuse. You can CC, damage, and regain heath in the amount of time it took you to sit in a corner and wait.

That, and these kinds of heals are available even when you aren't about to die. Overall, medi-ray or grace will greatly increase the amount of healing you receive. And as a recent Inaros devotee, I can't wait to get this mod. But I still claim that medi-ray and arcane grace and arcane victory are poor fixes for health orbs, simply because of their cost and availability.

The real point I'm making is: health orbs aren't balanced with the other heals in the game. There's no reason to have a healing mechanic that's always available, but yet is only rarely useful and pales in comparison to other healing mechanics. I'm just asking that we bring health orbs in line with the rest of the game. It's probably not needed, but still, why not?

[AdunSaveMe]

Just now, (PS4)IIIDevoidIII said:

I mean it in the way that, depending on how large the percentage health regain is, a low health frame would find much less use for it (arguably the frames that would need the health the most when hit). 

For example, if the percentage is, say, 6%, a 400 health frame would feel no difference from the change and receive 25 health, but my 225 health Loki would now only receive 13.5 Health on pickup.

In my original post I said 'a percentage of max HP, on top of that flat amount'. Which means low hp frames won't gain much, but they lose nothing.