What do you think of Warframes and weapons not viable against 400lvl enemies are bad?

[Ryddem]

De have to define what is 'endgame' once and for all, becouse as of now there is none. 

We had our endless void mission before, and as a relatively new player i always saw that as engame but now theres nothing more than sorties. 

The enless mission were the only content that ever posed any challange what so ever.

I don't even understand why we have this discussion in the first place.

[SinergyX]

8 minutes ago, Govictory said:

level 400 enemies? don't worry just let me bring my dagger with covert lethalitty on a Ivara and watch me prowl and sleep arrow all of the enemies and dagger to instakill them and not be worried about being shot at in the process

This, Covert Lethality is the only endgame (if there is any) mod/weapon ingame, upto lvl9999 (provided you got energy/dont run into nulifiers).

All other capable at such high level is part of some mechanics-glitch or exploit, apart the very few skills that do %-based damage rather then fixed (toxic aura of Chroma i believe?).

And offcourse Valkyr with Hysteria pre-nerf, according to most people.

Or you can hope for Nyx, where they kill eachother off :P

[Mochikomi_Shin_Jidai]

5 hours ago, (PS4)bddacres said:

Warframe is an endless mission game....... The belief that a weapon should never fall off in dps is illogically and DE should realize it as such 

DOWN VOTE

Stupid logic is stupid

 

[(PSN)Magician_NG]

The sooner DE removes 4x CP...the better.

[DEATHLOK]

1. More mods that scale damage with enemy level.
2. Leveled AI, but good luck with that. It's long been the case to "level" enemies with increased damage and health, maybe throw in extra abilities. But differentiate behavior?—that's a bit avant-garde for game developers.

It's going to be difficult to craft an organic end-game, given there will always be players discovering new and unheralded exploits to undermine anything developers create.

[VCaptiion]

Tell them to stop complaining because they have nothing to do other than killing enemies with meta-frame and meta-weapons. They can't think and find out the fun themselves even they have the best gear in the game. Once people found out how to cheese it then such 'complain loop' starts again.

Edited July 29, 2016 by VCaptiion

[Airwolfen]

The only weapon I had that could kill lvl 9999 enemies was my dagger.

Therefor all other weapons suck :|

[DeFragMe]

1 minute ago, Airwolfen said:

The only weapon I had that could kill lvl 9999 enemies was my dagger.

Therefor all other weapons suck :|

but, can you say the same when you use a rhino?

[Voltage]

7 hours ago, Volinus7 said:

My benchmark is 20 lvl150 napalms lol

 

anything that survived get my "Quality tested" stamp on it.

I tested my inaros with that logic and was able to go make a sandwich and he was still alive XD

[(XBOX)Prime Pedestal]

1 hour ago, DeFragMe said:

got that yesterday in a t4 survival tear as Ivara. was the one who always rezzed the other ones and keept the life support going... but before hand they told me that they wont rezz me... maybe i should have left them on the floor...

I had that with Excalibur on a sortie couple days ago. Someone asked me not to play him. He was my starter and I've not put 6 forma and a stupid amount of time play testing to not use my favourite frame. At the end of the day any frame can be used in any mission type if it's modded and played correctly, hell when im feeling lazy I just use my rhino or valkyr to run through spy missions.

[(XBOX)Prime Pedestal]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Magician_NG said:

The sooner DE removes 4x CP...the better.

You can play a survival with Ivara for as long as you can physically stay awake so does this mean covert lethality daggers should also be removed?

[DeFragMe]

8 minutes ago, (XB1)AnnoyedHaddock said:

You can play a survival with Ivara for as long as you can physically stay awake so does this mean covert lethality daggers should also be removed?

well, for ivara you dont need really covert lethality, jsut if you want to instant kill. Big heavy weapon makes quite a deadly finisher even on level 100+ , later oyu will need two finishers or four, but still works.

 

PS: yes, after a certain level even that does not work anymore because you have to fnish them 29 times before they die

[(XBOX)Prime Pedestal]

9 minutes ago, DeFragMe said:

well, for ivara you dont need really covert lethality, jsut if you want to instant kill. Big heavy weapon makes quite a deadly finisher even on level 100+ , later oyu will need two finishers or four, but still works.

 

PS: yes, after a certain level even that does not work anymore because you have to fnish them 29 times before they die

I just don't understand why you would want CP removed from the game, if that were to go then Shield Disruption would have to go as well with it being the Corpus equivalent. I may be slightly wrong with these numbers but a lvl 80 bombard has around 80k hp, with no armour degradation this means an ehp of around 750k, which is more or less a full Soma Prime clip of headshots (w/o corrosive damage) which is virtually impossible to do, I just don't see how it's a bad thing to have in the game. I've forma'd most of my frames to have no polarity, but I find a big proportion of players don't touch them meaning it's actually harder than you'd think to get 4x CP on a team.

Edited July 29, 2016 by (XB1)AnnoyedHaddock

[DeFragMe]

8 minutes ago, (XB1)AnnoyedHaddock said:

I just don't understand why you would want CP removed from the game, if that were to go then Shield Disruption would have to go as well with it being the Corpus equivalent. I may be slightly wrong with these numbers but a lvl 80 bombard has around 80k hp, with no armour degradation this means an ehp of around 750k, which is more or less a full Soma Prime clip of headshots (w/o corrosive damage) which is virtually impossible to do, I just don't see how it's a bad thing to have in the game. I've forma'd most of my frames to have no polarity, but I find a big proportion of players don't touch them meaning it's actually harder than you'd think to get 4x CP on a team.

we never said we want it completly removed.

i for at least dont like that 4 CPs (or 3 + drifts) remove the armor completly.. wich makes in my eyes no sense. Its not like the enemie is running because of this without armor around.

Shield disruptor at least was never a full reduction to 0 (the drift mods changed that)

[Lakais]

As someone said earlier. "Endgame" has nothing to do with enemy levels. Endgame is personal, it's what you do when you have chewed through the core part of the game. It's what keeps you entertained. To many it's ultra-difficult enemies that require a specific, distilled and perfectly executed playstyle and gear set. That's how it's been from older MMO games and it has spilled over. But that is simply their interpretation, their opinion. 

Me? I go around the star chart collecting fragments. And occasionally writing my own little head-canon campaign that I run through. And some other times I basically sit in Larunda Relay or my ship and just chat away for hours on end. Every once in a blue moon, I do plat and mod giveaways to new players because I can. Some days I only log on for the daily tribute. 

Those are the things that Entertain my three year old Tenno rear from day to day and those are my Endgame. 

Edited July 29, 2016 by Lakais

[EthosP]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Magician_NG said:

The sooner DE removes 4x CP...the better.

The sooner DE makes enemy scaling reasonable...the better. 

[(PSN)Magician_NG]

3 minutes ago, EthosP said:

The sooner DE makes enemy scaling reasonable...the better. 

I agree.

The problem is...I get the feeling that DE doesn't care about enemy armor scaling as much as they should.

I think their focus is to continue pulling back on player power, making cheese filled endurance runs increasingly more difficult to accomplish.

 

[Message2god]

I always feel like i always pull everyone else down because i run with anything not the best.

Other players are so much more effective that i can't even see any enemies alive before i aim and get blamed for doing nothing.

I cannot play the weapons and warframes that i like anymore because their inferior.

 

 

[DSpite]

On 29/07/2016 at 6:12 PM, Message2god said:

Topic is not about the necessity of fighting over lvl100 enemies but the fact that some warframe and weapons efficiency trumps others by so much that they are labeled as best and everyone must use it.

I played Guildwars 2, anyone one joining a party not running the highest dps setup are kicked instantly, everyone goes for speed runs and perfect loadout. They say the bad gears and weapons(any lower dps setups) exist to differentiate the good players and the bad players.

The fact that "speed runs" are even a thing in Guild Wars - just like our ability to just skip-run-and-jump all the way to an objective ignoring all the mobs in between - is technically "faulty mission design". If you basically ignore entire sections of maps, then there is no real point in keeping them. The mission should either be modified or objectives changed so that more interaction from players is needed to actually get to the mission end objective.

I play GW2 with guildies, and if we have people that are "too much" sub-optimal, we give advice. Kicking people because they are 80% of max DPS is idiotic and makes people not want to play in the first place. If and when there is specific runs that guild members are doing ONLY to get something specific, they chat first and recruit people that know the map, complement each other skills, etc etc, no one with ANY common sense just tries to recruit PUGs for the highest level Fractals, the same way that my volleyball team would not just invite someone that was sitting down watching the games if we arrived at the finals and a player was sick.

We would want someone we have used before AT LEAST similar to our play level, otherwise we might as well concede the game altogether and just play for fun rather then to win.

You can't expect a total stranger to know our calls or our usual tactics. It would just not work and be a mess.

Also, just because someone shows up with the correct skills and gear, it does mean he can play well. It just means that someone has a least told him "set up like this web page sais for this mission", and you would still have to ditch and start again - by that standard you proposed - and waste time, once again because you could not be bothered making some friends of similar skill level.

[ranks21]

you can use any weapon with the right setup to kill any level enemy, some just do it faster than others

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=734910729

that's level 408 rathum enemy and i'm only using body count fever strike point strike  and true steel to make it somewhat of a challenge. if you look closely at the health versus the armor on the bar youll see its almost dead with basically all its shields still intact or armor ( targeting an enemy's health always works better than using CP).

skill has nothing to do with it just being practical and efficient and this game is boring af.

[Omnimorph]

On 29 July 2016 at 7:57 AM, Message2god said:

End game is not lvl40 or lvl100 so simple.

I have heard so many people say this weapon cannot kill 150lvl heavy gunners, this warframe is useless on 400lvl enemies, high armor warframes still die in 1 hit no matter how high armor you stack so their useless.

What should DE do? Boost all the weapons and warframes up to par to deal with extreme content or nerf all of the over performing things down so nobody can survive to 400lvl enemies?

I think this may be one of the reasons DE have temporarily called a halt to the endless mission style (by taking away incentive to do them). 

Endless missions were always a placeholder for endgame content proper - something to keep vets occupied.  I don't think they were ever meant as a true representative of what DE's planned endgame content would be, but unfortunately since they were all that was around for a long time, from the playerbase's point of view (i.e. from the point of view of discussions amongst the playerbase) everything got a bit skewed around the endless content.  i.e., the trouble is the endless missions skewed the playerbase's idea of what "endgame appropriate" frames and weapons are, skewed the discourse around builds, etc.

I think with the introduction of the Raids, Sorties, Sentients, and stuff to come, we will probably see DE's plan for the endame proper develop further - and that is, I think designed around the "ceiling" of fully-modded weapons and frames, to provide content that is challenging for the average player who's developed some skill with their tools in the course of playing (i.e. they're neither brilliant nor S#&$) at that level.  That's also the level at which builds should be discussed - e.g. for example, the furore around "mandatory" and "useless" mods seems to me to be obviously an artefact of endless mission types' skewing of what people think as "endgame". 

If you think of just-above-Sortie level of difficulty as the endgame level DE are aiming at, then actually there's a fair amount of elbow-room for QOL and utility builds, when you're not trying to squeeze maximum burst dps, or trying to avoid using bullet hose weapons, say, for mobs above lvl 150 etc.  (i.e. what I mean is, something like the Soma, which is a fine, powerful weapon up to lvl 100 mobs, becomes useless beyond that, because you have to pump out several clips to kill something, which means ammo mute is mandatory, which lowers dps - so shotguns are the meta for the endless content, and even they need ammo mutes). 

Mutatis mutandis for frames - EVERY frame is perfectly viable for all content up to about lvl100, or just beyond.  But with the endless content, only particular frames in particular combinations were viable, so every other frame got castigated as "useless" in the meta.  But that's nonsense - and that's not what DE want.

Edited July 31, 2016 by Omnimorph

[ranks21]

taking away or limiting endless missions has left the game where it is now. sorties, raids and quests are only appealing for only so long (very limited)

endless missions whether you agree or not, has been and will always be the proving grounds for how well you are as a warframer. modding, tactical awareness,playing in a squad etc

[(PSN)Deception_Pharo]

There are frames that can survive level 80-100 enemies and as for damage you have banshee that can dish out tons of damage so that answers your question.

[VoidNomade]

1 hour ago, ranks21 said:

taking away or limiting endless missions has left the game where it is now. sorties, raids and quests are only appealing for only so long (very limited)

endless missions whether you agree or not, has been and will always be the proving grounds for how well you are as a warframer. modding, tactical awareness,playing in a squad etc

 

standing afk in a corner or on top of boxed pressing 4 and stuck the mousebutton or running around with shadow step

such endless skill

no Sir whether you agree or not endless missions always endorsed and breed the most cheesy most boring gameplay you can possible meet in wf

 

[ranks21]

 endless missions always endorsed and breed the most cheesy most boring gameplay you can possible meet in wf

you can do that in almost all missions including raids and sorties, how some players play should not be of any concern to you or the devs themselves because the ultimate goal is to get ppl to play the game.