If Oberon was Good....

[RavenCorella]

Listen to the folks who like it, guys. 
Oberon is the best frame out there, matter of fact-... I'd say his healing ability needs an immediate nerf because unlike Trinity it can heal over the entire map. I really hope this unfairness gets reworked, given Oberon is the best frame and it shouldn't outshine all of the others.

Oberon is too op, nerf please.

[Melos-mevim]

why do people keep demanding that he has to be either a paladin or a druid, why not both? make him some hybrid Druidin who fights with the power of nature or something like that

[Teloch]

20 minutes ago, cookieknife said:

but everyone around me hates him

People use to hate everything that doesn't kill an entire map via one button push (everything that is not like Ash), everything that doesn't lock down all map (everything that isn't pre-nerf mirage), and everything that isn't nearly invulnerable (unlike Inaros or pre-nerf Valkyr)

Yes, Oberon has problems, like the timer on renewal effect, but his main problem isn't his niche but the fact his niche is unpopular among vast masses of players and will always be ignored . An average player doesn't want to heal or buff, an average player wants to kill everything easily and to stay alive while doing so. That is why Oberon is mostly slapped across his deer mug not for flaws in his support abilities, but because he isn't damaging enough.

Edited August 14, 2016 by Teloch

[Xekrin]

1 hour ago, Senpai-Pie said:

Any frame can be good, if you yourself aren't horrible.

1 hour ago, Govictory said:

are you implying he is terrible?

It isn't really about terrible or good, yes any frame can be good with the right tactics and some skill on the player's part.  But its a comparison game, compare oberon to valkyr or ash or mesa or nova or just about every other frame except a few.  Any player with enough dedication to oberon can make him pretty good, but a new player jumps into him and they probably aren't going to like it much.  That same player jumps into some of the other frames and bam, they're off.

Yes he has pretty nice abilities, but any frame can always use touchups, people are just terrified of that concept because any time anyone asks for a rework or for this ability or that ability to be tweaked they think it will just get nerfed.

[cookieknife]

6 minutes ago, Teloch said:

People use to hate everything that doesn't kill an entire map via one button push (everything that is not like Ash), everything that doesn't lock down all map (everything that isn't pre-nerf mirage), and everything that isn't nearly invulnerable (unlike Inaros or pre-nerf Valkyr)

Yes, Oberon has problems, like the timer on renewal effect, but his main problem isn't his niche but the fact his niche is unpopular among vast masses of players and will always be ignored . An average player doesn't want to heal or buff, an average player wants to kill everything easily and to stay alive while doing so. That is why Oberon is mostly slapped across his deer mug not for flaws in his support abilities, but because he isn't damaging enough.

I feel his main problem is the damage he does falls flat and he cant be a bullet sponge, he has the paladin title but cant really take a hit which sort of bothers me. also hallowed ground offers nothing other than status. it's armor buff is minuscule to the amount it doesn't effect you, and it's damage is forgettable (although you can stack it but why would a power be considered useful if you have to cast it 10 times in 20 seconds?)

 

 If it's armor buff was up to 50% like valkyr's or 100% and his base armor was a tad bit higher, maybe it would be good and worth using for armor buffs. It also would be great to use as a synergy element honestly. it's like using polarize on mag, those enemies get more damage on crush, if Oberon was reworked hallowed ground needs to be touched up the most, and definitely needs to have synergy surrounding it. If an enemy is standing on hallowed ground and you use smite or reckoning on it, it should do something other than more damage (or more damage AND a special effect) but that would be a really good thing to bring him on par or atleast comparable to other frames

Edited August 14, 2016 by cookieknife
i added some stuff trying to make it clearerish

[-Costi-]

Dont worry guys his time  will come , these days De is working hardly on anything else.

 

[Syln]

19 minutes ago, Melos-mevim said:

why do people keep demanding that he has to be either a paladin or a druid, why not both? make him some hybrid Druidin who fights with the power of nature or something like that

Fight with the power of nature and burn it with holy fire :3

[Tesseract7777]

The worst frame in the game? Some of you have taken leave of your senses... 

 

Certainly like many old frames he could use some updating, and certainly a lot of frames would be a better choice for a lot of roles. But the worst, or even bad? Nonsense. 

Not being the optimal choice for most things doesn't make something bad or worse. 

Besides, there ARE times, however niche (and niche is an okay thing to be, when we have like infinity number warframes at this point) when you will want Oberon over others. 

Can you say freaking proc immunity? If you can't see how in some missions or situations you will want a frame that can provide area proc immunity over any other frame than you are hopeless. The fact that this frame can also top up health, apply rad procs and blind enemies is just icing on the cake. That is his "special role", and no Nezha doesn't do it nearly as well. He has to continually skate around and only has little pathways, it helps remove procs, but to easily apply constant proc immunity to large area, that's Oberon's game. 

Sure, it's niche, but its a situation where you want him over anyone else, when you want area proc immunity. I could name plenty of missions, especially sorties, where this would be a great idea. 

Others have also pointed out that he has a lot of great powers that are synergistic with each other. 

Sure, he needs some love like most frames do, but he is in no way bad, or not needed in meta/sorties. 

[cookieknife]

3 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

The worst frame in the game? Some of you have taken leave of your senses... 

 

Certainly like many old frames he could use some updating, and certainly a lot of frames would be a better choice for a lot of roles. But the worst, or even bad? Nonsense. 

Not being the optimal choice for most things doesn't make something bad or worse. 

Besides, there ARE times, however niche (and niche is an okay thing to be, when we have like infinity number warframes at this point) when you will want Oberon over others. 

Can you say freaking proc immunity? If you can't see how in some missions or situations you will want a frame that can provide area proc immunity over any other frame than you are hopeless. The fact that this frame can also top up health, apply rad procs and blind enemies is just icing on the cake. That is his "special role", and no Nezha doesn't do it nearly as well. He has to continually skate around and only has little pathways, it helps remove procs, but to easily apply constant proc immunity to large area, that's Oberon's game. 

Sure, it's niche, but its a situation where you want him over anyone else, when you want area proc immunity. I could name plenty of missions, especially sorties, where this would be a great idea. 

Others have also pointed out that he has a lot of great powers that are synergistic with each other. 

Sure, he needs some love like most frames do, but he is in no way bad, or not needed in meta/sorties. 

his powers are not synergistic at all with eachother. other than knockdowns theres nothing.

[Tesseract7777]

52 minutes ago, Xekrin said:

 

2 minutes ago, cookieknife said:

 

[Urlan]

Oberon is an all-rounder, he isn't supposed to be better in any particular role than most other warframes, he is supposed to take different roles and combine them in one place - not as good as the specialists but able to cover those roles well. Oberon actually has decent damage for his abilities except hallowed ground of course. Smite actually is one of the highest damaging first abilities while Reckoning does 1250 damage split between impact and radiation. In Reckoning's case, it suffers from poor range, as it is the smallest range around a warframe - it was increased however - it used to be around the distance of the current PVP version. Oberon and Nezha can remove status, as they are both something of all-rounders focused on party protection - this makes sense. Oberon with allies standing on Hallowed Ground or getting full healed from Renewal while Nezha's Fire Trail also removes status.

Another point that constantly comes up is Oberon hasn't got a rework, what is interesting is the Paladin warframe has, besides the little tweaks every so often; Oberon received a rework around Archwing - it gave him increased life, armor, and boosted his Reckoning, Smite, Renewal, and even his Hallowed Ground a bit. Unlike many reworks since, nothing was taken away in this rework, all of it was positive; the problem was that in the next patch all enemies were boosted in some cases by double damage and then received silly accuracy bonuses. The bonuses to his survival stats were practically negated, however, Oberon still stands as something of a median; if Oberon gets one-shot by something, its stronger than the old average and anything less is too fragile to survive it without ability spam.

I am not saying that those that want Oberon to be pumped don't have value in what they say, I play Oberon more than most and feel that he could use some small improvements here and there. It is important to note however that Oberon is a Paladin with nature Druid sub-theme - both all rounders - and has the role of an all rounder not the specialist like Trinity or Nova for instance. What Oberon brings to a team is covering roles, Oberon can help on damage, healing, and disruption with usually being semi tough in the position. Could Oberon be improved? Yes, but its important to improve him in his role and remember that he is the "balanced warframe".

[Tesseract7777]

Sorry forum glitch, this system messes up quotes so bad it drives me crazy. 

 

Anyways, I don't mean he has great synergy, but there's a little bit and there's a consistent theme, and his abilities mesh decently together. 

 

I think his main problem is just that he needs to be more tanky/hallowed ground needs to scale better for armor buff. Fix timer nonsense with Renewal and touch it up a bit. Apart from that I don't see the need for enormous changes to Oberon. 

If Hallowed Ground were worth using an armor buffing ability, and if Renewal could stay on when allies were at full health to act as a constant health regen... and if the way duration/the timer worked made more logical sense. I think Oberon would be in a good place. 

His (1) is more solid than most (1) skills and his ultimate only needs one change -- make a chance for health orb to drop as long as Oberon assisted in the kill, instead of only when he kills them with it, so that function of the ability actually scales. 

Edited August 14, 2016 by Tesseract7777

[cookieknife]

5 minutes ago, Urlan said:

Oberon is an all-rounder, he isn't supposed to be better in any particular role than most other warframes, he is supposed to take different roles and combine them in one place - not as good as the specialists but able to cover those roles well. Oberon actually has decent damage for his abilities except hallowed ground of course. Smite actually is one of the highest damaging first abilities while Reckoning does 1250 damage split between impact and radiation. In Reckoning's case, it suffers from poor range, as it is the smallest range around a warframe - it was increased however - it used to be around the distance of the current PVP version. Oberon and Nezha can remove status, as they are both something of all-rounders focused on party protection - this makes sense. Oberon with allies standing on Hallowed Ground or getting full healed from Renewal while Nezha's Fire Trail also removes status.

Another point that constantly comes up is Oberon hasn't got a rework, what is interesting is the Paladin warframe has, besides the little tweaks every so often; Oberon received a rework around Archwing - it gave him increased life, armor, and boosted his Reckoning, Smite, Renewal, and even his Hallowed Ground a bit. Unlike many reworks since, nothing was taken away in this rework, all of it was positive; the problem was that in the next patch all enemies were boosted in some cases by double damage and then received silly accuracy bonuses. The bonuses to his survival stats were practically negated, however, Oberon still stands as something of a median; if Oberon gets one-shot by something, its stronger than the old average and anything less is too fragile to survive it without ability spam.

I am not saying that those that want Oberon to be pumped don't have value in what they say, I play Oberon more than most and feel that he could use some small improvements here and there. It is important to note however that Oberon is a Paladin with nature Druid sub-theme - both all rounders - and has the role of an all rounder not the specialist like Trinity or Nova for instance. What Oberon brings to a team is covering roles, Oberon can help on damage, healing, and disruption with usually being semi tough in the position. Could Oberon be improved? Yes, but its important to improve him in his role and remember that he is the "balanced warframe".

he isnt balanced is the thing. he has no synergy and his powers do not really compliment eachother

[Tesseract7777]

Just now, cookieknife said:

he isnt balanced is the thing. he has no synergy and his powers do not really compliment eachother

Well they don't exactly, but they almost do. Apart from just being thematic, they almost have a certain compliment to each other, they are all just missing a little something -- it is like, in my opinion, that Oberon is almost within reach of making perfect sense, but he just doesn't quite add up. I think he's fixable without insane changes, just some tweaks, some common sense quality of life changes. 

[cookieknife]

2 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Well they don't exactly, but they almost do. Apart from just being thematic, they almost have a certain compliment to each other, they are all just missing a little something -- it is like, in my opinion, that Oberon is almost within reach of making perfect sense, but he just doesn't quite add up. I think he's fixable without insane changes, just some tweaks, some common sense quality of life changes. 

his fourth needs reimagined honestly.. the way it is, it's only useful if the enemy is dead. and you have to use it a few times for that to happen at higher levels.. which a lot of the time using all your energy at once will get ya killed

[Tesseract7777]

4 minutes ago, cookieknife said:

his fourth needs reimagined honestly.. the way it is, it's only useful if the enemy is dead. and you have to use it a few times for that to happen at higher levels.. which a lot of the time using all your energy at once will get ya killed

Well, in terms of the health orbs, just make it based on kill assists or something, so he can actually keep scaling that part of his ability. 

As for the rest of his fourth ability, I think the issue is that it tries to do too much and doesn't do any of it very well (which is why reimagining it a bit would not be a bad thing) 

Like, it's trying to be Nyx's chaos, and Excal's Radial Blind and some kind of radial knockdown ability all at the same time and it also wants to be a damage ability too. And a healing utility/support ability. 

That's trying to do way too much. I think they need to tighten it down to just doing a couple things, and then buffing up how well Reckoning does those things. It doesn't need to be trying to be five-six abilities at once, it is all over the place. 

Edited August 14, 2016 by Tesseract7777

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

Do people not see the benefit in extending bleedout with renewal? No one has ever had that one idiot teammate who is hopelessly surrounded by enemies and you need to thin them out first before saving them? Sometimes 15 seconds isn't enough. My only complaint is the effect randomly shuts off.

And Reckoning I think needs something similar to Nova where duration effects how the ability works. Short duration it instantly slams them into the ground. Longer duration it keeps them suspended longer in the air.

[cookieknife]

5 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Well, in terms of the health orbs, just make it based on kill assists or something, so he can actually keep scaling that part of his ability. 

As for the rest of his fourth ability, I think the issue is that it tries to do too much and doesn't do any of it very well (which is why reimagining it a bit would not be a bad thing) 

Like, it's trying to be Nyx's chaos, and Excal's Radial Blind and some kind of radial knockdown ability all at the same time and it also wants to be a damage ability too. And a healing utility/support ability. 

That's trying to do way too much. I think they need to tighten it down to just doing a couple things, and then buffing up how well Reckoning does those things. It doesn't need to be trying to be five-six abilities at once, it is all over the place. 

i feel it's blind should go and be replaced with something useful, it is his Ultimate ability , so something like armor strip or just making the orb drop a percent chance that isnt just on death would be pretty useful              

an idea for hallowed ground i had would be like, if you cast smite on an enemy standing on hallowed, it creates a radiation hazard (rad procs high chanced inside like on sorties, just wont damage tenno) doing the damage of hallowed ground, and using reckoning roots enemies in their place on hallowed ground so they stay there for 8 seconds on the ground (or anything like that i feel would  be cool and give him more utility and synergy)

Edited August 14, 2016 by cookieknife

[TheGodofWiFi]

1 hour ago, Teloch said:

People use to hate everything that doesn't kill an entire map via one button push (everything that is not like Ash), everything that doesn't lock down all map (everything that isn't pre-nerf mirage), and everything that isn't nearly invulnerable (unlike Inaros or pre-nerf Valkyr)

Yes, Oberon has problems, like the timer on renewal effect, but his main problem isn't his niche but the fact his niche is unpopular among vast masses of players and will always be ignored . An average player doesn't want to heal or buff, an average player wants to kill everything easily and to stay alive while doing so. That is why Oberon is mostly slapped across his deer mug not for flaws in his support abilities, but because he isn't damaging enough.

Not true. No one hates everything that doesn't kill with one button press. We have weapons to kill for us, CC and healing has always been more popular than straight up damage. No one hates Loki. No one hates Mirage. If anything people HATE press 4 to win.

Oberon does a very poor job of both CC and healing. His blind is a joke, the rad proc is laughable, the armour buff is so small it might as well not be there. 

I played Oberon for the first few months I started this game and I loved him. Then I started picking up frames like Nyx, Trinity, Inaros, Excalibur, Loki. All of them did a much better job than Oberon in both CC and healing.

Oberon is trying to have its cake and eat it but in doing so makes himself so utterly useless when compared to others.

You are incorrect in saying average players just want to press 4 to win. I'm an "average" player and I find that the most boring way to complete a mission. I prefer running Loki and Inaros most of the time. The frames keep you alive and your weapons do the killing.

Stop saying that everyone hates Oberon because he's not damaging enough. If he had decent CC and zero damage people would use him. But he has pitiful CC and laughable damage.

[cookieknife]

1 minute ago, LorianTheElderPrince said:

Not true. No one hates everything that doesn't kill with one button press. We have weapons to kill for us, CC and healing has always been more popular than straight up damage. No one hates Loki. No one hates Mirage. If anything people HATE press 4 to win.

Oberon does a very poor job of both CC and healing. His blind is a joke, the rad proc is laughable, the armour buff is so small it might as well not be there. 

I played Oberon for the first few months I started this game and I loved him. Then I started picking up frames like Nyx, Trinity, Inaros, Excalibur, Loki. All of them did a much better job than Oberon in both CC and healing.

Oberon is trying to have its cake and eat it but in doing so makes himself so utterly useless when compared to others.

You are incorrect in saying average players just want to press 4 to win. I'm an "average" player and I find that the most boring way to complete a mission. I prefer running Loki and Inaros most of the time. The frames keep you alive and your weapons do the killing.

Stop saying that everyone hates Oberon because he's not damaging enough. If he had decent CC and zero damage people would use him. But he has pitiful CC and laughable damage.

also hes a considered paladin and cant tank even slightlyyyy 

[Tesseract7777]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Tactless_Ninja said:

Do people not see the benefit in extending bleedout with renewal? No one has ever had that one idiot teammate who is hopelessly surrounded by enemies and you need to thin them out first before saving them? Sometimes 15 seconds isn't enough. My only complaint is the effect randomly shuts off.

And Reckoning I think needs something similar to Nova where duration effects how the ability works. Short duration it instantly slams them into the ground. Longer duration it keeps them suspended longer in the air.

 

That's interesting because that's something I was thinking about earlier. Maybe also it could do more damage when they land the longer they are in the air. 

 

1 minute ago, cookieknife said:

i feel it's blind should go and be replaced with something useful, it is his Ultimate ability , so something like armor strip or just making the orb drop a percent chance that isnt just on death would be pretty useful              

an idea for hallowed ground i had would be like, if you cast smite on an enemy standing on hallowed, it creates a radiation hazard (rad procs high chanced inside like on sorties, just wont damage tenno) doing the damage of hallowed ground, and using reckoning roots enemies in their place on hallowed ground so they stay there for 8 seconds on the ground (or anything like that i feel would  be cool and give him more utility and synergy)

 

Yeah I think the blind is out of place. Like Tactless Ninja was suggesting, I think it would be an interesting idea to have them held longer in the air, based on duration, which would also increase slam damage or something (longer they are in the air). Enemies would still be irradiated, but would have a chance to drop a health sphere as long as Reckoning damaged them before they died. Adding a short duration armor stripping effect, or, even a vulnerability effect like Day Equinox can cast with Rage, would give a helpful oomph to make it feel like an ultimate. But yeah I don't think it should be a blind ability, that just feels out of place. Like something there for token reasons. 

[cookieknife]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)Tactless_Ninja said:

Do people not see the benefit in extending bleedout with renewal? No one has ever had that one idiot teammate who is hopelessly surrounded by enemies and you need to thin them out first before saving them? Sometimes 15 seconds isn't enough. My only complaint is the effect randomly shuts off.

And Reckoning I think needs something similar to Nova where duration effects how the ability works. Short duration it instantly slams them into the ground. Longer duration it keeps them suspended longer in the air.

yes there is a benefit of doing that, but when oberon first came out his renewal could revive enemies. now that they nerfed it, it isnt really as much of an asset anymore. if they would bring it back to that idea, but making the time not instant but gradual, it would be great. NEKROS HAS AN AUGMENT FOR SOUL PUNCH THAT INSTANT REVIVES so why does this nerf need to stay lol... and yeah sorry im complaining about a 2 year old nerf....

[Tesseract7777]

Just now, cookieknife said:

yes there is a benefit of doing that, but when oberon first came out his renewal could revive enemies. now that they nerfed it, it isnt really as much of an asset anymore. if they would bring it back to that idea, but making the time not instant but gradual, it would be great. NEKROS HAS AN AUGMENT FOR SOUL PUNCH THAT INSTANT REVIVES so why does this nerf need to stay lol... and yeah sorry im complaining about a 2 year old nerf....

I guess Phoenix Renewal is like a massively nerfed form of that -- although mostly useless since Renewal turns off when health is maxed, meaning you can't just keep it on all the time. 

[TheGodofWiFi]

1 minute ago, cookieknife said:

also hes a considered paladin and cant tank even slightlyyyy 

Yea traditionally Paladins are like walking tank healers. Trinitys and Inaros seem to have won that title though. Honestly I really like Oberon, he was the first frame I truly enjoyed when I started this game. I hope he gets a good rework because I really canno find a reason to choose him over my Loki.

[MegpoidBeetle]

Broberon ain't a bad frame, nor is he exactly "perfect" either due to his jack of all trades status. Sure some might think I'm being bias due to my Oberon avatar, but I don't deny that he's my favourite :3 Got six formas on this bby. Playing 1 hour T4 survival wasn't much of a problem with him back then, and Shadow Step hasn't existed yet during then.

I just feel that his Hallowed Ground and Renewal could use a lil rework. And also I want a way to disable his friendly wildlife passives, it feels forceful especially when I wanna murder that annoying Hyekka.

If I want to be really honest I'd say Limbo/Hydroid is the worst frame, but of course I believe there are players that can make them undefeatable in missions.

Edited August 14, 2016 by GiraffaYandereBeetle