Nidus Perfectly Encapsulates the Issues with Horde-based Gamemodes

[owendawgx]

(I'm placing this in General because I'm using Nidus as an example of a larger issue, not just about the frame himself)

Nidus revolves around the unique new mechanic that is his contagion stacks. His passive, 3rd and 4th abilities all rely on them to function, and his first is boosted by it as well.

However, the method you gain stacks (primarily using your 1st ability) is incredibly mission reliant, meaning you benefit much more in intense horde-based mission types (like survival) than in other, more calculated game modes (sabotage, rescue). The result of this is that, in the aforementioned horde-based game modes, Nidus has total control over his abilities, where is 3rd and 4th are practically free, and every time you go down his passive is there to save you. But, in the more calculated modes, Nidus feels like an incredibly involved frame, where you have to closely watch your stacks for your passive, and you have to make sure you use your 1st in the most optimal ways. This isn't a complaint about Nidus, as I (and the community as a whole seems to) love the new frame, and think the uniqueness and interactiveness of his abilities is amazing.

However, this illustrates one of (imo) the biggest problems facing Warframe as a whole; frames/weapons which can clear out groups of enemies at once are disproportionately powerful when compared to other options.

This is the reason why even after their buff, Sniper rifles remain one of the less popular weapon classes, because, while their damage can be insane (see the Lanka, for example), running one alone can practically be suicide in things like Sortie survival, where there are 4 techs, 5 shield ospreys, 2 sapping and a dozen crewman/moas attacking you from all angles at a given time. Because of this, weapons like the Synoid Simulor and the Soma (with its massive magazine) are seen as the gods of Warframe content, with weapons that benefit other playstyles not really having a chance.

Now this is just my interpretation, and I'm not sure what could be done outside of decreasing the spawn levels in game modes like survival (especially for smaller tilesets), but I wanted to give my feedback regarding the issue, and hope that others can share theirs here as well. 

 

 

[Airwolfen]

I like it personally. Adapting your loadout to a more effective setup is part of the game imo.

[bejuizb]

AoE and pierce through damage scales per enemy you hit since there is no diminishing returns. It's why explosives and Seeking Force shotguns are hellishly good. I agree OP. I personally would prefer quite a lot less spawns in a bunch of missions. I'd still like some horde mode missions here and there, but in the lesser spawn type missions, increasing exp per unit might balance things out in terms of which is more lucrative. 

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

on the sniper point

i think its due mainly to people thinking in terms of sniper of other games not thinking warframe kill tactics 

i think it is something along the lines of what another player stated as a skill cutoff, sure you can use other weapons to deal aoe kills, but to utilize other weapons/frames that are not so straight forward can yield great results if only you have the skills and tactical mindset to apply it 

 such as using a sniper with punch through is more useful in game tactics that most dont seem to employ with them in play

examples of punch through utilization with tactics 

• mag 2 power, aim at top of bubble all shots are headshots , and bullets travel inside doing continuous damage and hits while ampin up the 2 powers damage on decast
• banshee, sonar silence [stealth multiplier damage] plus sonars weak point amps easily nukes multiple enemies in 1 shot, killing groups, angel shots or well placed shots clear multiple targets in 1 cast , but it takes skill and pays off 
• ivara 2 cast utilizing a sniper damage and further amping it with ivara, punchthrough to travel through multiple targets and dealing many headshots is another factor, but again skill is required

overal i think the problem many tenno face is that its easier to play the easy skill use frames over tactical frames

the main topic

9 minutes ago, Airwolfen said:

I like it personally. Adapting your loadout to a more effective setup is part of the game imo.

^ this is usually my mentality 

the skillcutoff is apparent

majority of players will utilise the easy to play/kill/nuke methods as they are established and straightforward/quick to use 

saryns rework showed this in a variation as did ashes 

but the overall tactics of enemies is very little, instead of a strike force or special ops /gurilla tactics of enemies attacking us we get cannon fodder and flood bonzai attacking us 

it would be more enjoyable if like the grineer /corpus used more miliatrty attack styles

i can understand infested doing bonzai/flood tactics as they are more instinct/animal based in their movements 

but fighting two heavily militarized enemies who literally act like they dont know any strategy or tactics in combat is a bit disappointing 

Edited December 26, 2016 by (XB1)EternalDrk Mako

[corrosivePaladin]

Ive yet to have any issue in any mission to get Nidus to atleast 40 stacks. Outside of lv10 and less. Still isnt hard to reach 10.

[owendawgx]

40 minutes ago, corporatePaladin said:

Ive yet to have any issue in any mission to get Nidus to atleast 40 stacks. Outside of lv10 and less. Still isnt hard to reach 10.

Right, and I never said that was an issue. I said it was something you had to pay more attention to than in endless missions where you can reach 100 with your eyes closed.

[blackheartstar_pc]

4 hours ago, Airwolfen said:

I like it personally. Adapting your loadout to a more effective setup is part of the game imo.

You could say it part of what makes it fun. At least imo.

[Yousho]

I think that's kinda what they tried to do with the sentients. 
An enemy you only fight a few at a time that become a high priority, making high single shot weapons more useful. 

[LSG501]

2 hours ago, corporatePaladin said:

Ive yet to have any issue in any mission to get Nidus to atleast 40 stacks. Outside of lv10 and less. Still isnt hard to reach 10.

It can be an issue if you get stuck in a group with something like an ember user who uses wof all the time.... biggest issue I've found with stacks is 'allies' stealing my grouped kills or even just single enemies so I don't get my stacks and waste my energy.