Founder's thoughts on umbra?

[Lockheed]

13 minutes ago, Defion said:

Like the Prime Warframes before him, Excalibur Umbra will be an entirely separate Warframe, and is presumed to have its own stats and polarities separate from either Excalibur or Excalibur Prime. Excalibur Umbra will also be a "global upgrade" to Excalibur, as opposed to being limited for a period of time.

That is exactly what A Prime Warframe is. A global upgrade to the base Warframe Excalibur. Umbra is Excalibur Prime, in the same sense that the Nikana prime is a global upgrade to the Nikana and the Dragon Nikana.

If Umbra was the intermediary between Base Excalibur and Excalibur prime in the same sense that the Dragon Nikana is the half way point between the base nikana and the Nikana prime, it wouldn't be quite so bad. However, as the Umbra isn't an insignificant stat increase - particularly in Energy but also in armour, this isn't the case - in fact it makes Excalibur prime the half way point, when it should be the maximum as mentioned with the Nikanas.

 

[ShadowStalker]

Excal Umbra will never be Excal prime

Excal prime will never be Excal umbra

so yeah :)

they shouldnt feel anything

Edited May 4, 2017 by ShadowStalker

[ShinseiArashi]

IF there is truly only a single Excal Umbra, and the 'prime' that China's Founders got is the exact same, then I personally DO NOT support the release of Umbra Excal in our Warframe. Why? Because we'd literally be taking away the ONLY thing that made their Founder pack exclusive and different from our packs. It'd be a huge kick in the balls.

Being a Founder myself, I definitely DO NOT support Umbra coming here if there isn't a Prime Variant that is exclusive to China. If there IS a Prime variant that China DOES have, then go ahead and give us Umbra. If not, then don't. You'd be ripping away what made China's Founder pack different, and essentially telling their Founder's that they paid big bucks for NOTHING.

[Gelkor]

5 minutes ago, GKDK said:

Can't wait for Excal Umbra for two reasons: 

1) No more where's umbra thread/questions

2) No more request to release Excalibur Prime

Cause we're all gonna get a more awesome and better looking Excalibur version soon. 

Depending if Excal Umbra mastery is in addition to or non-redundant to the mastery from Excal P.

If Umbra Mastery is separate then people will still freak out because Hunter+ Founders will still have 6k more Mastery.

Edited May 4, 2017 by Gelkor

[Echo]

1 minute ago, ShinseiArashi said:

IF there is truly only a single Excal Umbra, and the 'prime' that China's Founders got is the exact same, then I personally DO NOT support the release of Umbra Excal in our Warframe. Why? Because we'd literally be taking away the ONLY thing that made their Founder pack exclusive and different from our packs. It'd be a huge kick in the balls.

Being a Founder myself, I definitely DO NOT support Umbra coming here if there isn't a Prime Variant that is exclusive to China. If there IS a Prime variant that China DOES have, then go ahead and give us Umbra. If not, then don't. You'd be ripping away what made China's Founder pack different, and essentially telling their Founder's that they paid big bucks for NOTHING.

Thank you. Agree 100% 

[Phyrak]

2 minutes ago, ShinseiArashi said:

IF there is truly only a single Excal Umbra, and the 'prime' that China's Founders got is the exact same, then I personally DO NOT support the release of Umbra Excal in our Warframe. Why? Because we'd literally be taking away the ONLY thing that made their Founder pack exclusive and different from our packs. It'd be a huge kick in the balls.

Being a Founder myself, I definitely DO NOT support Umbra coming here if there isn't a Prime Variant that is exclusive to China. If there IS a Prime variant that China DOES have, then go ahead and give us Umbra. If not, then don't. You'd be ripping away what made China's Founder pack different, and essentially telling their Founder's that they paid big bucks for NOTHING.

Have an updoot

[(PSN)Kamil-the-KamiKa]

Umbra is a big part of the lore, he's gonna be released even if founders are crying about their excal prime not being the bane of non-founders anymore

also since when did DE ever say they will release a excal umbra PRIME?

also excal is just one of the possible umbras released, so i got frost prime but my friend doesnt because he joined warframed while he was vaulted, doesnt mean he is going to riot because of a frost umbra is gonna come out, hes gonna be happy as he missed out on frost prime, its the same with excal prime

Spoiler

so maybe SOME of you founders stop being so selfish and self righteous about your excal prime (yes we all owe you a big thankyou for actualy being a founder) and be happy for others, not always feeling so elite about yourselfs (and this is the minority of founders, while there arent any on console, i have met TONS of kind founders on forumns, too bad some have to spoil rep for rest :/

 

 

[(PSN)cdzbrbr]

1 minute ago, Vitrescence said:

A Global Upgrade is technically a Prime. If they wanted to "upgrade" Excalibur they should have replaced his model or gave him this as a Deluxe skin. Not give a whole new Warframe under the guise of it being an Upgrade. 

That's where i feel like stepping in again. Excalibur Prime wasn't sold as an upgrade.

Later on all Primes were perceived as upgrades (bar Mag I think; sorry MagPrime in this thread) and Excal prime was buffed to match this new concept, all fair.

But then again: You bought exclusive LOOKS; not UPGRADED stats. That's where we diverge in opinion. Yes, I like my exclusive stuff just like you, I'd be somewhat bothered if it ended up being worse too. But I'd definetly not give a damn if it shared the same stats after all it'd still have the exclusivity status over the other one.

[GKDK]

2 minutes ago, Gelkor said:

Depending if Excal Umbra mastery is in addition to or non-redundant to the mastery from Excal P.

If Umbra Mastery is separate then people will still freak out because Hunter+ Founders will still have 6k more Mastery.

It will never end if that's the case 

[Gelkor]

1 minute ago, GKDK said:

It will never end if that's the case 

I'm fine with it not granting me mastery. I actually don't like how it looks and it would be rank and bank for me. I like how simple Excal P is.

[Phatose]

Just now, (PS4)cdzbrbr said:

That's where i feel like stepping in again. Excalibur Prime wasn't sold as an upgrade.

Later on all Primes were perceived as upgrades (bar Mag I think; sorry MagPrime in this thread) and Excal prime was buffed to match this new concept, all fair.

But then again: You bought exclusive LOOKS; not UPGRADED stats. That's where we diverge in opinion. Yes, I like my exclusive stuff just like you, I'd be somewhat bothered if it ended up being worse too. But I'd definetly not give a damn if it shared the same stats after all it'd still have the exclusivity status over the other one.

Orokin Death Orb energy has been there since the beginning.  It wasn't ever purely cosmetic.

[Varacal]

3 minutes ago, ShinseiArashi said:

Because we'd literally be taking away the ONLY thing that made their Founder pack exclusive and different from our packs. It'd be a huge kick in the balls.

why? all your founders stuffs are still exclusive to you. god, this is why some players hate some of the founders, they can be pretty selfish sometimes, "take away our exclusive stuff"? no one is taking anything, you're getting umbra too, so i dont see why you'll get less if umbra is released, you can just do what those founders do in the relays and show off their excal primes, just cause you have it and we dont, but the difference now is, we'll slightly care less when umbra is here

[NeithanDiniem]

For the non Chinese build of warfare there is no mention at all about whether or not umbra frames, since umbra is not exclusive to excalibur, will have any stay boost at all over their normal or prime counterparts. People are freaking out over assumptions.

[Echo]

1 minute ago, (PS4)cdzbrbr said:

That's where i feel like stepping in again. Excalibur Prime wasn't sold as an upgrade.

 

Primes ARE Upgrades. However. He was made back then Primes were still being modified and tweeked, as someone else stated in the thread before. If Excal was released now, he'd be the upgrade. When they do their tweek for him, he should be (hopefully will be). 

[ShinseiArashi]

Just now, (PS4)kamil_demon said:

Umbra is a big part of the lore, he's gonna be released even if founders are crying about their excal prime not being the bane of non-founders anymore

also since when did DE ever say they will release a excal umbra PRIME?

also excal is just one of the possible umbras released, so i got frost prime but my friend doesnt because he joined warframed while he was vaulted, doesnt mean he is going to riot because of a frost umbra is gonna come out, hes gonna be happy as he missed out on frost prime, its the same with excal prime

  Hide contents

so maybe SOME of you founders stop being so selfish and self righteous about your excal prime (yes we all owe you a big thankyou for actualy being a founder) and be happy for others, not always feeling so elite about yourselfs (and this is the minority of founders, while there arent any on console, i have met TONS of kind founders on forumns, too bad some have to spoil rep for rest :/

 

 

You sir have obviously either A) missed the point of this thread entirely, or B) Haven't read the 2-3 pages worth of comments before posting yourself.

 

The problem Founders have with Umbra, imo, is it is taking away what made China's Founder pack unique, and taking away their Exclusive founder item.

Releasing Umbra for us is doing literally the same to China's Founder as releasing Excal Prime, Lato Prime, and Skana Prime would do to our Founders. Make them feel as if their money they put into the Founder pack, to get exclusive stuff, and help DE, was all for nothing. Things are EXCLUSIVE for a reason. Excal Umbra being a part of China's FOUNDER pack means it should STAY exclusive to them. 

Bring other Umbra's for all I care, but leave Excal Umbra where it should stay. An exclusive item for China's Founders.

[Lockheed]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)kamil_demon said:

Umbra is a big part of the lore, he's gonna be released even if founders are crying about their excal prime not being the bane of non-founders anymore

also since when did DE ever say they will release a excal umbra PRIME?

also excal is just one of the possible umbras released, so i got frost prime but my friend doesnt because he joined warframed while he was vaulted, doesnt mean he is going to riot because of a frost umbra is gonna come out, hes gonna be happy as he missed out on frost prime, its the same with excal prime

  Hide contents

so maybe SOME of you founders stop being so selfish and self righteous about your excal prime (yes we all owe you a big thankyou for actualy being a founder) and be happy for others, not always feeling so elite about yourselfs (and this is the minority of founders, while there arent any on console, i have met TONS of kind founders on forumns, too bad some have to spoil rep for rest :/

 

 

So far as we know, the Umbra that was linked is the exact umbra that we're getting. Given there are no images of a non-primed variant of Umbra (whether from DE or from the Chinese version), it can be assumed that Umbra "prime" is what we're getting.

Also, It's not about being Selfish and self-righteous, nor is it being an elitist - Founders paid a LOT of money for an elusive item that is not really an elusive anymore with the advent of Umbra being released.

 

Edited May 4, 2017 by Miro_X

[NeithanDiniem]

6 minutes ago, Gelkor said:

Depending if Excal Umbra mastery is in addition to or non-redundant to the mastery from Excal P.

If Umbra Mastery is separate then people will still freak out because Hunter+ Founders will still have 6k more Mastery.

6k mastery will be inconsiquential in the end. DE has confirmed multiple times that there will be more items than what is needed to reach MR 30.

[ShinseiArashi]

4 minutes ago, Varacal said:

why? all your founders stuffs are still exclusive to you. god, this is why some players hate some of the founders, they can be pretty selfish sometimes, "take away our exclusive stuff"? no one is taking anything, you're getting umbra too, so i dont see why you'll get less if umbra is released, you can just do what those founders do in the relays and show off their excal primes, just cause you have it and we dont, but the difference now is, we'll slightly care less when umbra is here

You as well do not get my point.

Excal Umbra was part of China's FOUNDER pack. An Exclusive item in it. Much like Excal Prime, Lato, and Skana Primes were the EXCLUSIVES for OUR  Founder packs. As I've said several times now, taking Excal Umbra and giving it to us would be exactly like talking Excal, Lato, and Skana Primes and handing them to ChinaFrame. You'd be destroying what made them exclusive, and destroying the value those items hold/held to the founders that got them.

 

This is NOT me saying they are taking away OUR exclusives. This is me saying DE is taking away China-frames exclusive. Umbra Excal coming here would be DE taking away the ONLY unique thing China-Frame has right now, and was probably the one thing that really sold their Founder pack.

Edited May 4, 2017 by ShinseiArashi

[NeithanDiniem]

4 minutes ago, Vitrescence said:

Primes ARE Upgrades. However. He was made back then Primes were still being modified and tweeked, as someone else stated in the thread before. If Excal was released now, he'd be the upgrade. When they do their tweek for him, he should be (hopefully will be). 

He was made before all other primes. He literally was the first prime in the order of telease, so he was not released when primes were being modified, he was released as the beginning of their existence.

Edited May 4, 2017 by NeithanDiniem

[Syndrella]

If the Umbras will ever be implemented they will mean a different line of warframes which probably won't outshine the prime frames. Excal prime is a thing which in the first place was a mistake by DE to let it be a founder item and not giving to the founders something different which symbolize their contribution. Their shortseeings made a lot of salt meanwhile and those whom wanted to fill their collection of prime items now should used to deal with the thing they never will have a chance to get these called primes and these prime stuffs killing the option to implement their dual variation primes and other useful stuffs.

There are many solutions to get rid this things with compensating the remained founders with a different items which really means and appreciate their contributions however not sure how many founders left. Secondly most of the founders doesn't have a problem with letting others to get the same stuff what they paid for if the options nowadays the same so let's say pay the same price fo it or just let peoples get it and compensate the founders. Nowadays Waframe not really needs their founders because a lot of non founder peoples paid a lot money to stabilize the company's economy and they got money to make the chinese version and so more.

The umbras may be will be a different and hard grinding versions of the current frames but my opinion is it's a non needed and good sounding promise because the regular frames and primed frames are currently enough to the devs deal with it unless they not made already dozens of frames and umbras but I doubt it they have the capacity to make as fast as they wish. 1 frame 1 month seems normal pace to me but their team still need growing to be able to up to date with the demands.

With that power they could make Dex frames, prisma frames and syndicate frames with their own marks but those variants are mostly just skins not real specific own frames.

[(PSN)cdzbrbr]

1 minute ago, Phatose said:

Orokin Death Orb energy has been there since the beginning.  It wasn't ever purely cosmetic.

The Void tileset came with Update 8, after excalibur's prime release. So I'm sorry, it wasn't released as an upgrade but go ahead you could take that. You would have 2 things to brag yourself about: Looks, energy in the void.

Like I said, that's really the bar between being fair and extremely selfish and where we diverge in opinion.

[Echo]

2 minutes ago, Syndrella said:

Secondly most of the founders doesn't have a problem with letting others to get the same stuff what they paid for if the options nowadays the same so let's say pay the same price fo it or just let peoples get it and compensate the founders. Nowadays Waframe not really needs their founders because a lot of non founder peoples paid a lot money to stabilize the company's economy and they got money to make the chinese version and so more.

Woah, what? So basically kick out all the founders since they aren't needed anymore?

 

Ouch.

[NeithanDiniem]

2 minutes ago, ShinseiArashi said:

You as well do not get my point.

Excal Umbra was part of China's FOUNDER pack. An Exclusive item in it. Much like Excal Prime, Lato, and Skana Primes were the EXCLUSIVES for OUR  Founder packs. As I've said several times now, taking Excal Umbra and giving it to us would be exactly like talking Excal, Lato, and Skana Primes and handing them to ChinaFrame. You'd be destroying what made them exclusive, and destroying the value those items hold/held to the founders that got them.

No, it wouldn't because what happens in China frame doesn't matter, as long as they are not releasing the founders items that were already contractually exclusive before they got the rights to offer the game there. Excel umbra is not stepping on any founders toes because he will not be the only umbra and the founders still have their exclusive.

[Varacal]

2 minutes ago, ShinseiArashi said:

You as well do not get my point.

Excal Umbra was part of China's FOUNDER pack. An Exclusive item in it. Much like Excal Prime, Lato, and Skana Primes were the EXCLUSIVES for OUR  Founder packs. As I've said several times now, taking Excal Umbra and giving it to us would be exactly like talking Excal, Lato, and Skana Primes and handing them to ChinaFrame. You'd be destroying what made them exclusive, and destroying the value those items hold/held to the founders that got them.

then wouldnt the ones that should be complaining the ones from chinaframe and not the founders from our servers?

[GKDK]

1 minute ago, ShinseiArashi said:

You as well do not get my point.

Excal Umbra was part of China's FOUNDER pack. An Exclusive item in it. Much like Excal Prime, Lato, and Skana Primes were the EXCLUSIVES for OUR  Founder packs. As I've said several times now, taking Excal Umbra and giving it to us would be exactly like talking Excal, Lato, and Skana Primes and handing them to ChinaFrame. You'd be destroying what made them exclusive, and destroying the value those items hold/held to the founders that got them.

But we have their Nikana Prime and Spira Prime already which was their Lato prime and Skana Prime. Quite obvious DE doesn't care. I greatly believe regardless this year or not, Excalibur Umbra will come to us as per China's founder pack. 

It's the thorn in DE's side with it ALWAYS being questioned and they have always responded on Devstreams that if they have news they will share. They didn't block it out like they did with Hema.