Being the Stalker at Tennocon?

[--RV--Hyenah]

1 minute ago, Mints said:

If the Stalker were anything other than a mild annoyance, no I wouldn't see a difference between the two. As it stands, his canned predictable AI destroys his purpose and renders him nothing but a nuisance.

Dude. If you bring the proper weapons and the proper Warframe, absolutely everything in this game is a nuisance. That's the point of it. You farm to a point where you have shotguns that fire nuclear warheads at people instantly killing them. Because you spent the time farming said weapons and mods.

The lack of challenge in the game is a problem. PvP isn't the solution. And if you want actual challenge, or even hardcore PVP challenge. I dunno what are you doing playing Warframe to be honest.

[(XBOX)AntiCaesar]

1 minute ago, BornWithTeeth said:

I mean, if you put in place limitations strictly as follows:

- Player controlled Stalker invasions are strictly opt in via the settings menu. As Jackviator noted, it might be necessary to provide a carrot, like making the drop chances of a player-Stalker more favourable if they are defeated.

- Player controlled Stalker can absolutely not interact with anything other than Tenno. Can't destroy objectives, can't kill ordinary enemies, can't activate life support, can't enter a Spy Vault.

- No Stalking in Raids, Sorties, or Assassinations.

- Player controlled Stalker has no control over who they target. It's completely random.

- Player controlled Stalker only goes after players who are eligible to do Sortie missions.

 

How about those suggestions?

Also, there should be a vote if someone wants to invade you. You don't have to let them invade, but you can if you want to do so

[Cifrer]

If someone wants to be able to do this, I don't care so long as there is no possible way they can drag me into it.

Straight up, you need to be able to turn it off.  Even if you are in a mission with 3 other people who have it on, if you have it off, it should be off.  Period, end of story.

How the interactions are for being able to be invaded by a player-stalker if you have it turned on, I don't care, that should have nothing to do with me.

I would want to have it turned off.  I don't see how that would be a problem.  If people want it, good for them, if people don't want it, they should be able to turn it off and have no way for it become a problem for them.

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

Whoo boy this is definitely a touchy topic.

While I like the idea personally (as playing as the Zanuka Hunter, one of the G3 or Stalker does sound like a ton of fun), it WILL not work in it's current rendition at all. Being able to grief other players in any form is already bad enough, but deliberately destroying Defense Pods and one-shotting Rescue Targets is a no-go for sure. Granted, this was crafted in three weeks, so some of the obvious balance issues will of course be addressed. Thing is, I don't really know how they can make this mode fun for players on both sides of the mode without completely gutting the mode and turning it into another shell less PvP mode.

[Energized]

8 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

~snip~

How about those suggestions?

That seems fair. I would love to see this feature with acceptable restrictions on the stalkers part.

Edited July 10, 2017 by Energized

[Tesseract7777]

3 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Graysmog said:

Whoo boy this is definitely a touchy topic.

While I like the idea personally (as playing as the Zanuka Hunter, one of the G3 or Stalker does sound like a ton of fun), it WILL not work in it's current rendition at all. Being able to grief other players in any form is already bad enough, but deliberately destroying Defense Pods and one-shotting Rescue Targets is a no-go for sure. Granted, this was crafted in three weeks, so some of the obvious balance issues will of course be addressed. Thing is, I don't really know how they can make this mode fun for players on both sides of the mode without completely gutting the mode and turning it into another shell less PvP mode.

Maybe make it so player stalker cannot hurt anything but players? 

Edited July 10, 2017 by Tesseract7777

[--RV--Hyenah]

4 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

I mean, if you put in place limitations strictly as follows:

- Player controlled Stalker invasions are strictly opt in via the settings menu. As Jackviator noted, it might be necessary to provide a carrot, like making the drop chances of a player-Stalker more favourable if they are defeated.

- Player controlled Stalker can absolutely not interact with anything other than Tenno. Can't destroy objectives, can't kill ordinary enemies, can't activate life support, can't enter a Spy Vault.

- No Stalking in Raids, Sorties, or Assassinations.

- Player controlled Stalker has no control over who they target. It's completely random.

- Player controlled Stalker only goes after players who are eligible to do Sortie missions.

 

How about those suggestions?

I mean that's the point of the Stalker, is it? He don't give a f*** about those reactor cores, survival pods or coolant cells. He is just there to be edgy, spawn in, kill the marked target and hop off.

In the assassinations and sorties I would argue that if you all opt in, it should theoretically be fine. Altho yeah, stalker on raids would be just dumb.

If anything people would use it to farm stalker PVP loot or to spice things up if they feel like it. But never force people onto a gamemode they don't like. PvP is not popular for a reason. I don't even think it's a balance problem, its just that people like to chill out killing some deformed motherf***ers with shiny weapons and cool power armor.

The focus of the game has always been "PvE looter shooter/Fashion simulator" and we all like that. You might want to improve it, but why would you play Warframe if not for that?

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

10 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

I mean, if you put in place limitations strictly as follows:

- Player controlled Stalker invasions are strictly opt in via the settings menu. As Jackviator noted, it might be necessary to provide a carrot, like making the drop chances of a player-Stalker more favourable if they are defeated.

- Player controlled Stalker can absolutely not interact with anything other than Tenno. Can't destroy objectives, can't kill ordinary enemies, can't activate life support, can't enter a Spy Vault.

- No Stalking in Raids, Sorties, or Assassinations.

- Player controlled Stalker has no control over who they target. It's completely random.

- Player controlled Stalker only goes after players who are eligible to do Sortie missions.

 

How about those suggestions?

Thing is, they'd have to seriously buff the player-based Stalker (and possibly other Assassins) if this were ever going to be implemented, as we all know those who opt into the mode would just bring a ridiculously overpowered series of weapons that can one-shot the Stalker as is.

It'd also probably have to be a 1v1 mode, without other players being able to intervene, unless they wanted to allow multiple people to play as the Stalker and say, his Acolytes, having the amount of players added depending on how many are in the mission.

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

1 minute ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Maybe make it so player stalker cannot hurt anything but players? 

Yeah, but then you still fall into the problem of even the player-based Stalker being incredibly weak. If players can opt-in, they'll definitely wait in an easy mode like Exterminate at lower levels with horribly OP gear to make the player Stalker's life miserable, maybe even grabbing multiple people and Warframes with CC like Frost. 

[BornWithTeeth]

Just now, (Xbox One)Graysmog said:

Thing is, they'd have to seriously buff the player-based Stalker (and possibly other Assassins) if this were ever going to be implemented, as we all know those who opt into the mode would just bring a ridiculously overpowered series of weapons that can one-shot the Stalker as is.

It'd also probably have to be a 1v1 mode, without other players being able to intervene, unless they wanted to allow multiple people to play as the Stalker and say, his Acolytes, having the amount of players added depending on how many are in the mission.

I would actually be kind of ok with that. Or, hell, how about letting the Stalker have both an appropriately scaled Dread and his Sentient armour? Dread is a better assassination weapon than War, and the time it would take for a player to whittle through his damage resistances and switch weapons between Primary and Secondary is the time it would take the Stalker to get a few pot shots off.

[Noabettiet]

As presented there, it was bare bones. I don't understand why anyone would use the current state of stalker invasions as gospel truth of how it will be.

 

But one thing i agree with, it just doesn't fit. It is extremely fun, yes, but doesn't fit.
Missions weren't built to have an player agent against it, because the world of warframe itself, favors npcs, because we are extremely strong already.

Hunting newbies, is not really the issue, you could have matchmaking or hell, an integrated system that handicaps you based on power difference. But missions, are another whole topic.

This is something, i feel that i'd enjoy seeing devs at prime time have fun with, or something.
But as far as it goes, i think DE should first think what they want to do with this "possible new mode". Assassinating only, would be extremely boring. But also sabotaging a mission in order to draw out the player, can be extremely awful for the community. Controversially, removing mission sabotage, removes the thrill of the hunt. 

 

I feel like, in order for this to work, the acolyte or stalker invasion should freeze the mission till the invasion (or some timer) ends. Or, his/her interference would have to be nerfed and supported by missions in game. (like Lotus informing that the "acolyte of the stalker" is interfering with the mission, by shielding the capture target or slowly damaging the rescue target)

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

12 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

I would actually be kind of ok with that. Or, hell, how about letting the Stalker have both an appropriately scaled Dread and his Sentient armour? Dread is a better assassination weapon than War, and the time it would take for a player to whittle through his damage resistances and switch weapons between Primary and Secondary is the time it would take the Stalker to get a few pot shots off.

True, but then it'd have to tell you that the player-based Stalker has gotten these upgrades, having all of his weapons, along with the Sentient armor to be able to go toe-to-toe with others. Dread, Despair and War would also have to scale to the enemies level to be fair (as if he didn't have all of these weapon and his powers, I couldn't see him fighting four other people when he's easily slaughtered by CC from Frost and the like), but then that brings upon the problem of lower-level planets being used to forcefully gimp the Stalker. 

He'd have to have a base-level on par with us so he was never weaker than us, yet then if that was allowed, he probably shouldn't scale in level with the planet (or really at all) unless multiple players are in the mission, gaining say 30 levels per person. So he'd be at level 120, if all four people opted into the mode together, which would make him substantially more powerful to compensate for the fact that he's getting 4x the bullets and possible CC thrown at him at once. 

There's a lot they can do to balance the mode honestly, and I think it'll be a lot of fun if it's implemented correctly. As, all in all, the worse thing the Stalker can do is kill the whole team once.

Seeing some variants of it too wherein we could also take the G3 (to possibly allow multiple player-based Assassins into a game) or run with the Zanuka Hunter could also be fun too.

Edited July 10, 2017 by (XB1)Graysmog

[iMalicious]

Having player controlled stalkers is like forcing PvP into PvE content, totally dislike this whole idea.

[Seraiya.Gier]

You know, I've been saying this for years. That there'd be a mode where you're the Stalker himself, or a Stalker type frame and you hunt other players using a similar system like invasions from Dark Souls/Bloodborne. You could have a choice between those Acolyte types, or both variations of the original Stalker. But the question is, what the hell is the reward? Or is the mere satisfaction of ruining someone's day?

[Tesseract7777]

20 minutes ago, (Xbox One)Graysmog said:

Yeah, but then you still fall into the problem of even the player-based Stalker being incredibly weak. If players can opt-in, they'll definitely wait in an easy mode like Exterminate at lower levels with horribly OP gear to make the player Stalker's life miserable, maybe even grabbing multiple people and Warframes with CC like Frost. 

Well yeah, it looked like the regular stalker and not the shadow stalker, so not much of a danger to anyone but newbies, who will probably just get owned by a way more experienced player regardless. 

Perhaps you get to play as full shadow stalker if you go to the higher level planets, but can only be regular stalker on lower level, to keep it balanced between newbies versus veterans, etc? Newbies still get somewhat owned even against regular stalker but at least they had a chance. 

And if it was actually SS against veterans, they might actually take down the target at least some of the time. 

Edited July 10, 2017 by Tesseract7777

[(XBOX)Graysmog]

2 minutes ago, Tesseract7777 said:

Well yeah, it looked like the regular stalker and not the shadow stalker, so not much of a danger to anyone but newbies, who will probably just get owned by a way more experienced player regardless. 

Perhaps you get to play as full shadow stalker if you go to the higher level planets, but can only be regular stalker on lower level, to keep it balanced between newbies versus veterans, etc? 

I still don't think that would work when higher level players could just abuse that system and purposefully go to lower level Planets themselves with newbies. That, and I don't really think there'd be anything to stop higher level players from just hopping into lower level Planets themselves.

Also, Shadow Stalker is completely restricted to melee. It'd be more of a downgrade in my opinion when his Defenses don't even matter at such high levels against higher-level players with, say, a Tigris Prime.

Edited July 10, 2017 by (XB1)Graysmog

[BornWithTeeth]

2 minutes ago, Reokudo said:

You know, I've been saying this for years. That there'd be a mode where you're the Stalker himself, or a Stalker type frame and you hunt other players using a similar system like invasions from Dark Souls/Bloodborne. You could have a choice between those Acolyte types, or both variations of the original Stalker. But the question is, what the hell is the reward? Or is the mere satisfaction of ruining someone's day?

Now, I am not being sarcastic, I really would like you to answer this sincerely: would it make Warframe a better game for the players if there were people whose objective in playing was to 'ruin someone's day'?

[dEjAvU5566]

There're too many people in this world

so 

10 minutes ago, BornWithTeeth said:

.... if there were people whose objective in playing was to 'ruin someone's day'?

These kind of people sure exists

 

while being an interesting idea of playing stalker himself, 

it relys on DE themself to carefully apply restrictions, cause you know, it's internet, someone out there just want to see the world burns and laugh about it

Edited July 10, 2017 by dEjAvU5566
Shorter quote

[Nusumu]

Never really thought this would be my first ever post within these forums, but okay. I can't really say I'm surprised to see such typical troll-like behavior from those in favor of this idea. "I want to ruin missions!" "I want to kill n00bs!" "I want to ruin other people's day!" "If you don't like this, you're a coward!" "If you don't like it, don't get marked!" (<-- Thus pretty much locking players out of the game entirely progression/Mastery wise with that last one)

If this gets implemented as is, I foresee nothing but problems. Should this get added with fixes (read: It shouldn't be added at all), there MUST be a way to opt out of it. Like a majority of those posting here, I don't play this game for the PvP. If I wanted that, I'd go play something else, and if I wanted this Dark Souls wannabe style invasion stuff, I'd go play Dark Souls. Thing is, I'm not playing Dark Souls. I'm playing Warframe. A cooperative PvE space ninja experience I can load up with some friends when I want to relax and do some flashy stuff. Now, there have been good suggestions on how this could be fixed, this I will not deny. However, if these changes are implemented, there will surely be crying, stomping, and gnashing of teeth from those who have already shown their only intent with this mode would be to grief, who will most likely then go out of their way to pester DE until other changes are made to lift these reasonable restrictions up until the point we have what we see in this demo, and that worries me. DE have already shown they have no issue attempting to appease a minority of the playerbase at the expense of the majority (Conclave, Solar Rail PvP, Spring Loaded Broadhead only being obtainable through Conclave, Conclave specific Tactical Alerts plastered on the PvE mission console), and I'm unsure of what would stop them from doing the same now.

I desperately hope that, before allowing any further progress with this "passion project," DE see this thread, read through it, see just what kind of people intend to use it (as well as their supporting "arguments"), and what these people intend to use it for.

[Noabettiet]

1 hour ago, Cifrer said:

If someone wants to be able to do this, I don't care so long as there is no possible way they can drag me into it.

then there is me, that wishes i was one of the people who experienced fighting against this stalker.

[Jeoxz]

For the first two suggestions:

"Your actions have consequences"

I mean it would surely be a bad move and frowned upon but it would make stalker much more scary, because if it kills you now it's like "Oh ok, lemme just press this revive button over here and carry on with my life", but if he makes you FAIL a mission, that's stepping it up. And to ensure Stalkers focus on their mark apply a strong punishment for not killing your objective.

Edited July 10, 2017 by Jeoxz
english

[(PSN)varas2110]

Then boom!... Frame Souls

[Cifrer]

29 minutes ago, Noabettiet said:

then there is me, that wishes i was one of the people who experienced fighting against this stalker.

I've got no problem with that whatsoever, as long as I don't get dragged into it.

I mean, really, if you find that fun that's cool.  I'm not against other people having fun.  I'm just against them ruining mine.

[Eldnacpeek]

18 hours ago, BornWithTeeth said:

I would support the inclusion of such a mode if it included the potential to backfire catastrophically on the attacking player. For instance, if they invaded and lost to the defender, they forfeit their most played Warframe, and had their name published in the Relays as a failed Stalker assassin. Sounds about right.

 

Not cruel enough. Assassin or not, he's still a punching bag. Even if controlled by a player, you can't magically bear Tigris Prime standing and constant Operator beam spam (solo or not). Sure, now that it wouldn't be AI, an imperfect mass unable to use strategy (especially in this game), it would require putting in a sliver more effort to take him out. However, given we won't be playing with Conclave balance, our weapons are more than enough (and Operators are still instant resistance reset). And if he happens to be paired against more than one, it's already over.

What happens if they fail a mission (guaranteed)?

1. They are permanently revoked of their access to the mode (Brain Burst style)
2. Their inventory is wiped of everything
3. They are provided Excalibur, MK1 Braton, Lato, Skana (no choice for other gear)
4. They get to keep their mastery rank, but cannot begin earning XP again until all lost gear is reacquired and releveled to 30 (everything, as in frames, weapons, companions, Archwing, etc)

And last, Support will not reset their account to its original state. They made the conscious decision to become the Stalker, therefore willing to face the consequences.

Edited July 10, 2017 by LazerSkink

[Noabettiet]

12 minutes ago, Cifrer said:

I've got no problem with that whatsoever, as long as I don't get dragged into it.

I mean, really, if you find that fun that's cool.  I'm not against other people having fun.  I'm just against them ruining mine.

i am afraid that if such system would come ,you'd be a target as well. Nobody picks.

 

don't worry tho, i am well aware of how weird i am

Edited July 10, 2017 by Noabettiet