Thanks for the useless mod, Lotus...

[BlackCoMerc]

12 minutes ago, AperoBeltaTwo said:

Sorry, but what exactly have you been doing in the game for 5 years if you can't complete a challenge like that?

Whether or not he CAN isn't the point. It's the NEED to do so in the first place that's utter crap.

Rivens are SUPPOSED to be a reward. Obtaining them is generally tedious - NOT hard; don't come back with "but I find Sorties easy" - just tedious.

Then you get your "reward" and guess what: MORE TEDIUM.

Between Sorties being crap, the loot tables being garbage, Rivens mostly being useless filler and Unveiling being easily the worst supporting mechanic in modern games, my interest in Rivens is zero.

It's like they WANTED us NOT to like or enjoy the Riven system at all.

[Xylia]

7 hours ago, KoboldMKB said:

A more valid complaint would be that The Gift of the Lotus mission was super easy. All of the Gift of Lotus missions didn't exceed level 15 or something, and it feels like it's aimed at new players who are just starting out the get them some pretty good gear so they can make a good start.

THEN, the riven challenges are something that are waaaaay too difficult for newbies to complete, such as what the OP mentioned. If the mission to get the riven is so much easier than sorties, then the accompanying riven challenge should be similarly much easier than usual. 

You all started out as noobs, and I DARE you to tell me that you wouldn't be angry if you were a new player again with next to no kick-&#! gear and this happened to you. 

This is another way of saying what I was trying to say with this thread.

Sure, I'm not a newbie, but I'm a returning player who is still trying to get their footing in a game I feel absolutely lost in. I see something easy, like a <Lv15 exterminate (IIRC?) to get a Riven Mod.

Would it be such a far stretch for me to think "Well, maybe one of These would be sensible?" especially if a friend told me that his was "Get 15 insignias"?

Then I go and do mine and it wants a Lv30+ solo mission. Mind you, I've been away from the game for 2 years, and back then Lv30 was.... not something you would attempt to solo, and especially NOT a Defense. And to add to that, you have to do so *perfectly*?

Yeah yeah, "Get this, this, and that!" ... still, why put a Riven Mod on a Lv15 mission that newbies have access to when most of the requirements are something no newbie has any business even trying?

In fact, that goes right along with PoE being so early in progression, but yet there's no way a newbie is going to do much in PoE, lol.

 

EDIT: And again, Disparity Disparity Disparity.

Nobody has addressed why SOME challenges are dirt easy, and others are far, far harder. RNG and all, but why is it that some items in the RNG pool are 10x better than the others? They should all be of relatively equal challenge.

Edited November 5, 2017 by Xylia

[AperoBeltaTwo]

48 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

Whether or not he CAN isn't the point. It's the NEED to do so in the first place that's utter crap.

Rivens are SUPPOSED to be a reward. Obtaining them is generally tedious - NOT hard; don't come back with "but I find Sorties easy" - just tedious.

Then you get your "reward" and guess what: MORE TEDIUM.

Between Sorties being crap, the loot tables being garbage, Rivens mostly being useless filler and Unveiling being easily the worst supporting mechanic in modern games, my interest in Rivens is zero.

It's like they WANTED us NOT to like or enjoy the Riven system at all.

Honestly, unlocking rivens was the most exciting thing I've done in the game in a long while. It speaks volumes about the gameplay tho - not about riven challenges themselves. But honestly, it's one of those instances where I have to say crap like "rivens didn't have to be anything at all". The required action of unlocking rivens allows them to be traded between players which is a good thing. It adds value to them and makes rivens more desirable of a reward. Tedium isn't the main issue here. Yes, it is tedious, but so is the rest of the game. The question is if it's unnecessary tedious like with the lack of universal vacuum, or if it's just the regular gameplay kind of tedious. I lean towards the latter in case of riven challenges, honestly. Doesn't mean that some of those challenges aren't stupid. But I have yet to encounter a completely undoable riven.

[BlackCoMerc]

1 hour ago, AperoBeltaTwo said:

Honestly, unlocking rivens was the most exciting thing I've done in the game in a long while. It speaks volumes about the gameplay tho - not about riven challenges themselves. But honestly, it's one of those instances where I have to say crap like "rivens didn't have to be anything at all". The required action of unlocking rivens allows them to be traded between players which is a good thing. It adds value to them and makes rivens more desirable of a reward. Tedium isn't the main issue here. Yes, it is tedious, but so is the rest of the game. The question is if it's unnecessary tedious like with the lack of universal vacuum, or if it's just the regular gameplay kind of tedious. I lean towards the latter in case of riven challenges, honestly. Doesn't mean that some of those challenges aren't stupid. But I have yet to encounter a completely undoable riven.

So...there's a right kind of Tedium? While I agree we need UV...I don't think aiming for tolerable degrees of Tedium should be a Dev goal...

Many, many Riven challenges aren't enjoyable. That's an issue.

[AperoBeltaTwo]

42 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

So...there's a right kind of Tedium?

nope. never said that. I simply stated that there is a kind of tedium that is alligned with the notion of "typical Warframe gameplay", while lack of UV can't be justified even by that kind of levels of tedium (especially when it's entirely skippable if only you always use particular equipment... wrong thread!).

[BlackCoMerc]

7 minutes ago, AperoBeltaTwo said:

nope. never said that. I simply stated that there is a kind of tedium that is alligned with the notion of "typical Warframe gameplay", while lack of UV can't be justified even by that kind of levels of tedium (especially when it's entirely skippable if only you always use particular equipment... wrong thread!).

Ok, I see what you meant there now. Sorry bout that.

[AperoBeltaTwo]

58 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

Ok, I see what you meant there now. Sorry bout that.

np

[(PSN)fullblast35]

Go back to super mario man.  Or have someone unveil it for you, people do it all the time.  its a riven mod and probably locked behind a certain MR, definitely not something for poor skill.  Because skill isn't only about OP weapons and frames.  Socialize,  think of any frame you didn't just max and put down and think of a squad combination to get it done. People used to complain about headshots while gliding, even scanning with dragon key with no abilities.  

[(PSN)Draconis1981]

I very rarely use this. In fact this is probably the first time i have used the word aimed at another player but you sir are entitled.

You got something potentially good for free, suck it up.

[Xarteros]

On 04/11/2017 at 1:24 PM, Xylia said:

So, friend comes on and tells me that the Gift of the Lotus today is a Riven Rifle Mod. He does it and he gets "Find 15 Syndicate Emblems".

Okay, so since the Riven Mod comes out of a lowbie mission, I thought well maybe there's special rules on this that it will give you something actually do-able.

Hahaha, this is Warframe.

It gave me "Do 10 waves of Level 30+ Defense Solo with no damage to the objective".

Yup. Thanks, Lotus, for the useless mod I'll never get to use. Goes right along with the other Riven mod I have, "Do a Lv30 survival without killing anybody". You guys at DE could have at least made this mod give a sensible objective or something, seeing as it is supposed to be a "gift" and it comes from a lowbie mission, or something.

Oh well.

You're a grand master and you don't know how to play the game to this capacity?

Frost on a solo defence. Enemies are slowed by your bubble, and can't shoot from afar. Taking shield damage doesn't count, the cryopod has to take health damage. Stupidly easy.

Level 30 survival with no kills? Take anything with tanking capacity or stealth. Ivara makes this a joke. You only need to last 5 mins, and the Lotus beacons make this almost guaranteed as long as you don't die.

[nickelshark]

Ignis + ember + akkad Eris =win

If it's still too hard, I'll unlock it for you.

[RistN]

On 4.11.2017. at 3:24 AM, Xylia said:

So, friend comes on and tells me that the Gift of the Lotus today is a Riven Rifle Mod. He does it and he gets "Find 15 Syndicate Emblems".

Okay, so since the Riven Mod comes out of a lowbie mission, I thought well maybe there's special rules on this that it will give you something actually do-able.

Hahaha, this is Warframe.

It gave me "Do 10 waves of Level 30+ Defense Solo with no damage to the objective".

Yup. Thanks, Lotus, for the useless mod I'll never get to use. Goes right along with the other Riven mod I have, "Do a Lv30 survival without killing anybody". You guys at DE could have at least made this mod give a sensible objective or something, seeing as it is supposed to be a "gift" and it comes from a lowbie mission, or something.

Oh well.

To be honest you just described yourself like inexperienced player.How you got almost 10k forum reputation....God knows..

[BlackCoMerc]

Here's a Reward.

What's it do?

Dont know.

How do I find out?

All you have to do is put up with minutes of UTTER TEDIUM that you absolutely WILL NOT enjoy thanks to frankly ridiculous restrictions involved in Unveiling your "reward" and you can find out what it does.

Um...Thanks?

Seriously, if you put this system into any other loot based game - Borderlands Series, Destiny, Diablo...anything - players would (rightfully) riot. Either give me a reward or dont. But dont CLAIM you're giving me a reward, and then hand me utter tedium instead.

There's a word for Riven Unveiling: Trolling. You're basically trolling your own player base with this system. 

 

[Xylia]

5 hours ago, RistN said:

To be honest you just described yourself like inexperienced player.How you got almost 10k forum reputation....God knows..

Um, did I not say on Page 3 (the previous page) that I took a 2 year hiatus?

Honestly, people refuse to read the thread before jumping to the reply button.......

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

On 11/3/2017 at 10:24 PM, Xylia said:

It gave me "Do 10 waves of Level 30+ Defense Solo with no damage to the objective".

Yup. Thanks, Lotus, for the useless mod I'll never get to use. Goes right along with the other Riven mod I have, "Do a Lv30 survival without killing anybody". You guys at DE could have at least made this mod give a sensible objective or something, seeing as it is supposed to be a "gift" and it comes from a lowbie mission, or something.

Oh well.

Funny thing is, I did both of those with Limbo. Easily. It can also be done with Frost without trouble. With enough efficiency you spam his bubble to keep ejecting people out when they get close while you kill off the rest of the groups.

The thing about rivens, like mastery tests, you're meant to be proving skill versatility. You can't expect to solve all of life's problems with Rhino and a Tigris. You need to be proficient in various frames and weapon styles. Honestly, it's confusing that you could have so many posts on your account but not have figured that out yourself by now. That is, unless your account used to belong to someone else....

 

On 11/3/2017 at 10:44 PM, sh00chu said:

You think that's bad. I got 'Solo an interception mission with level 30 or above enemies, while equipped with the hobbled dragon key, without dying or being downed'. It's almost as if the Lotus knows how much I despise interception missions.

I did this one with max efficiency Vauban. Lol Just find a map where you are in good enough view of other nodes and just bullet jump around and keep throwing a repelling bastille and picking people off.

Edited November 6, 2017 by (PS4)Riko_113

[Xylia]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Riko_113 said:

Funny thing is, I did both of those with Limbo. Easily. It can also be done with Frost without trouble. With enough efficiency you spam his bubble to keep ejecting people out when they get close while you kill off the rest of the groups.

The thing about rivens, like mastery tests, you're meant to be proving skill versatility. You can't expect to solve all of life's problems with Rhino and a Tigris. You need to be proficient in various frames and weapon styles. Honestly, it's confusing that you could have so many posts on your account but not have figured that out yourself by now. That is, unless your account used to belong to someone else....

 

I did this one with max efficiency Vauban. Lol Just find a map where you are in good enough view of other nodes and just run bullet jump around and keep throwing a repelling bastille and picking people off.

Dude, did you somehow miss my BIG RED TEXT in my OP? I seriously want to know.

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

7 minutes ago, Xylia said:

Dude, did you somehow miss my BIG RED TEXT in my OP? I seriously want to know.

I read everything in your original post except your link you posted. Hehe Too much hyperbole and excuses made it painful to follow.

Now, having gone and read your link I've realized that you have fallen out of touch with the current state of the game due to RL issues, which is understandable. Yet somehow you felt you were knowledgeable enough to decide a mechanic you know little about was "useless", "not sensible" or "do-able". Sure. That makes everything better now.

Random mechanics are random. The better thing to do would've been to start with your other post and explain that you're out of touch with Warframe and ask people how we would've gone about completing these and worked towards that goal.

[Xylia]

And earlier in this page, I asked a question still nobody has answered:

Why the disparity between the options of objectives you can get with Riven Mods?

You got at least one objective that is easy-peasy (get 15 emblems) and some of the others are far, far, FAR harder and require special setups to do.

There shouldn't be such ridiculous disparity between them.

That's what annoyed me the most, is that of course when there's disparity, I'm going to get screwed and get some of the options that are the most difficult for me. Maybe I don't like defending a piece of paper (and indeed I dislike Defense, quite a lot, always have)... and Survival, well I like it even less.

Of Flippin Course it would give me those two as my first two Riven mods, while my friend gets to enjoy his effortless mod. Wouldn't be so bad if they were all similar challenge, though.

Edited November 6, 2017 by Xylia

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

5 minutes ago, Xylia said:

And earlier in this page, I asked a question still nobody has answered:

Why the disparity between the options of objectives you can get with Riven Mods?

You got at least one objective that is easy-peasy (get 15 emblems) and some of the others are far, far, FAR harder and require special setups to do.

There shouldn't be such ridiculous disparity between them.

That's what annoyed me the most, is that of course when there's disparity, I'm going to get screwed and get some of the options that are the most difficult for me. Maybe I don't like defending a piece of paper (and indeed I dislike Defense, quite a lot, always have)... and Survival, well I like it even less.

Of Flippin Course it would give me those two as my first two Riven mods, while my friend gets to enjoy his effortless mod. Wouldn't be so bad if they were all similar challenge, though.

Ya, the range of difficulty on them can get pretty crazy. But it is purely random. 

Honestly, it would've probably turned into a crappy buff for a weapon you don't like anyway. Most are. You can always just sell it to someone else then run Sorties to get new ones.

The reason they added them originally was kinda to fix the gap between top tier weapons and mastery rank fodder. They were hoping that this would allow people to use weapons they liked that just didn't have the natural stats to stay competitive. Unfortunately the random nature of the rivens didn't offset the weapon dispositions enough to help in a lot of cases. I think it has worked to a degree, but it still hasn't made me enjoy weapons that I don't enjoy any more than I did before rivens came out. At least it's given people who enjoy that sort of thing something to work towards and keep busy in between updates.

[Xylia]

Yeah, I'll probably just end up selling the stupid things... though I'm not really a marketplace kinda person.

 

Well, I might try the Survival one... I do have a max rank Loki... should be able to max Duration/efficiency... I wasn't sure whether or not Lotus's air tanks alone would last 5 minutes or not. I just don't like Survival, lol.

 

The Defense one.... yeah screw that. I'll probably just sell it.

Edited November 6, 2017 by Xylia

[HunRii]

On 11/3/2017 at 9:51 PM, (PS4)SageHeed said:

Now that's an interesting challenge! 

No.  Annoying as all get out, but not interesting.