Thanks for the help! Baza Final Form

[Canach]

Thanks for all the help from a few different threads here!  😁

Below is my "final form" Baza, used by my Ash for any 'infiltration-style' missions. I think the Riven was a lucky find, but it really puts the build on the next tier. The overall 111.7% Crit Chance pairs real well with Hunter Munitions, and more double-shot is always welcome! The primed fast hands easily earns its slot as the tiny 40-round magazine almost made me toss the Baza, now I couldn't be happier with the little rifle. 

Any comments are welcome!

Image on Google Drive   (sorry, couldn't get it to post the image hot-linked)

		Baza (V) - 6 Forma
14V	V	Serration	+165% Damage Boost	7
15V	V	Split Chamber	+90% Multishot	8
9V	V	Point Strike	+150% Crit Chance	5
9V	V	Vital Sense	+120% Crit Damage	5
18 -	-	Baza Critacan	+179.6 Crit Chance, +99.6 Multishot	9
15 -	-	Metal Auger	2.1m Punch-thru	8
9V		Hunter Munitions	30% for Slash Status on Crit	9
12 -	-	Primed Fast Hands	+55% Reload Speed (1.5s >> 0.7s)	6
				57

[(PSN)LeBlingKing]

Looks like an intriguing build. I'd love to see it in action.

[TheGrimCorsair]

Metal Auger over Shred/Primed Shred? Kinda weird.

[Guest]

40 minutes ago, TheGrimCorsair said:

Metal Auger over Shred/Primed Shred? Kinda weird.

Baza fire rate is pretty high.

 

@OP
How does it perform without an element?

[TheGrimCorsair]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)iQuedas said:

Baza fire rate is pretty high.

 

@OP
How does it perform without an element?

Which is why Shred, and especially Primed Shred, is much more valuable than Metal Auger. You get the increase in DPS against multiple targets with the punch-through and a pretty substantial increase in DPS from rate of fire. It's doubly nonsensical to not use them since the OP's already using Primed Fast Hands to maximize reload speed in combination with Hunter's Munitions for fishing for slash procs.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, TheGrimCorsair said:

Which is why Shred, and especially Primed Shred, is much more valuable than Metal Auger. You get the increase in DPS against multiple targets with the punch-through and a pretty substantial increase in DPS from rate of fire. It's doubly nonsensical to not use them since the OP's already using Primed Fast Hands to maximize reload speed in combination with Hunter's Munitions for fishing for slash procs.

Not everyone enjoys high fire rates, since it requires a better spray/burst control, otherwise it's just a waste of ammo. So, it's pretty valid not using Shred/Primed Shred in a weapon with high fire rate and/or low magazine size, like Baza.

[TheGrimCorsair]

1 minute ago, (PS4)iQuedas said:

Not everyone enjoys high fire rates, since it requires a better spray/burst control, otherwise it's just a waste of ammo. So, it's pretty valid not using Shred/Primed Shred in a weapon with high fire rate and/or low magazine size, like Baza.

Yes, some people do prefer inferior builds. Doesn't mean their build isn't second-rate compared to what its maximum potential could be.

[Dreddeth]

To be frank, Primed Fast Hands on something with less than 2 seconds reload time already is a complete waste of a slot, and you really should be using an elemental combo, for the +75% damage boost if nothing else.

Though the status chance you'd get from a pair of +60%/+60% mods is definitely workable if not ideal, especially with so much multishot.

[Canach]

GrimCorsair,

OMG, Inferior for using Metal Auger instead of Shred?

Well, usually I do always use Shred instead of MA, and I'm a big fan of RoF. My Soma P for example uses Shred AND Speed Trigger for 28.6/s - which makes for very nice DPS!

As far as my Baza goes, 16.7 is pretty high already, especially for a tiny 40-round magazine, so I chose not to increase it more, but the other factor that should not be ignored is the doubling of penetration depth. There are enough doorway bottlenecks and infested clusters to realize that damage of the additional meter of penetration. Thirdly, as mentioned, extreme fire rates do tend to waste ammo, and ammo management IS a factor with that mag capacity. At any rate, I chose MA over Shred for this gun, not because I prefer inferior builds, but because I felt it was better, not in the simulation room, but in use on missions.

iQuedas,  I was kind of shy about not using any elemental damage at all, but the performance IS excellent - it was a new thing for me but in this case it works very well, thanks!

Dreddeth,  At 1.5s reload time, I was going to throw the gun away -  about 2.5s of magazine capacity with a 1.5s reload is for shotguns. Putting Fast Hands on it made enough difference that I really enjoyed using the gun, so I accepted the potential damage loss of the slot for the tactical advantage of being able to shoot quicker. Fast hands took me from 1.5s to 1s, which made the critical difference, using Primed Fast Hands is just better and was available.

All, I should note that I did try all sorts of combinations including building without Fast Hands, without Hunter Munitions, using Argon Scope and Bladed Rounds, etc. This has been about 2 months of design, test, and tweak - with my goal being what works best for me. I posted this because I did get a LOT of help from the forums, and also just to show the final product and get any other comments. At the moment I use this weapon or a Soma Prime or an Ignis Wraith as my primary, depending on the mission. I also occasionally use Dread or the Vectis. Of course, I'm still experimenting with other primary weapons (currently the Corinth, Tigris Prime, and Tiberon Prime).

Edited May 20, 2018 by Canach

[Dreddeth]

27 minutes ago, Canach said:

about 2.5s of magazine capacity with a 1.5s reload is for shotguns

That's... rather subjective. So much so that it in no way negates my point, which is grounded in the reality of your DPS with that build being much worse than it could be, because you've gone for mods that make no meaningful improvement to the gun's performance. You're essentially using your Riven as a crutch to bring it (maybe) up to par with a more straightforward build that slots in mods the gun actually needs to improve its poor base damage and ammo economy.

Again, you'd get more out of your gun if you switched out the redundant or wasteful mods (What's punch through gonna do for you when the Baza's damage falloff rate is worse than some shotguns?) for elementals. That would probably make your magazine last more than 2.5 seconds, provided you exercised trigger discipline and tried not to fire more shots than you needed. Considering that you should be aiming for head-shots with any crit weapon anyway, that makes trigger discipline even more important, and punch through even less, since the head (or more realistically face, since half the Grineer can't be head-shot from behind) is a small target on the outer edge of an enemy's hitbox.

[Canach]

58 minutes ago, Dreddeth said:

That's... rather subjective. So much so that it in no way negates my point, which is grounded in the reality of your DPS with that build being much worse than it could be, because you've gone for mods that make no meaningful improvement to the gun's performance. You're essentially using your Riven as a crutch to bring it (maybe) up to par with a more straightforward build that slots in mods the gun actually needs to improve its poor base damage and ammo economy.

Again, you'd get more out of your gun if you switched out the redundant or wasteful mods (What's punch through gonna do for you when the Baza's damage falloff rate is worse than some shotguns?) for elementals. That would probably make your magazine last more than 2.5 seconds, provided you exercised trigger discipline and tried not to fire more shots than you needed. Considering that you should be aiming for head-shots with any crit weapon anyway, that makes trigger discipline even more important, and punch through even less, since the head (or more realistically face, since half the Grineer can't be head-shot from behind) is a small target on the outer edge of an enemy's hitbox.

Agreed.  Actually I agree with all your points - and I hope you don't think I'm playing spray & pray - I scope in on pretty much every shot, and a fair percentage are head shots, and I conserve ammo pretty well. This is definitely a head-shot weapon, doesnt mean I don't have a lot of heads coming at me at once sometimes!

Anyway, I found the tiny magazine with the high RoF a bad combo that was too annoying to use. What good is higher DPS if I don't use the gun? It would have gone the way of the Twin Vipers (the way to the garbage bin) if I was not using fast hands. I don't play Warframe to be annoyed by my weapons - mods which make me enjoy the game are not wasted.  😉

I DO, by the way, take exception to your comment about using my Riven as a crutch. I adjusted my build very little to allow me to add the Riven, it was a late-comer and replaced an elemental damage mod. - Just saying.

Edited May 21, 2018 by Canach

[Oreades]

5 hours ago, (PS4)iQuedas said:

Not everyone enjoys high fire rates, since it requires a better spray/burst control, otherwise it's just a waste of ammo. So, it's pretty valid not using Shred/Primed Shred in a weapon with high fire rate and/or low magazine size, like Baza.

C-control? *looks at Supra Vandal and shrugs* 

[(XBOX)D34thst41ker]

You know, if you're using Hunter Munitions, the Primed Bane mods are worth considering. Currently, Slash procs double dip on the multiplicative bonus from the Primed Bane mods: the weapon damage the game uses to determine how much damage the Slash proc does is increased by 55%, then the Slash proc itself is increased by another 55%. The result is that your Slash procs deal 2.4 times as much damage as they would have without the Primed Bane.

Given the preferences you've expressed in this thread, I'd suggest this:

Serration/Hunter Munitions/Primed Bane/Primed Fast Hands

Point Strike/Vital Sense/Metal Augur/Riven

Personally, my version of the build would look like this:

Serration/Hunter Munitions/Primed Bane/Primed Shred

Point Strike/Vital Sense/2x 90% Elements

Less Reload Speed and Punch Through, but more Fire Rate and Damage.

[hooperinius]

My baza build is viral damage with primed cryo rounds and a riven that makes it 105 crit W/10x multiplier, it's lethal on most grineer except for a few over 100 like Gunners. Think I am using bladed rounds too so 13.4x? Lol

Biggest problem is that some higher level enemies like Gunners over 110-120 have titanic amounts of armor and the baza just isn't quite enough compared a Tigris to the face.

[(PSN)TheDrift-]

My Baza can take down a 145 gunner in less then a clip...it does have a very good riven...build is...

Serration/point strike/vital/Hunters/malignant force/primed cyro/split chabmer/riven (CD, Dam, multi) 

It might be worth considering losing the QOL fast hands and auger to put viral on...you might find you need to reload  less as your killing quicker! 

 

[DatDarkOne]

18 hours ago, Canach said:

All, I should note that I did try all sorts of combinations including building without Fast Hands, without Hunter Munitions, using Argon Scope and Bladed Rounds, etc. This has been about 2 months of design, test, and tweak - with my goal being what works best for me.

The bold part is all that matters.  I like that you tested various setups to find what works for you.  Kudos fellow Tenno.