Khora is just another Nidus

[aligatorno]

4 minutes ago, ChaosSabre said:

Her 1 is pretty much same as nidus 1 with less range. Her 2 pulls a group of enemies together but worse than nidus 2, Her is a 3 cat. Her 4 functions same way as nidus 2 holding enemies in one place but way worse. So yea she is just a bad spaghetti nidus with a cat.

Nidus's 1 is just the line version of Atlas's 1. His 2 is just the tentacle version of Vauban's 4. His 3 works just like Equinox's 3. His 4 works similarly to Vauban's 3. Nidus is a hosh posh of other frames then if we are applying your logic.  

 

[aligatorno]

25 minutes ago, ChaosSabre said:

Ok ok you got me there. Khora 1 is just a bad Atlas 1 and her 4 is a bad Vauban Bastille. So know there are 3 frames that can do her job better than she does. And only thing left unique to her is that she has a cat. As for nidus while I can see the comparisons they got enough differences to set them apart, not like khora or even new sentient frame where you can just point to a skill and go hey that's a minor reskin of this ability.

Khora's 1 is equal and sometimes better than Atlas's 1 overall. From a damage perspective ,using the same builds, their DPS without and without synergy of their buff abilities [Ensnare/Petrify] is similar, Khora makins use of crits and status procs, Atlas of Raw damage. Activation range falls in Khora's court since she can attack at long range,and now with her recent changes, you can get up to 10m wide AOE damage form just one attack. Atlas is a bit faster in this regard, but DPS wise they seem pretty equal to me, especially at sortie 3 levels. 

 

Her 4 is a better Bastille. Bastille requires an augment to work for all enemies and not for a set number, and requires powers strength to be able to catch them, you always need to keep it up if you build for Bastille. On the other hand, Khora's 4 doesn't rely on power strength to be able to catch the enemies, while it has 5m less range than Bastille, it makes up for it by being able catch enemies from afar, so the real range of the ability is the same this way.

Vauban's Bastille is better if you just want to disable enemies and shoot them easily, other  than that, Khora's better because it provides complete protection within the dome as long as there's even one enemy caught in it, it provides damage buff for her whipclaw and her weapons, it does slash damage and it can be used to do DoT at higher levels and nuke at lower levels .

Her 2 now that it is fixed and range buffed is better than both Nidus's Larva and Vauban's Vortex because it can be cast multiple times, it pulls enemy twice instead of just once, so any enemy that enters its range after the first pull will also be affected, it has a very good range and makes enemies easy to kill. Larva while much faster, it mashes them together making it pretty much impossible to target specific enemies. It can only be cast once and you have to either kill every enemy to get the ability back or wait for it to pop. If you want to have the freedom to pop it when you want, you need to use an augment, and when it pops, if enemies are still caught in it, it will disperse them in every duration,which isn't something that you might want.   Vauban's Vortex suffers from similar problems. It has a lower range now [it used to be equal] and it mashes enemies together, but it is spammable and works continuously. 

Edited June 5, 2018 by aligatorno

[Marekthejester]

Il y a 3 heures, ChaosSabre a dit :

Reason why even without augment for me Nidus does better is coz with one skill he provides both the pulling and control at same time much faster. Hitting enemies in that is not hard if you use something like a Lenz or Pox or a shotgun. In fact you want them to be grouped up as closely as possible for that. Khora 2 you still got that downtime where it's pulling enemies in and let's not forget you actually need to have a enemy present to cast on to have it go off. With Nidus you can just spam 2 above your head and it'll make everything come to you. As for her 4 I still think Vauban Bastille is even even without augment for me. Bastille doesn't swing enemies around making them harder to hit. It gives easy way to do headshots or just spam fire at a enemy that is sitting still so it will catch new enemies coming in decently enough. In a group that is not much of a problem. It also covers areas way better. The augment version makes it a way better option though. Even with all that the problem still stands that her abilities are way too similar to other frames we already have in the game. They had like what 6 months to redesign her kit and what they came up with is simply lame.

Sooo let me sum this up : You praise bastille cause it allow easy headshot and blame strangledome cause it prevent headshot but at the same time you praise larva wich completely prevent headshot and blame ensnare wich allow for easy headshot.

Otherwise, Ensnare has only one similarity with Larva, it pulls ennemies together, that's it. If we're going this way, than Larva is just a copy of Vortex, it pulls enemies together too, right ? Oh and Nidus Link is just a copy of Trinity's link, it links ennemies and make them take part of your damage, right ? And Nidus 1 is just a copy of Ember, Volt, Frost, Excalibur, Vauban, Ash, etc... it does damage right ?

What i mean is, stop summing up abilities to their effect, you need to look at everything that make it unique, it's mechanics, effect, synergy, visual and sound. And when we look at all of this, than Khora is truly unique, as every other frame. There's already some similar skill in the game, look at Ember, Volt and Frost 1, the mechanics are all the same but they remains different enough. The game is bound to have some similarities between frame sooner or later.

Now, you totally have the right to prefer Nidus or any other over Khora, that's your personal taste and it's fine. But don't say they are the same, cause they are not. 

[.Fire_Fly.]

Khora is my first choice over nidus for one I don't have to gain stacks with boring button smash

[Oreades]

Most frames at this point are a compilation of other frame powers or Archwing abilities which themselves are a compilation of frames powers. 

They've pretty much touched on all of the possible powers at this point the only thing left is tweaking them slightly and adding different effects. However just because two things are tomato derivatives doesn't make me enjoy Salsa any less because marinara is a thing...... aaand now I'm hungry...... no more reading stuff before breakfast. 

[CupcakesMoo]

[Atekron]

31 minutes ago, Oreades said:

Most frames at this point are a compilation of other frame powers or Archwing abilities which themselves are a compilation of frames powers. 

true and inevitable, there are not much stuff you can do: damage, CC, buff or debuff, but nidus and khora share identical playstale, i would even say they require certain way to play them, gather and destroy, all "synergized", all "predetermined"

[(PSN)LeBlingKing]

10 hours ago, Atekron said:

yeah, it sounds ridiculous, cos you throw some random sentences together, not even trying to make it sound reasonable, that's how it sounds

...that's the point...

...because that's how you sound like...

[Educated_Beast]

Many people have been farming for khora since day 1 and still have not gotten all the parts.  Many just paid plat for the frame.  

With that level of grind (most in entire game orders of magnitude more grinder than anything else ever introduced in Warframe), I imagine people will be pissed when she don't walk on water.  

I'm MR25 with every frame but this one and been trying since day one.  I've got 16 systems and no helmet.  

I may uninstall before I find her and I dam sure am not going to encourage this atrocious behavior by buying the frame with plat.  My plat will rot before I buy that frame.  

I hate her already.  

[Atekron]

4 hours ago, Educated_Beast said:

Many people have been farming for khora since day 1 and still have not gotten all the parts.  Many just paid plat for the frame.  

With that level of grind (most in entire game orders of magnitude more grinder than anything else ever introduced in Warframe), I imagine people will be pissed when she don't walk on water.  

I'm MR25 with every frame but this one and been trying since day one.  I've got 16 systems and no helmet.  

I may uninstall before I find her and I dam sure am not going to encourage this atrocious behavior by buying the frame with plat.  My plat will rot before I buy that frame.  

I hate her already.  

why do even torture yourself and grind for frame parts?

it's way easier to farm rare prime parts or trade rivens and then buy her from a market 

you can't beat RNG - "the house always wins"

[Sahansral]

Nidus' gameplay is constantly trying to get a higher mutation stack count which just destroys the fun for me. Dependancies on mission type, too much micromanagement, too many occasions when teammates can screw you up, weapon use is trivialized, just stomping, stomping, jumping....

Khora has the some of these issues - if you want real high damage. Using the melee combo counter and riven interaction you find yourself mostly using whipclash instead of weapons  to increase and keep up the combo counter for insane AOE damage. You put venari on healing duty and basically just onehit everything in an area. Her 2 + 4 aren't needed most of the time.