The first steps to fixing Warframe's issues

[Fallen_Echo]

2 hours ago, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Please elaborate on the maps you speak of because I don't understand what you mean.

For example think of some classic mmo rpg. As you reach higher levels and get better gear you also unlock maps where harder enemies are.

In warframe the nodes get harder with each planet but they stop too low, the hardest node in the whole game is Mot what has +400% enemy damage, a remmant of the key system and even that node is easy.

Warframe needs maps what were created with "engame players", "endurance runners" and "minmaxer madmans" . The new mode was a step in the right direction but its still not good enough.

[(XBOX)ZAYNE 79]

vor 14 Stunden schrieb (PS4)CommanderRadec81:

 

Can both of you please explain why you disagree? I already made some changes to my post.

Because I like the game how it is and your changes would change the game in a way I don´t like.

 

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

9 hours ago, (XB1)INZZANE 79 said:

Because I like the game how it is and your changes would change the game in a way I don´t like.

That doesn't really explain anything and basically giving the generic "no". If you're not going to go in depth why you disagree then I'm not going to bother with you that you seem to not give me any reason to listen to anything you say.  

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

21 hours ago, Fallen_Echo said:

For example think of some classic mmo rpg. As you reach higher levels and get better gear you also unlock maps where harder enemies are.

In warframe the nodes get harder with each planet but they stop too low, the hardest node in the whole game is Mot what has +400% enemy damage, a remmant of the key system and even that node is easy.

Warframe needs maps what were created with "engame players", "endurance runners" and "minmaxer madmans" . The new mode was a step in the right direction but its still not good enough.

I was thinking of something like NG+ that players would unlock primed versions of mods and arcanes with lv100+ content then NG++ would require the player to have their loadout filled with those mods and arcances with lv200+ content as one form of endgame(and unlock more health upgrades and maybe more mod slots) but I doubt that DE will be willing to do that.(I have a bunch of other ideas for the game written down in my notebook like weapon attachments to expand our weapons customization) 

[Tyreaus]

Some thoughts:

On 2018-10-17 at 11:04 AM, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Remove mandatory mods (damage %,multishot and crit damage),Pistol Amp,Rifle Amp,Shotgun Amp,Dead Eye,Steel Charge,flight speed mod and that weapons scale as you level them up to make it feel natural especially for new players(and make the base power level of the weapon scale with mastery rank like mod capacity) and to make it so much easier for DE to fix enemy health scaling (and also removing these stats from Rivens) and rebalancing weapons (example: Rifles gain 5.5% damage,3% multishot and 4% critical damage every time the weapon ranks up) 

I get the idea of removing mandatory mods and building them into weapon progression. I'm not so certain on removing the auras, though: by my experience, people vary aura usage quite a lot, be it CP or Rejuvenation, so even if an aura gives a boost to weapon damage, it's not quite the same "must have" as Serration + Split Chamber.

Also not sure on crit damage being labelled as "mandatory" when crit chance isn't, not to mention other crit mods.

And why flight speed of all things? When has that ever been mandatory, or even substantial in terms of game balance?

On 2018-10-17 at 11:04 AM, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Remove all health,shield and armor mods and have them be part of a permanent upgrade system similar to the operator(this effects all warframes,Archwings and companions all at once) that you gain a point every time you rank up any warframe and select which stat you want to upgrade and will still have multiple ranks that will require you to rank up other warframes to fully max these stats(you will get these points for free if you already ranked up a bunch of warframes once these changes is implemented) out to make it much easier for DE to fix enemy damage scaling

This really doesn't jive. I'm guessing the point is that you can give Warframes greater survivability by default? If so, then why not just keep the same progression as they currently have, but boost the health / shield / armour values? It'd match how things work now and how you want weapons to progress.

I mean, or you could just give Warframes a few extra open slots (like companions) so people are less bothered about how to fit in survivability mods. I feel like you'd get a similar effect doing that.

If it's more of a concern about variety, i.e. the fact that survivability = health and armour for just about everything, then I feel that some kind of rework surrounding shields would be more appropriate. Shields having DR with itself, having shield-equivalent Rage mods...that sort of thing.

On 2018-10-17 at 11:04 AM, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Remove Flow and have it be part of the upgrade system mentioned above because it's a mandatory mod and it trivializes the "energy reduction" modifier  

What? Flow is far from a mandatory mod. I know I'm not running it on my Arbitration Equinox and I'm pretty sure it's also not on my Ash Prime. It's not like you couldn't fold it in with the defensive stats above if you wanted to but the rationale of one Sortie modifier is super weak on this.

On 2018-10-17 at 11:04 AM, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Remove Magus Husk and Magus Vigor and buff the health & armor waybounds for the operator(and everyone will be refunded there credits and resources that you used to craft these)

I'm not sure why you'd want to do this. Why remove non-mandatory Arcanes that boost armour and health, just to move those boosts into the Focus system? What's the point?

On 2018-10-17 at 11:04 AM, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Adding a gilding system open to everyone to be able buff lower MR weapons to be able to scale for endgame (it will buff their stats but also the MR requirement)

I kind of like this idea, purely because it feels like it accomplishes what Rivens were meant to do. I might even suggest taking the "custom stat upgrade" concept you mentioned for Warframes and applying it here: let players tweak the stats of their gilded weapons how they want, let them make a certain underpowered weapon more of a status or crit powerhouse, or turn a Lato into a shotgun with so much multishot. (Number of points would depend how high the MR boost is, and it should be able to be re-spec'd)

Summary: Personally, I'm all for taking mandatory mods like damage and split shot and reworking them into something that encourages more versatility (emphasis on "rework" - I feel it's smoother to turn them into something that's still useful but not universally so, e.g. increased status proc damage). And I like the gilding idea, since that can bring pretty much every weapon into some level of viability—at least close enough where differences aren't so huge that something's outright worthless. But the overall idea is missing things.

For example: you remove Bane mods for being the new mandatory mods, yet the 60/60 and 90 elemental mods would just replace those straight away. You end up with the same sort of "power creep" problem that the removal of the Bane mods is meant to address. And a number of the changes here don't feel particularly necessary. What's with shuffling around the Magus Husk and Vigor buffs? I get the feeling they're meant to fit together with other alterations you haven't mentioned in the OP, like how enemy scaling might be improved. If that's the case, then there are definitely details missing.

I get it's just the "first steps", but I'm wary about climbing a staircase if I don't know where it goes, and I can't imagine I'm the only one.

[Cataclystri]

On 2018-10-23 at 11:12 PM, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

No it's not. 

Flawed mods have less drain than regular ones. New players with new frames/weapons, low MR ranks, no potatoes, and few slots with polarity, have a hard enough time to rank up their gear. 

Those flawed mods are of significant importance to those players. Leave them be. 

I should probably have mentioned that I haven't dealt with flawed mods for years and should definitely have not asserted something like that as a concrete point of concern. I still think flawed mods are a bit of an Endo waste, but again, that's coming from somebody who hasn't had any experience with them whatsoever for several years. In any case, I'll acknowledge that my opinion on them is insignificant in importance. I'd be interested to hear the opinion of somebody who recently 'graduated' from flawed mods, though.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

56 minutes ago, Cataclystri said:

I should probably have mentioned that I haven't dealt with flawed mods for years and should definitely have not asserted something like that as a concrete point of concern. I still think flawed mods are a bit of an Endo waste, but again, that's coming from somebody who hasn't had any experience with them whatsoever for several years. In any case, I'll acknowledge that my opinion on them is insignificant in importance. I'd be interested to hear the opinion of somebody who recently 'graduated' from flawed mods, though.

You quoted one. I started in February. I'm MR16 now but that does not mean that I don't remember the sequence of modding/levelling new gear when I had single digits. 

Remembering that starting mod capacity is tied to MR. So having single digit mod capacities (possibly double with a stance, polarity or aura where applicable) means having to choose carefully to squeeze every last erg in. 

While I owned some the full version of the mods, many times I just couldn't afford to put a fully levelled version in a slot. So I had to find combinations that would be "good enough" until I could swapped them out. 

Also recall that for the drain cost, the flawed mods can actually surpass the effect of the undamaged ones. 

When you're limited to a cost of 5 drain available to you, would you rather get +50% or +72%? For me it was an easy choice. 

Think about your fully levelled Primed mods and your regular ones, there's a significant cost difference. Sometimes you just can't afford to equip the primed version and like they say, half a loaf of bread is better than no loaf at all. 

The flawed mods were very useful, and just because someone has the full version doesn't mean that they will want to/should dump the flawed mods. 

 

 

[(XBOX)ZAYNE 79]

Am ‎25‎.‎10‎.‎2018 um 17:54 schrieb (PS4)CommanderRadec81:

That doesn't really explain anything and basically giving the generic "no". If you're not going to go in depth why you disagree then I'm not going to bother with you that you seem to not give me any reason to listen to anything you say.  

There is no point for me to explain in more detail.

What you want is something that will never happen and it would be something that changes the game dramatically and it wouldn´t be Warframe anymore after your changes.

 

This Topic is pointless but feel free to go on if you have nothing better to do

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

12 hours ago, (XB1)INZZANE 79 said:

There is no point for me to explain in more detail.

What you want is something that will never happen and it would be something that changes the game dramatically and it wouldn´t be Warframe anymore after your changes.

 

This Topic is pointless but feel free to go on if you have nothing better to do

You truly have nothing to say except say "no", sure whatever you say bud.bye.  

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

On 2018-10-25 at 10:50 AM, Tyreaus said:

I'm not sure why you'd want to do this. Why remove non-mandatory Arcanes that boost armour and health, just to move those boosts into the Focus system? What's the point?

Mainly because the operator is absolute useless garbage even with when maxed out that I only use him for the energy and that those arcanes only exists as a bandaid that it seems like DE nerfed the operator just for the sake of it instead of leaving it alone and make some actually good arcanes for the operator.

On 2018-10-25 at 10:50 AM, Tyreaus said:

I kind of like this idea, purely because it feels like it accomplishes what Rivens were meant to do. I might even suggest taking the "custom stat upgrade" concept you mentioned for Warframes and applying it here: let players tweak the stats of their gilded weapons how they want, let them make a certain underpowered weapon more of a status or crit powerhouse, or turn a Lato into a shotgun with so much multishot. (Number of points would depend how high the MR boost is, and it should be able to be re-spec'd)

Summary: Personally, I'm all for taking mandatory mods like damage and split shot and reworking them into something that encourages more versatility (emphasis on "rework" - I feel it's smoother to turn them into something that's still useful but not universally so, e.g. increased status proc damage). And I like the gilding idea, since that can bring pretty much every weapon into some level of viability—at least close enough where differences aren't so huge that something's outright worthless. But the overall idea is missing things.

 Why not make your own topic on this idea then.

[Tyreaus]

6 hours ago, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Mainly because the operator is absolute useless garbage even with when maxed out that I only use him for the energy and that those arcanes only exists as a bandaid that it seems like DE nerfed the operator just for the sake of it instead of leaving it alone and make some actually good arcanes for the operator.

That makes sense, but if Op survivability is the issue, why not just skip the removal part, buff the Focus nodes, and add better Arcanes?

6 hours ago, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Why not make your own topic on this idea then.

Because it's your idea for which I'm providing feedback and suggestions.

[AlinaBee]

So you want to remove all the modding to make the game even more shallow and boring? What an amazing idea

you are right on the fundamental issues, but your 'solution' is even worse

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

On 2018-10-31 at 4:23 PM, Tyreaus said:

That makes sense, but if Op survivability is the issue, why not just skip the removal part, buff the Focus nodes, and add better Arcanes?

Operator survivability is fine but it bothers me why do these arcanes exist and letting these arcanes to stay with the changes I suggested would just make them feel mandatory. The other operator arcanes suck because their proc chance is so low and when it dose proc the effect is so minuscule that it's not even worth trying.These aren't the only issues with the operator there it's stuff like movement,void damage needs a rework to be decent in other content besides eidolons,why can't we use mods for the amp,focus lens are so tedious to get,why dose the covergence orb exist,focus need a other rework,lack of vacuum etc. My solutions to some of these issues is to simply add a focus lens slot in the upgrade menu just like how DE did with arcanes,have lens drop from rare crates and completing missions in the void,lua and derelict,get rid of the the covergence orb and buff the focus lens, and add a universial focus school that uses all your unused focus points and move the waybounds there.

 

On 2018-10-31 at 4:23 PM, Tyreaus said:

Because it's your idea for which I'm providing feedback and suggestions.

Well my idea of the gilding system was to simply buff lower MR weapons(damage,crit chance,status chance etc) at the cost of higher MR requirement while yours was basically just rivens. 

Edited November 2, 2018 by (PS4)CommanderRadec81

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

On 2018-10-31 at 5:04 PM, AlinaBee said:

So you want to remove all the modding to make the game even more shallow and boring? What an amazing idea

Was the over exaggeration really necessary?

On 2018-10-31 at 5:04 PM, AlinaBee said:

you are right on the fundamental issues, but your 'solution' is even worse

Please elaborate on why.

[Tyreaus]

2 hours ago, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

letting these arcanes to stay with the changes I suggested would just make them feel mandatory.

If you make other arcanes better and buff waybound nodes yet the survivability arcanes are still viewed as "mandatory", then either A: the waybound buffs aren't enough or B: the other arcanes are still bad. Or both. Removing those survivability arcanes doesn't change that fact, it just obfuscates it. Wouldn't you rather fix the problem than sweep it under a rug?

I do agree other things could use changes, though.

2 hours ago, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Well my idea of the gilding system was to simply buff lower MR weapons(damage,crit chance,status chance etc) at the cost of higher MR requirement while yours was basically just rivens. 

My suggestion was literally to take your idea and add player control over which stats get increased when gilding. How is that like the random-acquisition, random-roll nature of rivens?

[Zi-Sui]

On 2018-10-18 at 2:05 AM, (XB1)Zweimander said:

Actually I only had time for a short reply but I will just say that other people have expressed many of the things I feel already. The way to balance is not removing a bunch of things, it is making a select few enemies that can fight us somewhat evenly. If we go that route we can still have the power fantasy 90% of the time but that other 10% would be some sort of challenge.

Personally I'd like this, and knowing my friends in this game I'm not the only one. We all want challenge, but a lot of us like the system how it is now, apart from weak enemies that become stronger only in stats as you spend more time in the mission. That is not the kind of challenge I'm looking for.

I think it's better to have diversity instead of more of the same, that's where this game really shines. The reason I'm often opposed to big suggested changes is, this game already works pretty well and making big changes that might make the game just worse would also require a lot of work from DE, worktime they could spend on fixing bugs, making new content and making changes people could agree more on.

[Pawkeshup]

Let's take this an issue at a time

• Remove mandatory mods (damage %,multishot and crit damage),Pistol Amp,Rifle Amp,Shotgun Amp,Dead Eye,Steel Charge and that weapons scale as you level them up to make it feel natural especially for new players(and make the base power level of the weapon scale with mastery rank like mod capacity) and to make it so much easier for DE to fix enemy health scaling (and also removing these stats from Rivens) and rebalancing weapons (example: Rifles gain 5.5% damage,3% multishot and 4% critical damage every time the weapon ranks up)

So, essentially this point should just be "remove mods". No matter what mod you would remove, any others remaining would then become the so-called "mandatory mods." What you're rallying against here is the game having a meta. Even then, the meta would change to have "mandatory guns," as with this system you propose, some guns would just be statistically better.

• Remove Corrosive Projection,EMP Aura(why do enemies have accuracy stat? honestly this shouldn't exist in a 3D action game because this defeats the purpose of having a movement  system and makes enemies either unfair or star wars stormtroopers that miss their shots even when standing still and instead turn their shots into projectiles similar to bullet hells like Nier Automata with different sizes and speed that the corrupted seem to have this already and that it makes sense in lore because the Tenno are supposed to be beyond a super soldier),Infested Impedance and Shield Disruption because these just trivialize content without the player having to do anything

Here we see the first issue, comparing Warframe to other games. That's your big issue, and we'll get into that after the next bit. You see, this isn't Nier. The game is fundamentally different in playstyle and aim. Nier is a single-player, offline, narrative focused game, where as this is an online, squad based hoard mode looter. The two have very different goals. Making every weapon a projectile would result in a massive performance hit for the game, and make it nearly unplayable in its current form as there are no dedicated servers to track all of this new data that's being sent. If you have not noticed, this game uses a matchmaking system where the host computer is the one that (hopefully) has one of the better ping rates and connection.

• Remove all health,shield and armor mods and have them be part of a permanent upgrade system similar to the operator(this effects all warframes,Archwings and companions all at once) that you gain a point every time you rank up any warframe and select which stat you want to upgrade and will still have multiple ranks that will require you to rank up other warframes to fully max these stats(you will get these points for free if you already ranked up a bunch of warframes once these changes is implemented) out to make it much easier for DE to fix enemy damage scaling
• Remove Flow and have it be part of the upgrade system mentioned above because it's a mandatory mod and it trivializes the "energy reduction" modifier 
• Remove Magus Husk and Magus Vigor and buff the health & armor waybounds for the operator(and everyone will be refunded there credits and materials that you used to craft these)

"Change this game to be another game." It's a theme in this post. Now you want to remove other so-called "required" mods to turn them into an upgrade system found in other games. This is, again, missing the point of why someone would choose Warframe over Destiny or other similar games. Warframe's mod system has no mandatory mods. However, like every other game out there, there's an optimal path to achieve a certain end. You want a Slowva? There's a build for that, and given it's been tested, eventually with the finite amount of mods we have, there will be a singular build that comes out on top. However, let me give you a great example.

Recently, I built another Inaros (I had bought my first one due to how hard it was for me to get Prime parts in the days of key farming parties). With this Inaros, I built an Umbral tank build of my own creation. I didn't follow much of a meta build, and I used all three Umbral mods for maximum power to the two key ones. While some will point out that this is "sub-optimal", it fits and suits my playstyle of being a nearly unkillable tank, and I use my pet to gain health to make myself near invincible.

What I did was create my own style that doesn't fit the meta, yet is perfectly viable as an option as it does exactly what I want it to do. That's the point of the mod system in Warframe. Yes, if you are looking to replicate a particular meta setup, one that currently benefits from whatever state the game is in at this time, you can do that. You can also get burned if the meta and balance of the game shifts away from that. See everyone who built for Naramon's original perpetual invisibility back when that was a thing. However, that does not stop you from spending time to test out other mod configurations to find what suits you and your tactics.

• Change Collision Force,Auger Strike and Buzz Kill( and other 120% IPS mods like these) into dual stat mods as IPS versions of mods like Shell Shock because mods with similar function like those already exist with Heavy Trauma,Jagged Edge and Sundering Strike 
• Limit the damage type mods to only be one at a time that can't stack mods with the same damage type(example: if you have Frostbite equipped your can't add Cryo Rounds in the same build on your soma prime and it doesn't limit other mods on your other weapons on your loadout) to make a chose between pure damage or damage + status chance.
• Mods that will require to be changed with these changes because these have stats mentioned above:Umbral Fiber,Umbral Vitality,Sacrificial Pressure,Augur Accord,Auger Pact,Gladiator Aegis,Gladiator Might,Gladiator Resolve and Vigilante Armaments

This final piece contradicts your top piece about creating must-have mods. You're essentially creating must-have mods. As for limiting choice, that's not what Warframe is. Warframe is total choice to try and make the build you want work as well as it can work within the bounds of the game.

• Adding a gilding system open to everyone to be able buff lower MR weapons to be able to scale for endgame (it will buff their stats but also the MR requirement)

Again, you want to fundamentally change how weapons work, and that still will not do what you want. There will still be better guns, and lacking certain mods, you  will not be able to bring up other, weaker guns to match the standards of those meta guns which are now just statistically better.

• Bring back the Conclave rating system(and be given a new name) to be more like a item level system like other MMO/RPG games (example: Destiny's light level system) thats its used for keeping track of your overall power level(there is a max cap that can be reached without forcing you to max out mods,focus or arcanes but is soft cap by MR and increasing your MR increases your base(unmodded) power level and has no involvement with pvp) for better balance for endgame and something for the players to grind for and block off new players from doing content they should't be doing(like Eidolons and Elite Alerts)

Again, you're bringing in a system from a game that doesn't mesh with how Warframe works. Eidolons are the only thing "endgame" that a new player can do off the bat, and that's more just due to where the Plains are located. Even then, a new player can still help a team by fetching lures and filling them, as well as helping downed players. Elite Alerts require the entire star chart to be completed. That will take a good deal longer than you're thinking it will.

Also, Light Levels are just like MR: Meaningless as far as skill level. All it means is that you've played long enough to acquire the right gearset, and Destiny, I believe, now has a token that ascends you to near max Light Level anyway so you can access the new content faster.

Conclave is a terrible game mode, and doesn't belong in Warframe. This game simply doesn't play well as a PvP system as every frame is more geared to dealing with hoards of enemies rather than one on one combat with one another.

• Riven Transmute no longer needs the transmuter
• Riven Transmuter is turned into a lock that you will able to lock a stat of the riven mod when rerolling and can be done with multiple stats but requires multiple locks

And again you are just making up a required mod. Personally, Rivens to my eyes should have a singular stat value for each attribute. The only idea I see worthwhile is locking stats. Brozime's idea on that was the best I've heard so far.

OP, you need a new game. The sheer number of changes you see as "first steps" gut the current game entirely. You're not happy with how this game is? There's plenty more fish in the sea. Pick up Destiny 1 or 2, or any one of the many looter games out there. Given time I bet you find a game that better matches with your expectations.

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

So, essentially this point should just be "remove mods". No matter what mod you would remove, any others remaining would then become the so-called "mandatory mods." What you're rallying against here is the game having a meta. Even then, the meta would change to have "mandatory guns," as with this system you propose, some guns would just be statistically better.

You seem to have ignored this "DE to fix enemy health scaling" especially armor with also the gilding system I mentioned that will make all weapons viable.

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

Here we see the first issue, comparing Warframe to other games. That's your big issue, and we'll get into that after the next bit. You see, this isn't Nier. The game is fundamentally different in playstyle and aim. Nier is a single-player, offline, narrative focused game, where as this is an online, squad based hoard mode looter. The two have very different goals. Making every weapon a projectile would result in a massive performance hit for the game, and make it nearly unplayable in its current form as there are no dedicated servers to track all of this new data that's being sent. If you have not noticed, this game uses a matchmaking system where the host computer is the one that (hopefully) has one of the better ping rates and connection.

I used Nier as an example,not to be used a way to compare the games because it's the only recent 3D game that uses the bullet hell mechanic and I mentioned that the corrupted seem to have this mechanic right now.

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

"Change this game to be another game." It's a theme in this post. Now you want to remove other so-called "required" mods to turn them into an upgrade system found in other games. This is, again, missing the point of why someone would choose Warframe over Destiny or other similar games. Warframe's mod system has no mandatory mods. However, like every other game out there, there's an optimal path to achieve a certain end. You want a Slowva? There's a build for that, and given it's been tested, eventually with the finite amount of mods we have, there will be a singular build that comes out on top. However, let me give you a great example.

 You seem to have ignored this "DE to fix enemy damage scaling". How is DE supposed to balance this because they truly can't because they can't balance this for players that do use the health mods because the the ones that don't will be one shot constantly. But they can't balance it for players that don't use these health mods because the ones that do will be immortal.

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

Again, you want to fundamentally change how weapons work, and that still will not do what you want. There will still be better guns, and lacking certain mods, you  will not be able to bring up other, weaker guns to match the standards of those meta guns which are now just statistically better.

You seem to misunderstood what I meant with this suggestion and that Loza03 already explained this better.

• But especially a gilding system. If it was locked to weapons a certain MR below the highest currently on a weapon (15, I believe? I might be wrong), then that would certainly help weak weapons become relevant, and reduce the need for strong band-aid mods for them... which also apply to their stronger brethren, negating the benefits.. Have this gliding be acquired as a fairly late-game achievement as a reward for reaching a certain amount of power. "Well done, you've become powerful. Now, you can bring your whole arsenal to that level, with a little work."

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

Also, Light Levels are just like MR: Meaningless as far as skill level. All it means is that you've played long enough to acquire the right gearset, and Destiny, I believe, now has a token that ascends you to near max Light Level anyway so you can access the new content faster.

MR is account level not like light level were its simply a measurement of the overall power level of your loadout and warfarme use to have a similar system back within the first year of warframe coming out of closed beta.

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

Conclave is a terrible game mode, and doesn't belong in Warframe. This game simply doesn't play well as a PvP system as every frame is more geared to dealing with hoards of enemies rather than one on one combat with one another.

Duh it's trash I already know that and that pvp will never work in warframe because the game is not built for it(plus I don't like pvp in general except arena shooters like Quake and Unreal Tournament) and that it only exist because a loud minority being a bunch of doomsayers that the game will die without pvp that it makes me laugh at these people because not every game needs pvp. And also the item level system I mentioned has no involvement with pvp.

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

And again you are just making up a required mod. Personally, Rivens to my eyes should have a singular stat value for each attribute. The only idea I see worthwhile is locking stats. Brozime's idea on that was the best I've heard so far.

You seem to have forgotten that I mentioned removing the mandatory stats off rivens that with the gilding system mentioned above DE can get rid of riven disposition.

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

OP, you need a new game.

Like what? I already finished all the games I have and I'm only excited for Doom Eternal,Devil May Cry 5,Darksiders 3,Lost Soul Aside,Witchfire and Spyro Reignited Trilogy(don't even try to tell me RDR2 because I have no interest for that game and that Rock Star are overrated just like CD Projekt Red and Nintendo)

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

sheer number of changes you see as "first steps" gut the current game entirely.

You seem to forgotten that I mentioned that these balance issues is just one of the fundamental issues with the game because there is more that I already mentioned from one of my responses on this thread.

5 hours ago, Pawkeshup said:

Pick up Destiny 1 or 2, or any one of the many looter games out there. Given time I bet you find a game that better matches with your expectations.

I absolutely despise Destiny,Bungie, and its community except for one youtuber and warframe is the only looter I like. I'm not going anywhere because there is nothing you or anyone can say to make me leave so nice try. If I was truly unhappy with the game(or any game in general) then I wouldn't even bother to be here posting because I wouldn't care about the game and avoid it for my own sanity.

Edited November 2, 2018 by (PS4)CommanderRadec81

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

12 hours ago, Tyreaus said:

I do agree other things could use changes, though.

You(and everyone else here) should check this topic out and support it because there are some pretty good ideas:

 

 

Edited November 2, 2018 by (PS4)CommanderRadec81

[IRVoidGuru]

Reading this makes me think that all players would be set to a standard cap of capability power would not be Progressive. You get to a point then you're at that point.

This suggestion is dangerous for a player like me who has become stronger than other players by knowing how to use the mod system intelligently.

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

3 hours ago, (PS4)IrSchm33 said:

intelligently.

Don't make me laugh there is nothing deep or complex about modding in warframe.

[IRVoidGuru]

19 hours ago, (PS4)CommanderRadec81 said:

Don't make me laugh there is nothing deep or complex about modding in warframe.

So do you know about the multi cumulative system?

How about status conversion?

It seems to me there might be more complex forms of modding in Warframe than you are aware of.

Edited November 3, 2018 by (PS4)IrSchm33

[(PSN)CommanderRadec81]

On 2018-11-02 at 3:31 AM, Pawkeshup said:

Let's take this an issue at a time

• Remove mandatory mods (damage %,multishot and crit damage),Pistol Amp,Rifle Amp,Shotgun Amp,Dead Eye,Steel Charge and that weapons scale as you level them up to make it feel natural especially for new players(and make the base power level of the weapon scale with mastery rank like mod capacity) and to make it so much easier for DE to fix enemy health scaling (and also removing these stats from Rivens) and rebalancing weapons (example: Rifles gain 5.5% damage,3% multishot and 4% critical damage every time the weapon ranks up)

So, essentially this point should just be "remove mods". No matter what mod you would remove, any others remaining would then become the so-called "mandatory mods." What you're rallying against here is the game having a meta. Even then, the meta would change to have "mandatory guns," as with this system you propose, some guns would just be statistically better.

• Remove Corrosive Projection,EMP Aura(why do enemies have accuracy stat? honestly this shouldn't exist in a 3D action game because this defeats the purpose of having a movement  system and makes enemies either unfair or star wars stormtroopers that miss their shots even when standing still and instead turn their shots into projectiles similar to bullet hells like Nier Automata with different sizes and speed that the corrupted seem to have this already and that it makes sense in lore because the Tenno are supposed to be beyond a super soldier),Infested Impedance and Shield Disruption because these just trivialize content without the player having to do anything

Here we see the first issue, comparing Warframe to other games. That's your big issue, and we'll get into that after the next bit. You see, this isn't Nier. The game is fundamentally different in playstyle and aim. Nier is a single-player, offline, narrative focused game, where as this is an online, squad based hoard mode looter. The two have very different goals. Making every weapon a projectile would result in a massive performance hit for the game, and make it nearly unplayable in its current form as there are no dedicated servers to track all of this new data that's being sent. If you have not noticed, this game uses a matchmaking system where the host computer is the one that (hopefully) has one of the better ping rates and connection.

• Remove all health,shield and armor mods and have them be part of a permanent upgrade system similar to the operator(this effects all warframes,Archwings and companions all at once) that you gain a point every time you rank up any warframe and select which stat you want to upgrade and will still have multiple ranks that will require you to rank up other warframes to fully max these stats(you will get these points for free if you already ranked up a bunch of warframes once these changes is implemented) out to make it much easier for DE to fix enemy damage scaling
• Remove Flow and have it be part of the upgrade system mentioned above because it's a mandatory mod and it trivializes the "energy reduction" modifier 
• Remove Magus Husk and Magus Vigor and buff the health & armor waybounds for the operator(and everyone will be refunded there credits and materials that you used to craft these)

"Change this game to be another game." It's a theme in this post. Now you want to remove other so-called "required" mods to turn them into an upgrade system found in other games. This is, again, missing the point of why someone would choose Warframe over Destiny or other similar games. Warframe's mod system has no mandatory mods. However, like every other game out there, there's an optimal path to achieve a certain end. You want a Slowva? There's a build for that, and given it's been tested, eventually with the finite amount of mods we have, there will be a singular build that comes out on top. However, let me give you a great example.

Recently, I built another Inaros (I had bought my first one due to how hard it was for me to get Prime parts in the days of key farming parties). With this Inaros, I built an Umbral tank build of my own creation. I didn't follow much of a meta build, and I used all three Umbral mods for maximum power to the two key ones. While some will point out that this is "sub-optimal", it fits and suits my playstyle of being a nearly unkillable tank, and I use my pet to gain health to make myself near invincible.

What I did was create my own style that doesn't fit the meta, yet is perfectly viable as an option as it does exactly what I want it to do. That's the point of the mod system in Warframe. Yes, if you are looking to replicate a particular meta setup, one that currently benefits from whatever state the game is in at this time, you can do that. You can also get burned if the meta and balance of the game shifts away from that. See everyone who built for Naramon's original perpetual invisibility back when that was a thing. However, that does not stop you from spending time to test out other mod configurations to find what suits you and your tactics.

• Change Collision Force,Auger Strike and Buzz Kill( and other 120% IPS mods like these) into dual stat mods as IPS versions of mods like Shell Shock because mods with similar function like those already exist with Heavy Trauma,Jagged Edge and Sundering Strike 
• Limit the damage type mods to only be one at a time that can't stack mods with the same damage type(example: if you have Frostbite equipped your can't add Cryo Rounds in the same build on your soma prime and it doesn't limit other mods on your other weapons on your loadout) to make a chose between pure damage or damage + status chance.
• Mods that will require to be changed with these changes because these have stats mentioned above:Umbral Fiber,Umbral Vitality,Sacrificial Pressure,Augur Accord,Auger Pact,Gladiator Aegis,Gladiator Might,Gladiator Resolve and Vigilante Armaments

This final piece contradicts your top piece about creating must-have mods. You're essentially creating must-have mods. As for limiting choice, that's not what Warframe is. Warframe is total choice to try and make the build you want work as well as it can work within the bounds of the game.

• Adding a gilding system open to everyone to be able buff lower MR weapons to be able to scale for endgame (it will buff their stats but also the MR requirement)

Again, you want to fundamentally change how weapons work, and that still will not do what you want. There will still be better guns, and lacking certain mods, you  will not be able to bring up other, weaker guns to match the standards of those meta guns which are now just statistically better.

• Bring back the Conclave rating system(and be given a new name) to be more like a item level system like other MMO/RPG games (example: Destiny's light level system) thats its used for keeping track of your overall power level(there is a max cap that can be reached without forcing you to max out mods,focus or arcanes but is soft cap by MR and increasing your MR increases your base(unmodded) power level and has no involvement with pvp) for better balance for endgame and something for the players to grind for and block off new players from doing content they should't be doing(like Eidolons and Elite Alerts)

Again, you're bringing in a system from a game that doesn't mesh with how Warframe works. Eidolons are the only thing "endgame" that a new player can do off the bat, and that's more just due to where the Plains are located. Even then, a new player can still help a team by fetching lures and filling them, as well as helping downed players. Elite Alerts require the entire star chart to be completed. That will take a good deal longer than you're thinking it will.

Also, Light Levels are just like MR: Meaningless as far as skill level. All it means is that you've played long enough to acquire the right gearset, and Destiny, I believe, now has a token that ascends you to near max Light Level anyway so you can access the new content faster.

Conclave is a terrible game mode, and doesn't belong in Warframe. This game simply doesn't play well as a PvP system as every frame is more geared to dealing with hoards of enemies rather than one on one combat with one another.

• Riven Transmute no longer needs the transmuter
• Riven Transmuter is turned into a lock that you will able to lock a stat of the riven mod when rerolling and can be done with multiple stats but requires multiple locks

And again you are just making up a required mod. Personally, Rivens to my eyes should have a singular stat value for each attribute. The only idea I see worthwhile is locking stats. Brozime's idea on that was the best I've heard so far.

OP, you need a new game. The sheer number of changes you see as "first steps" gut the current game entirely. You're not happy with how this game is? There's plenty more fish in the sea. Pick up Destiny 1 or 2, or any one of the many looter games out there. Given time I bet you find a game that better matches with your expectations.

Not going to respond are you huh?

[ChaellExE]

On 2018-10-17 at 11:16 PM, (PS4)ZERO_ghost90 said:

I feel you man, i would really love to skip all the raw damage mods and shove a lot of utility mods on my weapons, but riven mods have roots to deep in the game, and cant be tweaked whitout killing the riven economy economy (a good chunk% of the ingame platinum) or making the rivens mandatory, wich kills the market anyways, because making them easier to get will devalue them proportionaly

The economy can be changed by other entries when DE will release something bigger and put the old to access for everybody. 

some examples from the last five years:

• The mod fushion cores,
  • before endo
• Kavat genetic codes
  • before their introduction in the store.
• Primed Mods
  • still are but used to be way more 
    • before Baro. 
• Lenses
  • before their introduction into the store
• Corrupted mods
• Keys to access those void towers
  • before relics
• Primed weapons, warframes and companions
  • way more in the early days 
    •  before some were introduced into the store / warframe packs / vaulted

[ChaellExE]

On 2018-10-19 at 6:56 AM, Fallen_Echo said:

I like how you fixed the enemy scaling issue by not even touching or mentioning it!

 

Okay now seriously this is nothing else but a bunch of unnecesseary nerfs what dont fix the core problem.

 

First of all behind what you named as problems lies a giant troll named "Enemy scaling". This guy only does one thing, he negates all of your progression be making sure that no matter what you use after a point the literal cannon fodders will be the ones who obliterate you.

Just removing all of our ways to cope with this will only magnify the problems.

 

Second, powercreep is NOT a problem. I repeat powercreep is not a problem.

Powercreep is progression itself, as time goes on your characther gets more and more powerful just as how you are supposedly become wiser as you grow old. The problem lies within not with what we have but with what we dont and that is a place to use up your progression. In a well made game you are never forced ro backtrack low level areas just to grind core materials to progress, you are forwarded to a map approtiate for your power.

This is what is missing from here completely, even the latest endgame mode is something what is only difficult because of artifical mechanics.

 

** please note that I replied to your comment because you bring out the point that I would like to explain to OP 
     but feel free to react as you would like **

The scaling always has been the problem that was introduced to the game the bigger it became. 
Because lets face it. In a game as warframe can't halt people by forcing weapons with MR ranking to get to certain content. 
It doesn't work, for one simple reason and one simple reason only.


The game was never designed to have endgame content to begin with. 

To understand this and all of the hidden problems, you'll have to know the history of the game before it got to the point of where we are now. Trying to find a solution, together for it all. *This all is told by my point of view of the game and its history, as someone who experienced it from the view of my experience as an early player and the one of the current ones.*

Warframe in its early days was like a demo that people played over and over again. During the time to official mark of popularity, things were added to make it like a full game, but it was still in development (still is, but on a different level). As the game grew so, so did the popularity. But the problem was that it never could stay in a state that it was treated like an hobby project, so plat store was introduced for business purposes and the continuation of the game / developer.

I will get back to this in a short while.

The bullet sponges a.k.a enemy scaling
Content were added and people loved it, but it also meant that the majority was gaining upon the content. With this, the infinity cycle of weekly updates / addition to the game, at least for the beginning stages of the game. With all the good and bad that came with it. In order to solve the problem of catching up, the enemies became stronger on a larger scale, never meant to be initially beaten, beyond a certain point, always stayed one step in front of the players and their current arsenal. The players progressing in a somewhat linear fashion with each new addition to the game and the enemies scaling exponential, while staying relatively the same and only increasing in numbers. This all viewed in comparison, in terms of progression and different methods to solve the problem for and of reaching new heights.

Payers had found ways, within terms of legal playing, on how to beat these enemies, to a certain level, that is. They've found out that no matter how much they tried to use the system, (the different frames, mix of mods, abilities use and their progression), they never could go beyond a certain point and even if they did, it would have taken way too long, with their arsenal at that point, until the next update and introduction of the next big thing. At first this was only on certain places, like the infinity rounds, were people could go on and on the levels, only to quit when they couldn't go far enough with what they had. Soon enough these mobs (levels) would also make their way into the normal game play, which made the challenge a problem. One which never really got solved.

 

It makes me wonder till this date, why do enemies have levels and the player and their weapons ranks? These things never seem to become equals in this game, but also never would've made any sense if they did ...
 

 

Power creeps (lore wise)

You are The Tenno, a legendary ancient ninja warrior, whom's group was the reason for the downfall of the greatest empire ever existed in the current history. Send in a mysterious way to slumber and awaken after **insert huge amount of time** as an artifact of the old. Upon awakening you flee for you life, only to be led by the Lotus, for which you do her bidding and loyalty towards. 

The Tenno themselves are powerful, way powerful than anything you might come across in the game for a long time. The reason for this is really simple from a lore point of view.
(The lore it began with before the game became what it is now, without the updated enemies and interference of quest)

They, the Tenno and every faction around them are the result and what is left of this great empire. The Tenno, all most unchanged by the effects of the fall of the empire, besides being lost in the new era, but in terms of power still ranked as one of the most powerful till date. The Grinneer are from the lowest rank of that era and by the beginning of the game they are just seemingly to be making their way to new heights. The Corpus, seems like the commoners of that era, and when the empire fell, they automatically rose to the top, but never really did anything else. Mostly always seemed to be in war with the Grinneer for territory, even though there seem to be commerce between them. 
Last but not least the Orokin, the fallen empire and the remains and information scattered with it,

Because the Tenno is almost unchanged by the effects of the fallen empire, in terms of strength, they did not have to build that up again. The rest of factions, seemed to have other problems within that did not need such power to begin with, to solve their past and mostly current problems, until the arrival of the Tenno. 
 

Powercreeps (game-play wise)

Warframe is a game where the player is a fast pased, deadly, almost immortal assassin, with tools and abilities in his arsenal to clear a room of mercenaries and other high ranking soldiers or enemies in seconds, or so it seems. 

In the old game there was Warframe **insert name of beginner frame**, and it could wipe a room with the beginning gear and the rest of the of the planets (wasn't allot) with ease, if you had certain mods to equip. On top of that, there was not much to begin with either, nor it did had a way variation of different models and enemies. You dropped it, wiped rooms, loot and repeat. New modes were introduced and enemies got types, more advance and stronger, to the point where the beginning gear wasn't enough to carry trough the rest of the game anymore.This cycle kept repeating it self but now with the old gear before new ones were introduced. Same concept as with other RPGs, level up and exchange the old gear for current level appropriates, only now real time. And this went on for while.

The game got revamped and it's first iteration marked the beginning of the warframe we all play and love. And everything else of what we have now i s just build upon this system, which now is known as the unsolvable core of the game. Remove this, and everything that Warframe is, will be lost forever. 

This is why we see bandages, over bandages, over bandages.
 

 

In Warframe there are two types of powercreeps

• The first one:
  • Power-creeps exist because the game is made that way.
    • The player is meant to be almost all powerful and an one man army and against a platoon of enemies, no matter the faction they may come from. Not all enemies can be dealt the same way, but one thing for certain. All, including the player, goes down when the hit points reach 0. 
       
• The second one:
  • Things that are not supposed to be there at a certain moment, time or relevant to the current content in terms of level and or place. 
    • As mentioned earlier the game was build with the intention that the player would progress on a linear fashion. 
      While the game brings out and offers the possibility to branch out, as how the player see fit. So far, so great. The game is now days is also more designed with the linear fashion of the player progression in mind, as seen with:
      Specters of the Rail:  map progression, weapon blueprints and given to players when reaching a certain point on the map
      The Second Dream: quest progression
      The Sacrifice: re ranking of the required mastery for certain weapons
      
      DE recognized the problem among new ones and chose to guide new players and it seems to be working to a certain extend. It just solves a part of the problem. The other side of the problem is that comes to mind is acquiring new weapons and mods without restricting players to walk the linear path in terms of choice. Which is something that is not truly solved yet but the great arsenal of Warframe makes this really not a great problem to fix immediately. As some weapons are made to tackle the hard things will oppose the players.
      
      It is noted that as soon a certain weapon is hyped to the max by the majority of players in terms of being OP, these weapons, frames and abilities are most likely also the ones that get nerfed due to the reaction of or how it used by the community. Mostly these weapons are not acquired by player until a later point in the game, due to mr restrictions, the amount of resource needed for the build and or mods used in builds by those who may have used it before its rise in popularity.

 

 

 

The game was not meant to have an endgame. 
I have mentioned it earlier and now the side notes are cleared I would like to elaborate myself. 

Since the conception of the game the game felt like a demo. And even now, 5 years later, it still sometimes does. It is felt as soon as the game gets repetitive, this most noticeable due the lack of refreshing content after a long period of none major updates (especially on the consoles), the player need to achieve certain things in the game and the RNG that is not in the favor of the player. On top of that comes the tedious resource gathering of unholy amounts by the need of ungodly amounts as requirements for different aspects. It is felt like this because it is still being build and maintained around the systems that made it, what it is today. 
Eventually it might outgrow these terms,with the growth of DE. And that is fine from time to time as the game is still in development and what is meant to be endgame content and neither the balance, will not ever exist considering the cycle and the involvements of the community, Frankly I hope it will stay that way for the better things and new heights to come. 
 

 

Edited December 8, 2018 by ChaellExE
typos