Another Ember rework suggestion

[FollowTheFaceless]

I got it. I'll try again:

 

1. Melting - Ember covers herself up in flame (no self damage), converting all her ranged weapons 25/50/75/100% of damage to fire damage for 10/20/30/40 sec. Any enemy trying to hit her in melee suffers from 200/300/400/500 blast damage with 100% status effect.

Affected by duration and strength mods.

Augment - Heat - ability can be cast on allies with 20/30/40/50% of it's effectiveness. 

 

2. Accelerant - radial 7/10/13/16 m flash that stuns enemies for 1 sec and reduces their fire resistance by 25% for duration of ability. Increases all outcoming fire damage by 1.25/1.5/1.75/2.25 for 10/15/20/25 sec.

Affected by duration, range and strength mods.

Augment - Accelerator - every ally inside cast area (including Ember) gets 25% boost to reload/movement/cast speed for 2.5/5/7.5/10 sec.

 

3. Inferno - Ember melts air around herself in 5 m radius, converting all incoming ranged damage to 25/50/75/100% fire damage. Any enemy inside ability range suffers from 150/250/350/500 fire damage per sec. Duration 10/15/20/25 sec.

Affected by duration and strength mods.

Augment - unchanged.

 

4. Dancing Flames - creates a fire particles (2/4/6/8 particles) hovering around her seeking enemies in 5/10/15/20 m radius dealing 300/400/500/700 fire damage in contact and creating another 2 seeking particles active in 10 m fixed radius and dealing 50% of original damage. Enemies can be targeted multiple times. Flow ability: every particle costs 10 energy and respawns in 5/4/3/2 sec. 

Ability can be charged for additional 50% damage, double particles spawn on impact and double energy cost.  

Affected by strength, range and duration (number of particles) mods.

Augment - Hell Flies - alters impact effect, creating fire vortex that sucks.enemies inside constantly dealing 50% (75% charged) of ability damage per sec for 2/4/6/8 sec in 10 m radius.

 

Passive - permanent 30% fire resistance. Immune to fire status effect.

 

If that's one bad, then I dunno...

Edited June 8, 2019 by FollowTheFaceless
First one was bad, I got it.

[Blexander]

I hope this is a joke.

[FollowTheFaceless]

1 minute ago, Blexander said:

I hope this is a joke.

Nope. No jokes.

[Blexander]

Just now, FollowTheFaceless said:

Nope. No jokes.

Oh god. I'm not even going to attempt to go in depth as to why this makes Ember worse than ever. I'll just say: her passive and Fire blast are NOT fine, self damage on a squishy DPS is objectively dumb, and a static 4th ability is borderline useless. It's not even bland, it's just bad.

[FollowTheFaceless]

7 minutes ago, Blexander said:

Oh god. I'm not even going to attempt to go in depth as to why this makes Ember worse than ever. I'll just say: her passive and Fire blast are NOT fine, self damage on a squishy DPS is objectively dumb, and a static 4th ability is borderline useless. It's not even bland, it's just bad.

Please do. Or what? Making you push buttons (one button - 4) more than 1 time per mission is traumatizing?

Edited June 7, 2019 by FollowTheFaceless

[ShortCat]

13 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

Please do.

• You gimped Ember when you took away her Accelerant and especially its augment, as such disarmed her.
• Including Accelerant effect into #4 is useless, because you do not have enough fire damage to boost.
• All of the reworked abilities now can proc heat status, which is bad, because heat cannot be overriden. Your Ember will set enemies for whooping 125-300 damage on fire, while stronger heat effects from weapons cannot trigger.
• Fireblast, her worst ability right now, becomes the best ability in this new kit

Main idea behind your reworks seems to somehow enable her horrible passive so that Ember can spam Wisp inspired fields. She loses all her scaling damage and almost all CC she has.

[FollowTheFaceless]

3 minutes ago, ShortCat said:

• You gimped Ember when you took away her Accelerant and especially its augment, as such disarmed her.
• Including Accelerant effect into #4 is useless, because you do not have enough fire damage to boost.

2>4>3>Catchmoon. You failed here.

4 minutes ago, ShortCat said:

All of the reworked abilities now can proc heat status, which is bad, because heat cannot be overriden. Your Ember will set enemies for whooping 125-300 damage on fire, while stronger heat effects from weapons cannot trigger.

It's a fire based frame, duh. What else did you expect?

5 minutes ago, ShortCat said:

Fireblast, her worst ability right now, becomes the best ability in this new kit

It's fine with this set.

6 minutes ago, ShortCat said:

Main idea behind your reworks seems to somehow enable her horrible passive so that Ember can spam Wisp inspired fields. She loses all her scaling damage and almost all CC she has.

The only thing she looses here is her press-and-forget mechanic.

[ShortCat]

2 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

2>4>3>Catchmoon. You failed here.

What?

2 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

It's a fire based frame, duh. What else did you expect?

Did you even understand what I said there? Your weak ability heat procs will block much stronger weapons heat procs and reduce total damage.

5 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

It's fine with this set.

Yea, I said it. What is not fine, that her currently worst ability becomes her best.

5 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

The only thing she looses here is her press-and-forget mechanic.

Press #4 and forgett is not how Ember is played in higher lvls. Its her Accelerant augment with scaling weapon damage. This reworks steps in big footsteps of Ember's last fixes to completely ruin her, becasue people focus too much on WoF and its low lvl clear capabilities.

 

[FollowTheFaceless]

2 minutes ago, ShortCat said:

What?

If you can't understand this synergy, then there is no reason for further talk, neophyte.

[Blexander]

37 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

If you can't understand this synergy, then there is no reason for further talk, neophyte.

I don't think YOU understand how synergies work. Nor do you understand that Heat damage doesn't stack or overwrite itself, unlike the other status'. You lack core knowledge on Ember's role and mechanics. You don't even understand what makes Ember bad. Turning Ember into a CC frame during the Nuke meta? Are you well?

And the reason I'm not going to go in-depth is because I've done it TOO MANY TIMES on suggestions far better than this one. There's no point in telling somebody why they're wrong when they:

1. Refuse to listen

2. Played Ember once, heard she's bad, and made a halfassed attempt at a rework that just adds to the pile

Edited June 7, 2019 by Blexander

[FollowTheFaceless]

2 minutes ago, Blexander said:

I don't think YOU understand how synergies work. Nor do you understand that Heat damage doesn't stack or overwrite itself, unlike the other status'. You lack core knowledge on Ember's role and mechanics. You don't even understand what makes Ember bad. Turning Ember into a CC frame during the Nuke meta? Are you well?

I am.

I just use 2 (+25% pow), then 4 (fire mult for whole party boosted by mods+passive), then 3 (adds fire damage to projectiles for anyone inside ring, also boosted by ults mult) and take fire based weapon (Ignis or in my case 14k fire damage crit tuned Catchmoon). What nuke do I need in this case?

Your turn.

[Blexander]

2 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

I am.

I just use 2 (+25% pow), then 4 (fire mult for whole party boosted by mods+passive), then 3 (adds fire damage to projectiles for anyone inside ring, also boosted by ults mult) and take fire based weapon (Ignis or in my case 14k fire damage crit tuned Catchmoon). What nuke do I need in this case?

Your turn.

By the time it took you to set up 3 abilities, Saryn clicked 1 button and did both faster and better.

What are you trying to prove? That Ember can deal decent damage with weapons and that makes her a good DPS?

[FollowTheFaceless]

1 minute ago, Blexander said:

By the time it took you to set up 3 abilities, Saryn clicked 1 button and did both faster and better.

If you talking about 1 - it's not, it needs to accumulate damage first. If 4 - just nope (and it's not ONE button as you mentioned if used above spores).

 

4 minutes ago, Blexander said:

What are you trying to prove? That Ember can deal decent damage with weapons and that makes her a good DPS?

Maybe. I don't understand what YOU trying to prove? That Ember needs to be OP as before? She was 1-button joke before rework. She is even worse now.

[Blexander]

2 hours ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

Maybe. I don't understand what YOU trying to prove? That Ember needs to be OP as before? She was 1-button joke before rework. She is even worse now.

Lmao, I knew it. You're one of those guys.

"Oooo, Ember was so OP before"

Listen carefully, Ember's current WoF is STRONGER than before. Her 1 can be charged, her 2 is the same, her 3 is the same, her 4 has a range nerf and an efficiency nerf, but it has more damage at 100% chargr. If you think that at ANY point Ember could have been taken into a high level mission and not get instantly shreded just like now, you didn't play her much.

Heat damage sucks, how can you not get this? AFK WoF was dead when they added the cost/time increase, but they bricked WoF by reducing its range by 50%. YOU CAN'T EVEN USE FIREQUAKE BUILDS.

Your move.

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

At this point we've passed suggestions.  We have officially entered plea for help territory...

[(PSN)CodyXSavageX]

You already failed 

With no survivability she’s just a worse saryn you need to give ember something that makes her different from other frames  so people have a reason to choose her 

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1094133-myunhealthyhobby’s-ember-rework-idea/

I recommend going here and seeing what you can add or critique on

[Maka.Bones]

9 hours ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

3. Fire Blast - no changes. It's fine.

I don't see how it's fine? To me, it's the worst ability of her kit. 

1) offers very small damage

2) knockdown lasts as long as her animation. So you can't even make use of the time enemies are knocked down. 

3) the lingering AoE effect, doesn't do any damage in the center.

4) It also doesn't last very long,

5) doesn't do much damage period, so why even cast it when you could use WoF?

6) doesn't stagger enemies or proc much status effects, or offer any damage mitigation. 

7) The damage bonus to weapons shooting through it is laughable (I've tested it, and it didn't seem very effective). And it's a small area to shoot through (which you can't take with you.)

😎 you need to walk towards wherever you want it placed... 

9) her fireball or WoF, work better than this. They can completely replace it; Fireblast literally offers nothing unique to her kit. 

Her 2 (accelerant) is fine though.

Edited June 7, 2019 by Maka.Bones

[FollowTheFaceless]

Okay, I'll remake it completely. I have a really nice one this time.

[(PSN)MyUnhealthyHobby]

On 2019-06-07 at 4:09 AM, FollowTheFaceless said:

I got it. I'll try again:

 

1. Melting - Ember covers herself up in flame (no self damage), converting all her ranged weapons 25/50/75/100% of damage to fire damage for 10/20/30/40 sec. Any enemy trying to hit her in melee suffers from 200/300/400/500 blast damage with 100% status effect.

Affected by duration and strength mods.

Augment - Heat - ability can be cast on allies with 20/30/40/50% of it's effectiveness. 

 

2. Accelerant - radial 7/10/13/16 m flash that stuns enemies for 1 sec and reduces their fire resistance by 25% for duration of ability. Increases all outcoming fire damage by 1.25/1.5/1.75/2.25 for 10/15/20/25 sec.

Affected by duration, range and strength mods.

Augment - Accelerator - every ally inside cast area (including Ember) gets 25% boost to reload/movement/cast speed for 2.5/5/7.5/10 sec.

 

3. Inferno - Ember melts air around herself in 5 m radius, converting all incoming ranged damage to 25/50/75/100% fire damage. Any enemy inside ability range suffers from 150/250/350/500 fire damage per sec. Duration 10/15/20/25 sec.

Affected by duration and strength mods.

Augment - unchanged.

 

4. Dancing Flames - creates a fire particles (2/4/6/8 particles) hovering around her seeking enemies in 5/10/15/20 m radius dealing 300/400/500/700 fire damage in contact and creating another 2 seeking particles active in 10 m fixed radius and dealing 50% of original damage. Enemies can be targeted multiple times. Flow ability: every particle costs 10 energy and respawns in 5/4/3/2 sec. 

Ability can be charged for additional 50% damage, double particles spawn on impact and double energy cost.  

Affected by strength, range and duration (number of particles) mods.

Augment - Hell Flies - alters impact effect, creating fire vortex that sucks.enemies inside constantly dealing 50% (75% charged) of ability damage per sec for 2/4/6/8 sec in 10 m radius.

 

Passive - permanent 30% fire resistance. Immune to fire status effect.

 

If that's one bad, then I dunno...

I applaud you for you efforts but this will actually make Ember a melee frame but no doubt it would probably work better than her current kit. Ember is a “Caster” type Fire esper that’s supposed to be a glass cannon.

The range you have for her abilities to affect enemies will get the player whacked off pretty fast.

You seem to have put a lot of thought into this so I give you an “A” for your hard work. I thank you for trying to better our Ember as well. 🙏

[(PSN)MyUnhealthyHobby]

I forgot to also state that the fourth ability you’ve made for Ember is pretty much Nova’s first ability so it would be hard to use that one. 

[FollowTheFaceless]

1 hour ago, (PS4)MyUnhealthyHobby said:

I applaud you for you efforts but this will actually make Ember a melee frame

But... 90% ranged damage resistance...

[(PSN)MyUnhealthyHobby]

58 minutes ago, FollowTheFaceless said:

But... 90% ranged damage resistance...

Lol 

[Atsia]

On 2019-06-07 at 4:09 AM, FollowTheFaceless said:

Passive - permanent 30% fire resistance. Immune to fire status effect. 

Note. DE has already said they're not doing passive elemental immunities or resistances.

[FollowTheFaceless]

4 hours ago, Atsia said:

Note. DE has already said they're not doing passive elemental immunities or resistances.

Then where is my Primed Flame Repellent?