Lua Lens discussion: What's in for those who are maxed out in all 5 trees?

[Xaero]

1 hour ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

So... Whining about something that we don't know what it does, is what you call "feedback", is it? That word doesn't mean what you think it means. 

Care to try again? 

If just voicing a concern is considered whining by you, that's your own problem. As for feedback, I was referring to negative posts about Echoes.

Edited August 27, 2019 by Ksaero

[Jarriaga]

35 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Yes we do. And it was entirely possible to max it out before they added ESO. It didn't stop them from implementing ESO, did it? Should it have? Should they revert that? 

 

Speculation, and then running around claiming that the sky is falling and what that means ≠ feedback. 

The extent of your "feedback" is "this may or may not be of use for me, I really don't know". Beyond that, the entitled part is "I don't want this, despite not knowing what it is, I want something else, and I want it right now despite not really knowing what it would be or having any consensus". 

And seriously

Listing ESO as an example doesn't help your argument. It not only added a focus farm for those who were yet to max out, but it also added incentives in the way of weapons few people had and radiant relics (Including new relics from new Prime frames and weapons; fresh every 3 months) to save you from farming void traces, . That way, even if you didn't need the focus, you could still get something out of ESO. See? Rewards for ALL!

What's the equivalent here?

Fine then. If the item is released tomorrow with no benefit to those who are maxed out, the proposals made today as speculation will suddenly turn into feedback, because having foresight is apparently not an option. And yet, somehow I am the toxic ancient here rather than those with a condescending, aggressive and dismissive attitude like yours.

I will no longer reply to you. I don't want my thread to get derailed and locked. Feel free to have the last word.

Edited August 27, 2019 by Jarriaga

[sinnae]

I don't understand if it's delusion, stubbornness or narcissism that causes players who have 100%ed the game to demand more things specifically made for them. You won the game! You literally completed every long-term farm and grind available at the moment. You're free to go play another one now.

[Jarriaga]

11 minutes ago, sinnae said:

I don't understand if it's delusion, stubbornness or narcissism that causes players who have 100%ed the game to demand more things specifically made for them. You won the game! You literally completed every long-term farm and grind available at the moment. You're free to go play another one now.

You're also being needlessly condescending, aggressive and dismissive.

Based on your post, I should go away from a game I have enjoyed so far, but has shifted in priorities so much that it feels like I'm no longer welcome.  For you in your post, there's not even a middle ground or the possibility of new things to keep me engaged when we wouldn't even be having this conversation to begin with if it wasn't because a new reward is being added for an old and forgotten system, like if you were gifted an expired coupon for cake. You can't use it even if you want to.

I will no longer reply to you either. Please feel free to have the last word if you feel like it.

[kabushack2004]

On 2019-08-26 at 7:04 PM, Jarriaga said:

While details arrive, I think it's safe to speculate its purpose based on the item type: Focus lens. This means it may yield more focus than an Eidolon Lens, or may gather focus for more than 1 school at a time. Assuming you are yet to max out your focus farm, this is a good item since it will speed-up your progress. However, what's there for players who already maxed out all 5 focus trees and unlocked all way-bound abilities?

 

what if they are tradeable
eidolon lenses are worth 80p
imagine this thing

[Jarriaga]

11 minutes ago, kabushack2004 said:

what if they are tradeable
eidolon lenses are worth 80p
imagine this thing

Trading for plat is only a saving grace when you're not constantly buying your own plat like I am. 

But the same can be said for anything tradable, like a second copy of Adaptation. It serves no direct purpose on its own by itself without involving someone else in order to discard it for something for a different item. 

Edited August 29, 2019 by Jarriaga

[Avienas]

On 2019-08-27 at 3:30 PM, sinnae said:

I don't understand if it's delusion, stubbornness or narcissism that causes players who have 100%ed the game to demand more things specifically made for them. You won the game! You literally completed every long-term farm and grind available at the moment. You're free to go play another one now.

Its the basis of how a `online service` based game tends to work. Eventually the game will become unaccessible unless D.E. decides to prove they are mother fking moses once again with what they do for warframe and decide to release the ability for the public to host thar own warframe server(s) to preserve all the hard work that was put into the game, Basically kind of like how Phantasy Star online 1 became in a sense.

TILL THEN THOUGH, a company who plans to actively keep thar game a going, should not be skipping out on releasing new content and fixing issues in the game itself, if they just release whatever the fk they want without listening to feedback, then it would just be the same as how companies like activision & EA games would cram things in games with `exciting ideas` like b.s. cash scam crap that none of the consumers would especially wanted and the only ones who did are the investors who would just get richer as whales keep dumping money in ignorantly. People will definitely not stay with a game if a company continues to make bad decisions, especially if they have other things they can enjoy which has a similar entry level, but less frustrations present.

People are free to go play another game sure, but if they have a favorite game, they would like it to have real, replayable, content that they could especially enjoy with friends, family, interacting with new players, aka the community type of content which can end up having infinite more replay ability because everyone just basically has a good time then thinking about what else they need to grind next.

Its kind of hard to declare specifically, what counts as `community type` content, since it can vary depending on the game, but i would think D.E. could get a good start on fixing issues and maybe re-design conclave into some interesting challenge fun where people could do things like K-drive racing, parkour racing, maybe make lunaro interesting, a boss rush mode, maybe even get really interesting to let players get a bunch of switches, levers and dials and can make a custom game-mode out of it to come up with some whacky challenge modes like trying to take down Vor using a Brakk while forced to constantly jump since if they stay on the floor for more then 5 seconds they get set on fire.

[_flq_K4m1k4z3]

0_0 Jarriaga you scare me! Stop, take a break, you deserve it. You have pass the game. Just do something else and come back at an other big update. You will appreciate more the game. We are at an "end", but DE continue to implanted stuff. I don't often saw some others games or developers be so active after all this years on there game, not my game, not your, but the game of DE. Sometimes I'm not happy with some changes, but I get used to it, I take the Adaption mod and let do the rest. A rarely write here, maybe because of what I read, like that, but you, I understand you, and understand the others and I think you can understand if you reflect on that. But you, I think you just need a break to appreciate the game later. You have seen what it's coming, so you know it's not the end-game. Who knows when it will end? No ones. So before you become more frustrated about what DE try to do (just you know, the lens and everything on this update didn't even come out before your post, even if you post what Reb have said) on there game, take it easy my friend! 😉

I will not reply to you either me too. Please feel free to have the last word if you feel like it. I just want goods words for you and try to "reappreciate" the game when you will feel that's the time to retry it. Remember at the start, compare this from today, it's a good example. But hey, I have fun Tenno! :)

[(XBOX)Erudite Prime]

Nothing. It's for the vast majority of people who haven't maxed out everything. 

[Jarriaga]

2 hours ago, (XB1)Erudite Prime said:

Nothing. It's for the vast majority of people who haven't maxed out everything. 

Official Stats are in. It's 3.25% affinity to focus conversion vs. 2.25% using an Eidolon lens, which means you still have to engage with ESO, Eidolon hunting, or Equinox adaro sleep build if you want focus. 

Focus you would already have with an Eidolon lens. 

I understand there are many others who are yet to max out, but this is not due to lack of tools because Eidolon lenses make you hit the daily cap. 

Edited August 30, 2019 by Jarriaga

[Darth_Predator]

10 часов назад, kabushack2004 сказал:

what if they are tradeable
eidolon lenses are worth 80p
imagine this thing

You mean those same eidolon lenses that you can also craft essentially for free if you have all needed components and willing to spend some time? If plat cost is too much, you can pay with time. It's not like eidolon lenses are only available via market.

[BloodRavenCap]

The problem is not the rewards, the problem is that we obviously lack meaningful, replayable content. What's up with the Operators? I mean, why would I even develop all the schools, if there is no point in using Operators that much, except in situations where they are mandatory? Why would I want to use an Operator if my frame already can nuke half the map and cripple the other half? 

It always have been like this. The systems are there, we just don't have enough meaningful content to play it with. Right now, all the systems are tied to rewards, that aren't really that good, because:
1) you have to repeat the same missions over, and over, and over to get exactly what you want, cause RNGesus;

2) core loop of the game isn't fun enough.

You do all the missions just to finish them as fast as you can to get rewards that don't feel really rewarding - yeah, sometimes they just make life easier for you, but really long-living games offer something beyond that - gameplay that you want to return to. Right now, the gameplay of Warframe is just means to an end - a tool to get the rewards. You kinda feel fun when you're playing, but at the same time without incentive of rewards you don't feel like playing some of the missions at all. I mean, what was the last time someone played Hijack missions?

I think DE can continue on this path for maybe four-five years max, but at some point they really have to ask themselves: "What are we doing?" They add stuff that everyone burns through in one week, max, and then complains about lack of content. It's not that we don't have anything to do. I, myself, haven't even hit 20 MR, haven't maxed the schools, haven't collected all the arcanes, haven't collected all the frames. And I don't feel like playing. Night Wave season 1 made me depressed, because you waste a lot of time for things you don't really care about and in the end, it's just a completionist syndrome that makes you do all those things. New players become vets in a matter of months, they burn through content and hit the same wall we all are living beside right now. At this point they should just burn all the old systems and remake everything from the ground up, because the problem is in the core concept of Warframe - the game itself ISN'T JUST THAT FUN. Yeah, you can play the game like one and a half hour every day and you will still hit the wall at some point. It shouldn't be like this. You do missions just to get rewards when you should do missions because you just like playing the game. That's the core problem that is directly tied to the OP's question.

Why would I even bother with maxing all the schools when there is just no point in using Operator? Why would I try the other guns when I already have the best weapons of the game maxed and formaed? Why would I bother with any of this, when there is just no meaning in playing, when I get the same crappy rewards and I just don't feel any fun? It's just busywork at some point.

And you know what I realised? This game actually rewards you MORE when you are NOT PLAYING. Just take the rework of Cetus and Quills' arcanes, take this Lua lens, take everything else. Take Night Wave 2. First, DE creates some unneccessary grind walls, then, after everyone complains, they make everything piss-easy. And, as I said, when you sink hundreds of hours into the game just for rewards that aren't even that good... AND THEN THOSE REWARDS BECOME EASIER TO GET - oooh, boy, we should really start to think about reworking the core gameplay.

Edited August 30, 2019 by BloodRavenCap