Nekros Need rework on his 1 abilities

[ChaoticEdge]

I hope the dev don't slide off nekros's 1st ability like

they still got fire in their basement by all i mean fire I mean lots of issues in the game with the warframe itself.

[Andele3025]

13 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

I hope the dev don't slide off nekros's 1st ability like

It is fine tho.
It could do more by filling the "direct damage" gap of his kit in a scaling way with % max hp damage or true damage, but it does its job.

[FoxFX]

4 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

a warframe that do bane mods?  Hmmm I think I would vote for that too.

It would make sense since the idea is that Nekros takes the souls of his target briefly empowering himself with it. In retrospect, there are a couple of other Warframes that could have Bane-like buffs into them.

[ChaoticEdge]

2 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

It is fine tho.
It could do more by filling the "direct damage" gap of his kit in a scaling way with % max hp damage or true damage, but it does its job.

oh yes like how vauban was the entire time when the dev had nerf him so bad because players hate his 1 so much during before he was nerf and now they nerf him so bad they didn't want to touch him during that time.  Like they nerf Nyx how OP she was that she use to be a nuke with her 4 and now it certain uses using now.  Just like how WUKONG HOW MUCH HE IS A MEME THAT MONKEY DOES NOT GIVE A *long length censorship by moderator*

Then there is that time they nerf EMBER how bad HER ABILITIES WAS for the Dev refuse to change it for almost the same thing as VAUBAN!  I am not having this same issues and where Nekros's 1 ability will forever remain a meme for No, no more meme!

[ChaoticEdge]

3 hours ago, FoxFX said:

It would make sense since the idea is that Nekros takes the souls of his target briefly empowering himself with it. In retrospect, there are a couple of other Warframes that could have Bane-like buffs into them.

hmmm funny I barely see them...oh well I think Nekros would take that make him more valuable increase that he doesn't end up in the his punch to be meme and apologized for late replies.  As you know terrible flashback someone give.

[Andele3025]

7 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

oh yes like how vauban was the entire time when the dev had nerf him so bad because players hate his 1 so much during before he was nerf and now they nerf him so bad they didn't want to touch him during that time.  Like they nerf Nyx how OP she was that she use to be a nuke with her 4 and now it certain uses using now.  Just like how WUKONG HOW MUCH HE IS A MEME THAT MONKEY DOES NOT GIVE A *long length censorship by moderator*

Then there is that time they nerf EMBER how bad HER ABILITIES WAS for the Dev refuse to change it for almost the same thing as VAUBAN!  I am not having this same issues and where Nekros's 1 ability will forever remain a meme for No, no more meme!

No, his 1 being the weakest part of his kit is much like how 3 is the weakest part of wisps kit or charge of rhinos.
Its in a very good place already, it could be better if it perhaps did true damage or even % max hp damage. Any change to the non-damage size of performance would make nekros worse. Its not even a meme ability just ok single target CC that for no reason doesnt have a explanation that using it from lower elevation it results in a knocks down while from higher elevation or if the soul impacts a surface within a second it results in a very strong knockback.

[ChaoticEdge]

9 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

No, his 1 being the weakest part of his kit is much like how 3 is the weakest part of wisps kit or charge of rhinos.
Its in a very good place already, it could be better if it perhaps did true damage or even % max hp damage. Any change to the non-damage size of performance would make nekros worse. Its not even a meme ability just ok single target CC that for no reason doesnt have a explanation that using it from lower elevation it results in a knocks down while from higher elevation or if the soul impacts a surface within a second it results in a very strong knockback.

was it Nidus had his 1 ability the weakest yet that prove more powerful and true dmg as for Rhino for his charge did well thanks to another mod that transform it better unlike nekros for he is just being the team medic but the version of nerf of overwatch's healer for I mean all their healer.  As for that even thou you use strengthing mods on Nekros for who want to do that for leaving nekros flimsy as thin glass for cannon cannot fired or either the mixing the other mods with it for it doesn't save it all the time for we are "LIMITED IN MODS SLOTS" the performance of other frames does has higher better perks and having Nekros is just joke of meme doesn't present any back up.

As again his 1 was never was "ATTENDED" for I believed the dev was rush work with his abilities with his 1 because probably they had someone split drinks or either they forgot about it what it was so they probably improvised it.  At the time being this doesn't make it so great or either help the team for it is better to actually take over a dead body just punching it like how Inaro does while he is eating his victim for I find it more useful then just punching something and go ragdoll as the ability doesn't work on bosses or able target them at all the one that are "Special".  I proven with the bugs if you hit the target they went flying outside the park area which I done this with rhino for his ragdoll power actually send enemies flying across the ocean and yes I have to show it and reported that bug but ever sense they "ignore me more then so many time" I have to be the one be a d##! to actually put it how bad abuse ragdoll is by sending capture target out the map for making mission failure (note I didn't did it alot for I only did it minimized few).  So no thanks again, for I will ragdoll all the enemies out the map in exterminate in Cetus's bounty and sending every single enemies I spot which Nekros's ability in range is really high for I can send them off the map and players will not complete exterminate in the bounty.

So put your "everything is fine" away for it isn't fine for I will troll you and have to actually making your goal of being not accomplish your goal of "meme" for I am start to had it.  I will have to put another example terrible idea to have over powerful ragdoll and I can aim with this 1 button to push the enemies far away that players can't see it.

[MasterBurik]

37 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

So put your "everything is fine" away for it isn't fine for I will troll you and have to actually making your goal of being not accomplish your goal of "meme" for I am start to had it.  I will have to put another example terrible idea to have over powerful ragdoll and I can aim with this 1 button to push the enemies far away that players can't see it.

We don't negotiate with terrorists.

[ChaoticEdge]

1 hour ago, MasterBurik said:

We don't negotiate with terrorists.

  Sorry you don't belong to hidden group for just bunch gangster hiding in the back ally in your department. In fact I pointed out Nekros can be trolly frame I can do lots of BS and this is why I demanded to change because someone in the group has the brain of troll that actually will grief players and I didn't say I am commit to keep on doing trolls for I only did it minor few here and there to make a statement or a point because what I just say

 

2 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

yes I have to show it and reported that bug but ever sense they "ignore me more then so many time" I have to be the one be a d##! to actually put it how bad abuse ragdoll is by sending capture target out the map for making mission failure (note I didn't did it alot for I only did it minimized few)

like always DE "IGNORE ME TOO MANY TIME" too many time during that time and I am shouting out my lungs at them "this is going be trolly, ppl can abuse this, ppl will grief this" so many time I shouted they deiced close the door in my face and I have to actually see this as a problem.  I hate to do it in action but if they ignore this too long, I'll have no chose either get someone who I know to start trolling again to actually make a point.

[Leqesai]

FWIW Soul Punch should straight up OHKO any enemy and convert them into a spirit thrall. 

It should only hit one enemy and the thrall (ghost/soul of an enemy) should be invulnerable for a set duration. Soul punch used again while you have a spirit thrall causes it to explode for a % of damage dealt to it (converted into cold damage) in an AOE (not affected by walls or LOS). The ability would be affected by power strength (conversion percent), range (explosion range) and duration (duration of spirit thrall).

Base duration of 10s with a base range of 5m and base damage of 2x damage absorbed.

There you go. Now his 1 is useful without being OP.

 

[Andele3025]

9 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

was it Nidus had his 1 ability the weakest yet that prove more powerful and true dmg as for Rhino for his charge did well thanks to another mod that transform it better unlike nekros for he is just being the team medic but the version of nerf of overwatch's healer for I mean all their healer.  As for that even thou you use strengthing mods on Nekros for who want to do that for leaving nekros flimsy as thin glass for cannon cannot fired or either the mixing the other mods with it for it doesn't save it all the time for we are "LIMITED IN MODS SLOTS" the performance of other frames does has higher better perks and having Nekros is just joke of meme doesn't present any back up.

Nidus 1 stacks with his passive. Rhino charge deals impact with blast procs.
And no, you build nekros for strength either way thus a % damage skil ala revenant for 1 would perfectly fix the gap without DE having to fiddle to extreme amounts with the shadows which are already extremely effective decoy/health transfer sacs.

And hard cc isnt a meme ability, hell even the yeet isnt a meme as its a instant kill.

9 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

As again his 1 was never was "ATTENDED" for I believed the dev was rush work with his abilities with his 1 because probably they had someone split drinks or either they forgot about it what it was so they probably improvised it.  At the time being this doesn't make it so great or either help the team for it is better to actually take over a dead body just punching it like how Inaro does while he is eating his victim for I find it more useful then just punching something and go ragdoll as the ability doesn't work on bosses or able target them at all the one that are "Special". 

Except its not true, it works on all enemies as a ragdoll/stagger attempt that dont have invul on body except for body parts or are flat out impossible to stagger-ragdoll escalate.
Before melee stances being peppered with impact procs (and loads of animation locks) it was among the easiest abilities to spam to keep a bursa open

9 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

I proven with the bugs if you hit the target they went flying outside the park area which I done this with rhino for his ragdoll power actually send enemies flying across the ocean and yes I have to show it and reported that bug but ever sense they "ignore me more then so many time"

A enemy being ragdolled by a ability half of whose main feature is that it ragdolls isnt a bug.

9 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

I have to be the one be a d##! to actually put it how bad abuse ragdoll is by sending capture target out the map for making mission failure (note I didn't did it alot for I only did it minimized few).

No it doesnt, Capture targets reset upon falling out of bounds, have done so reliably since hydro got added to plains of eidolon.

9 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

  So no thanks again, for I will ragdoll all the enemies out the map in exterminate in Cetus's bounty and sending every single enemies I spot which Nekros's ability in range is really high for I can send them off the map and players will not complete exterminate in the bounty.

Yes you will, you can still shoot the enemy with a PT weapon or just go AW for succ (or even simpler, move 4 zone tiles till "mission failure" is at 20 and move back in to spawn move enemies (aka same tactic reliably used for survival mission packing/not leaving enemies in paused state).

9 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

So put your "everything is fine" away for it isn't fine for I will troll you and have to actually making your goal of being not accomplish your goal of "meme" for I am start to had it.  I will have to put another example terrible idea to have over powerful ragdoll and I can aim with this 1 button to push the enemies far away that players can't see it.

No, all just indicates you dont know how the skill works.

 

3 hours ago, Leqesai said:

FWIW Soul Punch should straight up OHKO any enemy and convert them into a spirit thrall. 

1shot without high cost is bad design for sustainability.

3 hours ago, Leqesai said:

It should only hit one enemy and the thrall (ghost/soul of an enemy) should be invulnerable for a set duration. Soul punch used again while you have a spirit thrall causes it to explode for a % of damage dealt to it (converted into cold damage) in an AOE (not affected by walls or LOS). The ability would be affected by power strength (conversion percent), range (explosion range) and duration (duration of spirit thrall).

 

Blowing up your shadows shouldnt be encouraged as it means DE just has a excuse not to give Nekros a spawn priority table the players could organize just as octavia got her mandachord. If you mean EXTRA minions, performance issues with too many minions spawned constantly was part of what DE tried to avoid when they made nekros actually play the game.

[Leqesai]

3 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

1shot without high cost is bad design for sustainability.

Blowing up your shadows shouldnt be encouraged as it means DE just has a excuse not to give Nekros a spawn priority table the players could organize just as octavia got her mandachord. If you mean EXTRA minions, performance issues with too many minions spawned constantly was part of what DE tried to avoid when they made nekros actually play the game.

You do not understand my suggestion.

The 1 is basically a conversion ability. It kills a target (one target at a time, no AOE) but then spawns a single additional ghost thrall.

And I am not saying "blowing up your shadows" Please read my post carefully before responding...

I am saying blowing up the single ghost thrall generated by your 1. It is a two-step process for causing a burst of damage.
Think of it like this:
Target enemy, use 1 to kill it. Enemy becomes ghost thrall. Trying to kill another enemy with your 1 instead causes the ghost to explode dealing AOE damage. Using your 1 again after the thrall is dead allows you to kill another enemy. If you think "1shot without high cost..." is what I'm saying then you are very confused. 25 energy for one kill is not cheap. Especially when you have to cast it once to kill and again to blow up a thrall before you can kill again (I wasn't even considering the energy cost of the blowing up of a thrall. At 0 energy cost this is still not cheap).

This in no way unbalances the gameplay and in no way encourages any kind of relationship to this weird comparison you're drawing between Nekros and Octavia (what are you even talking about...). Maybe if Warframe wasn't Warframe, and you were killing only 10 enemies per match, but when you're killing tons of enemies a single OHKO move is hardly game breaking. I mean, Ash had this functionality for years until they nerved covert lethality. It was nowhere near gamebreaking.

And it isn't "extra minions" it is one additional minion. This is hardly going to impact performance. I've played in matches with full specter loadout, nekros with his minions and ghosts from weapon abilities and there are no significant performance hits. You need to understand what minions are. They are essentially npcs... Have you seen how many npcs are spawned in matches? They wouldn't add weapons that create ghost effects if they were seriously afraid that these temporary minions would negatively impact performance.

 

[Andele3025]

4 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

You do not understand my suggestion.

I very much did and why i said nope unconditional instant kill without investment is bad design no matter if its cost is 50 energy across 2 presses instead of 1 press.

4 minutes ago, Leqesai said:

And it isn't "extra minions" it is one additional minion. This is hardly going to impact performance. I've played in matches with full specter loadout, nekros with his minions and ghosts from weapon abilities and there are no significant performance hits. You need to understand what minions are. They are essentially npcs... Have you seen how many npcs are spawned in matches? They wouldn't add weapons that create ghost effects if they were seriously afraid that these temporary minions would negatively impact performance.

Except it was literally the concern when nekros got reworked and is the reason why console spawn rates are much lower (even on steel path) vs PC (which sucks for them but w/e).
Hell its why the game takes paused enemies more than 2 tiles away and moves them to your next room if you cycle to enemy respawn timer with enough of em.

[Leqesai]

5 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

I very much did and why i said nope unconditional instant kill without investment is bad design no matter if its cost is 50 energy across 2 presses instead of 1 press.

Except it was literally the concern when nekros got reworked and is the reason why console spawn rates are much lower (even on steel path) vs PC (which sucks for them but w/e).
Hell its why the game takes paused enemies more than 2 tiles away and moves them to your next room if you cycle to enemy respawn timer with enough of em.

This is incorrect. This has been happening on all mission types regardless of how many entities are spawned. It has to do with Warframe's poor matchmaking.

If you remember back to when Warframe was getting ported to Switch, they brought in some outside people who looked at the code and fixed tons of issues with the game. Issues not related to Nekros or his minions but issues that generally led to Warframe being much more stable (ever since then the performance on lower end machines has been much more manageable, so matchmaking has improved).

 

And also, lets just agree to disagree about my change to Soul Punch.

[Andele3025]

Just now, Leqesai said:

This is incorrect. This has been happening on all mission types regardless of how many entities are spawned. It has to do with Warframe's poor matchmaking.

Nope, was literally stated on stream yee ago when talking about if nekros took up spawn slots, its there to make sure the game doesnt have too many paused entities if you left some behind.

Just now, Leqesai said:

And also, lets just agree to disagree about my change to Soul Punch.

No, it just doesnt do anything to either fill the kit gap (scaling damage) nor health of his game loop (or game in general, i mean look at rev 3, its now hardcapped vs specific enemies exactly because it had such a effect only you're suggesting a cheaper and no build cost version).

[ChaoticEdge]

8 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

Nidus 1 stacks with his passive. Rhino charge deals impact with blast procs.
And no, you build nekros for strength either way thus a % damage skil ala revenant for 1 would perfectly fix the gap without DE having to fiddle to extreme amounts with the shadows which are already extremely effective decoy/health transfer sacs.

And hard cc isnt a meme ability, hell even the yeet isnt a meme as its a instant kill.

and no one want build a glass cannon build and blast enemies one of the time each as they have to press 1 button to spam it for NO ONE IS WILLING TO DO SO as again no one going make Nekros with glass cannon build and yes it is a meme a pretty useless meme if you look up which type of meme it is the one with the cricket sound.

8 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

Except its not true, it works on all enemies as a ragdoll/stagger attempt that dont have invul on body except for body parts or are flat out impossible to stagger-ragdoll escalate.
Before melee stances being peppered with impact procs (and loads of animation locks) it was among the easiest abilities to spam to keep a bursa open

Do you want to bet?  Yes I know the ragdoll does not effect all enemies which I said it already the special doesn't get ragdoll which that is capture and assassination one which means cetus's bounty on assassination is not to be ragdoll across the map.  Yet I can yeet these grineer across the map with Nekros by using corrupted mods to weak the strength even further which because I CAN, for I can aim ragdoll still no matter how far they are it is called "SPAM THE BUTTON 1" for I done it so many time for I did it for the KICKS for punt joke.

8 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

A enemy being ragdolled by a ability half of whose main feature is that it ragdolls isnt a bug

as again I didn't say it is a bug but a bug that can be cause by players to send out enemies before they got update that why did the capture target was sent flying across the map into the ocean water (I only did this by accident in experiment during that time and came across it)

8 hours ago, Andele3025 said:

No, all just indicates you dont know how the skill works.

I do know how it works it just you don't understand the level behind it around it.  Think as tree branch that has good and bad in these branches for the extension is unlimited by this joke of Nekros's ability for as again I could send enemies out the map depending if I have super long range which I could build it and just focus on long range hitting to push them out.  As to be I could make the defense mission a failure as in abort, for I can force an enemy to glitch in the map and if they don't have Sryan or any AoE attacker that attack though walls basically I'll pretend like an idiot who don't know what is going on but I really do know what is going on.  Yes they HADN'T Fix that bug about enemies going though walls when abilities when in uses with Nekros's soul punch.

This time I am trying not to troll when I am really fed up and had it but is it worth it to do so all the time? No, minor here and there until to the point you have to actually have to make a point to show that "how bad abuse can be used in the game".  As again I am not benefit myself for I could of stay quite and abuse the abilities and let my teammate nothing to know about it long ago even the rhino for I could of kept quite and ragdoll enemies out of boundary and just bully players that way but no I am only drawing to the point of "whoops my bad pressing the 1 button for my finger is just thick accidentally pressing it" for I only do it when I mean it if I meet toxic players who actually think they hot stuff then that is why I did it during the time while they didn't had patch for capture target because meeting those guys who is toxic for it is better let them "fetch".  As again I am not going step down my foot to grief new players or average,pro, and veterans players alike unless I have to make a point to actually let the communities see this abilities need to be change.  For Vauban's club had to put cries out to DE so many time, Ember club did the same thing even the other frames does the same thing for how long it took DE realized to actually change them?  More then 4 years and Vauban was the longest then any frame.

As again Nekros was pose to be under "rework" but everyone forgotten about him and no one realized that how forget-able he is when he is actually the farm frame that no one care about and act like he never existed in the 1st place for everyone think he is normal farmer just there taking care his property with his double barrel shotgun.  As again this is pretty much sum it up that Nekros was to "CARE LESS" on the who like who or rather use frame.

[Andele3025]

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

and no one want build a glass cannon build and blast enemies one of the time each as they have to press 1 button to spam it for NO ONE IS WILLING TO DO SO as again no one going make Nekros with glass cannon build and yes it is a meme a pretty useless meme if you look up which type of meme it is the one with the cricket sound.

What glass cannon? Nekros tanking and survival power increases with strength. Have you ever even played bone daddy?

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

Do you want to bet?  Yes I know the ragdoll does not effect all enemies which I said it already the special doesn't get ragdoll which that is capture and assassination one which means cetus's bounty on assassination is not to be ragdoll across the map.  Yet I can yeet these grineer across the map with Nekros by using corrupted mods to weak the strength even further which because I CAN, for I can aim ragdoll still no matter how far they are it is called "SPAM THE BUTTON 1" for I done it so many time for I did it for the KICKS for punt joke.

Because ragdoll isnt related to power strength, why would it when the ability deals damage. Its like trying to argue to make knockdowns scale with power strength. If you dont want to yeet, dont angle the cast from a higher elevation or when the enemy is right infront of a wall.

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

as again I didn't say it is a bug but a bug that can be cause by players to send out enemies before they got update that why did the capture target was sent flying across the map into the ocean water (I only did this by accident in experiment during that time and came across it)

And they respawn on the closest walkable block nearest their last pathing line point (its in fact something one can abuse in steel path disruption with ash).

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

I do know how it works it just you don't understand the level behind it around it. 

Nope, you very much demonstrated that you dont. And its damage is indeed lacking as you go higher in levels which is why the other suggestions of % or true damage (or both) are solid fixes.

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

 As to be I could make the defense mission a failure as in abort

You cant because enemies outside of pathable terrain that arent flagged as mission relevant despawn after 6-10 seconds of being in a ragdolled or unpathable state. As every nekros player should know.

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

let the communities see this abilities need to be change

Except they dont and you're talking from a plain lack of knowledge of the ability and game mechanics.

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

As again Nekros was pose to be under "rework" but everyone forgotten about him

Didnt because he is well designed and working. His augments were forgotten as they are a relic of a age when power came at a higher cost (and creeping terrify was stealth nerfed for no reason with slow/paused changes) and he lacks in kit damage scaling (which % damage or true damage on 1 very much could/would fix), but thats not even a problem.

47 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

normal farmer just there taking care his property with his double barrel shotgun.

100k+ EHP resource looping loot tank and slash melee. Shotties are extremely inefficient at corpse cutting while keeping up kill speed as it would require you to intentionally bodyshot and not rely on status options of primaries/hm.

Also with your apparent focus on range for some forsaken reason, lemme just drop a hint of unless you're doing stuff like arena endo farms (or anything with low max spawns), over 150~160 range is inefficient due to desecrate rate (or 110%~120% on steel path spawn rates).

[ChaoticEdge]

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

What glass cannon? Nekros tanking and survival power increases with strength. Have you ever even played bone daddy?

there is tons of chose sacrafices even you have shadow of dead mod on it it doesn't mean your strength mod will actually help you punching each the enemies that there is for players will see it as a waste and never even "use it" what is being used a lot is terrified ability and that is more useful then his 1 ability.  You hadn't even guess why I make list of complain about it for I play him long enough on day 1 he came out for he does not have the backbone for his punches for he rely on weapons and his 1 is a knock knock joke.

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

Because ragdoll isnt related to power strength, why would it when the ability deals damage. Its like trying to argue to make knockdowns scale with power strength. If you dont want to yeet, dont angle the cast from a higher elevation or when the enemy is right infront of a wall.

you know they go though walls if you spam it enough on single target.

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

And they respawn on the closest walkable block nearest their last pathing line point (its in fact something one can abuse in steel path disruption with ash).

Do you know how much such little but really I actually made players walk further beyond boundary and they don't really walk back because there is a actual bug that break the AI to actually path back where it is going at just like how energy leecher get stuck under the stair case for the pathing error is broken which for me I dunno how I did it but I just kept on punching it non stop for the sense of logic is broken within

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

Nope, you very much demonstrated that you dont. And its damage is indeed lacking as you go higher in levels which is why the other suggestions of % or true damage (or both) are solid fixes.

faults it isn't solid fixes, nekros strength can be dull down by corrupted mods if you had forgot which I can spam it and not kill the target but force it to the point the enemy cannot be touch by players even their archwings can't even reach them in time which if you leave the mission bubble it will consider as mission failure in cetus's bounty for there cannot be more then 1 or 2 players leaving because it is lock by stupid rules.

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

You cant because enemies outside of pathable terrain that arent flagged as mission relevant despawn after 6-10 seconds of being in a ragdolled or unpathable state. As every nekros player should know.

that is the point Nekros can force enemy AI despawn and he is faster then players can aim unless they aren't using Mesa to fire all the direction or syran or other frame that can target ragdoll frame but this can make mission fail by over extending the time limits.  Keep this in mind by forcing AI to be killed take limbo example for he could do the same thing using his 1 ability to all the enemy AI and players cannot even shoot it or harm it for Limbo could have massive duration and massive range as he is using corrupted mods to get negative in strength he could easily troll all the players at once as he could make mission failure.

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

Except they dont and you're talking from a plain lack of knowledge of the ability and game mechanics.

I understand the mechanics it just that you have no knowledge about what players does if they start trolling new players or average players for the troller always look for good loop to have fun and joke around as they step beyond boundary of trolling

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

Didnt because he is well designed and working. His augments were forgotten as they are a relic of a age when power came at a higher cost (and creeping terrify was stealth nerfed for no reason with slow/paused changes) and he lacks in kit damage scaling (which % damage or true damage on 1 very much could/would fix), but thats not even a problem.

that was the point they doing this abuse like vauban was and yes he is the next beating useless frame who is force to be forgotten which the hype for him wasn't great and no one even care for him for they only look at him another farming frame that is actually in the trash can as the dev genitally put him in there.

1 hour ago, Andele3025 said:

100k+ EHP resource looping loot tank and slash melee. Shotties are extremely inefficient at corpse cutting while keeping up kill speed as it would require you to intentionally bodyshot and not rely on status options of primaries/hm.

Also with your apparent focus on range for some forsaken reason, lemme just drop a hint of unless you're doing stuff like arena endo farms (or anything with low max spawns), over 150~160 range is inefficient due to desecrate rate (or 110%~120% on steel path spawn rates).

that why he is only meant farming frame and never tooken seriously of his farming skills.  As again his 1 ability is the far worst during the time of Vauban's old 1 how badly it was nerf.  As again no one even use his 1 not even uses for an excuses to actually use it.  He is the guy who sit there and doing farming the crops and cry to sleep because no one want give nekros's 1 ability for a go and never be used it again.

The only chance the new players who used him thought it was cool but until they realized how bad it was they will refused even using his 1 ability for they more likely go after 2-4 abilities and never again even touch it.  That is where the sad part come in as while nekros cry to sleep that his soul punch never will be used again for the value of his soul punch is actually in the garbage.  Note that lots players still talk trash about nekros still and still shun by communities even today.  Nekros fan don't want talk about his 1 abilities for they want keep his 2-4 and they don't want say they even use his 1 for everything.  I only end up his 1 ability for giggle and $##! if I am bored enough to do so.

As again grabbing the graph from dev's video from 2018

Spoiler

 

the link for it on time the average player who actually use nekros prime is actually in 13th place but it is actually where we should question is where is the regular nekros is at?  It is not listed in there because the fact it isn't the dev forgot about it for it just not been used a lot for the players reply on special shiny new prime nekros for they really don't care because it is just farmer frame just farm stuff.  Players are never fund type for nekros for they only focus desecrate, terrified and shadow of the dead and that was it and never touching that 1 button ever again.  What is really worst is trinity prime and regular one has the same issues and they got fan ppl backing her up a lot and saying "Never change her".

[Andele3025]

1 hour ago, ChaoticEdge said:

there is tons of chose sacrafices even you have shadow of dead mod on it it doesn't mean your strength mod will actually help you punching each the enemies that there is for players will see it as a waste and never even "use it" what is being used a lot is terrified ability and that is more useful then his 1 ability.  You hadn't even guess why I make list of complain about it for I play him long enough on day 1 he came out for he does not have the backbone for his punches for he rely on weapons and his 1 is a knock knock joke.

There are no sacrifices to build Blind rage+int. Turning 1 into % damage or true damage would mean 1 use as other than cc/energy dump at higher levels would increase and most frames rely on their weapons. He is more than tanky enough to compete tho.

Quote

you know they go though walls if you spam it enough on single target.

Except thats not true as the soul bounces off surfaces and bases the ragdoll/cc strength on it.

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Do you know how much such little but really I actually made players walk further beyond boundary and they don't really walk back because there is a actual bug that break the AI to actually path back where it is going at just like how energy leecher get stuck under the stair case for the pathing error is broken which for me I dunno how I did it but I just kept on punching it non stop for the sense of logic is broken within

No. Just move enough tile sections for paused enemies to be teleported along with new spawns. Enemies getting stuck in pathable and damageable areas but too bugged in pathing to get out.

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mission bubble it will consider as mission failure in cetus's bounty for there cannot be more then 1 or 2 players leaving because it is lock by stupid rules.

Stop ignoring how mechanics work, mission leave is on a timer which even resets every time you re-enter. Even without old itzal blink which let you go past the entire map twice without failing you can still pass 3-4 spawn zones to reset the enemies (much like how thumper farming works).

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Keep this in mind by forcing AI to be killed take limbo example for he could do the same thing using his 1 ability to all the enemy AI and players cannot even shoot it or harm it for Limbo could have massive duration and massive range as he is using corrupted mods to get negative in strength he could easily troll all the players at once as he could make mission failure.

Except thats not true as limbo 1 has a duration and enemies in unpathable zones stuck in ragdoll are killed (and even give global affinity). There is literally 0 actual troll potential (other than 4 draining energy of oberons).

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I understand the mechanics it just that you have no knowledge about what players does if they start trolling new players or average players for the troller always look for good loop to have fun and joke around as they step beyond boundary of trolling

Then why are you ignoring them.

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tThe only chance the new players who used him thought it was cool but until they realized how bad it was they will refused even using his 1 ability for they more likely go after 2-4 abilities and never again even touch it.  That is where the sad part come in as while nekros cry to sleep that his soul punch never will be used again for the value of his soul punch is actually in the garbage.  Note that lots players still talk trash about nekros still and still shun by communities even today.  Nekros fan don't want talk about his 1 abilities for they want keep his 2-4 and they don't want say they even use his 1 for everything.  I only end up his 1 ability for giggle and $##! if I am bored enough to do so.

As again grabbing the graph from dev's video from 2018

No, ignorance isnt a excuse and most of all again no, he is loot papa and is literally seen as a A to S tier frame depending on regular or endurance survival gameplay and even without extra loot he has extremely good ehp with a self sustaining loop.

Quote

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the link for it on time the average player who actually use nekros prime is actually in 13th place but it is actually where we should question is where is the regular nekros is at?  It is not listed in there because the fact it isn't the dev forgot about it for it just not been used a lot for the players reply on special shiny new prime nekros for they really don't care because it is just farmer frame just farm stuff.  Players are never fund type for nekros for they only focus desecrate, terrified and shadow of the dead and that was it and never touching that 1 button ever again.  What is really worst is trinity prime and regular one has the same issues and they got fan ppl backing her up a lot and saying "Never change her".

Regular version of a frame (except excal and frames without primes) quite literally doesnt matter when it comes to % stats unless you're looking at what frame to unvault next. PS regular nekros is 43rd on the list you can see it to the left on the video itself. Argument based on ignorance isnt a argument.

[ChaoticEdge]

5 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

There are no sacrifices to build Blind rage+int. Turning 1 into % damage or true damage would mean 1 use as other than cc/energy dump at higher levels would increase and most frames rely on their weapons. He is more than tanky enough to compete tho.

that is a sacrifices, but your limited by mods for there is only 8 slots and having exlius and aura are different from one another and it slap down by stregnth for it is common for players to do so but it still put him as glass cannon for leecher always get stuck in stair case or somewhere else for good gosh who know where they are but now the things are changing and being more hassle again and try wiggle that one out even thou you have adaption mod on.

8 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

Except thats not true as the soul bounces off surfaces and bases the ragdoll/cc strength on it.

corruption mods, negative strength

that how you start forcing enemy AI off the map enough with pure range abilities and you don't have to focus on any strength for it can be used as troll abilities like how vauban was shocking the enemies across the map before his nerf.

13 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

No. Just move enough tile sections for paused enemies to be teleported along with new spawns. Enemies getting stuck in pathable and damageable areas but too bugged in pathing to get out.

that is the goal that why nekros's ability is trolly like vauban except for grief has been met.

14 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

Stop ignoring how mechanics work, mission leave is on a timer which even resets every time you re-enter. Even without old itzal blink which let you go past the entire map twice without failing you can still pass 3-4 spawn zones to reset the enemies (much like how thumper farming works).

I am not ignoring the mechanics work for I am pointing the flaw issues the same time which even thou you re-enter it doesn't mean that archwings has blink it doesn't reach them in time because either the enemies get ragdoll into the ground which I had seen enemies in the ground which also another rare bugs goes on and fun fact you can make them disappeared without killing them for the game can force weridly submerge enemies in the ground and still in the circle.  I do not know they fix it or not but if they didn't it then they aren't despawning then.

17 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

Then why are you ignoring them.

 

17 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

No, ignorance isnt a excuse and most of all again no, he is loot papa and is literally seen as a A to S tier frame depending on regular or endurance survival gameplay and even without extra loot he has extremely good ehp with a self sustaining loop.

are you death in the ar for yes I know he is looter why do you think I only say he is just farmer, stop putting that bucket over your head because clean out that eye of yours which abilities is being used more over in nekros?  Do you see everyone punching things out with nekros's 1?  Anyone? do you still do it on every enemies?  Do you spam it? stop yourself looping back to the point "oh he is looter for he is grand papa" we are not talking about that for we all know he is great farmer.  His effort of his 1 is absolutely trash just like how vauban's bounce was because players want keep that damn troll abilities to bully players and super lazy bottom of the can to "BLOCK DOORS" we are not having nekros standing in front he door using his 1 ability spamming it.

21 minutes ago, Andele3025 said:

Regular version of a frame (except excal and frames without primes) quite literally doesnt matter when it comes to % stats unless you're looking at what frame to unvault next. PS regular nekros is 43rd on the list you can see it to the left on the video itself. Argument based on ignorance isnt a argument.

I think your looking at the wrong look about it again unless that stupid record spot misread again on somewhere your not pose to be at then pretty much it is where players who use what but like always players do not use regular nekros and prime still for rarely players even pull that unless they are running low on endo but we got arbitration for plenty enough for me or the players play that arena fight thing farm endo but hardly nekros only use his ability on his 3 and never bother with his other abilities which players will join in and use their own abilities to group up enemies.  your not even talking about those we are talking about his 1 ABILITIES HOW MUCH IT IS ACTUAL TRASH! For claiming "its help" but really it doesn't for what it provide for players is just banana.

So, Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo.  If you think that is incorrect grammar but it is correct grammar. That is how I sum it up for Nekros's ability 1 is.

[Andele3025]

Just now, ChaoticEdge said:

that is a sacrifices, but your limited by mods for there is only 8 slots and having exlius and aura are different from one another and it slap down by stregnth for it is common for players to do so but it still put him as glass cannon for leecher always get stuck in stair case or somewhere else for good gosh who know where they are but now the things are changing and being more hassle again and try wiggle that one out even thou you have adaption mod on.

No its not because nothing else is relevant. Going over 160 (or 120 for SP) range doesnt do anything due to desecrate timer. Also over 100k ehp is literally the opposite of glass cannon and if you want to leech/afk in a mission its on you, regular people use weapons.

Just now, ChaoticEdge said:

that how you start forcing enemy AI off the map enough with pure range abilities and you don't have to focus on any strength for it can be used as troll abilities like how vauban was shocking the enemies across the map before his nerf.

Range doesnt effect yeet of soul punch much like strength doesnt, its not a moddable stat. Ignorance isnt a argument.

Just now, ChaoticEdge said:

that is the goal that why nekros's ability is trolly like vauban except for grief has been met.

Proof other than assertion from ignorance?

Just now, ChaoticEdge said:

I am not ignoring the mechanics work for I am pointing the flaw issues the same time which even thou you re-enter it doesn't mean that archwings has blink it doesn't reach them in time because either the enemies get ragdoll into the ground which I had seen enemies in the ground which also another rare bugs goes on and fun fact you can make them disappeared without killing them for the game can force weridly submerge enemies in the ground and still in the circle.  I do not know they fix it or not but if they didn't it then they aren't despawning then.

its 20s. In that time a in AW you can comfy reach from mountain base to sea and back.

Just now, ChaoticEdge said:

are you death in the ar for yes I know he is looter why do you think I only say he is just farmer, stop putting that bucket over your head because clean out that eye of yours which abilities is being used more over in nekros?  Do you see everyone punching things out with nekros's 1?  Anyone? do you still do it on every enemies?  Do you spam it? stop yourself looping back to the point "oh he is looter for he is grand papa" we are not talking about that for we all know he is great farmer.  His effort of his 1 is absolutely trash just like how vauban's bounce was because players want keep that damn troll abilities to bully players and super lazy bottom of the can to "BLOCK DOORS" we are not having nekros standing in front he door using his 1 ability spamming it.

Ignorance isnt a argument. And yes i do see people using SP, because its a 1h upper body animation with the fastest cast and also being a cc thus fills the role of both targetting ancients n dangerous eximi types while being a energy dump for resource loop and triggering shield generation.
You dont spam it because you shouldnt spam abilities pointlessly. Even garuda doesnt spam her 1 and nidus has a literal animation cap on his 1 too to discourage mindless stomps over effective double waves.

And no bounce isnt not will ever have any comparison to soul punch or any ability that cant move allies.

Just now, ChaoticEdge said:

I think your looking at the wrong look about it again unless that stupid record spot misread again on somewhere your not pose to be at then pretty much it is where players who use what but like always players do not use regular nekros and prime still for rarely players even pull that unless they are running low on endo but we got arbitration for plenty enough for me or the players play that arena fight thing farm endo but hardly nekros only use his ability on his 3 and never bother with his other abilities which players will join in and use their own abilities to group up enemies.  your not even talking about those we are talking about his 1 ABILITIES HOW MUCH IT IS ACTUAL TRASH! For claiming "its help" but really it doesn't for what it provide for players is just banana. So, Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo.  If you think that is incorrect grammar but it is correct grammar. That is how I sum it up for Nekros's ability 1 is.

So you admit you have no argument and no knowledge of his kit, are suggesting nerfs out of ignorance and dont care about actual feedback of "if anything changes, it should just be letting him damage scale within kit with true and/or low % damage".

 

[ChaoticEdge]

Just now, Andele3025 said:

No its not because nothing else is relevant. Going over 160 (or 120 for SP) range doesnt do anything due to desecrate timer. Also over 100k ehp is literally the opposite of glass cannon and if you want to leech/afk in a mission its on you, regular people use weapons.

Range doesnt effect yeet of soul punch much like strength doesnt, its not a moddable stat. Ignorance isnt a argument.

Proof other than assertion from ignorance?

its 20s. In that time a in AW you can comfy reach from mountain base to sea and back.

Ignorance isnt a argument. And yes i do see people using SP, because its a 1h upper body animation with the fastest cast and also being a cc thus fills the role of both targetting ancients n dangerous eximi types while being a energy dump for resource loop and triggering shield generation.
You dont spam it because you shouldnt spam abilities pointlessly. Even garuda doesnt spam her 1 and nidus has a literal animation cap on his 1 too to discourage mindless stomps over effective double waves.

And no bounce isnt not will ever have any comparison to soul punch or any ability that cant move allies.

So you admit you have no argument and no knowledge of his kit, are suggesting nerfs out of ignorance and dont care about actual feedback of "if anything changes, it should just be letting him damage scale within kit with true and/or low % damage".

 

your the person who is laid back and not discovering much about it like the example someone discover how to escape Uranus's map.  Basically you also have no knowledge itself about it how I can troll it and I am not trying to be temp by your following action to force me to start trolling players.  I can prove my point whatever I feel like and I don't have to prove it even thou person who argue back want proof for they also have a nekros and never "tested this fact is true" for it is in the "agreement contract" that made by DE that for clearly read when I got back to the fine print on the paper after my rhino's ramming party troll which it shows one them "grief".  For your the one making flaws and effortless pointless argument for your one those players who want to keep "memes" like vauban's bounce.

narrowing all the topic down your not getting the point, we can make nekros punch weak as possible for your not seeing the picture, I am not asking DMG proven, I am not asking where the point his 1 abilities must instance kill everything how nuke frames are.  I am asking making nekros's ability of his 1 useful instead of punch something that goes flying.  I never ask make nekros's punch make things flying for you are missing the point that why I tested you you understand any knowledge that understood that nekros's 1 ability is absoultely a joke for we aren't asking strength for it is simple flashback everyone focus Ember's old 1 ignite one single target and that was the version of nekros's ability of his 1.  As again everyone hate Ember's old one for it just burn 1 person and they use full on strength and never touch it's 1 ability and so does it follow up again.

arguing with you seem more pointless for your not learning about how trolls works like nova's teleport portal to troll players the living daylight out of it.  Then we got Valkry her pull or drag ability to drag frames is still exist for I drag so many players into the portal in ESO which it works and had avoid temp to do it so many time. As again we got the other abilities that trolls players that still exist.  The game is a meme and made it to be just obvious reason some abilities are really $##! and giggles as in they are trash abilities make ppl just for laugh and actually trash it.  My gosh remind me the time Excal's old 3 button the "Super Jump" for the only uses was a joke and meme and that was the actual $##! and giggles as again Nekros 1 abilities for my goal is too dang simple just do the opposite of the mission for example I could use Nekros's ability 1 to keep away enemies that why I use that mod make it weaker so I don't kill weaker grineer and keep it enough far as possible for new players to temp to fail right away for I tell you this I use to be troller in other games before and does everyone still have a trolly mind for yes we can troll if you use to be a troll.

Now stop being a "Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo" and note it isn't non-sense for look up the dictionary and look at the meaning.

[Andele3025]

2 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

your the person who is laid back and not discovering much about it like the example someone discover how to escape Uranus's map.  Basically you also have no knowledge itself about it how I can troll it and I am not trying to be temp by your following action to force me to start trolling players.  I can prove my point whatever I feel like and I don't have to prove it even thou person who argue back want proof for they also have a nekros and never "tested this fact is true" for it is in the "agreement contract" that made by DE that for clearly read when I got back to the fine print on the paper after my rhino's ramming party troll which it shows one them "grief".  For your the one making flaws and effortless pointless argument for your one those players who want to keep "memes" like vauban's bounce.

Im the person who you can thank for nagging Pablo to damn fix titania razorwing controls, lantern having a absorb like every other ability that gives enemy invul and possibly razorfly regen option. The person who 30 min into patch noted the bullS#&$ of initial combo heavy slash spam memes despite de wishing to gut meme strike if you want to talk about knowledge and "discovery". Meanwhile it in no way changes that youre just making up stuff out of ignorance of both nekros specific and overall basic game mechanics AND is somehow capable of comparing 2 entirely unrelated mechanics (ragdolling a enemy vs forced bounce effect on ally).

2 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

narrowing all the topic down your not getting the point, we can make nekros punch weak as possible for your not seeing the picture, I am not asking DMG proven, I am not asking where the point his 1 abilities must instance kill everything how nuke frames are.  I am asking making nekros's ability of his 1 useful instead of punch something that goes flying.  I never ask make nekros's punch make things flying for you are missing the point that why I tested you you understand any knowledge that understood that nekros's 1 ability is absoultely a joke for we aren't asking strength for it is simple flashback everyone focus Ember's old 1 ignite one single target and that was the version of nekros's ability of his 1.  As again everyone hate Ember's old one for it just burn 1 person and they use full on strength and never touch it's 1 ability and so does it follow up again.

No, your ignorance isnt a argument.

2 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

arguing with you seem more pointless for your not learning about how trolls works like nova's teleport portal to troll players the living daylight out of it.  Then we got Valkry her pull or drag ability to drag frames is still exist for I drag so many players into the portal in ESO which it works and had avoid temp to do it so many time. As again we got the other abilities that trolls players that still exist.  The game is a meme and made it to be just obvious reason some abilities are really $##! and giggles as in they are trash abilities make ppl just for laugh and actually trash it.  My gosh remind me the time Excal's old 3 button the "Super Jump" for the only uses was a joke and meme and that was the actual $##! and giggles as again Nekros 1 abilities for my goal is too dang simple just do the opposite of the mission for example I could use Nekros's ability 1 to keep away enemies that why I use that mod make it weaker so I don't kill weaker grineer and keep it enough far as possible for new players to temp to fail right away for I tell you this I use to be troller in other games before and does everyone still have a trolly mind for yes we can troll if you use to be a troll.

If your own ignorance of mechanics makes you feel the game is bad, dont play, just know that you making arguments from ignorance isnt actually making a point. Soul Punch is good, fills a role in the kid, its damage could be tweaked as it doesnt scale.

2 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

Now stop being a "Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo" and note it isn't non-sense for look up the dictionary and look at the meaning.

You ignoring points and making arguments from ignorance doesnt change reality.

[ChaoticEdge]

Just now, Andele3025 said:

Im the person who you can thank for nagging Pablo to damn fix titania razorwing controls, lantern having a absorb like every other ability that gives enemy invul and possibly razorfly regen option. The person who 30 min into patch noted the bullS#&$ of initial combo heavy slash spam memes despite de wishing to gut meme strike if you want to talk about knowledge and "discovery". Meanwhile it in no way changes that youre just making up stuff out of ignorance of both nekros specific and overall basic game mechanics AND is somehow capable of comparing 2 entirely unrelated mechanics (ragdolling a enemy vs forced bounce effect on ally).

No, your ignorance isnt a argument.

If your own ignorance of mechanics makes you feel the game is bad, dont play, just know that you making arguments from ignorance isnt actually making a point. Soul Punch is good, fills a role in the kid, its damage could be tweaked as it doesnt scale.

You ignoring points and making arguments from ignorance doesnt change reality.

your the one making meaningless argument when I pointed out nekros's 1 ability is a troll, rubbish and absoutely meaningless and no I am not avoiding the argument by translated in words buffalo for repeated 8 time

Spoiler

 

by I mean ppl are bunch bison in the city who bullies to put it short.  In my case your the buffalo who goes into buffalo city who buffalo the other Buffalo without thought at 1st even thou you have no clue about Buffalo who had also buffalo other ppl and your in that Buffalo group that buffalo ppl without acknowledge understanding or even clarified when explain.

for I wasn't avoiding for I pointed your argument is meaningless for it can for it can can but really can't make a statement.  For your missing the point viewing Nekros for you need spend time his 1 ability much longer until you figure out can can understanding why is his 1 ability is very terrible still and need to be rework.

[Andele3025]

2 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

your the one making meaningless argument when I pointed out nekros's 1 ability is a troll, rubbish and absoutely meaningless and no I am not avoiding the argument by translated in words buffalo for repeated 8 time

So you admit you're making S#&$ up and arguing from ignorance of how both nekros and the game work?

2 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

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by I mean ppl are bunch bison in the city who bullies to put it short.  In my case your the buffalo who goes into buffalo city who buffalo the other Buffalo without thought at 1st even thou you have no clue about Buffalo who had also buffalo other ppl and your in that Buffalo group that buffalo ppl without acknowledge understanding or even clarified when explain.

for I wasn't avoiding for I pointed your argument is meaningless for it can for it can can but really can't make a statement.  For your missing the point viewing Nekros for you need spend time his 1 ability much longer until you figure out can can understanding why is his 1 ability is very terrible still and need to be rework.

Because his 1 is ok and objectively doesnt need a rework, you merely asserted that out of the fact that you didnt know till recently how it works. At most it could get is % true damage (and a small amount like 5% at that) that has 100% gore chance and auto target wekspot/actual hp on enemies that have invul chest segment/actually have a effect on enemies like ruk n hek. Nice projecting tho on being a buffalo.