Protea Farm is the least fun I think I've ever had in Warframe

[Wheelhouser]

And there's more than few things that aren't fun in Warframe (Corpus Railjack missions, K-drives, Archwing missions).

I think the Xoris is easily my least favorite weapon I've ever used here.  Cumbersome, clunky (on both controller and keyboard) and, at least for me, impossible to judge when the projectile is at the trapped crew member.

Got the Neuros on my 10th try, so that seemed ok.  But 0/18 on chassis (a couple fails as I seemingly missed detonation on the trapped dudes - how I have no idea).  And now 0/16 on systems (with a couple fails as I tried different approaches - Revenant seemed like an awful choice).  I have no more middle tier coins and only 22 more hard tier coins.  Of course I have MANY dupes of every other drop, though.

Using Octavia and just a rifle (and not Xoris), success on the Nightmare difficulty seems down to a couple random things - do enough enemies spawn close (they don't always) and do enough triangles drop (they don't always).  Those are nearly impossible to see, too.

Just an awful encounter, especially with the RNG of Warframe added to it (I mean I defeated the middle one 16 times and didn't get her part, and now at 14 on the hard one and no part).

I can do the mission, but my god it's so incredibly unfun.

[KitMeHarder]

• IMO the Xoris is really good (best weapon in the game before the Sisters of Parvos update). And you only need it if you aren't using a good nuke frame.
• Wait a little bit near extraction, and the dude will spawn so you always gain back the coin you used (he spawns within 2-4 min of in game time).
• Mesa, I believe, pretty easily does this mode while ignoring all the bonus time mechanics. 

[Drachnyn]

I feel that, it took me like 8 hours to farm her parts together. Depending on the xoris only extends your suffering, get something that can hit the kill target without time extensions. Mesa works great for that in my experience.

[Lutesque]

2 hours ago, Wheelhouser said:

 

I think the Xoris is easily my least favorite weapon I've ever used here.  Cumbersome, clunky (on both controller and keyboard) and, at least for me, impossible to judge when the projectile is at the trapped crew member.

It's even worse if you happen to already use other Glaives since they all have different Flight Speeds.... For example the Glaive Prime is so fast you pretty much have to Detonate it using timing rather than attempting to eye ball just how far it has travelled but the Xoris is so slow that you have to do the exact opposite 😐... There's also some properties that are Unique to The Glaive Prime.... Like how it can Punch Through an Infinite amount of Enemies where else even with the Piecing Navigator Augment in the Xoris it can only go through two Enemies before it starts to Bounce... And once it Bounces about two Times it Forcibly Ends Navigator and returns to you..... Don't even get me Started on The Wolf Sledge.... Which is basically a Hammer Shaped Glaive 😝....

2 hours ago, Wheelhouser said:

(a couple fails as I seemingly missed detonation on the trapped dudes - how I have no idea).

Yeah I just Ignore those Dudes and get my Time Extensions from the Tiny Pyramids dropped by the Specters.... Attempting to go after them causes the Specters to Scatter and if they Scatter then you can't hit them Effectively....

2 hours ago, Wheelhouser said:

Of course I have MANY dupes of every other drop, though.

Except The Mortus Shoulder Guard... Because that one is literally nothing if you already have one....

3 hours ago, Wheelhouser said:

 

Using Octavia and just a rifle (and not Xoris), success on the Nightmare difficulty seems down to a couple random things - do enough enemies spawn close (they don't always) and do enough triangles drop (they don't always).  Those are nearly impossible to see, too.

Try using Octavia with The Xoris.... It's a very potent Combo 👍....

3 hours ago, Wheelhouser said:

 

I can do the mission, but my god it's so incredibly unfun.

It's actually quite hard to nail down what's so unsatisfying about the Granum Void Specifically but in my case I personally hate it because The Deadlock Protocol was the very first time I ever played an Update the exact same day it launched and Oh Boy... The Bugs.... THE BUGS 😱 !!! however after the bugs got Hot Fixed I think I nailed down what was irritating me.... It's the lack of Choices.... 

 Basically the Way The Granuum Void is setup it only rewards Nuke Frames like Volt, Mesa and Equinox.... I don't know if Saryn works due the the Specters Status Immunity.....  This I found extremely irritating because this was when I finally decided I wanted to be a Booben main and having my Warframe become Useless just because of "Reasons" is why I hate the Granuum Void So Much....

Look.... They are other terrible grinds in this game.... Pre Update Harrow and Nidus.... But atleast when you are doing Defection and Infested Salvage your Options aren't arbitrarily Gimped and thus even though the RNG is screwing you over... Atleast your Choices are respected.... Some what ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ....

But when it comes to Farming Protea and Khora it's either Use Mesa/Saryn or don't bother 😐.... And this is why I avoid those modes like the plague.... Because none of my three most used Warframe's are suited for that level of Killing....

1 hour ago, KitMeHarder said:

IMO the Xoris is really good (best weapon in the game before the Sisters of Parvos update). 

Glaive Prime is Better 😁... Hell Wolf Sledge is Better....

2 hours ago, KitMeHarder said:

Mesa, I believe, pretty easily does this mode while ignoring all the bonus time mechanics. 

 

1 hour ago, Drachnyn said:

Mesa works great for that in my experience.

The only issue with Using Mesa is that when it's time to start Farming the Sisters Of Parvos you have to learn to deal with The Xoris eventually as that will grant you Free Access to a Progenitor of your Choosing instead of Being stuck with Magnetic.... Which is actually nice in the Tarca Plasmor and Tetron...

 

[KitMeHarder]

1 minute ago, Lutesque said:

Glaive Prime is Better 😁...

The slash procs were massive overkill anywhere besides Steel Path Grineer, making the upsides of the Xoris better everywhere else. And even then, if you packed enough raw damage behind it (or played smart), the Xoris still plowed through it.

6 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

Hell Wolf Sledge is Better....

But you're free to believe whatever you want.

[Wheelhouser]

2 hours ago, KitMeHarder said:

• IMO the Xoris is really good (best weapon in the game before the Sisters of Parvos update). And you only need it if you aren't using a good nuke frame.
• Wait a little bit near extraction, and the dude will spawn so you always gain back the coin you used (he spawns within 2-4 min of in game time).
• Mesa, I believe, pretty easily does this mode while ignoring all the bonus time mechanics. 

I hate using it.  I see how it's good.  But the controls (for me) are clunky on both controller and mouse/keyboard.  Thankfully I don't need it to clear the mission (though I'm now at 7 or more of each drop OTHER than Protea from the tier 2 mission).  Especially on controller (how I usually play) it's very awkward to use.  I just don't like glaives in this game.

Every time I've used Mesa I've died in Peacemaker.  I have no idea how people are able to not die as Mesa.  I'm usually dead by 30 seconds (with over 50 kills).

[KitMeHarder]

2 minutes ago, Wheelhouser said:

Especially on controller (how I usually play) it's very awkward to use.

If it helps, I have 'use primary fire to melee' enabled. So right bumper to throw, and right analog to explode (doesn't work while dual wielding). Feels pretty good to me.

BTW, if you're using glaives as a client, literally anything but perfect ping will screw you over. You have to tap explode at least twice, but the worse the ping, the more I recommend just spamming it.

7 minutes ago, Wheelhouser said:

I have no idea how people are able to not die as Mesa.

I haven't done the GV in a long time as Mesa, but usually I don't need anything more than Shatter Shield. After that you can add Arcane Guardian, then Adaptation, then Shooting Gallery's stun, etc...

[Lutesque]

44 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

The slash procs were massive overkill anywhere besides Steel Path Grineer, making the upsides of the Xoris better everywhere else. And even then, if you packed enough raw damage behind it (or played smart), the Xoris still plowed through it.

You would be right... Except the Slash doesn't even Proc due to how hard it hits 😱....

11 minutes ago, KitMeHarder said:

BTW, if you're using glaives as a client, literally anything but perfect ping will screw you over. You have to tap explode at least twice, but the worse the ping, the more I recommend just spamming it.

Ive never had this issue before... Or maybe it happened and I simply missed it 🤔...

22 minutes ago, Wheelhouser said:

Especially on controller (how I usually play) it's very awkward to use.  I just don't like glaives in this game.

They were pretty good in Digital Extremes' Old Game... Dark Sector.... as you would toss The Glaive with the Right Shoulder Button instead of one of the Face Buttons....

Man... Excalibur was so Cool back then ♥️ !!!

He had a Volt Shield except his could Deflect AoE Rockets back at whoever Fired Them.... He had Invisibility but could Run and thus was Vastly Superior to Ivara...

And he had Navigator... Which surprisingly was not better than Ivara's Current Navigator.... But his one Didn't Drain Energy and could be Spammed without any Limitations...

Yeah Tenno in Dark Sector is still the best version of Excalibur 😎...

30 minutes ago, Wheelhouser said:

Every time I've used Mesa I've died in Peacemaker.  I have no idea how people are able to not die as Mesa.  I'm usually dead by 30 seconds (with over 50 kills).

Well.... There are limits to how Peace Maker can effectively remove Targets and the number of things Shatter Shield can protect you from....

For example the Specters have a tendency to fly in close and Kick you... And I'm pretty sure Shatter Shield provides Absolutely Zero Damage Reduction from that....

Further more if the Lazers that they shoot at you have an AoE on them (similar to the Supras wielded by the Juno Elite Crewmen) the Shatter Shield does nothing against that too....

In my case Ive never subscribed to the notion that Mesa was Overpowered and so I used the Augment:

It fits In the Exilus Slot so really there's no reason not to use it...in my case I always Reposition by Rolling whenever something spawns behind me.... The Roll also Benefits from Amalgam Barrel Diffusion's Dodge Speed passive...and thus the Animation ends faster and allows you to continue Firing sooner too....

Lastly... Because building Mesa is so Flexible I have I have Steel Fibre on my build....

LoL... You should see the Reactions I get from People when I Reccomend those Two mods over more Power Strength.... It's like they deem it Evil to build Mesa for anything other than Regulators.... And then They Die because they think they are Invincible when they are not 😝 !!!

 

[KitMeHarder]

5 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

You would be right... Except the Slash doesn't even Proc due to how hard it hits

Thanks for reinforcing my point. (And depending on where you're claiming this, you're just using a frame that's bugged with glaives like Chroma.)

[Lutesque]

2 hours ago, KitMeHarder said:

Thanks for reinforcing my point. (And depending on where you're claiming this, you're just using a frame that's bugged with glaives like Chroma.)

Nope... It turns out the the Procs don't happen at the same time... The game Priorities the Innate Damage Types on the weapon first then Procs the Forced Procs afterwards.... In other words if your Weapon is strong enough to kill with just the Mods on it then the Special Case Procs like Hunter Munitions and Internal Bleeding (as well as the Slash Proc on Glaive Prime's Heavy Attack) simply just don't Proc at all....

The reason why this is a Problem is because The Kubrow Mecha Set doesn't work as effectively if you kill the Marked Enemy outright without Requiring a Slash Proc.... This set gives my Internal Bleeding Daikyu massive AoE potential but only if the Target that gets marked can survive the initial shot...

If it doesn't then I have to mop up the remaining Targets one by one 😭 !!!

Same goes for Epitaph (who shall now be referred to as Daikyu JR.)

 

2 hours ago, KitMeHarder said:

you're just using a frame that's bugged with glaives like Chroma.

What bug are you referring to ?

I don't use Chroma beyond profit Taker but there is another Warframe who's buff works a similar way so I'm worried I might run into this bug... What is it ? 😱

 

[Vaz2017]

I disagree on every point, OP.

To start with, I love every single thing you listed as "not fun."

IMO, the Xoris gimmick is a nice little bit of spice in the mode, and although it's tricky and/or clunky at first, you can get used to it. I appreciate it especially because I never really understood how to use glaives until the Protea stuff forced me to learn.

Most activities in Warframe that aren't standard mission nodes are either head-bangingly hard or very easy, depending entirely on whether you choose the right tools for the job. Octavia and a rifle are not the right tools for this job.

As for the RNG, try not obsessively counting how many runs you're doing. Just do a few each day, don't sweat it, and sooner or later you'll have Protea.

[Drachnyn]

vor einer Stunde schrieb Vaz2017:

As for the RNG, try not obsessively counting how many runs you're doing. Just do a few each day, don't sweat it, and sooner or later you'll have Protea.

That's all nice and easy to say if you do get lucky. If you dont it might just take weeks to months to get all her parts. Stretching out a farm like is still going to make it feel awful.

[Vaz2017]

1 hour ago, Drachnyn said:

That's all nice and easy to say if you do get lucky. If you dont it might just take weeks to months to get all her parts. Stretching out a farm like is still going to make it feel awful.

Yes and no. I've taken months to farm some frames. There are weapons I've had only one or two parts of for years. It's all about the mentality you choose to adopt.

[Wheelhouser]

3 hours ago, Vaz2017 said:

Octavia and a rifle are not the right tools for this job.

Well we can agree to disagree on the rest, but this isn't true.  I've no real problem with Octavia and a rifle in clearing the mission.  I've had a couple fails due to not enough triangles (with like 70 kills), but if there are any that I come across, it's easy.  No idea if it helps that my rifle is a well-modded vermislicer primary (with a good Riven), but killing things is not the problem.  Tier 1 done, Tier 2 over 25 clears, Tier 3 over a dozen.

[Lutesque]

2 hours ago, Drachnyn said:

That's all nice and easy to say if you do get lucky. If you dont it might just take weeks to months to get all her parts. Stretching out a farm like is still going to make it feel awful.

Pretty much how I feel.... I prefer to suffer right here and right now than to drag my suffering through the following weeks....

1 hour ago, Vaz2017 said:

Yes and no. I've taken months to farm some frames. There are weapons I've had only one or two parts of for years. 

One could interpret that as saying anything can not bother you if you just don't engage with it....

And the issue I have with this way of thinking it feels like it's an excuse for not fixing or improving anything people are not satisfied with..

Defection Missions are eggcelent example of this.... This mode is just Awful.... Me choosing to skip it everytime it appears in the sortie does nothing to make it better....

1 hour ago, Vaz2017 said:

It's all about the mentality you choose to adopt.

I mean... My mentality is to want this game to be fun....

What's yours ? 😱

 

[DoomFruit]

I used Revenant's #4 when farming Protea. Build for range, a bit of strength and max efficiency, stand on a rock and nuke everything. That only works if you're solo, however. Add another player and the increased killcount that you need is too much.

Yes, that gimps any Tenet weapons because the added element is always cold, but I did this before they existed.

[SimulatedKnave]

16 hours ago, Wheelhouser said:

And there's more than few things that aren't fun in Warframe (Corpus Railjack missions, K-drives, Archwing missions).

I think the Xoris is easily my least favorite weapon I've ever used here.  Cumbersome, clunky (on both controller and keyboard) and, at least for me, impossible to judge when the projectile is at the trapped crew member.

Got the Neuros on my 10th try, so that seemed ok.  But 0/18 on chassis (a couple fails as I seemingly missed detonation on the trapped dudes - how I have no idea).  And now 0/16 on systems (with a couple fails as I tried different approaches - Revenant seemed like an awful choice).  I have no more middle tier coins and only 22 more hard tier coins.  Of course I have MANY dupes of every other drop, though.

Using Octavia and just a rifle (and not Xoris), success on the Nightmare difficulty seems down to a couple random things - do enough enemies spawn close (they don't always) and do enough triangles drop (they don't always).  Those are nearly impossible to see, too.

Just an awful encounter, especially with the RNG of Warframe added to it (I mean I defeated the middle one 16 times and didn't get her part, and now at 14 on the hard one and no part).

I can do the mission, but my god it's so incredibly unfun.

You can have enough enemies spawn?  I've done about six and literally never have had close to enough Specters spawn.  

[KitMeHarder]

9 hours ago, Lutesque said:

Nope... It turns out the the Procs don't happen at the same time... The game Priorities the Innate Damage Types on the weapon first then Procs the Forced Procs afterwards.... In other words if your Weapon is strong enough to kill with just the Mods on it then the Special Case Procs like Hunter Munitions and Internal Bleeding (as well as the Slash Proc on Glaive Prime's Heavy Attack) simply just don't Proc at all....

That's what I mean. Without taking the procs into consideration, their explosions basically do the same damage. And if I'm doing so much overkill damage, why would I crown the one with halve the AoE?

9 hours ago, Lutesque said:

What bug are you referring to ?

Unless it's been fixed, most frames that add base damage to weapons double dip their buffs on the heavy attack explosions.

[Wheelhouser]

At this point clearing is not at all the issue (it's really still not a fun weapon to me, the xoris).

I have 41 non-protea drops from the t2 crown.  By basic numbers I should have 3 or possibly 4 (on average) with that many clears.

This is when I usually stop playing warframe for a few months (horrid farms with terrible luck).  But with the weekly primes I was looking forward to a couple months of warframe.

As for not farming something non-stop like this - I'm not going to enjoy it any more if I give it a break for a day or a week or a month.  And once you (or at least for me) cross a certain improbability without getting the drop you're after, whatever farm it is, I get kind of stubborn and I'm either going to get it, or I'm going to stop playing the game.  This is just the part of Warframe's design I find awful and the opposite of what makes a good game.  I don't know the odds of going 0/41 on an 11.11% drop, but things like this happen too often in WF for me to just believe that the tables are true.  And then there's the t3 crown part after, which I'm already like 0/15 or so on...

[Wheelhouser]

1 hour ago, SimulatedKnave said:

You can have enough enemies spawn?  I've done about six and literally never have had close to enough Specters spawn.  

I have seen no issues with numbers of enemies spawning.  It's either time (as I'm not using the Xoris, so no crewman free) due to no triangles spawning, or in the case of the stationary nukers, I die before I can get the 75 kills.  But with Octavia and plopping a mallet, and shooting things and collecting triangles, no issues at all with kills.

[Lutesque]

7 hours ago, KitMeHarder said:

That's what I mean. Without taking the procs into consideration, their explosions basically do the same damage. And if I'm doing so much overkill damage, why would I crown the one with halve the AoE?

I don't know... Convenience ? 

7 hours ago, KitMeHarder said:

Unless it's been fixed, most frames that add base damage to weapons double dip their buffs on the heavy attack explosions.

Considering that Condition Overload doesn't work on these things.... I think that's fine 😁....

 

[Vaz2017]

On 2021-12-09 at 11:26 AM, Wheelhouser said:

I don't know the odds of going 0/41 on an 11.11% drop, but things like this happen too often in WF for me to just believe that the tables are true.  And then there's the t3 crown part after, which I'm already like 0/15 or so on...

This is an issue MMO players run into all the time: probability doesn't work the way humans tend to intuit it should. It's not that a 1% chance means you're guaranteed it'll occur 1 in 100 times, or even nearly guaranteed. It's that you have a 1% chance of the desired result every time you do the thing, and probability doesn't care if you've done it once before, ninety-nine times, or two hundred times.

There's also the issue that random number generators used in games aren't completely and truly random, simply because it's hard to simulate "true randomness."

[ReverseKinetix]

Funnily enough the best warframe I've found to actually do Granum Voids is Protea herself. I always just go to the edge of the map, set up my dispensary, turrets, and then set up some grenade fans around the area and let the turrets go to work. I can average about 40 seconds per granum void using this method.

No the real problem is spawning sisters. For this I have to basically do the same thing, but with a different warframe. It actually takes longer for me to use the progenitor I want, get 25 kills, then wait out the timer than it does for me to clear out the granum void with someone like Protea. Not only that, but after doing all this I still have to wait for the treasurer and sister to spawn in and just hope that it's a weapon I want. Protea only has 3 parts, there are 8 tenet weapons, and you will need multiple of each to max it. Now factor in ephemeras which almost never spawn in. You get left with doing the same farm, but with more inconveniences and having to run it even more times.

[Wheelhouser]

On 2021-12-11 at 5:05 AM, Vaz2017 said:

This is an issue MMO players run into all the time: probability doesn't work the way humans tend to intuit it should. It's not that a 1% chance means you're guaranteed it'll occur 1 in 100 times, or even nearly guaranteed. It's that you have a 1% chance of the desired result every time you do the thing, and probability doesn't care if you've done it once before, ninety-nine times, or two hundred times.

There's also the issue that random number generators used in games aren't completely and truly random, simply because it's hard to simulate "true randomness."

Oh I know that.  Just because I missed the roll 41 times in a row doesn't mean the next roll had any better chance than 11.11% (btw, the 42nd roll, right after I posted this, was the T2 protea part, and then the T3 I got about 5 runs later, for a total of about 20 T3 successes - I don't actually know, since you can only have 1 of the scenes in your inventory, and I got that drop at least 4 times).

But probability says that I am likely to have rolled 11.11 or lower once in 9 attempts.  So the T1 part taking me 10 rolls felt just fine.  The T3 part at ~ 20 was a bit much.  But 42 is I'm guessing statistically rare.

Anyway, I got the drop, and other than RNG and the Xoris, I really LIKE the encounter as designed.  My issue with the Xoris stems, I think, from playing on a controller and having the alt fire be RS press, while still needing to sometimes also use the RS to aim.  So figuring out how to do this without the Xoris was my 1st frustration, and then RNG.

It's the same thing with the Yareli quest (done, btw).  I felt the game wanted me to hit 5 inputs at the same time, with only 4 fingers/thumb in use (LT, LB, LS, RS and A).  The issue was jumping (A) and direction facing (RS) simultaneously.  So for the grind scores (1500 and 2000) I had to remap jump to RT so I could actually do all 5 inputs at once.  Learning a new jump input was much quicker than learning the mouse/keyboard controls for everything else.

[Zeddypanda]

I can't help you make the farm less boring, but I can help you make it more boring if you'd like. So boring that you can mostly just kinda watch a video while standing around.

What you need:

• Vauban
• About 200% power strength.
• As much range as you can get.

What you do:

• Go to edge of map.
• Throw power thing on yourself to boost damage.
• Throw out all of your tether coils, distribute them a bit aways from where you're standing so they can spawnkill.
• Watch funny videos.
• Refresh power thing and tether coils only the one time if you got the proper amount of duration.

This works because the ghosts are immune to tether coil's grip, so they'll keep trying to grip and do their one-time damage every time.